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Why I think a fully voiced PoE:Deadfire is a mistake


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All dialogue in the game is voiced.

 

I am in Neketaka, doing quests. After every cleared dungeon and finished quest, I go and offload the loot to the same few shopkeeps in the market district.

 

Every time I want to sell loot, I will have to hear the same "Good business to you, mahuamana!" line, over and over again. Because the game is fully voiced.

 

All dialogue in the game is voiced.

 

I am walking around the city central square, or in front of the queen's palace. I hear the same beggar, the same cheese vendor, or whatever, spouting the same "Spare a coin!"/"Buy delicious clams!". As I am going to sleep, after having played up to 3AM, I will still hear these voices in my head. Because the game is fully voiced.

 

All dialogue in the game is voiced.

 

I am walking around any settlement in the game, doesn't matter which. Random people are going about their randomly triggering exchanges - "Do you think the weather is improving" - "No, but I heard rumours that the mayor has changed his underpants last week". These conversations are looping every other minute. I keep hearing them every time I pass by those random dudes. After a while, I start avoiding certain streets and NPCs in the area, because I'm sick of death of their repetitive conversations. A feature that was fun in the beginning is now tiresome to hear. Because the game is fully voiced.

 

All dialogue in the game is voiced. Have you started ignoring these last two sentences yet? Why? Reread them again! It's so much fun!

 

I am walking around town. The aforementioned NPCs dialogues kick in. I am hearing them for the Nth time. But suddenly, one of my companions starts his/her own conversation with another one of my companions! Wow, that's gonna be something fun, I want to hear it, shut up annoying NPC dudes! I try to run away into a side street, but oh no, I missed it! Because the game is fully voiced.

 

10/10

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A Custom Editor for Deadfire's Data:
eFoHp9V.png

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There is some truth in what you wrote. But personally I think after suffering through the repetitionsrepetitionsrepetitions... in DOS2 I can also survive them in PoED. Voiced actors make some sense for me, I liked it in DOS2 in the end.

 

What would make me reconsider even buying PoED would be voiced narrator story telling which could not be disabled separately.

Edited by geala
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Firstly, you can turn off voice seperately. Do that if you're so annoyed by voices.

 

Secondly, don't become the new "in the infinity engine games" group.

 

Thirdly, whatever the case, it's done and it's not changing. Go back to secondly.

Edited by Sedrefilos
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If POE2 being in this respect like almost every other game on the market then this must be a difficult hobby to enjoy. Most people aren’t bothered by it and prefer full voice acting, so from a financial perspective it can hardly be considered a mistake.

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Firstly, you can turn off voice seperately. Do that if you're so annoyed by voices.

I see you are having difficulty, or pretending that you are, understanding a simple argument.

 

I'll try to make it easy - Disliking full VO is not equal to disliking ALL VO. Got it? This means that turning off ALL VO is not a cure for the annoyance of having FULL VO.

 

Secondly, don't become the new "in the infinity engine games" group.

In the infinity engine games, with their more limited resources VO was handled in an inventive and I think ultimately better way for the player. Two examples:

 

Most NPCs would have a set of voiced lines which were played at random when you initiated dialogue. Although they were not corresponding to the text of the dialogue, they gave you an idea about the NPC, which is ultimately the point in an isometric game where you don't have much animations and can't see the face of the character.

 

Dialogues involving party members would pause the game and take place in the conversation UI, instead of hovering text. I don't know at what point and who in Obsidian got the idea that having hovering text and voiced conversations between party members play out while we are travelling through an area and my camera is on the other end of the map, is very good for my `immurshun` as opposed to having a conversation which pauses the gameplay... but they were wrong.

 

Anyway, let's really skip comparing to the IE games, because the comparisons wouldn't be in your favor. Which you would have known for yourself, if you knew the IE games.

 

Thirdly, whatever the case, it's done and it's not changing.

Slow down, scooter. You are not the authority on what is changing and what isn't.
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A Custom Editor for Deadfire's Data:
eFoHp9V.png

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the problem with full vo is cost.  full vo is, 'ccording to developers, extreme expensive.  fantastic vo can make a good game better, but it can't make a bad game good.  decent vo, on the other hand, is largely forgettable, and is nevertheless costly. there were a couple instances o' nice vo in poe, but fantastic were the exception rather than the rule.  if deadfire vo is similar in quality to poe, it will be similarly hit and miss.  as such, am not thinking full vo improves deafire much and all that money spent on vo coulda' instead been spent on more substantive aspects o' game development.  

