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Karmashock

Wish there were an option to remove resting restrictions

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I just preferred the way they handled it in Icewind Dale or planescape torment. You could rest as many times as you wanted. You just needed to find a relatively safe place. The problem is that those camping supplies packages are not terribly common and that means wizards etc have to be really careful about what spells they use because you can't just rest whenever you run out of spells.

 

I know some people like this feature. I'm not saying it should be off for everyone. Just let me turn off the camping supplies if I want to do that.

 

The hardest difficulty in this game is not especially a problem for me. The issue is that on the harder difficulties resting is even more limited and that means you have to waste a lot of time going back to town every time you need to rest again. And that means more loading screens... and it is just a giant waste of time and is totally boring. I've turned the difficulty down not because the harder difficulties are too hard but because I have to back to town more often and that bores me. So I had to lower the difficulty for that reason alone which is kind of lame.

 

Please just add an option to let me rest without the camping supplies restriction.

 

Another idea possibly for another game because it is too late to do this other thing... you could have various places in most maps and dungeons where you could rest as many times as you wanted but only in those places.

 

I understand why the resting restrictions are in the game, I'm just saying that what it does is force you to go back to town a lot and that whole process is very repeatitive and boring. If I could press one button that would automatically take me back to town, rest me up, and immediately come back to that part of the dungeon... I'd prefer that. I'd even get up and get a drink whenever it happened if you wanted my character to literally go through that process on the screen.

 

Anyway... I hates the camping supplies. I don't need the game set to baby mode. I just need to be able to recharge my wizards without going through a big long boring process every time.

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This is a really good point (and obviously a big no-no in fantasy games to force such a mechanic on Players - lazy, ill-thought out and implemented).

 

I was against this, but the anal - retentive got their way (probably not as they thought though, as one can see, backtracking to rest has no negative consequences, making limited resting supplies a farce).

 

Cue the rabid masses to swarm in with rationalisation now.

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I wouldn't mind being able to have say 4 on hard difficulty, but I don't know about letting people have an unlimited amount of camping stuff to use.

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Read the OP'S post again - basically you do have unlimited camping supplies because one can backtrack and rest without consequence other than the time-sink.

 

That totally invalidates limiting resting supplies, don't you think?

 

I personally prefer wandering monsters to this implemented atrocity and farcical mechanic.

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The issue is that on the harder difficulties resting is even more limited and that means you have to waste a lot of time going back to town every time you need to rest again.

 

The only backtracking I've done on Hard so far has been backtracking to an earlier part of a dungeon to pick up the camping supplies I couldn't pick up at the time because I was full. And that's rarely even necessary.

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Yeah. Remember the BG games statement... "You have been waylaid by enemies and must defend yourselves..."

Edited by eLPuSHeR
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If there are no negative consequences to backtracking, why are you complaining about the mechanic? When you're enjoying a game, isn't boredom a negative consequence?

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"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." -Marcus Aurelius

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I find very annoying having to backtrack a lot just for acquiring new supplies. Just my opinion though.

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I wouldn't mind being able to have say 4 on hard difficulty, but I don't know about letting people have an unlimited amount of camping stuff to use.

Well, the problem with that idea is that there are limited camping supplies in the game from what I can tell. Further, why do I have to go back to town to buy more camping supplies just because I'm going through endless and have rested 4 times?

 

Part of the issue might be that you're not using wizards as much. I am. I like my wizards. And that means I burn out my spells and I have to rest or my guy is just useless. If I were running mostly fighters or something then yeah, they don't really have abilities that can only be used once per rest. So the rest mechanic would be less obnoxious.

 

But when you're running wizards, you need to rest with some frequency. And that's 75 gold every time you do it... assuming you can even buy camping supplies. A really you're very strongly encouraging me to go back to town every five or six fights, go through all the loading screens... typically a minimum of 4 or 5 just to get to the damn inn keeper. And then after doing that, I have to go through another 4 or 5 loading screens to get back to where I was before. That is super annoying.

 

What I want, is for there to be a little radio button or check box or something in the game options that just turns the camping supplies restiction OFF. I don't want to carry 4 camping supplies or 20 camping supplies. I outright dislike the mechanic.

 

 

 

If we are just pathologically addicted to this concept then at the very least given a "return to inn" button that I can press that will take me DIRECTLY to the inn. No intermediary loading screens. Direct from dungeon to inn. And then when I have talked to the inn keeper, rested, and am ready to go back to the dungeon, I want one button that returns me exactly to where I was in that dungeon with a loading screen for the dungeon only. I do not want to load the area outside the inn, the area after that that isn't the dungeon, or any of the additional loading screens along the way to the place I was when all I wanted to do was rest.

 

I am not telling anyone else how they have to enjoy the game. By all means... do your camping supplies thing if you like that. I'm just saying, let me avoid that aspect of the game because I personally find it to be obnoxious.

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Yeah. Remember the BG games statement... "You have been waylaid by enemies and must defend yourselves..."

 

Yep.

