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Politics Episode 7: Remake of Episode 4

Politics

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#21
HoonDing

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I think he hates ppl called Khan.

 


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#22
Gromnir

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hmmm. 

 

 

the conan bit is a quote attributed to genghis khan.  as such, am betting trump actual has a stash o' khanp0rn he drools over... while eating fried chicken and donuts as he sits on his golden toilet.

 

HA! Good Fun!


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#23
Guard Dog

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You know... it Trump had half a brain (something no one has accused him of in my hearing) he would submit the Paris Accord to the Senate for ratification like Barack Obama should have done. If they ratify we stay in. If they don't we don't. Either way it's off his back and he looks like a hero to the right for following the Constitution.
 
If Obama had any brains, and he's not stupid, he knew an Executive Agreement could be undone by the next executive. And I'm sure he also knew an agreement that placed statutory requirements on private American citizens, subject to punitive actions by entities OUTSIDE of the United States is not an agreement. It's a treaty. Treaties are supposed to be ratified by the Senate. So why didn't he do it? Because more than half of the Senate is voted in by people who didn't vote for him and he can't impose his will on people if that pesky Constitution and democratic process keep getting in the way.

Why would Trump submit something to the Senate that he disagrees with? Then have it certainly defeated and look like he lost? Obama and the Democrats thought they won the demographics war (and they probably have, just not quite yet), so the next President would certainly be a Democrat and follow Obama's policies. Didn't quite work out that way in spite of everyone's expectations. Also Trump could still unilaterally withdraw from a treaty even if it's ratified by the Senate, and a non-treaty agreement can not place statutory requirements on American citizens.

 

 

  1. ​It's too late to do anything like this now. Done is done. So let's get that out of the way first. If he said he was pulling out because it was never submitted to the Senate for ratification he gets two things. He gets the treaty killed without paying a political price because it would never be ratified. Two he looks like a real constitutionalist while doing it. That will appeal to the people he needs to win in 2020. It's a win-win.
  2. The President can NOT unilaterally withdraw from a treaty ratified by the US Senate. Such a treaty is law in the US. The only way he can is if the withdraw is allowed for in the language of the treaty. For example, NATO. The language of that treaty allows for any member to withdraw with a notice of a certain period of time. 1 year IIRC. When George W Bush withdrew from the ABM treaty with Russia he was allowed to do that because the language of the treaty allowed for a withdrawal. Since a ratified treaty has the force of law the President must enforce it. Only Congress can repeal one. Or the supreme court if there is a constitutionality issue. I seem to remember that actually happened once in the '60s.
  3. You're right, a non treaty agreement cannot permit regulatory administration of the activities of the citizens of the Unites States. It's that whole consent of the governed thing. Which is why the Paris "Accords" should have been sent to the Senate in the first place.


#24
Guard Dog

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http://www.npr.org/2...w-legal-hurdles

 

look at what trump left on his desk this morning. another steamy pile o' wtf.

 

*shrug*

 

attempting to come up with reasonable explanations for trump impulse control blunders is becoming increasing difficult.  the only explanation we got is if trump were convinced the travel ban is doomed, it would be better to face inevitable defeat with a show o' strength. core constituents appear ok with trump ineffectiveness as long as he continues to act tough and talk big.  so IF the executive order is a lost cause, it would be better for trump to defend vigorous and then blame Court for failure.  is no other reasonable explanation for the latest trumpism.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Well, I realize this is of small consolation but look at it this way. While this is embarrassing for Americans of an above average education and political awareness it is also a little entertaining waiting to see what he does next.  Also you would have had no joy from a Hillary Clinton administration. Just a whole other set of problems. So really no matter who won last year it was going to suck.

 

As ditzy as he was I voted for the best candidate in 2016. I thought so then... I KNOW it now.  



#25
Amentep

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I hope this thread continues to discuss anything but politics. :p

kp brought up Mummy in the genesis post.  with the new universal monster movies being released, we cannot help but lament the metaphorical death o' the traditional mummy.  no longer is the mummy a revenant punishing those who defile a tomb, but is a demigod/god with apocalyptic intent. blame the brendan fraser rachel weisz films? to keep this political, we can throw out a more sinister (ridiculous) possibility.  given the middle-eastern origin o' the mummy, is the transformation from a singular and limited threat to a danger directed at western culture entire represent transparent and insidious islamophobia on the part o' the movie producers?

 

muahaha.

 

c'mon.  you has seen crazier stuff from breitbart, no?

