[My biggest complaint about Pillars of Eternity? I miss the Magic Missile.]

I'm curious, did anybody find a need to swap out spell books for a Wizard character? There didn't seem to be a burning need to use more than the four spell slots per level they provided. In fact, for several spell levels just one or two spells were sufficient. But perhaps it was just my play style.

Never ever not once did I even have to consider it.

[My biggest complaint about Pillars of Eternity? I miss the Magic Missile.]

Magic missile has always been overpowered, in both crpgs and pen and paper D&D.  I can't say I miss it honestly. 

[Rest bonus from completed keep should be waaaaay better]

I never said it was overpowered, dude.  What I said was that taking either the cumulative bonuses or +4 Intellect was not an obvious choice, and explained why.

Your reasoning is still garbage. Skill checks are rare. Rarely needed even if checked. And tend to be quite high. +1 making a difference will thus also be insanely rare. Just because youd make a dumb choice doesnt mean the choice isnt obvious. The only time you should choose a +1 to mechanics over something like +4 int is because you know a check is coming up and what that check is and that +1 is going to be enough.

[Rest bonus from completed keep should be waaaaay better]

 

 

It's not even that overpowered; +4 Intellect vs +1 to everything is not an obvious choice.

Its not overpowered AT ALL.

 

Yeah it is an obvious choice. +4 all the way every time. Unless you need a skill boost for something in particular. The boosts are percentage based. Higher and focused beats low and spread out by a mile because no one needs every stat boosted.

 

Having it be cumulative is in no way overpowered. Itd still be pretty weak actually. 

 

With various conversation checks and other situations where +1 to different skills would prove useful in succession, I'd take the cumulative stronghold bonuses on many occasions, for convenience.  Just not all occasions.

 

So an edge case where youre trying to metagame some dialogue checks means itd be overpowered? Please.

And Id love to hear some actual examples where this would be at all useful. I can recall very few dialogues like youre describing.

What conversation has within one dialogue high skill checks for multiple skills? Even if that were true itd be useful in those rare situations. Not even close to overpowered.

[Benevolent = tough luck, you won't get this powerful artifact?]

I think the ideal spear for Hiravias 

Hehehe yeah Im going to focus Hiravias on using spears in encounters. 

 

EDIT: Oh yeah and forget that stupid spear. I was all prepared for some epic Engwithan artifact. Felt like Id been trolled.

[Rest bonus from completed keep should be waaaaay better]

It's not even that overpowered; +4 Intellect vs +1 to everything is not an obvious choice.

Its not overpowered AT ALL.

 

Yeah it is an obvious choice. +4 all the way every time. Unless you need a skill boost for something in particular. The boosts are percentage based. Higher and focused beats low and spread out by a mile because no one needs every stat boosted.

 

Having it be cumulative is in no way overpowered. Itd still be pretty weak actually. 

[Caved in and fought cheese with cheese]

Edit: Further note: It is really sad that the devs made such a great game but failed so hard on the adra dragon. It is by far the most cheesy and cheap boss design I have ever seen in a video game and I've been a gamer for 20 years. 

Wow in those 20 years you must not have played a single challenging game or gotten very good because the Adra Dragon is not hard.

 

The Adra Dragon has high damage including an AOE, high defenses and some adds. Not even very many adds. That's cheap and cheesy? No immunities. No environment effects. No disables (just the handful of Adragans but not the dragon itself.) No special instant kills (The damage is survivable). The damage isnt even raw like your party can make use of.

 

That's it. That's the great amount of cheese you find so impossibly insurmountable. Most people would beat it using buffs, debuffs and disables just like any other fight that might actually require some work but apparently that's cheese now. The adds are a joke and you can take them out the same way you usually take out Adragans and Xaurips. A couple foe only aoes. Especially since you've buffed your party.

[Doesn't build diversity feel a tad....limited?]