 

Something like this is what we should have had, instead of camping supplies. Which really are nothing more than a pain in the ass.

 

All of my characters can carry multiple suits of armor, but they can't carry more than 2 bits of camping supplies between them. How this idea got off the drawing board and into the game is beyond me.

Edited by Valsuelm
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I bet it could be done through modding. I'd say go over to the Pillars of Eternity Nexus page and find IE Mod, and ask the authors if they could add an option for what you want. They don't communicate much but they do seem to listen when people request something if enough do - they did with a couple of new mods recently and included them in theirs with permission of course.

 

They might be willing to make the feature quite robust, so make sure you share all the ideas you have for any changes to the game - they might be able to do all of it, who knows.

 

By the way, did you know that sometimes in some places if you find an NPC that already has their own camp, sometimes there is dialog after you do something for them that lets you rest at their camp and they will watch your back?

 

Another good idea to go along with being able to camp almost anywhere you want to, or in more places without needing camping kits is the customizable possibility of when and how often you might be able to be inturrupted during your sleep and it use the interactive story telling to start off with, so that a battle can go on. Like either a creature or two, or bandits (cause as of right now Bandits and Creatures only wait for you to run into them, but occationally having them find you during your sleep out in the wilds, would be interesting). There is a mod for Skyrim that does that, I don't remember what it's called. Totally different kind of game, but still a great example for the feature I'm talking about.

Edited by Ram
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Probably the camping supplies limit level should be unhooked from the easy/normal/hard setting and given its own setting.

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Time-sinks are not ingame negative consequences. They are instead RL annoyances.

 

The first instance (if present) would at least support the notion of limiting resting. The second is just causing irritation and annoyance through a poorly implemented mechanic.

 

You may remember how the OC from NWN dealt with this - by having a recall stone (instant transport to save time).

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I used to think that time-wasters were not good mechanics, but now I am not so sure. The point of resting restrictions is to try to get you to play dungeons without resting too often. If people aren't resting too much because walking back to town to rest is too annoying for them, then it's doing its job.

 

Essentially, being able to go back to town and rest is really only there to make sure you don't get irrevocably stuck. It's not intended to be used as a common mechanic. It only becomes a problem if the higher difficulties force even good players to do it more than very occasionally. In that case, what's really the problem is the supply limit at harder levels anyway.

Edited by NathanH
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Time-sinks are not ingame negative consequences. They are instead RL annoyances.

 

The first instance (if present) would at least support the notion of limiting resting. The second is just causing irritation and annoyance through a poorly implemented mechanic.

 

You may remember how the OC from NWN dealt with this - by having a recall stone (instant transport to save time).

 

 

I used to think that time-wasters were not good mechanics, but now I am not so sure. The point of resting restrictions is to try to get you to play dungeons without resting too often. If people aren't resting too much because walking back to town to rest is too annoying for them, then it's doing its job.

 

Essentially, being able to go back to town and rest is really only there to make sure you don't get irrevocably stuck. It's not intended to be used as a common mechanic. It only becomes a problem if the higher difficulties force even good players to do it more than very occasionally. In that case, what's really the problem is the supply limit at harder levels anyway.

 

 

As to time sinks being real life annoyances, it is a game. And if you want that feature to annoy you then by all means leave it on. My point is that I want a button taht lets me turn it off for "ME". I am not telling you how to play the game. Please do me the small courtesy of not presuming to tell me how to play the game.

 

I will outright use cheat codes on the second playthrough simply to nullify this issue if the devs don't provide the change or a modder doesn't provide a mod.

 

I'm not especially interested in statements to the effect of "I think its better if you're bored and annoyed"... it is a game. If I'm bored and annoyed then the game has failed in its primary purpose.

 

As to the notion that if I have to rest that often then I am doing something wrong... poppy****. Do the endless path with 7th level characters and two wizards in your party. You have to use some sort of spell in every encounter and that means that after four or five encounters you're going to need to rest. And that means you're burning a camping supply about once a level in most cases if not twice if there was a big boss fight.

 

And that means lots of backtracking to the surface to rest, find more camping supplies which... I don't even know where to find more at this point. And then once you've done that you can then go back through three or four more loading screens to get back to the place where you initially and were quite fine continuing from that point if you just had more camping supplies.

 

And before anyone presumes to tell me that my interpretation is not as pure as theirs, I'll remind you that in all the old Black Isle games you could rest whenever you wanted.

 

Planescrape torment? Rest whenever you want.

Balder's gate? Rest whenever you want.

Icewind dale? Rest whenever you want.

Fallout? Rest whenever you want.

 

So where did this idea come from that it would be a good idea to force me to back track half way through a dungeon simply because I need to rest and they want me to get more "camping supplies"?

 

Look, obviously some people like the camping supplies. I find that completely incomprehensible but I don't have the arrogance to suggest that everyone should play the game my way. Just let me play it mine.

 

That's all I want. Do I honestly have to resort to console commands? Because... if that's how this has to play out... so be it. I totally refuse to keep backtracking. Its annoying.

