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Chris Avellone: The Final Frontier


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Comes across as a bad therapy session. Clearly the method isn't working.

 

my issue with MCA is that he has been rehashing old ideas in many of the characters that he has written after Torment and I have not seen anything from him that is nearly as memorable for a very long time now.

 

That really overshadows the entire nonsensical controversy for me. We're here for the games, not to be an ethics board. Presumably.

 

He wrote Durance, right? It's the most annoyingly overwritten, repetitive bull****ter I've seen in a video game. I'd say that's the problem right there.

What about Ulysses from Lonesome Road? Stuck in the same style of expression, which isn't necessarily bad if it weren't a completely uninteresting and obvious circle, same thing with the cartoonish Old World Blues. But eh, everybody likes their own thing and some people seemed to love it, but that style is not for me.
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Well, not to state the obvious, but is a bit of context missing - maybe that poster and him have been sniping at each other a lot ?

 

Yes, they've had prior interactions. Context is missing. As with other snips of things he's said in this thread.

 

As I mentioned before in this thread, one really should read that thread, before commenting here. Certainly before offering criticism. It's an increasingly long read of course, and much of it is skippable (I mostly just scan for Chris's or other Dev posts), but I do think worth the read. 

 

A thread about an ongoing thread is kind of meh. I'm here as I'm curious for reactions and how much diehard loyalty there is here.

 

Avellone is more than a little believable, and despite the insinuations of some in this thread, he's not inconsistent, nor acting out of drunkenness.

 

The best that I can tell is that he'd had enough of being asking questions based on false assumptions, and hearing a false narrative of events. He'd kept a lot bottled up and one day he said "'**** it', I'm not keeping these secrets anymore, who wants to know what? I'll tell ya". That's something I and I'm sure others can relate to.

 

As with all of the best writers Avellone has a deeper understanding than most of human nature, and in order to get that understanding one has to have to have a great appreciation for the truth, as well as to be very human themselves.

Edited by Valsuelm
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The truth seeking is nonsense. Most people should know of Obsidian's shaky past, and on the flipside, that Avellone has had disdain of management for years, all that's missing is the details and these are one-sided, no matter how "true", and really isn't anyone's business.

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Avellone is more than a little believable, and despite the insinuations of some in this thread, he's not inconsistent, nor acting out of drunkenness.

 

 

Bro, he's persistently and reliably inconsistent- the only thing consistent is the 'in' in front of 'consistent'. Doesn't necessarily mean that he's wrong, but that certainly isn't evidence that he's right.

 

I do wish people would drop the drink accusations though.

 

As with all of the best writers Avellone has a deeper understanding than most of human nature, and in order to get that understanding one has to have to have a great appreciation for the truth, as well as to be very human themselves.

 

 

...

 

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand MCA. His posting style is extremely subtle and without a solid grasp of office politics the points will go over a typical reader's head. There's also Chris's nihilus development which is a deftly woven character- his characteristics draws heavily freom Vhilor in PST for example. His fans understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of his commentary, to realise that they're not just well written characters and complaints about management, they say something deep about existence. As a consequnce people who don't believe Chris truly are idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate the accuracy in Chris's existential catchphrase "tinynickinyourmouth", which is itself a cryptic reference to the guy's username. I'm smirking right now imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as MCA's genius wit unfolds itself on the Codex. What fools, how I pity them.

 

Any yes, by the way, I do have an MCA tattoo. And no, you cannot see it, it's for Codexer's eyes only- and even then they'd have to demonstrate that they're within 2 years of my join date (preferably older) beforehand and have at least 10k parrots received. Nothing personnel, vals.

Edited by Zoraptor
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As with all of the best writers Avellone has a deeper understanding than most of human nature, and in order to get that understanding one has to have to have a great appreciation for the truth, as well as to be very human themselves.

 

 

True, I tried having my cat read his posts to engage in the debate but I think human writing just confused him.

Edited by algroth
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My Twitch channel: https://www.twitch.tv/alephg

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His statements about Feargus get more and more damning... I wonder if Obsidian can ignore this forever. Most of all this is all very sad to me. I'm not gonna let it ruin my excitement for Deadfire but it certainly is troubling.

Edited by Vyrulisse
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To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand MCA. His posting style is extremely subtle and without a solid grasp of office politics the points will go over a typical reader's head. There's also Chris's nihilus development which is a deftly woven character- his characteristics draws heavily freom Vhilor in PST for example. His fans understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of his commentary, to realise that they're not just well written characters and complaints about management, they say something deep about existence. As a consequnce people who don't believe Chris truly are idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate the accuracy in Chris's existential catchphrase "tinynickinyourmouth", which is itself a cryptic reference to the guy's username. I'm smirking right now imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as MCA's genius wit unfolds itself on the Codex. What fools, how I pity them.