Talents do not have to be equal. There is no need to play the so-called optimal builds. If someone believe that by taking certain talent(s) will "gimp" character and that is not "proper" way of playing role playing game is fine but has no bearing on anything. There are options, most of not all of them are viable to take to PotD.

 

But I will be missing + 6 acc if I take + 10 reflex instead which is game breaking to gimp my character like that!

 

cool story bro

 

Stories are cool but nobody cares. If you have suggestions how to balance - another notion I do not quite understand in single player RPG - talents, lets see them. The debaters are waiting.

You are incredibly naive. Yes talents do need to be "equal." You only get freaking 6 of them. Picking 6 stupid ones leads to a much less fun character. If someone doesnt understand how defenses work and they pick Bear's Fortitude and (big surprise) it does practically nothing for them, then it isn't that the class is gimped. It's that they just wasted one of only 6 limited resources they can never get back. That is in direct violation of Obsidian's stated design goal of not having trap crap.

 

 

Oh god, what the hell? Seriously, what the hell? All of my what the hells.

Confused? It's not exactly complicated. Even you should understand the post.

 

The hell is reducing the universal talents down to a small pool that will do something for pretty much any character and that are also much clearer for casuals. Cast spells? Spell Master is obvious and will help them do exactly what it says. 4 separate spell bonus talents that individually are outshone by some rings and require knowledge of what happens at level 9 and 11 to evaluate properly are terrible for new players. Weapon focus requires knowing what weapon you've settled on for the end of the game. That's just stupid.

 

Consolidating them also means a tank build or dps build can actually afford some variety. This would only marginally increase characters powers because the bad talents are really bad. I should also point out I am very much in favor of increasing the difficulty. Some enemies should be either immune or have sky high defenses to some effets. They need to target better, have some more foe only aoe etc. So Im not just trying to argue for characters to be even more overpowered.

[Doesn't build diversity feel a tad....limited?]

I was brainstorming this when trying to make the suckier talents more viable and less boring. This is just idle musing.

 

Elemental Master=Scion of Flame+Spirit of Decay+Secrets of Rime+Heart of the Storm

Weapon Focus    =Is just +6 Accuracy to all weapons (Cuz use whatever weapons you effing want. Seriously.Alternatively you choose whatever 4 weapons you wanted for your concept. Master of guns? Wizard with Quarterstaff, Rod, Scepter, Wand? IE Wizard with Quarterstaff, crossbow, dagger, wand? But this makes the talent reward metagame information so I decided on making it universal.)

Weapon Master   =All weapon styles (Same as weapon focus. This really doesnt do anything amazing. Just lets you decide to try out dual wielding for awhile before settling on using a great sword or a sword and shield.)

Gunman          =Marksman+Gunner+Close Shooter

Hard to Kill    =Bears Fortitude, Bulls Will, Snakes Reflexes+Superior Deflection

Fancy Footwork  =Shot On the Run+Fast Runner+Graceful Retreat+Unstoppable

Spell Master    =Bonus Spell of level 1,2.3 and 4 (By levels 9 & 12 the first two talents are a waste anyways and this puts this talent in line with the rings of wizardry. Honestly this still wouldnt even be very good. By level 12 I had more spells than I could possibly use in a fight. But it's something nice at early levels casuals will pick and have more fun in the class.)

Blood Knight    =Bloody Slaughter+Hold the Line+Body Control+Mental Fortress

Medic           =Wound Binding, Field Triage and Envenomed Strike (I still wouldn't take it actually but now at least you heal a decent amount of health.)

Loaded for Bear =Arms Bearer+Quick Switch

The modals can stay

I'd just remove Dangerous Implement but I know it has its uses for edge cases.

 

Hilariously the bad talents are so bad even combining them with the more useful ones isnt much of a boost to a characters power.

 

These should also be a lot clearer for casual players which ones are really going to help your build.

[A change to petrify?]

<insert stupid image because I have no thoughts of my own>

 

The picture was over you randomly insulting the OP. And now you're randomly insulting me.