 

HA! Good Fun!

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"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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Gairnulf, you are doing the exact same thing the "in the infinity engine" group did. Complaining about a thing that's already implemented and it's not going to change. They won't just toss away all that dialogue they paid to record three weeks before launch just because some oldies don't like full vo. It's common sense, not authority. 

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I must be an utter CRPG freak or something, but repetitive VO lines and voiced bark strings get my juices flowing! I often love this repetition, it's like comfort food to my ears. 

 

Still, to this day, when I hear a number of classic lines and barks from BG and especially NWN1, I almost tear up.

 

Well, I'm exaggerating a bit, but I do really like it - and to me it fits the CRPG bill. I'm expecting this repetition. However, a few lines are always worse than others, and I'm glad we can tone down companion banter frequency, for instance.

Edited by IndiraLightfoot
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*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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Let's see...halibut....sheep's cheese.....tomatoes...

Let's see...halibut....sheep's cheese.....tomatoes...

Let's see...halibut....sheep's cheese.....tomatoes...

 

 

But I don't mind because nobody has as many friends as the man with many cheeses.

Edited by Queeg
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If my post hasn't been edited yet, I'm still looking to find the error I made typing it.

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Gairnulf, you are doing the exact same thing the "in the infinity engine" group did. Complaining about a thing that's already implemented and it's not going to change. They won't just toss away all that dialogue they paid to record three weeks before launch just because some oldies don't like full vo. It's common sense, not authority. 

Nobody said anything about undoing the voiced dialogue.An idea option would be a toggle to have as much as the first game was voiced to be voiced. I always felt that was an idea amount. Just enough for some flavor. I don't see why you're complaining about feedback either. Yeah it's probably too late for this game but there's always the next one.

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"Rip Deadfire

 

Long live Pillars 1. Oh well, Eora was nice while it lasted."

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nope. I for one, I am glad to see it is fully voiced. I'm looking forward to seeing how this affects the literature and the world + lore in the game compared to the first abd I know many will be surprised at just how good Obsidian covered it up.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Prepare to be annoyed...

 

Just not as nearly as annoyed as we were hearing "You must gather your party before venturing forth".

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Just what do you think you're doing?! You dare to come between me and my prey? Is it a habit of yours to scurry about, getting in the way and causing bother?

 

What are you still bothering me for? I'm a Knight. I'm not interested in your childish games. I need my rest.

 

Begone! Lest I draw my nail...

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the problem with full vo is cost.  full vo is, 'ccording to developers, extreme expensive.  fantastic vo can make a good game better, but it can't make a bad game good.  decent vo, on the other hand, is largely forgettable, and is nevertheless costly. there were a couple instances o' nice vo in poe, but fantastic were the exception rather than the rule.  if deadfire vo is similar in quality to poe, it will be similarly hit and miss.  as such, am not thinking full vo improves deafire much and all that money spent on vo coulda' instead been spent on more substantive aspects o' game development.  

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

This is a legitimate concern IMHO. Where I draw the line on VO is when content has to be cut, or dialogs simplified, to accomodate it. However there are two points to consider:

 

1. Nobody could accuse Larian of cutting or simplifying content for DOS2, they just sucked up the cost of it. And it was I think almost certainly as resounding success in terms of sales which is all to the good in my book. I think it paid for itself twice over at least. There aren't 1.5m+ IE game nuts still around to account for it. These are new players and they are used to full VO and notice it bad when it's missing.

 

2. In the case of Deadfire since the decision to record the entire game was made long after the text was written, edited and tested, we can be sure we are getting the full monte, no cuts, no compromises. I think Obsidian have looked at how the full VO in DOS2 was recieved, shook the piggy bank, and decided to have a punt on it themselves. I would wager it will pay for itself many times over similar to DOS2. And if it does it's already paid for full VO on the next installment. If it increases the audience I'm all for it, end of.

 

Another point, seeing as I come from "full VO over my dead body" camp until very recently, is that DOS2 has definitely changed my viewpoint. The fact is that characters like Lohse and particularly Red Prince really came to life in that game for me. VO works bascically. The only remaining concern I have is over the possibility of watering down content in the future as a result of VO costs. Any sniff of that and my torch and pitchfork are out of the shed licketysplit.

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Well, at least it's far better than partial voice acting which, to me, makes games feel awkward at times.

