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Update 93: Patch 1.03 - Important Community Fixes

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I am very, very disappointed. Between NWN2, it's expansions and New Vegas I have clocked in literally a thousand or more of hours of time playing your games and to see you capitulate to a hate group that literally wants to kill all men simply for being men is upsetting to the extreme.

 

While I did not back the game (Remember, No Russians Preorders), I had been planning on buying it once I had the disposable income available. Now, I will not. I know your marketing department probably doesn't consider the lost sales and the lost respect as important as pandering to hate groups, but I felt the need to sign up and make my opinion, however much it'll be lost in the noise, known.

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It was a nice poem, made me chuckle.  Didn't make me want to go and attack homosexual people or view them as inferior to myself...I have a mind of my own afterall.

 

Exactly what I wanted to say.

 

I´m gay myself and I haven´t been offended in any way by this.

 

To be honest, I see it exactly as others here: that some anonymous intenret crowd started yelling and you backed up.

 

Not cool, Obsidian.

 

You haven´t lost customer in me, because I think you worked hard and delivered a splendid game; but will you buckle just because somebody will start moralizing a complicated and morally complex game?

Isn´t that exactly what we backed? 

 

Please, just hold on, don´t let them beat you so easily.

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We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing (George Bernard Shaw)

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It was a nice poem, made me chuckle.  Didn't make me want to go and attack homosexual people or view them as inferior to myself...I have a mind of my own afterall.

 

Exactly what I wanted to say.

 

I´m gay myself and I haven´t been offended in any way by this.

 

To be honest, I see it exactly as others here: that some anonymous intenret crowd started yelling and you backed up.

 

Not cool, Obsidian.

 

You haven´t lost customer in me, because I think you worked hard and delivered a splendid game; but will you buckle just because somebody will start moralizing a complicated and morally complex game?

Isn´t that exactly what we backed? 

 

Please, just hold on, don´t let them beat you so easily.

 

Too late for that, they have buckled, caved and run with their tail between their legs. They have been beaten because of whiny men-hating feminists. 

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Absolutely disgusting to see Obsidian cave in like this, and spitting in the faces of their backers in the process. The overwhelming majority was in favor of KEEPING IT, as you could see simply by checking the official forums or other places.

 

If I'm offended by wizards being in the game because mystical things are against my religion, will you also pull them from it?

 

The vocal population were present in that debate. I, for example, have an opinion regarding the issue, but chose not to share it. I highly doubt the forum objectively represents the 'overwhelming majority'.

 

LOL, by debate you mean a bunch of special snowflakes who not only haven't played this game before, but are not gamers themselves, people who their whole life purpose is to be offended by words, sounds and images? And spare me, SJWs never debated anyone, all they do is block people. There has been numerous of "calls" for debates, and they all backed back, because they are cowards. That was not a debate, all it was, was people shouting thei frustrations and inssecurities to the world, like they always do.

 

"I highly doubt the forum objectively represents the 'overwhelming majority'."

 

The forum represents the backers and people who played the game, not a small minority of people who got offended by a stupid joke, that wasn't offensive to begin with. You can spin this is, it ends the same way.

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I am a bit dissappointed. Not with the silly text change itself (who reads them, anyway), but with the idea that independent artists have to change their contents because of overreacting outrages. I might be offended by the lack of left-handers in the game, but you won't patch them in because of me, you leftphobic hipocrits. I go play Zelda!

No, seriously, the game is great and Obsidian is one of the best RPG-makers out there, but my ideal of a crowdfunded hardcore fan centered badass developer game has got a crack.

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This is really disappointing. I think we should have both the original limerick and the new limerick. 

 

We should not back down and cave into the nonsensical demands of the social justice wankers. 

 

Seriously Western developers, grow a freaking backbone. You will not see game developers, say, in Japan caving into this crap. 

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I'll have to think seriously if I'll back or buy again any of your games if you have to censor your own game to favor people that desires the extinction of all male gender... 

 

You sir just won a truckload of hyperboles.

 

But seriously, can we get back on topic?

 

Just had a 570Mb patch pushed through Steam and I would like to know what it does, instead of reading about paranoid masculinists.

