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Why do some people/reviewers dislike the story of Pillars so much.

story plot deadfire pillarsofeternity

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#21
LuccA

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

My thoughts as someone who hasn't played the game yet is that I pay as much attention to RPS' opinions as to do to the colour of my morning turds

 

 

Yeah, yeah, i read your clever remarks about how you don't give ****s about professional reviews somewhere else in the forums. No need to go searching every opportunity to repeat yourself.

 

I'm not taking the above mentioned review as undeniable truth. That's exaclty why I'm asking the forum users about their opinions.

 

Thanks to those who answered.


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#22
Yosharian

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

My thoughts as someone who hasn't played the game yet is that I pay as much attention to RPS' opinions as to do to the colour of my morning turds

 

 

Yeah, yeah, i read your clever remarks about how you don't give ****s about professional reviews somewhere else in the forums. No need to go searching every opportunity to repeat yourself.

 

I'm not taking the above mentioned review as undeniable truth. That's exaclty why I'm asking the forum users about their opinions.

 

Thanks to those who answered.

 

 

It's more of a personal dislike of RPS, but sure



#23
AlphaShard

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

I think if a God stole my sole and walked away in a giant Adra statue I'd form a better plan then just straight follow him. Anything that gets near the statue dies. Frankly I am loving the hell out of this story and I pity those that can't find that same enjoyment. Not all games are for everyone to enjoy, "Different strokes for different folks" "One mans treasure is another's garbage" and all that. 


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#24
Crucis

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

 

LuccA, the problem is that if the only thing the game cares about is chasing the main story line, it can end up feeling like the IWD games where the game was literally a single direct line of maps one after another, and the closest thing to a side quest was something that could occur within a single map, or at best a multi-map area (like the final building/castle/tower in IWD2).  That can get exceedingly boring after a while, and can make the game less enjoyable for multiple replays because there's largely only one way to play it, and replayability depends more on party composition than an an ability to change the order in which you do things.


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#25
Yosharian

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

 

LuccA, the problem is that if the only thing the game cares about is chasing the main story line, it can end up feeling like the IWD games where the game was literally a single direct line of maps one after another, and the closest thing to a side quest was something that could occur within a single map, or at best a multi-map area (like the final building/castle/tower in IWD2).  That can get exceedingly boring after a while, and can make the game less enjoyable for multiple replays because there's largely only one way to play it, and replayability depends more on party composition than an an ability to change the order in which you do things.

 

 

Exactly.  There's always going to be a disconnect there, it's an unavoidable consequence of games with any kind of open-ended exploration.


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#26
Crucis

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That just tells you what these people know. 

 

A slow start is actually perfect for an RPG because it allows the player to build up his character. Remember the exchange with Calisca in PoE1? That's the sort of things that help flesh out a character and make him or her a little more than some numbers on the character screen. 

 

With that being said I still think PoE1 did a poor job introducing its setting. There is just too much information when you're getting started and it can only be overwhelming. 

 

I can't really say how Deadfire's introduction would feel to someone who hasn't played the first game but I think it's following the same pattern mostly. Having played the first game makes things much less confusing though. 

 

IMO the problem is not that the story is bad, it's more about those people not wanting to invest in the story. Perhaps they feel the path to be taken is not obvious enough. Maybe they want dragons to show up right after character creation just like in Skyrim (which is absolutely terrible and something no self respecting Game Master would do in a pen and paper RPG). Frankly I don't really know. I'm just glad we still get the opportunity to play games that provide a "slow" start. 

 

The problem is that with the BG and IWD games, they existed in a familiar setting, at least for many D&D veterans, and the games didn't have to spend an enormous amount of time and effort to set up much of anything, except perhaps your immediate surroundings.  They could take for granted that you knew some things, like who the deities of the Forgotten Realms were.  But PoE1's Eora was a totally new and unfamiliar setting.  It seems to me that there's bound to be a pretty fair amount of information they feel is needed to be passed along.


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#27
Crucis

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

 

LuccA, the problem is that if the only thing the game cares about is chasing the main story line, it can end up feeling like the IWD games where the game was literally a single direct line of maps one after another, and the closest thing to a side quest was something that could occur within a single map, or at best a multi-map area (like the final building/castle/tower in IWD2).  That can get exceedingly boring after a while, and can make the game less enjoyable for multiple replays because there's largely only one way to play it, and replayability depends more on party composition than an an ability to change the order in which you do things.

