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Skyrim relies on your imagination to roleplay your character, but not as much dialogue and the world.

 

Skyrim basically puts all the real roleplaying responsibility in the player's head and imagination. There is no ingame restrictions in Skyrim that prevents you from deciding who you want your character to be when it comes to personality.

Do not make me laugh.

 

You can roleplay all you want, but within the context of the world, it makes no sense to do so.

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I don't like what they offer because they offer virtually nothing.  That's the hallmark of AAA gaming really.  Completely without substance most the time.  Just pretty graphics and lots of violence.

Preach. I managed three hours of Darksiders and I had to force myself to get that far. It's just so boring. I remembered it being a huge deal when it came out, so what happened? It's not that I hate action-platformers, because Dust: An Elysian Tail riveted me. Heck, even going AAA, Alice: Madness Returns was way better (I really enjoyed Madness Returns).


Curious about the subraces in Pillars of Eternity? Check out 

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Darksiders takes a long time to get to the actual meat of the game. It's a standard action RPG until you get to the first tower, in which it becomes Zelda.

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Just curious about exactly how Steamspy works -- looking at the site today, it seems that the number of "owners" for PoE actually peaked on 4/12 before declining slightly and then rebounding over the next few days.

 

How does that work? Why would the number of owners ever decrease? If numbers were revised for greater accuracy, wouldn't they be revised retroactively?


DID YOU KNOW: *Missing String*

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That's just sampling error. They do a rolling survey of public Steam accounts to see what the Steam-using gamers are doing. It's great for information for comparing the popularity of games, not just owners but players and play time.


Curious about the subraces in Pillars of Eternity? Check out 

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I am surprised there has not been a press release from Paradox or Obsidian stating sales numbers.  I assume this is because the numbers are underwhelming.

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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

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"Things are funny...are comedic, because they mix the real with the absurd." - Buzz Aldrin.

"P-O-T-A-T-O-E" - Dan Quayle

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I am surprised there has not been a press release from Paradox or Obsidian stating sales numbers.  I assume this is because the numbers are underwhelming.

Paradox already said, that Pillars is one of their best selling games.

With Cities:Skylines together it made 18,5Million Dollars.

http://gamingbolt.com/pillars-of-eternity-cities-skylines-earn-18-5-million-in-three-weeks

so its really succesful (and it was mentioned weeks ago).

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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

Winner, winner, chicken dinner. I don't expect PoE numbers until they have an audience like E3.

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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

 

Oh please, stop thinking that Pillars will sell "a million" :). What  means it anyway? If the number of sold copies will raise significantly in the future then because of 60 oer 80% sales. The mayor turnover already happened, the important sale time is over. Obsidian made about 10 Million $, i thinks thats ok for an extremly niche game like Pillars.

 

Relative high sale numbers like LoG 1 or D:OS where  exceptionsm, there is a reason why the "cRPG" grenre is dead and crowdfuning was needed.

 

This kind of gamers are now the main clientele for rpg´s :

 

kids-gaming.jpg

Edited by Ramireza

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Skyrim relies on your imagination to roleplay your character, but not as much dialogue and the world.

 

Skyrim basically puts all the real roleplaying responsibility in the player's head and imagination. There is no ingame restrictions in Skyrim that prevents you from deciding who you want your character to be when it comes to personality.

Do not make me laugh.

 

You can roleplay all you want, but within the context of the world, it makes no sense to do so.

Irrelevant. It's fun and we enjoy it, even if it isn't rewarded in the mechanical sense. I could imagine a story or write it down, or roleplay it in Skyrim - and I wouldn't say one method is inherently inferior to the others.

 

There are many aspects of Skyrim that make me facepalm and long for better development - guilds and UI design come to mind - but the game retains the series core strengths: worldbuilding and moddability. I love the setting enough to come back time after time, and I can replace the underdeveloped perk trees with interesting, complex ones with one quick download from Nexus or if I prefer, hours in the Creation Kit, which is a great fun in and of itself.

Edited by Rosveen
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Skyrim relies on your imagination to roleplay your character, but not as much dialogue and the world.

 

Skyrim basically puts all the real roleplaying responsibility in the player's head and imagination. There is no ingame restrictions in Skyrim that prevents you from deciding who you want your character to be when it comes to personality.

Do not make me laugh.

 

You can roleplay all you want, but within the context of the world, it makes no sense to do so.

 

The earliest part one starts to roleplay is childhood. Like when a girl plays mother with her dolls or a boy and his friend is playing police and robber. Are you saying they are not having fun because the context of the real world does not interact with them roleplaying?

