Has there been any news on OBS fixing the Soulbounds for Deadfire?

[master guardian]

In Pillars one the proc chance was to low. 10% on a hit or a crit.

 

So by the time you took into consideration misses and grazes the dam thing basicaly never went off. Then when it did go off they got a save vs reflex, will ect.........

 

I thought most of them where completely bloody useless. 

 

I really  hope OBS realise the mistakes they made with this and address them in Deadfire

Edited March 11, 2018 by master guardian

[Wormerine]

I liked that low chance, and it referred to very unique effects (like spawning wilder). I thought the very idea was to have them do something very cool every once in a while. Like sword in BG2 which had 5% to kill enemy etc.

 

I am not sure if they will take the same approach. There is a soulbound dagger with a cool unique ability (kills with it to regain resources 1ce per rest). I would be happy to see both more consistent soulbound and those with very cool but rare effect.

[algroth]

Considering that you can very well manage to land a hit or crit five, maybe ten times in a single fight (depending who and how many against of course), the 10% chance is actually pretty damn high. So much so that I recall very few fights in which I didn't fight with a group of vessels on my side thanks to the Grey Sleeper (5% chance to invoke vessels). Landing five hits with your weapon, which is perfectly doable, would lead to the initial 10% chance turning into a 41% chance to land the effect. If my maths is right, here's the odds for landing the effect at least once through multiple hits with a 10% proc chance weapon (rounded to the nearest whole number):

 

1 - 10%

2 - 19%

3 - 27%

4 - 34%

5 - 41%

6 - 47%

7 - 52%

8 - 57%

9 - 61%

10 - 65%

 

So what seems like a low chance on paper actually becomes a pretty high chance when considering how *many* hits or crits you land through a single fight, or through the game even. On neutral conditions you ought to be able to land as many hits or crits as you do misses or grazes, since to my understanding you only need a 50+ on the attack roll after factoring in accuracy and deflection to land the hit (off of a d100 roll). So if you're not landing enough hits or crits, maybe you ought to consider buffing up your accuracy?

[huang]

I watched videos of the backer beta and in them soulbound weapons work the same way they did in Pillars 1. Who knows if the reason for that is that some stuff wasn't implemented yet.

[Achilles]

I don’t think I ever had difficulty maxing out soulbounds. Can’t “fix” something that isn’t actually broken?

[Lamppost in Winter]

[master guardian]

if reckon if i had posted

 

"The soulbound proc rate from pillars 1 was to high at 10%, are OBS looking at fixing it by lowering the Proc rate"

 

I would have got a big heap of responses from forum members on this thread arguing that the proc should be raised not lowered"

 

Thats how this forum operates.

 

No seriously the pillars 1 forum is full of hundreds of posts stating that the proc rate for the soulbounds was to low at 10%. It was an issue in the first game that people wanted fixed

[Yosharian]

It probably seems too low but when you actually play it in-game it's not that bad at all

 

I can echo seeing Grey Sleeper summons very, very often

[master guardian]

It probably seems too low but when you actually play it in-game it's not that bad at all

 

I can echo seeing Grey Sleeper summons very, very often

on a barbarian with carnage maybe

[Boeroer]

I also think that the proc chances are generally too low. Problem is that once you include things like Carnage, Driving Flight and Blast suddenly those proc chances are too high. Look at the Redeemer or Unlabored Blade (old version) + Carnage or Stormcaller + Twinned Arrows + Driving Flight... So I guess Obsidian wanted to go a middle route.

Edited March 12, 2018 by Boeroer

[Yosharian]

 

It probably seems too low but when you actually play it in-game it's not that bad at all

 

I can echo seeing Grey Sleeper summons very, very often

on a barbarian with carnage maybe

 

 

Nope, Fighter

[Achilles]

if reckon if i had posted

 

"The soulbound proc rate from pillars 1 was to high at 10%, are OBS looking at fixing it by lowering the Proc rate"

 

I would have got a big heap of responses from forum members on this thread arguing that the proc should be raised not lowered"

 

Thats how this forum operates.

 

No seriously the pillars 1 forum is full of hundreds of posts stating that the proc rate for the soulbounds was to low at 10%. It was an issue in the first game that people wanted fixed

Holy ****! Do you mean to tell me that the Obsidian forums is a place where lots of people with different opinions like to post, and that no matter what you say, you’re bound to find at least a few people who will ageee with you? Amazing.

[master guardian]

I also think that the proc chances are generally too low. Problem is that once you include things like Carnage, Driving Flight and Blast suddenly those proc chances are too high. Look at the Redeemer or Unlabored Blade (old version) + Carnage or Stormcaller + Twinned Arrows + Driving Flight... So I guess Obsidian wanted to go a middle route.

yeah i agree. but dont you think that is a bad decision? letting carnage dictate the proc chance for all weapons?? they should change how carnage works instead of making weapons useless

[Yosharian]

 

I also think that the proc chances are generally too low. Problem is that once you include things like Carnage, Driving Flight and Blast suddenly those proc chances are too high. Look at the Redeemer or Unlabored Blade (old version) + Carnage or Stormcaller + Twinned Arrows + Driving Flight... So I guess Obsidian wanted to go a middle route.

yeah i agree. but dont you think that is a bad decision? letting carnage dictate the proc chance for all weapons?? they should change how carnage works instead of making weapons useless

 

 

Haven't they done exactly that with Deadfire?

[Boeroer]

Yes.

 

For PoE I could have turned the argument around and say: "but don't you think that is a bad decision? Letting soulbounds dictate how Carnage works? They should change the proc chance instead of making Carnage useless."