 

 

Exactly.  There's always going to be a disconnect there, it's an unavoidable consequence of games with any kind of open-ended exploration.

 

 

And as I recall, even the magnificent BG2 had tons of unrelated side quests as well.  It's one of the reasons it was so beloved.  You didn't have to play them in the same order.  They took you to many different areas that were unrelated to the main story line.  Frankly, without those side quests, I'd think that even the best (main) story line would get rather boring after the first or second play-through. 


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#28
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Yes, exactly. And the side quests are just as epic as the main quests, well, some of them. Firkraag for example!

#29
Crucis

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Yes, exactly. And the side quests are just as epic as the main quests, well, some of them. Firkraag for example!

 

And while the BG2/TOB was rather straight line as I recall (been a LONG time), that side quest dungeon was pretty epic.


Edited by Crucis, 30 September 2018 - 04:50 PM.


#30
jf8350143

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.
 
The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.
 
Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.
 
Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?


It's the same with Skyrim or Fallout 4, you can travel around in your ship the moment you leave the first island, and the main story is completely optional from that point.

Personally I have 0 problem with this, the gods want you to pursue Ethoas, whether the watcher want to do it or not is competely up to you. In PoE 1 you will become crazy if you don't find Thaos soon enough, but this time you yourself won't be dead or anything if you just running around being a pirate.

#31
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I guess, as I said I am not saying their aren't issues with this story and I get having problems with the way it's presented too. I just find issues in so many games it sometimes seems like Pillars is singled out a little. Like the point about urgency (it makes no sense fot you to be doing side quests while *insert plot* is happening). That can be applied to so many rpgs I honestly roll my eyes when it comes up. I get that it's a problem but it exists in so many games as people expect side quests in rpgs and ,many rpgs have some level of urgency to their main quest so it can be all epic and save the worldy.


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#32
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I for one found the story in the first game just meh. It was interesting to learn about the new world they setup, some history and religion ,etc. But your character really has NO reasons to go chasing some peeps because he has nightmares. And if curiosity was a good enough reason, it would have died quickly when finding a decrepit keep full of angry spirits and a dungeon crawling with monsters.

 

Hell, half way through the game i actually opened the journal to try and remember what the main quest was. You do get an explanation in the final chapter that somewhat ties it all together but for the most part the story is weaker than what IWD 1/2 threw at you, and those were combat focused games.

 

At least the second game starts with a giant god stomping your keep and ppl, which is a good enough reason to go chase his ass. Lets hope that you don't just forget that after 10 hours while you go painting your ship pink.



#33
LilithMV

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I have also seen a few people who dislike the start of the story of POEII but like the story in the first game. Which I find interesting since personally it took me 5 tries to get into POEI due to the start feeling uninteresting. I never felt this with Baldur's Gate I and II. However, POEII had me hooked right from the start. It feels more like the BG games, which is good. 

 

Also the main story being disconnected; Well I like that. It's more like BGII in this regard. Unlike BGI where there was not much of any side quests, it was all about the main story really.


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#34
sucinum

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I'll not play PoE2 for a few months, but I'm reading a few reviews.

 

The opinion on the story that got me most worried was Rock Paper Shotgun's on-going review. It said that the main story was too disconnect from every other quest (kinda similar to PoE1 actually). In PoE1 however, it was more forgivable because the main story was you seeking a way to get rid of your soul-awakening. It did not feel very imediate - which was a complaint from a lot of people - but at least it made sense when your character was dealing with a slow-progressing illness and chose to adventure here an there in sidequests.

 

Now, however, there's a giant god that took your soul stamping cities (apparently) and it just feels weird (according to the review) to be doing anything else besides following that god. This is a very poor story design decision and it god me less excited to play the game :(.

 

Can anyone who have played the beggining of the game give their thoughts about that?

 

I am a few hours into Deadfire and can confirm that, the pacing just feels wrong at the start. One day, you watch the gods discussing and get the feeling that this is an important matter. The next day (actually a week later, since you travel by ship) you start running errands in a really huge city. Eder even makes a comment about losing track.

 

Also you have a lot of stuff to micromanage, especially your ship, but also companions, factions and your personal fame. You have to make a lot of choices, like distributing skills on a borderline overwhelming skill tree, but can't really judge their outcome, since combat is very rare. And select a ship crew out of lots of NPCs, which all have different skills and character traits. And spend money you don't have on ship stuff you can't judge what it does. And hey, your cook broke her hand and morale goes down, since you don't have beer on board, manage that! Also there are several factions you can side with or not, but don't really get an idea how and why that matters and what consequences this will have in the future. There is one larger dungeon (a mansion of some kind), but the reason to enter it seems miniscule and also requires to take a side between two factions, where you can only talk to one of them. All other fights are simple brawls, a lot of buildings and persons have no meaning (yet).