Double facepalm.

You dont know what random means. Which hilariously makes my mockery of you even less random.

[A change to petrify?]

 

 Just because youre not very good doesnt mean the dragon is an impossible challenge. Of course now you'll probably just say confuse is too powerful and obviously not "conventional" for some ridiculous reason.

 

 

 

<insert stupid image because I have no thoughts of my own>

 

Was there something in particular you disagreed with? Because the original poster decided the Adra Dragon was in their own words "unbeatable" by "conventional" tactics which is hilariously untrue. It has high defenses and does high damage. Thats all it has going for it outside of the mobs that join the fight but because you cant auto attack it to death people keep claiming it's cheating or cheese filled or other nonsense. Therefore it would not be surprising to me if they are then foolish enough to find the use of any debuff, like confusion, to be "unconventional."

 

As such the OP's argument that petrify is leaps and bound beyond other debuffs was highly flawed. It rested on them using 6 traps and then using the barbarian with jolting boots combo to own adra dragon which is a whole other issue entirely.

 

Ultimately I agree that petrify is nearly an insta-kill but it is not leaps and bounds beyond the other disables like prone and paralyzed. It is better than them in that foes take increased damage beyond the extra damage decreased defenses bring but it is a higher level debuff so that is not entirely unexpected. So unless your picture was supposed to represent you having a headache due to your ignorance maybe next time try understanding what is being said.

[Weapon Choices for Cipher]

Yeah, every cipher ends up getting both draining whip and biting whip anyways.

 

Personally, I like dual wield melee cipher with a ranger backup.  Basically play it as a rogue, just with a lot more crowd control.

 

Tenuous grasp is an awesome combat opener for a level 1 spell.

I get plenty of focus without Draining Whip so I dont bother to take it.

[A change to petrify?]

I just kept the dragon confused. Petrify isnt required. Neither are traps. Just because youre not very good doesnt mean the dragon is an impossible challenge. Of course now you'll probably just say confuse is too powerful and obviously not "conventional" for some ridiculous reason.

 

That being said petrify is the ultimate debuff and is practically instakill. There are still 6 spell levels to go in the wizards spell book... Where do Obs go from there?

[druid attack: ranged or melee?]

You cast spells. Very early levels use an arbalest.

[Learn Penetrating Shot, never turn it off...]

 

PoE should have embraced the firearms/arbalests/crossbows that helps make their world more distinct from usual fantasy drek and just ditched the stupid bows. But no of course thats not possible because of the hard-on a lot of geeks have for bows

 

This would have made the whole world much less believable. 

Got a bow fan proving my point right here. Yeah a world where guns have relegated archery to a status and hobby symbol. SOOOOO unbelievable.

[Wizard & Implements]

Rogue / Rangers dont have wizard spells lol. Aslo Im use the implement build with a full ranged backline anyway, just without useless rogues / rangers.

Zealous Endurance + Zealous Focus arbalest paladins, Wael or Magran Priest, and Wizard. Could throw in a chanter but I like the double Zealous modals. 

So you spend all your talents on implements because you love wizards for their spells. Makes sense. Rogues and Rangers are hardly useless especially because a ranged spec rogue or ranger is going to put your ranged spec wizard to shame. If your wizard is casting spells they aren't making use of a single one of their talents. Brilliant.

 

Your second sentence has literally nothing to do with anything. Zealous focus is going to benefit a class with higher accuracy over the wizard in the exact same situation. Why do piddly little blast damage when I have AOE spells?

 

 

I use that spell a lot, do Implement talents work on it too? If so then Im def not changing my mind. Implements ftw. Also Im sure marksman works on that spell too.

 

Its easy to go check. I didn't find marksman to work with any spells but its always interesting to find these little quirks. Maybe blights is an exception.

[Learn Penetrating Shot, never turn it off...]

PoE should have embraced the firearms/arbalests/crossbows that helps make their world more distinct from usual fantasy drek and just ditched the stupid bows. But no of course thats not possible because of the hard-on a lot of geeks have for bows.