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

 

First Universal Mummy film w/Karloff has the Mummy/Imhotep not punishing interlopers or defilers; instead he walks out of the tomb area (sure he drives an archeologist mad so doing, but that's he couldn't take the site of the Mummy walking around) and later tries to force the re-incarnation of his lost love.

 

You have to jump forward 8 years to 1940's THE MUMMY'S HAND to get the idea of the Mummy being directed by the High Priest of Karnak to kill all those who'd defile Anaka's tomb.

 

That said, its probably important to point out that the first of the major mummy novels, Stoker's Jewel of the Seven Stars, involves the mummy trying to re-unite her soul (trapped in a mummified cat) with her 'astral body' who happens to be the daughter of one of the expedition leaders who found her tomb.  That a bunch of people end-up dead (at least in the original version) is secondary to her attempt to reunite spirit and body, however its arguable that Queen Tera is the prototype for the super-powered Mummy who could potentially rain destruction down that you see picked up in the Frasier and current films.


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#26
Gfted1

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U.S. State Department approves $750 million Saudi training program sale: Pentagon.

 

WooHoo! Since the border wall is going to run us 1B / 62 miles then this sweet Saudi cherry will cover 46.5 miles! 


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#27
Elerond

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https://www.wsj.com/...udis-1496700739

 

President Donald Trump’s Washington hotel received roughly $270,000 in payments linked to Saudi Arabia as part of a lobbying campaign by the Gulf kingdom against a controversial piece of terrorism legislation last year.

 

The payments—for catering, lodging and parking—were disclosed by the public relations firm MSLGroup last week in paperwork filed with the Justice Department documenting foreign lobbying work on behalf of Saudi Arabia and other clients.

 

As part of a lobbying effort against the bipartisan Justice Against Sponsors of Terrorism Act, or JASTA, Saudi Arabia’s Washington lobbyists and consultants spent approximately $190,000 on lodging, $78,000 on catering, and $1,600 on parking at the Trump International Hotel. The Daily Caller website first reported on the payments.

Mr. Trump last month made Saudi Arabia the first stop of his first international trip as president, and described the country as a key ally in the war on terror and an important partner in bringing peace and stability to the Middle East.

 

Saudi Arabia has been lobbying against JASTA, a law that was passed by Congress over former President Barack Obama’s veto. It allowed Americans to sue foreign governments over terrorists attacks.

 

The payments to the Trump Hotel were made by one of MSLGroup’s subcontractors and reimbursed by the Saudi government, according to Michael Petruzzello, an MSLGroup executive. They were part of a lobbying campaign bringing American military veterans to Capitol Hill to advocate against JASTA, he said.

 

All the hotel spending took place between Nov. 2016 and Feb. 2017, according to Mr. Petruzzello. Most of the payments to the hotel were made before Mr. Trump was officially sworn in as president, but some were in late January and early February—after Mr. Trump became president.

 

Survivors and families of victims of the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks have been pushing for the law so that a lawsuit can proceed against Saudi Arabia for any alleged role in the attacks. The kingdom has denied any involvement and U.S. officials have backed that position.

 

Ethics officials have raised questions about foreign government payments to the Trump Organization. Watchdog groups say the Trump Organization’s business with foreign entities, in particular governments that book rooms or events or other business at the Trump International Hotel near the White House, risks violating a constitutional provision that bars federal officers from accepting payments or gifts from foreign countries without Congress’s consent.



#28
redneckdevil

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So Saudi was smart enough not to blow their whole load on donations to Clinton's presidential campaign and saved some for Trump.
So basically either Clinton or Trump, we would be where we are now....except in a war with Russia.

#29
Bartimaeus

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"Top Secret NSA Report Details Russian Hacking Effort Days Before 2016 Election"

https://webcache.goo...n&ct=clnk&gl=us

Apparently, the lady who leaked this was arrested about an hour after it was leaked.

(e): Also, in other news, CSPAN, FOX, CNN, CBS, ABC, and NBC will all be airing the Comey testimony live this Thursday.

Edited by Bartimaeus, 05 June 2017 - 07:05 PM.

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#30
Agiel

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http://www.npr.org/2...w-legal-hurdles

 

look at what trump left on his desk this morning. another steamy pile o' wtf.

