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Politics 2017 Part 3


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#641
Ben No.3

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@Longknife
An excellent Diagnosis. I think I might just add some thoughts, though i don't pretend to have the same insight as you appear to have.

I think the situation you describe is an inevitable consequence of both having only two major parties and that those two parties are, politically, in fact very close to each other. Because their differences are, on average, not tremendously big and they are the only parties, this creates a situation where they don't have to cooperate at all.

Because they are ideologically fairly close, the elections will also become elections of emotion by reason. The dogma, the villainification (is that a word? I think you know what I mean...) of the other, and the almost complete absence of reasonable discussion are the consequence.

You don't only need more parties, you also need more parties on the political spectrum than just Center/Center Right (though admittedly Trump and his cabinet seem to turn out more conservative than the average).

#642
Malcador

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I did like the small bits of laughter when he mentioned draining the swamp. Kind of disappointing to hear that in a speech at that level but that's where we are now I guess :)
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#643
BruceVC

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I did like the small bits of laughter when he mentioned draining the swamp. Kind of disappointing to hear that in a speech at that level but that's where we are now I guess :)

Remember the old  " draining the swamp "  from the presidential race, he definitely hasn't achieved much on that front :lol: 



#644
Ben No.3

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Why would Trump want to drain te swamp? He is part of the swamp, and I bet you he likes the swamp as well.

#645
Wrath of Dagon

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Speech apparently well received, but from the reports I read no indication of a pragmatic approach we need to start dealing with the many problems of this country.

#646
BruceVC

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Speech apparently well received, but from the reports I read no indication of a pragmatic approach we need to start dealing with the many problems of this country.

The speech was good but what do you think are the problems he should be attending to first?

 

He is looking at reforming Obamacare, tax cuts for the middle class, he wants to rebuild the military and destroy ISIS amongst other things 



#647
Wrath of Dagon

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Speech apparently well received, but from the reports I read no indication of a pragmatic approach we need to start dealing with the many problems of this country.

The speech was good but what do you think are the problems he should be attending to first?
 
He is looking at reforming Obamacare, tax cuts for the middle class, he wants to rebuild the military and destroy ISIS amongst other things

Those are actually the problems that need addressing. The issue is the Republican ideologues in Congress which will not agree to anything sensible. On Obamacare, they want to simply get rid of it, regardless of people who can't afford medical insurance. On tax cuts, Republicans including Trump, want a huge tax cut and at the same time increased military spending. In addition Trump wants a 1 trillion infrastructure plan, government paid family leave, and assorted other spending increases. All this while we already have a budget deficit that's projected to grow without bound, and a huge amount of unfunded future liabilities. Meanwhile, no one is even talking about bringing medical costs under control, which is the main driver of the budget problems.
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#648
BruceVC

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Speech apparently well received, but from the reports I read no indication of a pragmatic approach we need to start dealing with the many problems of this country.

The speech was good but what do you think are the problems he should be attending to first?
 
He is looking at reforming Obamacare, tax cuts for the middle class, he wants to rebuild the military and destroy ISIS amongst other things

 

Those are actually the problems that need addressing. The issue is the Republican ideologues in Congress which will not agree to anything sensible. On Obamacare, they want to simply get rid of it, regardless of people who can't afford medical insurance. On tax cuts, Republicans including Trump, want a huge tax cut and at the same time increased military spending. In addition Trump wants a 1 trillion infrastructure plan, government paid family leave, and assorted other spending increases. All this while we already have a budget deficit that's projected to grow without bound, and a huge amount of unfunded future liabilities. Meanwhile, no one is even talking about bringing medical costs under control, which is the main driver of the budget problems.

 

You raise some valid considerations . I share some of your concerns



#649
Ben No.3

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Look, WOD sees the problems with having a right wing politician as the man of the working class ;)
You can't have both a deregulated economy and a cared for working class. You can't have both low taxes and fair distribution of wealth, i.e. a large middle class. :p

Edited by Ben No.3, 01 March 2017 - 08:57 AM.


#650
213374U

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I don't see this as an Icarus story. This is a guy undone by his own nature.

 

He lived off of saying controversial things. It was never an issue up until it was decided overnight that its time for it to become an issue. 

 

Literally overnight.

 

http://archive.is/Rhjcj (note timestamp)

 

In the end he's just a pawn, and throwing him under the bus was easier than the alternative. But by doing so they are playing into the shaming game the "establishment/MSM" are running.



#651
Wrath of Dagon

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I don't think Milo was that important to "the movement". It's going to live or die by what Trump and Republicans in Congress do.

#652
Volourn

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The 'movement' won the moment Trump got the presidency.

 

That was a HUGE FU to the 'establishment' even though Trump has BIGLY ties to the establishment but the establishment didn't want him. L0L Politics L0L



#653
HoonDing

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"Those are actually the problems that need addressing. The issue is the Republican ideologues in Congress which will not agree to anything sensible. On Obamacare, they want to simply get rid of it, regardless of people who can't afford medical insurance. On tax cuts, Republicans including Trump, want a huge tax cut and at the same time increased military spending. In addition Trump wants a 1 trillion infrastructure plan, government paid family leave, and assorted other spending increases. All this while we already have a budget deficit that's projected to grow without bound, and a huge amount of unfunded future liabilities. Meanwhile, no one is even talking about bringing medical costs under control, which is the main driver of the budget problems."

 

Maybe he thinks he can just empty Fort Knox.



#654
BruceVC

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The 'movement' won the moment Trump got the presidency.

 

That was a HUGE FU to the 'establishment' even though Trump has BIGLY ties to the establishment but the establishment didn't want him. L0L Politics L0L

What are the objectives of the  " movement  ", if they won what are the outcomes for this victory?



#655
Longknife

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The 'movement' won the moment Trump got the presidency.

 

That was a HUGE FU to the 'establishment' even though Trump has BIGLY ties to the establishment but the establishment didn't want him. L0L Politics L0L

 

It won't do jack if those same establishment players adapt their bets to co-align with him, which they're already doing.

 

This isn't progress, this is "we could've fallen off Mt. Everest but instead we only fell off K2."



#656
Raithe

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On the random innocent-whistling on some of the political spectrum..

 

16681764_1245377968887885_39165616864029


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#657
Chilloutman

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#658
TrueNeutral

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At 33 pages this one's overdue. Say goodnight to this thread, make a new one if you want.




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