 

So that has two sides. Carnage is the integral part of a whole class. Changing the mechanics of Carnage when introducing soulbounds would have changed (and maybe broken) the class. So I guess they went with the easier way that is most likely causing less troubles.

And there's not only Carnage, there's Torment's Reach, Blast and Driving Flight/Twinned Arrows, too.

 

The best solution would have been to give dedicated proc chances for each class. But that might have been too much work.

 

Now in Deadfire Carnage doesn't proc anything anymore. But Minor Blights/Blast/Driving Flight and Citzal's Spirit Lance do. So if there will be a soulbound rod or non-weapon items with on-hit proc chances (a bit like Glittering Gauntlets for example) there will be the same problems again.

[master guardian]

carnage does not proc the weapons in DF hahaha that is hillarious

 

yeah you would pick a barb multiclass just for this if you could .........hence why they prob ditched it

[Yosharian]

I always hated Carnage anyway. I'd be really happy if they made Frenzy the built-in ability and Carnage optional.

[master guardian]

barb lovers must be completely and utterly devastated!

[Boeroer]

Well Barbs have some other cool stuff now. I also thought that Carnage was too dominant in PoE (despite being a barb lover). The whole class was solely circling around Carnage (and Heart of Fury) and not much else.

 

I think the effect is too weak in Deadfire at the moment, but it's hard to say. Maybe there will be some nice abilites that alter/buff Carnage a bit.

 

What I don't get though: they changed Carnage so that they won't have all those problems with procs anymore. But at the same time they changed Blast (into something that works like Carnage on PoE) and made it a modal so that everybody can use it with a rod. Now a rogue can do Blinding Strike in an AoE, monks can stun enemies in an AoE and trigger Swift Flurry like crazy with the multiple hit rolls, Paladins can do Flames of Devotions with Blast and so on. Same with Citzal's Spirit Lance and  also Minor Blights (AoE now works like PoE's Carnage did). Why? 

Edited March 13, 2018 by Boeroer

[cokane]

In Pillars one the proc chance was to low. 10% on a hit or a crit.

 

So by the time you took into consideration misses and grazes the dam thing basicaly never went off. Then when it did go off they got a save vs reflex, will ect.........

 

I thought most of them where completely bloody useless. 

 

I really  hope OBS realise the mistakes they made with this and address them in Deadfire

 

Dunno what you're talking about, but I've almost always done playthroughs with Aloth using that soulbound rod, and the dominate goes off all the time. It can actually get quite annoying after awhile.

[Bionick]

I had The Grey Sleeper on my melee wizard. The summoning ability went off in every encounter of at least moderate length, and a lot of quick battles, too.

[Achilles]

 

In Pillars one the proc chance was to low. 10% on a hit or a crit.

 

So by the time you took into consideration misses and grazes the dam thing basicaly never went off. Then when it did go off they got a save vs reflex, will ect.........

 

I thought most of them where completely bloody useless.

 

I really hope OBS realise the mistakes they made with this and address them in Deadfire

Dunno what you're talking about, but I've almost always done playthroughs with Aloth using that soulbound rod, and the dominate goes off all the time. It can actually get quite annoying after awhile.

if I’m remembering names correctly, this isn’t the first time he’s come around, singing this song. Regardless, you are correct; proccing is fine

[Boeroer]

That's because Blast extends the proc chance via AoE onto multiple targets.

For a priest and druid the proc chance is pretty low.

 

Also compare Unlabored Blade on a Barb or Monk with Unlabored Blade on a fighter for example.

Or Stormcaller on a ranger (Twinned Arrows+Driving Flight) with Stormcaller on a chanter or cipher.

 

Grey Sleeper's proc chances trigger all the time with a Barb or a Monk (with Torment's Reach) but less often on other melees.

 

This is a balancing problem for proc chances in PoE.

Edited March 16, 2018 by Boeroer

[morhilane]

What I don't get though: they changed Carnage so that they won't have all those problems with procs anymore. But at the same time they changed Blast (into something that works like Carnage on PoE) and made it a modal so that everybody can use it with a rod. Now a rogue can do Blinding Strike in an AoE, monks can stun enemies in an AoE and trigger Swift Flurry like crazy with the multiple hit rolls, Paladins can do Flames of Devotions with Blast and so on. Same with Citzal's Spirit Lance and  also Minor Blights (AoE now works like PoE's Carnage did). Why?

More like how? and I'm going to bet that Dev A "copy-pasted" the old code for Carnage to the new modal Blast/Citzal's Spirit Lance/Minor Blights and then a bit later Dev B changed Carnage but nobody realized that others were using the old code.

 

And now "fixing" is not a priority compared to adding the new features and fixing more major bugs.

[Boeroer]

Maybe something like that. But why not copy & paste the code from old Blast to new Blast in the first place? It did trigger on-hit/on-crit effects, but at least it didn't translate stuff like Runner's Wounding Shot's hobbling to the AoE. Same with Spirit Lance. They even nerfed Blast, Minor Blights and Spirit Lance once I wrote that Envenomed Strike poisons enemies in an AoE when used with those - and took that "oversight" out of those effects.

 

They had it all fixed (except Carnage) and then *bam* they start all over again with the same stuff. I mean I like Blast or Spirit Lance + Arterial Strike or Stunning Blows in Deadfire - it's powerful and fun and worth to build a whole character around it. I just can't get onto the train of thought...    

Edited March 16, 2018 by Boeroer