 

I have been told all these years that partial (minimal voice acting) in rpg's is the "best" way but it's not. It is a good excuse for a half-arse'd job though. There's nothing quite like the first paragraph of an important npc being voiced and the rest being non-voiced. It's just weird and feels incomplete... I no longer feel like I'm reading a great novel but a novel interupted by someone trying to call me on the phone. It's a....troubling thing. I've learned that partial/limited voice overs can never compare to full voices or none at all because of this.

 

Personally, I love to read (dare I say too much, though it's probably obvious by now), I'd just rather have a game either with no voice overs at all or with full voice overs. The vast majority of rpg's are either fully voiced or not at all and when their writing is centered well around that, it really shines. For Crpg's this is no different.

 

I always did question why my party was able to speak when given a command but then not in general. The "As you wish" and other lines in Baldurs Gate for example felt plastic because of it.

 

What is the point here exactly? Obsidian went bold and all out. Huge kudos for them I can't wait to hear every npc in Nekataka. You would do well to follow my example and support this trend for Crpg's within the industry.

 

We should be more concerned about how messy the balance is and the refinment of combat...

 

 

 

Cheers!

Just what do you think you're doing?! You dare to come between me and my prey? Is it a habit of yours to scurry about, getting in the way and causing bother?

 

What are you still bothering me for? I'm a Knight. I'm not interested in your childish games. I need my rest.

 

Begone! Lest I draw my nail...

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Remembering everyone’s beloved BG where barkstrings were on a three second repeat (literally).

 

But that was everyone’s beloved BG so that’s ok.

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"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

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Yes indeedy! Yes indeedly-do....

 

It was absolutely horrid but nostalgia goggles are like a few good beers and a dark room ;)

Just what do you think you're doing?! You dare to come between me and my prey? Is it a habit of yours to scurry about, getting in the way and causing bother?

 

What are you still bothering me for? I'm a Knight. I'm not interested in your childish games. I need my rest.

 

Begone! Lest I draw my nail...

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Well, at least it's far better than partial voice acting which, to me, makes games feel awkward at times.

 

I have been told all these years that partial (minimal voice acting) in rpg's is the "best" way but it's not. It is a good excuse for a half-arse'd job though. There's nothing quite like the first paragraph of an important npc being voiced and the rest being non-voiced. It's just weird and feels incomplete... I no longer feel like I'm reading a great novel but a novel interupted by someone trying to call me on the phone. It's a....troubling thing. I've learned that partial/limited voice overs can never compare to full voices or none at all because of this.

This is one of those subjective things, but for me the partial way is the best.  It gives me enough of a feel for each character, and establishes their voice, but doesn't slow me down too much.  Conversely, no VO is boring and full VO is too slow.

I read way faster than they speak - full VO may add hours to my playthrough (LOL).   Trying to read ahead while the VO is still going gets annoying at best and tricky at worst.  But I still want to hear each character's voice, tone, etc at the beginning of a conversation.

There was a good suggestion in the other thread for a hotkey toggle - turn off the VO once you've had enough and just want to read - turn it back on when you want too.  That'd satisfy both camps.

Edited by Silent Winter
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Guest 4ward

full VO doesn‘t necessarily fit this style of game where lines are presented in a box like if you‘re reading a comic or book (though i understand that it‘s a selling point for Obsidian players thinking ‚the more the better‘). As already mentioned, text/dialogue in this kind of games can also get repetitive unlike in games like Kotor or DA where you have cutscenes for dialogues. Also in regards to immersion, Obsidian would be well advised to invest in partial VO for the localized versions. Subtitles are nice for movies, but there isn‘t anything more immersion breaking than playing a game in say German and then listening to English VO (muting VO as a solution is cheap, we‘re not in text adventure times and players of non-English versions will feel neglected).

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hm....full VO Noober... BG would have been a different and better game :-D

 

 

 

 

But seriously, I'm not bothered by VO at all. In fact in generally like the idea, even though I do read much faster, but so what. Sometimes it is nice to just sit back, just enjoy the story let the atmosphere sink in, emerce myself a bit more, and should it actually annoy me I can always switch voices off. Don't see any problem here.

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During the steaming, the player talks to a spirit, and it has a text wall of description with several short dialogues like "murder!" in it, and it's not voiced.

 

So I'd say whether they voiced all those repeated dialogues just flows on the screen is not clear yet.

 

Also partially voiced never works for me since you choose what dialogue option you choose, unless you only voice the first sentence and nothing else, you'll ended up having a dialogue where one sentence is voiced, the next don't, then the NPC suddenly starts to talk again. It's feels way to strange.

Edited by jf8350143
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