[Taking level 1 spells when leveling up]

Level 2 spells are not "strictly" better no. This is true of all classes actually. Also you may have already learned the level 2 spells you want but not the level 1 spells you want die to grimoire drops.

 

Nope. Aloth is another reason you can choose a lower level spell instead of a higher level one. So you can grab a great level on spell Aloth doesn't have.

[Wizard & Implements]

Yes I've taken Blast / Penetrating Blast / Dangerous Implements / Marksman / Weapon Focus Noble on my Wizard on Potd and it works great.

And no, the elemental utility talents are nowhere near as useful for a wizard as their spells cover a lot of elements, I'd rather focus on implements or guns / arbalests.

Its a wizard. If I wanted to focus solely on ranged combat Id have made/used a rogue or ranger. You end up spending all your resources on boosting their accuracy. What a waste.

Elemental talents are far more useful for buffing their spells and takes less talents than you who admittedly had to spend every single talent on making them not suck at ranged combat. 20% more damage to fan of flames. Saying their less useful because they have a number of spells that are buffed by the talents is literally nonsense. The DR boost is welcome too. Especially freeze DR.

[Audra Dragon Petition]

Oh brother the fights really not that hard.

[Patch notes for 1.03]

 

 That Arbalest nerf was well done and a good sign for balance patches going forward.

 

Despite your sarcasm, your words taken at face value are actually half-true: the arbalest was by far the best ranged weapon. Not only did it have the excellent spike damage to remove a threat as soon as the fight began, it also had the highest sustained DPS in the game. Even with one third of its damage taken it's still equivalent DPS (but still better at bursting enemies down) to the crossbow at about 5 DR and higher relative DPS as DR increases.

 

Of course they didn't nerf the Arquebus, which wasn't far behind the Arbalest. It, and probably the pistol, need some nerfing while the hunting bow, war bow, and crossbow need some buffing.

The arquebus doesn't need a nerf. It's only barely better than the arbalest in damage and literally nothing else.

[Can someone help me make an legendary Wizard?]

 

you guys serisouly trying to fight with a lvl 1-2 wizard alone with no companions? Is this your first RPG....ever?

 

  Gee.  First time playing the game.  No idea even HOW to get to the next town, or even that it is possible to do so without fighting at least the one mob.  Psychic I was not.  I've learned how to get past them now, but did you somehow, magically KNOW exactly where you were going the first time YOU played?  (Please no BS about how we should have checked online first.  Some people don't like spoilers.)

 

LOL. Of course I did. First there's the overland map. So we know we just came from the north. Obviously a cave to the north is not the way to go to reach the next area.

Then there's the road to the south of the map and non hostile npc just across the bridge. 

[Wizard buff spells - what's the point?]

 

 

 

"To be fair. D&D wizards do represent many, many, things wrong with class design."

 

D&D wizards represent the awesomesauce of class design. They are perfect the way they are.

I'm just going to assume you're trolling.

 

I don't really see what's wrong with wizards. They're a pretty cool class, and I enjoy seeing the silly hijinks my more creative friends get into.

 

They are a class whose theme is MAGIC! and MAGIC! is do all the things.

 

Of course that is powerful. But being ridiculously powerful is not great design. Any 13 year old can make an overpoweringly awesome class.

[Cipher is an aggro magnet - to be fixed?]

Its not the cipher its just whos squishiest. For me it's Aloth.

[Nerf of Sure-Handed Ila in 1.03]

Maybe someone will make a mod to un-nerf all the nerfs in this patch. Personally I would love some1 to unnerf the arbalest.

What the hell is supposed to be the point of unnerfing the arbalest. It was literally better than the arquebus in every single way before the patch. Now it does slightly less damage. If the enemy has DR. And depending on how much you can eat the -5 to accuracy from the arquebus. Clearly Obsidian lost their mind ... making the arbalest so much better in the first place.