Also: what does this mean for the dex vs might/str/res debate? Both Dex and Str give diminishing returns, but the diminishing returns on Dex are much stronger?
Since DEX coefficient is now aggregated additively, it gets diluted by other bonuses. At the same time it's impact is not that much reinforced by maluses... (like MIG was on grazes in PoE1)
because of double inversion.
Here's a mini-comparison:
And what conclusion can we make? Not sure completely, but on first glance I'd say:
- if you have many speed bonuses, it might be better to max MIG > PER >= DEX for auto-dps
- if you have maluses, then it depends how much. At 50% maluses, you might want to either leave DEX at 8 (i.e. some point where PER becomes better investment)
, or max it.
P.S. Btw there is no longer any inter-action delay when auto-attacking. I suppose the delay from PoE1 was related to exit-time
on idle animation, and was finnaly removed.P.P.S. Just a note: that delay wasn't influenced by DEX, that's why I mention it.
Hey MaxQuest, I still have a hard time understanding your speed formula. Can you explain what will be the final recovery for someone in heavy armor using Overdraw (no other bonuses/penalties). And also what would be the recovery of a dual wielder with Two Weapons Style, Frenzy and 20dex (no other penalties)?
Under the current system, it should work like that:
#1. Heavy Armor + Warbow with overdraw:
- base_attack_time: 1.1s
- base_recovery_time: 3.0s
- recovery_steps_sum = (1 - 1/0.645) + (1 - 1/0.5) = -0.55 + -1 = -1.55
- recovery_speed_coef = 1 / (1 - steps_sum) = 1 / 2.55 = 0.392
- final_attack_time = 1.1s
- final_recovery_time = 3.0/0.392 = 7.65s
#2. Dual Sabres, TWS, Frenzy, 20 DEX, no penalties:
- base_attack_time: 0.7s
- base_recovery_time: 3.0s
- attack_steps_sum = (1.25 - 1) + (1.3 - 1) = 0.55
- attack_speed_coef = 0.55 + 1 = 1.55
- recovery_steps_sum = (2 - 1) + (1.2 - 1) + (1.25 - 1) + (1.3 - 1) = 1.2 + 0.55 = 1.75
- attack_speed_coef = 1.75 + 1 = 2.75
- final_attack_time = 0.7 / 1.55 = 0.45s
- final_recovery_time = 3.0/2.75= 1.09s
Is "diminishing returns" the correct term?
Depends on the used definition, and I've seen a few)
Let's take DEX. Each point increases a related action speed bonus in 0.03 increments.
Absolute gain is always the same. But relative gain is going down. Adding 30 extra horsepower to a 500hsp monster, is relatively less than adding those 30 to a 145hsp mini cooper. Or think of adding water drops to the sea.
I call this: "intrinsic diminishing returns".
And if absolute gain was also going down: simply "diminishing returns". That's like in wow, fear once and you get 8s duration; fear again and it will have 4s duration; and 2s on 3rd appliance. You made the same investment, but got a lesser result even in absolute values.
Also, I often use the term "diluted". Think of MIG in PoE1 on crit. Since it was additive, going from 10 to 11 MIG, would net you a 1.53/1.50 = 1.02 (instead of x1.03) increase.
And, the inverse of it would be "reinforced". That's PoE1 MIG on grazes. 0.53/0.5 = 1.06. So if you grazed a lot, and assuming you could not rise your accuracy, you really wanted high MIG score.
Edited by MaxQuest, 03 February 2018 - 08:59 AM.