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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

 

Oh please, stop thinking that Pillars will sell "a million" :). What  means it anyway? If the number of sold copies will raise significantly in the future then because of 60 oer 80% sales. The mayor turnover already happened, the important sale time is over. Obsidian made about 10 Million $, i thinks thats ok for an extremly niche game like Pillars.

 

Relative high sale numbers like LoG 1 or D:OS where  exceptionsm, there is a reason why the "cRPG" grenre is dead and crowdfuning was needed.

 

This kind of gamers are now the main clientele for rpg´s :

 

kids-gaming.jpg

 

What exactly is the problem with "that kind of gamers?" All I see is a bunch of dudes holding controllers and a judgemental prick.

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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

 

Oh please, stop thinking that Pillars will sell "a million" :). What  means it anyway? If the number of sold copies will raise significantly in the future then because of 60 oer 80% sales. The mayor turnover already happened, the important sale time is over. Obsidian made about 10 Million $, i thinks thats ok for an extremly niche game like Pillars.

 

Relative high sale numbers like LoG 1 or D:OS where  exceptionsm, there is a reason why the "cRPG" grenre is dead and crowdfuning was needed.

 

This kind of gamers are now the main clientele for rpg´s :

 

kids-gaming.jpg

 

What exactly is the problem with "that kind of gamers?" All I see is a bunch of dudes holding controllers and a judgemental prick.

 

 

Console Gamers, PPL that loves to "beat" games, Person with a low attention span, that expect hand holding, "social awareness" and epic presentation.

 

I have no problem with them,  except for the fact that this means that most games today are made for idiots.

 

This video sums it up pretty good :

 

Edited by Ramireza
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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

 

Oh please, stop thinking that Pillars will sell "a million" :). What  means it anyway? If the number of sold copies will raise significantly in the future then because of 60 oer 80% sales. The mayor turnover already happened, the important sale time is over. Obsidian made about 10 Million $, i thinks thats ok for an extremly niche game like Pillars.

 

Relative high sale numbers like LoG 1 or D:OS where  exceptionsm, there is a reason why the "cRPG" grenre is dead and crowdfuning was needed.

 

This kind of gamers are now the main clientele for rpg´s :

 

kids-gaming.jpg

 

What exactly is the problem with "that kind of gamers?" All I see is a bunch of dudes holding controllers and a judgemental prick.

 

Well the one on the far right looks a little high and they all look slightly bored.

 

Anyways, I think the CRPG genre isn't as big as it once was has to do with the increased cost of doing business. These days, you can't really make money like you used to. So there's less reason to take chances. Also the CRPG genre has always been a bit niche, gaming as a whole expanded.

 

EDIT: Ahhh the big "Casual" vs "Hardcore" false dichotomy

I consider myself a casual gamer. I never played pokemon competitively. I don't particularly care about graphics. I like puzzle games. I play games casually.

 

My favorite Elder Scrolls game is Daggerfall. Ultima IV is one of my favorite games of all time. My favorite fighting game is Virtua Fighter 4. I think "Let Us Cling Together" is better than "Final Fantasy Tactics". ROT3K is one of the greatest things to happen to gaming (haven't played any of them after Wall of Fire though). The idea that games are "dumbed down" to appeal to casual gamers is a bit misguided if not outright wrong. Most casuals are smart enough to play many of these games. The reason why skyrim is much simpler is the same reason why BECMI, AD&D, 3.5 and 5th edition are all very different games. Different design teams that think different things are important. I'm not saying there isn't cynicism involved, there most certainly is, but I think it has more to do with how much work they are willing to do to bring back the "climb" skill.

Edited by Dadalama

It's good to criticize things you love.

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Larian Studios -has- been fairly transparent, and some of the things that Swen Vincke has said about Divinity: Original Sin are a little scary. Basically, yeah, they used the crowdfunding campaign to help draw in additional investors--and to secure loans. And they sunk all of their capital into the game. The release date for Divinity: Original Sin was actually determined by Larian waiting until the last possible moment they would need to repay those loans. Thankfully, DOS was a roaring success and Larian was able to repay its loans and expand... but that could very easily have not been the case.

Larian also hinted that game sales were far less important than luring investors for the future.

I imagine the same will hold true for Obsidian.

The real success of PoE will be measured by what (if any) development deals Obsidian signs in the coming months.

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This kind of gamers are now the main clientele for rpg´s :

 

kids-gaming.jpg

 

 

A bunch of nerdy looking dudes. They are different from the old kind of clientele how?

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And let's face it cRPGs could never boast a terribly wide audience, so the fact that PoE wouldn't sell a million copies shouldn't come as a great surprise to anyone, let alone Obsidian themselves.

