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Headgear Poll  

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  1. 1. Should we be able to enchant Helms, Hats & Hoods?



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I remember when I first started playing this game and I found my first helm and noticed two things:

 

1. It had no Damage Reduction contribution despite being a metal helm.

 

2. It could not be enchanted.

 

I then came to the conclusion that, like pets, helms and hoods and whatever else you put on your head were essentially cosmetic items in this game. A few hours later I come across the The Pilgrim's Lasting Vigil Helm in the Temple of Eothas with its +1 to Resolve and Perception.  Later on, I am trying to justify putting the Hermit's Hat on my Cipher for its +1 to Might while trying not to hurl at the sight of it. I hope you can see the problem here.

 

I am now in a good position, with a large stockpile of resources and the ability to turn any piece of armor into great gear. Yet despite the ability to buff even normal Dyrewood Clothing to Exceptional status and grace it with all sort of enchants I am yet relegated to parceling out a rag-tag assortment of helms and hats that are the only ones in the game I can find with any stats. I just think this is silly; we have a great helm that looks awesome on Edér but I have to opt instead for a hood that increases perception but is meant for a stealthy character because that is all I have for him.

 

It does not have to be game breaking, and I can indeed go without even putting a helm on anyone for the whole game. But I just want the same range of choices for what goes on my character's head as I do for his or her chest armor & clothing.

 

Basically, headgear is a big deal and at present it feels like an incomplete feature in the game. What do you guys think? 

Edited by Venatio

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I don't want to be able to enchant them, but I would like to be able to transfer the enchantments between different pieces of headgear for cosmetic effect.

  • Like 8

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I think that the enchanting system is lackluster and that itemization feels hollow, and the way everything is broken up into enchants, whether you can enchant that specific enchant yourself or not, and no matter what the item actually *is*, contributes greatly to that.

 

So I'm not sure I want them to be enchantable. I voted "yes", because at the end of the day, I want to be able to do *something* with them.

 

But related to the issue, what I want more is for helmets and hats to matter, and for it to matter to a sensible degree. For example, at the very least, most helmets should have some kind of minor Deflection or Defense bonus, even if it's just a tiny Hit-to-Graze or Crit-to-Hit ratio.

 

The fact that I can't run around in my white hood the entire game saddens me.

Edited by Luckmann
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I think that the enchanting system is lackluster and that itemization feels hollow, and the way everything is broken up into enchants, whether you can enchant that specific enchant yourself or not, and no matter what the item actually *is*, contributes greatly to that.

Oh good, it's not just me.

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I've been thinking about that itemization issue... and I think it may be more of a presentation problem than a substantive one.

 

The item properties are broken down into enchantments, as you say. It makes them feel banal, interchangeable, and mass-produced, even if they have cool descriptions, and even if mechanically they're "the same thing" as in the IE games. "Spellbind - Jolting Touch" just sounds inherently duller than "Does an additional 20 points of electrical damage on critical hit." 

 

(Not a fan of the enchantment/crafting mechanics either. Making it as easy as click-click-click loses the magic. I had most fun with NWN2 OC's crafting in that series, and it was the most restrictive and arguably frustrating one.)

  • Like 4

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I don't mind them starting out as cosmetic, but being able to add a minor enchantment or two to them would be nice.

  • Like 5

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I thought this was going to be a thread about the need for a "hide helmet" toggle, because IMO that's wha the helmet situation in this game needs the most.

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Being able to enchant every piece of item (e.g. cloaks, too, since people would want to wear their favourite cloak) would quickly destroy the itemisation system as it stands. A more significant reworking would be required. Itemisation is not great, and it would benefit from one anyway. 

 

One simple option is to add a cosmetic enchantment where you do the same thing, gold and some ingredients, then transform just the icon and model of a given helm or cloak. I don't think this should be available for armour and weaponry, because there's a point to making them distinctly identifiable and making unique ones look special, but there aren't really any such unique helms/cloaks. 

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I do not think that helmets should be enchantable and I am pretty happy with the way they work currently, since the only benefits they give are so small that I can justify not wearing them at all. On top of that, you can disable them for specific party members via console without losing achievements.

 

That said, I am unhappy that all enchanted helms (except the deer head) are extremely bland looking and that there are no good looking plate helmets. Some nice unique hats and helmets would have been nice.

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I thought this was going to be a thread about the need for a "hide helmet" toggle, because IMO that's wha the helmet situation in this game needs the most.

I thought that was a universal truth for all games. Head gear is always f'ugly.  ;)

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Being able to enchant every piece of item (e.g. cloaks, too, since people would want to wear their favourite cloak) would quickly destroy the itemisation system as it stands. A more significant reworking would be required. Itemisation is not great, and it would benefit from one anyway. 

 

One simple option is to add a cosmetic enchantment where you do the same thing, gold and some ingredients, then transform just the icon and model of a given helm or cloak. I don't think this should be available for armour and weaponry, because there's a point to making them distinctly identifiable and making unique ones look special, but there aren't really any such unique helms/cloaks. 

 

Cloaks and Helmets should be enchantable, I think, and honestly, I would not mind boots or gloves, either. You are entirely correct in that that would necessitate a significant reworking of the itemization system, but I would not mind that in the least. The game could really use one, but I would not expect one, not even in an expansion (since it would involve going back and reviewing existing content, which is exactly what I want them to do, but that's.. extremely rare in the industry).


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I thought this was going to be a thread about the need for a "hide helmet" toggle, because IMO that's wha the helmet situation in this game needs the most.

I thought that was a universal truth for all games. Head gear is always f'ugly.   ;)

 

Hoods and turbans look pretty good if you can match the colours  :cat:

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I thought this was going to be a thread about the need for a "hide helmet" toggle, because IMO that's wha the helmet situation in this game needs the most.