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The whole game is balanced around limiting resting supplies, that is what makes hard mode hard. Per encounter abilities are made to be spammed and per rest abilities are to be held in strategic reserve.

 

If you are resting all the time because you are out of spells don't use as many. Barring that, play a cipher who bypasses the normal spell mechanics and can spam everything all the time.

 

If you are resting all the time because your guys are maimed but still have spells left over, then start using more spells to reduce the damage taken and/or kill the monsters faster.

 

If you are both maimed and out of spells you are properly limiting your rests :) Or you are under leveled or using bad tactics :0

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Time-sinks are not ingame negative consequences. They are instead RL annoyances.

 

The first instance (if present) would at least support the notion of limiting resting. The second is just causing irritation and annoyance through a poorly implemented mechanic.

 

You may remember how the OC from NWN dealt with this - by having a recall stone (instant transport to save time).

It´s actually worse than that. Game offers you a slap on the wrist for not playing well instead of teaching you how to play with limited resources. It´s almost insulting and demeaning.

 

There are a lot of games that actually adhere to their intended difficulty and are enjoyable to play until the end. Gamers are not so soft-skinned that they can´t take a little beating when trying to get through the hardest difficulty level. Not letting that happen also destroys one of the fundamental reasons for playing games in the first place: euphoric feeling of beating something verifiably difficult.

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The resting mechanic in the game is one of the most horrible mechanics I have seen in an RPG, it needs to go.

 

  • It screws up the flow of the game
  • This plus the annoying fetch quests add  tedious
  • It is UNFUN
  • Forced to go through loading screen hell..and loading screen hell...and loading screen hell.....
  • Makes no sense at all, you have a limited stash, but you have limited camping supplies?
  • Makes no sense at all 2, camping supplies break down after one use?  
  • Mages are screwed over the most compared to the other classes, you are forced to just play a gunslinger with your rod/wand instead of a mage class
  • The previous RPG's mages worked because you could rest anywhere/anytime
  • It is unnecessary punishment.

 

I remember when they mentioned resting in a kickstarter update way back and thinking "That sounds like a bad idea", after playing it in action, it is not only a bad idea, it is a horrible bad idea that should have never been implemented at all.  Forcing everybody to play a tedius style of play is not fun.  There should be a switch to turn this off for those who do not want to play this.   

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I don´t mind them including that option, sort of like how you can tick off maining your companions before killing them.

But part of the challenge on the higher difficulties is not only choosing when NOT to fight, but also to kill using minimal effort, and balance out your spell usage with your health, AND the health between your party members.

 

Playing on POTD, you really have to restrict your spell usage for most encounters.

 

Once I figured that out, it became immensely more enjoyable to play.

Edited by cavemandiary
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There should be a switch to turn this off for those who do not want to play this.   

There is a console command to force a rest.

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There should be a switch to turn this off for those who do not want to play this.   

There is a console command to force a rest.

 

 

Yup, just install IE Mod and type "rest" -> Problem solved.

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Well, regardless of my personal thoughts on the mechanic, I think I understand what the intention was. A lot of people in this thread are saying that they have to go back to town all the time to rest even though the fights aren't too hard on their current difficulty setting (normal/hard/potd). However, I think the idea is that if you are having to go back to town all the time to rest, then the fights are too hard for you on that difficulty setting and you should lower the difficulty. "The fights aren't too hard for me, I just use all of my per rest spells/abilities in every encounter" isn't a valid argument because if you're overusing your per rest spells and abilities, then the fights are too hard for you. Lower the difficulty a notch and you'll be able to use up those abilities less quickly and you'll be able to carry more camping supplies.

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"Forsooth, methinks you are no ordinary talking chicken!"

-Protagonist, Baldur's Gate

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...I understand why the resting restrictions are in the game, I'm just saying that what it does is force you to go back to town a lot and that whole process is very repeatitive and boring...

 

I originally thought the idea (of camping supplies) was decent (not great, but decent), but with more time in I have to agree with you.

 

Fundamentally, there is no difference between resting as much as I want vs. resting only in town (or with camping supplies) other than a whole lot of wasted (real) time.

 

It is somewhat annoying.

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...I understand why the resting restrictions are in the game, I'm just saying that what it does is force you to go back to town a lot and that whole process is very repeatitive and boring...

 

I originally thought the idea (of camping supplies) was decent (not great, but decent), but with more time in I have to agree with you.

 

Fundamentally, there is no difference between resting as much as I want vs. resting only in town (or with camping supplies) other than a whole lot of wasted (real) time.

 

It is somewhat annoying.

 

But in practice, there is. Because you know that restocking your camping suplies is a chore, you are more likely to moderate your use of per rest spells and abilities. This allows the designers to make spells that are deliberately overpowered, but has limited use. And that´s the problem with the Cipher - his abilities are at will, but of "per rest" quality.

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I rarely need to use camping supplies on POTD. If you find yourself needing to rest a lot more than your supplies allow, maybe lower the difficulty.

 

Unlimited resting will only make the game far too easy.

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