 

*shrug*

 

attempting to come up with reasonable explanations for trump impulse control blunders is becoming increasing difficult.  the only explanation we got is if trump were convinced the travel ban is doomed, it would be better to face inevitable defeat with a show o' strength. core constituents appear ok with trump ineffectiveness as long as he continues to act tough and talk big.  so IF the executive order is a lost cause, it would be better for trump to defend vigorous and then blame Court for failure.  is no other reasonable explanation for the latest trumpism.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

I think Trump's priority is somehow retaining the votes he won in 2016 for the election in 2020 (should he make it that far). Though I'm hesitant to use the tired phrase "if trends hold" since lots can happen in 42 months (see the introductory portion of David Frum's article in the Atlantic for the picture of "things that may be") it looks increasingly unlikely that those who didn't vote for him in 2016 will be swayed given his performance thus far short of Democrat primary voters dropping the ball for their nominee (I remain convinced that in spite of Sanders having some modicum of charisma and having a message that resonated with voters that he would have lost even harder to Trump).


Edited by Agiel, 05 June 2017 - 09:39 PM.


#31
redneckdevil

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I wonder if the Democrats will actually put forth a "good" candidate next election. If so I might vote Democrat.
Also I BETTER see the same hostile Nick picking with the same president whoever the **** it is, or we all biased as ****.

#32
Guard Dog

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Even if they did they will still be Democrats. They will still be the party of no free speech, no private property rights, censoring the internet. They will still try to take guns away from law abiding citizens, and tax everything in sight to fund a federal government that ignores our constitution and grinds our state and local governments into the dirt. The biggest problem is even if one of the two parties runs a great candidate, voting for that candidate empowers all the worst aspects of that party. They way to figure out which side you're on is to look at the worst part of all the political factions and figure out what the country would look like if they suddenly got everything they wanted. Find out who's utopia you'd hate the least and vote for them.


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#33
Guard Dog

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This one bears watching. This is right in Roberts & Sotomayor's wheelhouse: http://reason.com/bl...nificant-4th-am



#34
Wrath of Dagon

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I wonder if the Democrats will actually put forth a "good" candidate next election. If so I might vote Democrat.
Also I BETTER see the same hostile Nick picking with the same president whoever the **** it is, or we all biased as ****.

Ha-ha-ha-ha. The media is the propaganda arm of the Democratic National Committee.

#35
Gromnir

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debbie wasserman schultz is no doubt wanting restitution.  have her own "propaganda arm" public eviscerate her last year and then go after the dnc as a whole  almost immediate after hillary wins the nomination? folks in the media (whatever the hell is the media, 'cause it clear don't include fox, breitbart and many other organizations) clear didn't get the memo... or their check.

 

HA! Good Fun!



#36
Wrath of Dagon

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DWS is a grade A moron. They had to get rid of her to have any chance at all.

#37
Gromnir

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doesn't change the fact the media were pretty ruthless as they went after debbie wasserman schultz and the dnc itself.  sure, much o' the media has a liberal slant, but the notion o' the media working as a propaganda arm for the dnc is utter nonsense and clear refuted by history both recent and long term.

 

and let's not be hypocritical, eh? from the politics 2016/2017 threads it is clear possible for folks to defend grade A morons w/o any sense o' shame or regret. 

 

HA! Good Fun!



#38
Wrath of Dagon

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Once again metaphor is lost on you. Of course I didn't mean to say the MSM is literally employed by the DNC, just that they have a left-wing agenda perfectly in-tune with the Democrat party. That doesn't mean they're all Hillary supporters or Sanders supporters, just that they supported one or the other, and would prefer either to any Republican.

#39
Gfted1

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Top U.S. diplomat in China quits to protest Paris accord exit.

 

That will teach them! :lol:



#40
Gromnir

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Once again metaphor is lost on you. Of course I didn't mean to say the MSM is literally employed by the DNC, just that they have a left-wing agenda perfectly in-tune with the Democrat party. That doesn't mean they're all Hillary supporters or Sanders supporters, just that they supported one or the other, and would prefer either to any Republican.

am not sure you understand metaphor.  perhaps you intended hyperbole?

 

again, the media includes breitbart and fox.  the media, including more liberal sources, clear didn't have an agenda in-tune with the democratic party or hillary or the DNC (which were your specific example) when those liberal media sources were ruthlessly attacking the dnc and its leadership during an election year.  clearly the agenda weren't "in-tune."

 

suggest many major media sources tend to be liberal would be pointless as is not something any would deny.  suggest those liberal media sources would have a tendency to advocate for liberal candidates would also be a kinda pointless observation as is axiomatic.

 

"The media is the propaganda arm of the Democratic National Committee."

 

utter nonsense and is far different than simple recognition o' general alignment o' interests.  hyperbolic nonsense.

 

HA! Good Fun!


Edited by Gromnir, 06 June 2017 - 09:17 AM.






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