There is a console workaround at least (and doesn't disable achievements for those without IE mod).

Select which party member(s) you want to hide the helmet, open console and type HelmetVisibility False. To toggle back on it's HelmetVisibility True.

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I disagree to being able to enchant headgear for the simple reason it wouldn't be fair to the Godlike, who would suddenly become a less desirable Race. They already have a slight disadvantage in that area, but it's offset by their racial ability so worth giving up. Start making headgear more powerful and it could ruin the balance for that race.

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I've been thinking about that itemization issue... and I think it may be more of a presentation problem than a substantive one.

 

The item properties are broken down into enchantments, as you say. It makes them feel banal, interchangeable, and mass-produced, even if they have cool descriptions, and even if mechanically they're "the same thing" as in the IE games. "Spellbind - Jolting Touch" just sounds inherently duller than "Does an additional 20 points of electrical damage on critical hit." 

 

(Not a fan of the enchantment/crafting mechanics either. Making it as easy as click-click-click loses the magic. I had most fun with NWN2 OC's crafting in that series, and it was the most restrictive and arguably frustrating one.)

The itemization is fine and I think the enchantment system is great. Its just that the IE games' +1 extra attack looks sexier than x1.25 attack speed to some folks. 

Edited by Shevek
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I disagree to being able to enchant headgear for the simple reason it wouldn't be fair to the Godlike, who would suddenly become a less desirable Race. They already have a slight disadvantage in that area, but it's offset by their racial ability so worth giving up. Start making headgear more powerful and it could ruin the balance for that race.

 

... godlikes are already a less desirable race. There's plenty of good helmets in the game, even right from the start.

 

 

The +1 PER and RES Helmet at the Temple of Eothas, Kana Rua's +1 INT Turban at Caed nua, for example.

 

 

Letting people slap +1 DEX and +1 INT to their hoods won't change that. I'm willing to say that, yeah, it might upset the overall itemization balancing somewhat, and it might necessitate - thank god - a big of an itemization overhaul. But the argument that godlikes will suffer is bogus. It won't change anything for them.


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Seeing as there are hats/helmets with stats, I think we should be able to enchant the regular ones too. That or remove the enchants from headgear alltogether. "All or nothing" basically.

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Enchants should require a vendor. Being able to enchant just before battle is too meta and allows you to game the system. At least for armours and weapons, I'm okay with scrolls being made because thats basically just parchment and ink.

 

I would vote yes if there was enchant Helms, Hats & Hoods with a vendor.

Edited by Tuckey

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Well, I am happy to see so many people voice their opinion and vote. I agree with Silverstar that given the unusual discrepancies created by having helms with stats that it may have been better if the game developers had made headgear purely cosmetic. But since headgear does have enchants it makes sense that we should be able to enchant them as Luckmann said, with a small enchant range of +1 for basic stats. That way players can run around looking awesome with their Tricorn Hat while not feeling like they are completely ditching an asset in the form of their awful looking Hermit Hat of +1 Might. 

 

Lastly, I must disagree with Tigraines in that while there are good looking cloaks in the game (and some bad looking ones) I don't think cloaks vary as much or affect the overall look of a character as distinctly as different hats and helms. Save for the Eothasian Robe you get in the Temple Dungeon I do not think there are any cloaks or capes that would unduly impede a character's cosmetic appeal. Hats, on the other hand, are a far more noticeable and less changeable item which can alter a character's cosmetic appeal entirely. 

 

Also, Tuckey has a good point - the game could add a milliner or hatmaker to the game who could enchant headgear without having to overhaul the game's enchant system or make a separate enchant list for hats and helms. 

Edited by Venatio

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It's really mind-boggling how Obsidian didn't implement a "hide helmet" toggle or put necklaces and cloaks into seperate slots.

 

I mean, the former can be activated with a simple console command after all... how hard can it be to add a small checkbox to the character inventory next to the colors to disabled the helmet displayal?

And why combine clocks and necklaces into one slot? With most item stats not stacking anyway, what could possibly happen that this is required for balancing?

 

 

To go back on topic: Actually I'm fine with helmets not being able to be enchanted. It's good to have some truly unique items in the game that you can not gain from an enchanting job. It's already bad enough that most unique weapons and armors you can find in the game aren't that much stronger than enchanted level 1 gear.

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It sucks that putting on helms makes your hair disappear...

 

And yes, we should be able to enchant them.

  • Like 1

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It's very weird how helmets/hats have been implemented.

 

I mean, when I got my first one with no stats on I was like "What? That's a thing?" but then came finding the ones with stats (With no ability to customize cosmetics, such as a "Hide helmet" toggle that isn't done using IEmod and Console Commands)

 

It also seemed strange that Godlikes, who have quite powerful racial bonuses, mention that they can't wear helmets/hats which seemed to me to suggest that it's an actual downside that they miss out on some statistical advantage from not being able to equip something in that slot... But no, there's such a limited selection of headwear in game that actually has stats and often comes in a small amounts (Like +1 perception which while nice, can often be made up with other gear) so they don't really miss out on anything.

 

While, just enchanting helmets and such to being perfectly itemized is kind of boring, it's one of the easiest ways to make headgear relevant (Along with allowing customization of looks) without having to add in a ton of new items or add stats to every existing item.

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In my opinion they should go with all in crafting system, where you can enchant all the wearable items and have ability to put about any enchantment that there is on them, but I also think that they should make enchantments recipes such that you can find them all around world and some you need to buy/learn from masters. And they also should go back to their original vision that you need forges, labs, etc. to enchant and craft items. And of course materials for better enchantments should be rare or even unique.

 

Current solution to limit enchanting to make findable loot feel more special don't seem to have desired effect within players so as compromise didn't work so I do see little point keeping it in the game anymore.  

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