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This is an obvious lie though. You changed it because you were pressured by a minority group on Twitter lol. You've alienated the people who saved your company from oblivion by backing this game on Kickstarter to appease the rampant SJW movement demanding anything they find offensive to be censored. The fact that you're lying about it now is even more disgusting and disrespectful. Be honest about it.

 

"So this is how liberty dies, to thunderous applause" has never been more relevant.

 

Oh god, why did I read this horrible thread? It's nothing but gamergaters and people trying to defend a dumb limerick as artistic integrity.

 

Are you actually serious? This doesn't at all represent me. My goal in backing this project was not "I want a studio I love to make something that offends SJWs".

 

And that quote. Jesus Christ man, that quote. You know if the limerick referred to laser guns and sci fi stuff you'd have no problem with it being changed, but the moment someone gets offended, it's the death of liberty to actually listen to them.

 

This entire situation is still messed up though - who is the change for? It's not for the GGers because apparently the most important thing to them is that this game contains content that offends minorities. It's not for the people who were actually offended because it's obviously a dig against them.

 

Third time's the charm, right?

 

YPUNSLU.png

 

 

You spelled "she" wrong. And last time I saw gators talk about Thompson they were saying how great a guy he really was. I know logically consistent arguments aren't gg's strong suit, but really.

 

Sincerely, a backer who made Pillars of Eternity possible. Unlike you mr. sockpuppet. 

 

All these new accounts wihtout backer status coming out of the woodworks suddenly trying to give extra weight to a ****ty position ... typical gg "tactics".

 

Sure you did, now show me evidence of Gators saying he's a great guy, typical SJW tactics, making claims they cannot back up.

 

Do you even know what sockpuppet means? You clearly don't, go look the definition of that, just because someone made a new account on the forumm so they can debate the issue does not make them a soc-puppet anymore than all the cry babies crying "oh, won't you think about the women who get offended about pretty much anything" who have never bough or played the game, hell, they don't even play games.

 

"All these new accounts wihtout backer status coming out of the woodworks suddenly trying to give extra weight to a ****ty position ... typical gg "tactics"."

 

Extra weight? The majority of backers on the forum are in favor of keeping it up, only two people are against, thats~at least a 10 - 2 ratio...

 

Funny how you dismiss other people's opinions because "they haven't backed the project", yet, this was changed because of people who don't even play games to begin with. This is the "opposition", bunch of people who can't defend their position without assuming things, acting like hypocrites and strait up lying about things that never happened.

 

> I deem this offensive, change it or else I won't play your game, that I haven't backed, played or will ever play, because I'm not even a gamer

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 Stop being such entitled whiny little girls with your 1st world problems and grow a pair. The world won't end because of this and idiots will still overreact to things.

 

 

Really? Playing vidya is my principal source of amusement apart from reading. This game is rather pricey for a programmer working in a rather small company in Poland (prices are mostly converted to Euros and the course of Euro to zloty is astounding and rising).  I have to choose one game to buy this month to keep me entertained after my duties. Especially after my beloved grandma has a stroke 3 weeks ago and is paralysed - which means I will support her financially in the future (her pension is ridiculously low, I live and work 500 kilometers away so I have to help hire someone to take care of her). So every eurocent counts. And I need entertainment what with the hard work, economic uncertainty, grandma's and my health problems (I'm on constant medication) and the looming crises near the borders of Poland (they are starting to call back army reservists this and next year, for God's sake, I'm one of them).

 

And now tell me I shouldn't care about the fact that the game I planned a lather large portion of my precious salary to invest in can be changed and censored on a whim of some meddlesome careless easily offended person with enough Twitter following. She can invade my game made to entertain me and give me some respite from everyday problems and dangers, to be paid by me, and take stuff away. Just because she *doesn't like it*. She has to inject everyday politics (when I have newspapers in my country yelling every day about possible aggression from Russia, and nuclear bombers from both countries flying all over Europe) into my moment of respite, my escape into the make-believe.

 

Tell me I'm entitled.

Edited by Azradun
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"Censorship" in the sense many of you are referring to generally requires some sort of authority, typically governmental, removing content deemed inappropriate by the ruling regime.