 

Any yes, by the way, I do have an MCA tattoo. And no, you cannot see it, it's for Codexer's eyes only- and even then they'd have to demonstrate that they're within 2 years of my join date (preferably older) beforehand and have at least 10k parrots received. Nothing personnel, vals.

More effort than this deserves but hilarious nonetheless.
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Avellone is more than a little believable, and despite the insinuations of some in this thread, he's not inconsistent, nor acting out of drunkenness.

 

 

Bro, he's persistently and reliably inconsistent- the only thing consistent is the 'in' in front of 'consistent'. Doesn't necessarily mean that he's wrong, but that certainly isn't evidence that he's right.

 

I do wish people would drop the drink accusations though.

 

As with all of the best writers Avellone has a deeper understanding than most of human nature, and in order to get that understanding one has to have to have a great appreciation for the truth, as well as to be very human themselves.

 

 

...

 

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand MCA. His posting style is extremely subtle and without a solid grasp of office politics the points will go over a typical reader's head. There's also Chris's nihilus development which is a deftly woven character- his characteristics draws heavily freom Vhilor in PST for example. His fans understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of his commentary, to realise that they're not just well written characters and complaints about management, they say something deep about existence. As a consequnce people who don't believe Chris truly are idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate the accuracy in Chris's existential catchphrase "tinynickinyourmouth", which is itself a cryptic reference to the guy's username. I'm smirking right now imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as MCA's genius wit unfolds itself on the Codex. What fools, how I pity them.

 

Any yes, by the way, I do have an MCA tattoo. And no, you cannot see it, it's for Codexer's eyes only- and even then they'd have to demonstrate that they're within 2 years of my join date (preferably older) beforehand and have at least 10k parrots received. Nothing personnel, vals.

 

Masterful. Have you considered a job writing RPG companions?

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His statements about Feargus get more and more damning... I wonder if Obsidian can ignore this forever. Most of all this is all very sad to me. I'm not gonna let it ruin my excitement for Deadfire but it certainly is troubling.

It's only troubling if you accept everything he's saying at face value.

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"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

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The best that I can tell is that he'd had enough of being asking questions based on false assumptions, and hearing a false narrative of events. He'd kept a lot bottled up and one day he said "'**** it', I'm not keeping these secrets anymore, who wants to know what? I'll tell ya". 

In order to get that understanding one has to have to have a great appreciation for the truth, as well as to be very human themselves.

 

Yeah. Likely story, especially given the timing of this eruption of pent-up "truth".

 

TivYd1U.jpg

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*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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Obsidian's Glassdoor is an interesting read. Not as good as my old firm, but still.

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Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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His statements about Feargus get more and more damning... I wonder if Obsidian can ignore this forever. Most of all this is all very sad to me. I'm not gonna let it ruin my excitement for Deadfire but it certainly is troubling.

It's only troubling if you accept everything he's saying at face value.

 

If only half of what he's saying lately is true then it's still troubling. This is some pretty harsh stuff.

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Love the drama, but could someone please summarize the whole thing, as I kinda got lost on page 3.

 

 Sure. Obsidian is about to release Pillars 2: Deadfire. If it's good, consider backing or buying the next game they make. Avellone is working on a game with Owlcat games called Kingmaker. If you try that game,  and like it, consider backing or buying the next game that they make.

 

 Let's see ... yeah ... that's pretty much it.

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Problem is... Obsidian is silent on the matter... and i understand that since POE2 is about to release.

 

 

You know why? Because their lawyer has probably told them to shut the **** up in case they are planning to take it to court. Chris is looking for reactions and they aren't playing his game.

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Hate the living, love the dead.

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my issue with MCA is that he has been rehashing old ideas in many of the characters that he has written after Torment and I have not seen anything from him that is nearly as memorable for a very long time now.

 

That really overshadows the entire nonsensical controversy for me. We're here for the games, not to be an ethics board. Presumably.

 

He wrote Durance, right? It's the most annoyingly overwritten, repetitive bull****ter I've seen in a video game. I'd say that's the problem right there.

I made a similar observation on Reddit the other week. To my surprise he responded.

 

Durance was nothing more than Ignus and Kreia. Not a bad mix, but not a new character either. Same thing with Shape of Fire in MotB; an old character with a new name.

