damage calculation with multiple modifiers

[zczczc1680]

Could anyone explain to me how the damage is calculated in game? It's quite confusing and most of the time I can't get the right results if there are multiple modifiers.

 

 

Example1:

base damage roll = 20.1   

modifier :   + 25% critical  - %25 blunted critical  + 33% might  +30% overpen.  

result = 31.1

 

seems like  it should be 20.1 * 1.25 * 0.75 * 1.3 + 20.1 * 0.33 = 31.129875 which is weird, since a critical hit dealt by weapons with "blunted critical" may cause less damage than a normal hit (if not overpenetrates armor) 

 

 

 

Exanple2:

base damage roll = 24.6

modifier:  -50% graze   +33% might

result = 14.8

 

I don't understand, how do I get 14.8? Does anyone know the formula?

 

 

[Cdiaz]

Hello zczczc1680,

 

Thanks for the post, sorry it can be very daunting for some of the calculations in game for sure! We currently have blunted criticals bugged for its wording, and Ill be sure to pass along the HP issue.

 

Best,

 

-Caleb

[Madscientist]

The numbers are correct, your formula is wrong.

The correct formula is:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Every dmg bonus/malus has an actual "step" associated to it.

 

 

Since damage bonuses are positive in nature their step is positive and equal to the percentage damage increase. Some examples of steps of dmg bonuses:

• Weapon specialization bonus(+10% dmg) => step=0.1
• Crit damage bonus (+25% dmg) => step=0.25
• Sneak attack bonus (+50% dmg) => step=0.5

 

In the case of maluses the formula for the step is a bit different: 1-1/(1-malus). Here are some examples of steps of dmg maluses:

• Graze malus (-50%) => step=1-1/(1-0.5)=1-1/0.5=1-2=-1
• Light under-penetration (-25%) => step=1-1/(1-0.25)=1-1/0.75=1-4/3=-0.333
• Severe under-penetration (-75%) => step=1-1/(1-0.75)=1-1/0.25=1-4=-3

 

Now, all the steps of the dmg bonus and maluses are summed up together.

 

If the sum is >=0 you have the formula that you mentioned: rolled_dmg * (Step_SUM + 1)

 

If the sum is <0 you have the following formula: rolled_dmg/(1-Step_SuM)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

In your case it is: 20,1 * ( 1 + 0,25 - 0,33 + 0,33 +0,3 ) = 31,1

 

The problem is that penalties are inverted, so -25% does not lead to a step of -0,25 but step=1-1/(1-0.25)=1-1/0.75=1-4/3=-0.333

 

We should start a thread about basic game mechanics and pin it in that part of the forum.

Edited May 12, 2018 by Madscientist

[zczczc1680]

The numbers are correct, your formula is wrong.

The correct formula is:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Every dmg bonus/malus has an actual "step" associated to it.

 

 

Since damage bonuses are positive in nature their step is positive and equal to the percentage damage increase. Some examples of steps of dmg bonuses:

• Weapon specialization bonus(+10% dmg) => step=0.1
• Crit damage bonus (+25% dmg) => step=0.25
• Sneak attack bonus (+50% dmg) => step=0.5

 

In the case of maluses the formula for the step is a bit different: 1-1/(1-malus). Here are some examples of steps of dmg maluses:

• Graze malus (-50%) => step=1-1/(1-0.5)=1-1/0.5=1-2=-1
• Light under-penetration (-25%) => step=1-1/(1-0.25)=1-1/0.75=1-4/3=-0.333
• Severe under-penetration (-75%) => step=1-1/(1-0.75)=1-1/0.25=1-4=-3

 

Now, all the steps of the dmg bonus and maluses are summed up together.

 

If the sum is >=0 you have the formula that you mentioned: rolled_dmg * (Step_SUM + 1)

 

If the sum is <0 you have the following formula: rolled_dmg/(1-Step_SuM)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

In your case it is: 20,1 * ( 1 + 0,25 - 0,33 + 0,33 +0,3 ) = 31,1

 

The problem is that penalties are inverted, so -25% does not lead to a step of -0,25 but step=1-1/(1-0.25)=1-1/0.75=1-4/3=-0.333

 

We should start a thread about basic game mechanics and pin it in that part of the forum.

Thanks for your answer.

But still, the formula is weird to me.

 

First, might and critical(it's nothing compared to its brother graze) damage bonus are definitely underpowered since there are so many bonus sources in the game(especially the high-rank weapons).

 

Second, the "blunted critical" must be reworked due to the formula.

The -25% critical damage, which is surely applied in a critical hit, is actually -0,33 in steps. Thus, it makes a critcal hit weaker than a normal hit if no overpenetration occurs.  

 

In fact, any negative modifier y = -x <0 is considered 1 - 1/(1-x)  =  - x/(1-x) in steps and always more powerful than the positive modifier x>0, cuz x - x/(1 - x) = - x^2/(1 - x).  The difference increases dramatically while x becoming closer to 1, which means just one high damage reduction can effectively negate almost all bonuses.

 

For armor, it's reasonable.

For graze, not quite logical since graze surpasses critical too much but they are meant to be in the same rank.

And if there exists any other high damage reduction in game, it will be completely broken.

 

Moreover, we can't increase base damage during the game while damage bonus and max HP being higher and higher.

Therefore in late games(or even at the very beginning of the game if I play a high might rogue), a critical hit will do almost the same damage as a normal hit. The base damage roll is much more important(higher base normal hit stronger than lower base critical hit).

Despite of this, since a graze will negate almost all bonuses (-100% in steps), u can't do much more damage(and most likely much lower) than base damage with a graze.

So, in late game critical = hit and graze = miss(on-hit-effects are not considered) if there are no multiplicative modifiers, which is quite strange in my opnion.

Edited May 13, 2018 by zczczc1680

[Guilherme Oliveira]

How can a 25% damage debuff be greater than a 25% buff?  It doesn't make any sense and the game doesn't explain it.