 

I feel very lost and without a red thread. I know sooner or later everything will be pieced together, but the start is really rough. First you are drawn in, then you are let go. Everything you do feels pointless compared to your really important main quest.

 

It's still a good game, don't get me wrong :)



#35
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I do agree with the general issues with the plot. For example the other stuff going on in gilded vale is more interesting than what is going on with the main plot. The main plot doesn't really get interesting until defiance bay and then lady Webb kind of ruins it by just telling you everything. Like I kinda worked out the big reveal at the end of pillars before the end but they could have dropped a few more hints I guess. The stuff in the white march dlc is a bit better for that but that came out after the game so many players including myself played that after they had already finished the game.

On the other hand I appreciate what they were going for with the story. There are aspects of it that are very interesting and in general the writing is good.

The slow start helps push you to explore and learn about the world. So I don't really see that as much of a problem.

The info dumps are a little irritating I agree but it's not exactly a new thing either.

#36
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I am a few hours into Deadfire and can confirm that, the pacing just feels wrong at the start. One day, you watch the gods discussing and get the feeling that this is an important matter. The next day (actually a week later, since you travel by ship) you start running errands in a really huge city. Eder even makes a comment about losing track.

Also you have a lot of stuff to micromanage, especially your ship, but also companions, factions and your personal fame. You have to make a lot of choices, like distributing skills on a borderline overwhelming skill tree, but can't really judge their outcome, since combat is very rare. And select a ship crew out of lots of NPCs, which all have different skills and character traits. And spend money you don't have on ship stuff you can't judge what it does. And hey, your cook broke her hand and morale goes down, since you don't have beer on board, manage that! Also there are several factions you can side with or not, but don't really get an idea how and why that matters and what consequences this will have in the future. There is one larger dungeon (a mansion of some kind), but the reason to enter it seems miniscule and also requires to take a side between two factions, where you can only talk to one of them. All other fights are simple brawls, a lot of buildings and persons have no meaning (yet).

I feel very lost and without a red thread. I know sooner or later everything will be pieced together, but the start is really rough. First you are drawn in, then you are let go. Everything you do feels pointless compared to your really important main quest.

It's still a good game, don't get me wrong :)

Isn't this just the same as bg2 thouh? The begining sets up the plot and then you are dumped into athkatla where u then do a whole bunch of unrelated side quests and explore the city/surrounding area. For the most part the plot doesn't pick up again until about halfway through the game. Despite the fact that there is definitely a sense of urgency there too.
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#37
adreeasa

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In BG2 you spend the first part of the game gathering a party to help you get revenge/save Imoen/both, and you tell them that from the start. You explore to find someone who can help you track Irenicus down and do odd jobs to help you fund said expedition.

 

I am curious if Deadfire gives you the same sense of purpose in the first half , the first game certainly did not.



#38
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In BG2 you spend the first part of the game gathering a party to help you get revenge/save Imoen/both, and you tell them that from the start. You explore to find someone who can help you track Irenicus down and do odd jobs to help you fund said expedition.

I am curious if Deadfire gives you the same sense of purpose in the first half , the first game certainly did not.


Sure but it's not like you have much on an idea how to start tracking Theos in pillars either. Just a few leads.

Deadfire isn't as much of an urgent thing for one thing your task is kind of updated as u go along.

#39
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The question is, why would i care about Thaos ? He said some mambo-jumbo near a big statue and i have nightmares or stuff ? Is that reason enough for some dude who is(or wants to be ) a farmer to go fighting trolls ?


Edited by adreeasa, 11 May 2018 - 03:46 AM.


#40
Mikeymoonshine

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The question is, why would i care about Thaos ? He said some mambo-jumbo near a big statue and i have nightmares or stuff ? Is that reason enough for some dude who is(or wants to be ) a farmer to go fighting trolls ?


You go to see maerwald to get answers on the whole watcher thing and it's on the way to defiance bay which is the most reasonable place to go next as staying in gilded vale isn't an option. Once u have seen maerwald you learn about the whole losing your mind thing and there you have your reason.

This is just about as reasonable a motivation as any other RPG of this type but for some reason people defend other games and act like it's a big problem here.





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