 

 

MotB and KOTOR2 were full of Torment-like characters. 

 

It was particularly noticeable because they all speak in the same wordy, troubled, existential style and carry similar 'spiritual' baggage.

 

Don't get me wrong, it's still better than daddy-issues Bioware, but MCA has been orbiting the same muse for a while now.

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И погибе Српски кнез Лазаре,
И његова сва изгибе војска, 
Седамдесет и седам иљада;
Све је свето и честито било
И миломе Богу приступачно.

 

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Avellone is more than a little believable, and despite the insinuations of some in this thread, he's not inconsistent, nor acting out of drunkenness.

 

 

Bro, he's persistently and reliably inconsistent- the only thing consistent is the 'in' in front of 'consistent'. Doesn't necessarily mean that he's wrong, but that certainly isn't evidence that he's right.

 

I do wish people would drop the drink accusations though.

 

As with all of the best writers Avellone has a deeper understanding than most of human nature, and in order to get that understanding one has to have to have a great appreciation for the truth, as well as to be very human themselves.

 

 

...

 

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand MCA. His posting style is extremely subtle and without a solid grasp of office politics the points will go over a typical reader's head. There's also Chris's nihilus development which is a deftly woven character- his characteristics draws heavily freom Vhilor in PST for example. His fans understand this stuff, they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depth of his commentary, to realise that they're not just well written characters and complaints about management, they say something deep about existence. As a consequnce people who don't believe Chris truly are idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate the accuracy in Chris's existential catchphrase "tinynickinyourmouth", which is itself a cryptic reference to the guy's username. I'm smirking right now imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as MCA's genius wit unfolds itself on the Codex. What fools, how I pity them.

 

Any yes, by the way, I do have an MCA tattoo. And no, you cannot see it, it's for Codexer's eyes only- and even then they'd have to demonstrate that they're within 2 years of my join date (preferably older) beforehand and have at least 10k parrots received. Nothing personnel, vals.

 

 

I've never seen you triggered so badly, what's gotten into you

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И погибе Српски кнез Лазаре,
И његова сва изгибе војска, 
Седамдесет и седам иљада;
Све је свето и честито било
И миломе Богу приступачно.

 

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As a 'professional statement taker' I know well the eternal truth of Babylon 5. Understanding is a three sided sword. There is your side, their side, and the truth. And so far we only one of the sides. Understanding is yet far away.

 

But 'truthfully'  I don't care to find out about out what the other sides have to say at this point. Because even if Avellone is speaking completely factually - so what? Obsidian's owners are incompetent/ruthless? There is nepotism going on in the company? As a consumer of RPG video games what is that to me? The game is either good or it isn't, and I enjoy it or I won't. So far, I can't recall an Obsidian game I've played that I did not immensely enjoy, games Obsidian made while Avellone worked there and games they made after he left.

 

If Obsidian did him wrong - fine. Let him seek restitution through the civil and criminal justice systems. The courts and the police are open. Yet, wait, he hasn't, hasn't he? What police reports or  lawsuits has he filed? None? Then I suppose it wasn't that bad, was it? And if whatever wrong he suffered wasn't severe enough for him to seek formal restitution for himself then it wasn't severe enough to prevent me from enjoying the game I've backed.  

 

Of course, Avellone has now stated or made allusions to on the other forum that legal action is imminent - years after he left the company. Paradox is suddenly contacting him a year and a half after Tyranny was released because "they aren't happy with Obsidian" even though there are interviews on the web stating they would love to work with Obsidian again (like this one: https://www.pcgamesn.com/tyranny/tyranny-sales-paradox-obsidian )

 

Yet, only the cusp of a major Obsidian release does Avellone, who works for a competitor on a rival project, suddenly get on the forums and start making these allegations and allusions.

 

A big game is about to be released and this should be a joyous time for at all, yet this does this mudslinging sour it. Maybe you haven't realized it yet, Avellone, but its hard to sling mud without getting muddy yourself. Whatever.  I'm going to enjoy this game in spite of you.

Edited by TheBombPhilosopher
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Chris is actively encuraging Obsidian workers to confirm his claims.

 

lzHchei.jpg

 

...

 

Chris says that _nick is a shill, DU facetiously says he's on Obs' payroll and Chris takes it seriously?

 

lolwut.

 

He says "IF you are an Obsidian worker etc", he is not sure about that.The message here is that Chris is actively encouraging Obsidian workers to confirm his claims, if they indeed work at Obsidian.

J_C from Codexia

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