But 1 million in sales is not a wide audience, in the case of PoE it's a reasonable expectation. I know people are getting tired of having D:OS getting thrown in their face in this discussion but it *must*. D:OS is PoE's true Peer. It's a kickstarted game, it's a PC exclusive, it's an RPG, and its development costs was ~$4 million.

 

It sold ~ 1 million copies. Therefore, PoE SHOULD do the same. If it doesn't, then there will be legitimate questions to ask. The main one being: WHY NOT?

Edited by Stun

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Well, until they hit a significant milestone such as 1 million units, why bother?

 

Oh please, stop thinking that Pillars will sell "a million" :). What  means it anyway? If the number of sold copies will raise significantly in the future then because of 60 oer 80% sales. The mayor turnover already happened, the important sale time is over. Obsidian made about 10 Million $, i thinks thats ok for an extremly niche game like Pillars.

 

Relative high sale numbers like LoG 1 or D:OS where  exceptionsm, there is a reason why the "cRPG" grenre is dead and crowdfuning was needed.

 

This kind of gamers are now the main clientele for rpg´s :

 

kids-gaming.jpg

 

aaand here we go again. but it's really not about controller vs kb+m, it's about attention span.

 

 

don't generalize people like this. i am pretty much in the same age as them currently, but i do take my reading well. in fact, i'm probably the only one out of thousands that reads the golden plated NPC, because some of them are genuinely interesting, some made me smile, some are heartbreaking. i like them, altho there are several that's badly written.

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Yeah they look like normal young people, not harbingers of decline. I was that age (maybe a little younger) when I first played Baldur's Gate and was knee high to a grasshopper when I played and loved dungeon master. Young people aren't the problem, publishers and developers treating them like idiots is.

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When market often rejects those developers and publishers that take risks and rewards those who don't it will lead situation where those who put most money in the game will take least risks, as it is best way to guarantee that game will produce profits. 

 

I just hope that relatively good success of recent higher profile RPG's (Divinity Original Sin, Wasteland 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Pillars of Eternity, Bloodborne and hopefully Witcher 3) will lead situation where those with money see RPGs as safe option and start produce more of them.

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And let's face it cRPGs could never boast a terribly wide audience, so the fact that PoE wouldn't sell a million copies shouldn't come as a great surprise to anyone, let alone Obsidian themselves.

But 1 million in sales is not a wide audience, in the case of PoE it's a reasonable expectation. I know people are getting tired of having D:OS getting thrown in their face in this discussion but it *must*. D:OS is PoE's true Peer. It's a kickstarted game, it's a PC exclusive, it's an RPG, and its development costs was ~$4 million.

 

It sold ~ 1 million copies. Therefore, PoE SHOULD do the same. If it doesn't, then there will be legitimate questions to ask. The main one being: WHY NOT?

 

 

Where did you get that ~$4 million for the D:OS budget (just curious, I had heard it was considerably higher)? I haven't played D:OS yet by the way, but have heard a lot about it. I generally agree with what you're saying, but the main, obvious difference is the multiplayer co-op in D:OS, which allows the game to appeal to a larger audience because it incorporates people uninterested in playing a single-player game. Also there are some other big differences such as the serious writing and story of PoE vs. the lighthearted nature of D:OS's writing. It seems that a lot of people play D:OS primarily for the combat and dungeon diving, and others specifically for the co-op, while a lot of people that wouldn't play D:OS play PoE for the story, writing, etc. There is definitely a lot of overlap though. I can't think of a closer competitor so they should be compared, but the large differences need to be taken into consideration.


"Forsooth, methinks you are no ordinary talking chicken!"

-Protagonist, Baldur's Gate

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Where did you get that ~$4 million for the D:OS budget (just curious, I had heard it was considerably higher)?

Larian counted their budget/expenses in euros. They had ~4 millions euro, 3 of their own, 1 from Kickstarter. I'm not sure how much that would be in dollars.

 

I certainly hope PoE will do at least as good as D:OS, if only to see the sequel.

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Where did you get that ~$4 million for the D:OS budget (just curious, I had heard it was considerably higher)?

Larian counted their budget/expenses in euros. They had ~4 millions euro, 3 of their own, 1 from Kickstarter. I'm not sure how much that would be in dollars.

 

I certainly hope PoE will do at least as good as D:OS, if only to see the sequel.

 

 

It is bit over 5 million dollars with exchange rates during development of D:OS , now it is about 4.33 million dollars, as euro has weakened during last autumn and beginning of this year compared to dollar. 

They only got about 1 million dollars from KS.

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