 

A video game company altering some dialogue in their video game doesn't really rise to the level of censorship under Communism or Fascism you weirdos. Stop making the comparison; it makes you look insane.

 

Again, Obsidian seems to agree that the content is offensive, and removed it, while working with the backer in question. You have no grounds to complain and you aren't going to win people to your cause through ridiculous hyperbole.

 

Of course, what is GamerGate but screaming into the wind about a cause you've already landed on the losing side of?

You are using outdated definitions so it fits your purpose.

If someone/a company is pressured or it is demanded for them to change their art or product, "or else" it is considered censorship, because they were forced to change or not release their art in it's integrity. Censorship and a regime do not need each other to happen. And weirdos? You can barely write proper English, let alone articulate your stance of the subject, you have no moral to call anyone a weirdo. That's why films go through a review and labeling process before they are launched, that is "censorship" in a way, a great example is 30 shades of grey, who has a new "censored" version. Forms of censorship>censorship, get it right next time, before you get schooled again kid.

 

"  Of course, what is GamerGate but screaming into the wind about a cause you've already landed on the losing side of?"

 

Let me see, proved breach of ethics, the journo pro list, proved collision

 

VS

 

Cry babies on twitter who believe in the patriarchy, that "white cis-het males" do not have the right to speak about women & their problems, yet their solo purpose in life is to talk about men. The same people who have been proved to be lying about their threats, location at the time of their treats, and other things which I have no time to talk about.

 

Losing side, how is the vast majority of gamers on the losing side, because there's 6k people crying on Ghazi? Spare me.

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@Azradun Hm, if you're really on that tight a budget, why are you buying games so soon after release anyway? I'm not, and I buy almost all of them a couple of years later when they can be had for 5-15 euros or so. The only ones I buy on release are the ones I'm genuinely interested in.

 

Besides which by then all the bugfixing, rebalancing, and other tweaking will have been done. Your computer will also be more likely to be able to run it well.

 

Computer games are weird: you can actually get a better product for much less money simply by waiting. 

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I have a project. It's a tabletop RPG. It's free. It's a work in progress. Find it here: www.brikoleur.com

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 Stop being such entitled whiny little girls with your 1st world problems and grow a pair. The world won't end because of this and idiots will still overreact to things.

 

 

Really? Playing vidya is my principal source of amusement apart from reading. This game is rather pricey for a programmer working in a rather small company in Poland (prices are mostly converted to Euros and the course of Euro to zloty is astounding and rising).  I have to choose one game to buy this month to keep me entertained after my duties. Especially after my beloved grandma has a stroke 3 weeks ago and is paralysed - which means I will support her financially in the future (her pension is ridiculously low, I live and work 500 kilometers away so I have to help hire someone to take care of her). So every eurocent counts. And I need entertainment what with the hard work, economic uncertainty, grandma's and my health problems (I'm on constant medication) and the looming crises near the borders of Poland (they are starting to call back army reservists this and next year, for God's sake, I'm one of them).

 

And now tell me I shouldn't care about the fact that the game I planned a lather large portion of my precious salary to invest in can be changed and censored on a whim of some meddlesome careless easily offended person with enough Twitter following. She can invade my game made to entertain me and give me some respite from everyday problems and dangers, to be paid by me, and take stuff away. Just because she *doesn't like it*. She has to inject everyday politics (when I have newspapers in my country yelling every day about possible aggression from Russia, and nuclear bombers from both countries flying all over Europe) into my moment of respite, my escape into the make-believe.

 

Tell me I'm entitled.

 

 

Sounds to me like you have way bigger problems than a joke being taken out of the game, so really why are you getting so worked up over something so trivial in the larger scale of things? There's no flashing lights in the game reminding you of the joke that was removed. The only reason this thing is still an issue is because people tend to overreact to even the slightest things these days instead of just shrugging and moving on.

I bet most of the people complaining about it didn't even notice it in the first place.

 

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Hate the living, love the dead.

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@Azradun Hm, if you're really on that tight a budget, why are you buying games so soon after release anyway? I'm not, and I buy almost all of them a couple of years later when they can be had for 5-15 euros or so. The only ones I buy on release are the ones I'm genuinely interested in.

 

 

I'm almost 36 and in moderately bad health - struggling with some medical problems for 6 years now, and my daily stress is strong nowadays. Games are my fuel. My health is only going to get worse, not better.  I buy several books and one game per month to keep me busy and distracted. Pillars of Eternity looked so good I didn't want to wait for a promotion year or two after.

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@Azradun Hm, if you're really on that tight a budget, why are you buying games so soon after release anyway? I'm not, and I buy almost all of them a couple of years later when they can be had for 5-15 euros or so. The only ones I buy on release are the ones I'm genuinely interested in.

 

 

I'm almost 36 and in moderately bad health - struggling with some medical problems for 6 years now, and my daily stress is strong nowadays. Games are my fuel. My health is only going to get worse, not better.  I buy several books and one game per month to keep me busy and distracted. Pillars of Eternity looked so good I didn't want to wait for a promotion year or two after.

 

 

Getting all worked up and enraged isn't going to help your health, of this I'm pretty sure. Enjoy your game and focus on what's really important (hint: the rephrasing of a poem inside a vidya game isn't important).

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Sounds to me like you have way bigger problems than a joke being taken out of the game, so really why are you getting so worked up over something so trivial in the larger scale of things? There's no flashing lights in the game reminding you of the joke that was removed.

 

I can't do anything about any of those bigger problems as they're mostly facts by now so I'm doing things what I can about the thing I can change (I already planned my costs and savings for months ahead, work overtime etc.). I guess it's a normal psychological reaction called 'translation' or something like that (I know this in Polish not English).

 

I don't even care about the joke itself that much. I didn't like it (on aesthetic grounds). What I do care about is the established course of action:

 

1. A person finds content offensive, mobilizes people on Twitter.

2. Obsidian removes content, applies a patch, content goes away.

3. I no longer have that content. Gone.

 

Rinse and repeat?

 

This establishes a bad precedent. If I wanted a game where other people influence it in real time I'd play a MMORPG. And I hate these.

 

Thank you everyone for the conversation, I'll have to be gone for the remainder of the day. I must say I am pleasantly surprised about the level of the discussion here - it's not as bad as I expected (know some very bad and vulgar forums). The community for the game does look good.

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Not sure if you're serious or not. Regardless. Let's take that deep breath together. Inhale. One... Two... Three... Exhale. And again... Okay? I truly don't mean that to patronize you. I am actually concerned you are letting internet cats dancing across a keyboard affect your mood. Oh you weren't aware? That's all we are. Absolutely true. Cats somehow mashing out complete thoughts. Even this. So take this next bit with a grain of salt.

 

 

 

You can not deny this is a triviality if it affects you so. It is a triviality relatively speaking. Claims of alleged insensitivity or obsequiousness have a way of building malign towers to better cast stones. But that is fine. Because you know triviality when you see it, but more importantly... the cats. Hope you feel better LordCrash.

 

Sincerely,

Detruncate

 

 

You're right, I'm sorry. I know I should let this internet stuff get to me but sometimes the pure stupidity, egocentrism and self-righteousness of some people on the internet is really hard to bear.

 

Anyway, I think Obsidian can gladly go without every single customer who feels personally offended by such a triviality (no matter on which "side" you are). The community here and the long-term sanity of its members (devs included) will be better without them. Looking at the ridiculously low post count of many people on this "discussion" proves that most of them aren't really interested in the game itself in the first place...

 

Much Ado About Nothing.

Edited by LordCrash
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35167v4.jpg

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Getting all worked up and enraged isn't going to help your health, of this I'm pretty sure. Enjoy your game and focus on what's really important (hint: the rephrasing of a poem inside a vidya game isn't important).

 

 

Well, I can agree with the first part at least. Being angry does bad things to my blood pressure.

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Just FYI, I am a trans woman, and I was pretty displeased with that memorial, and was writing to Obsidian about it when I saw this update. I knew immediately which text they were talking about because, no, it's not just one crazy person on twitter - That joke was hateful and mean spirited. Guess I need to be raked over the coals too. Kind of horrified at the bile that's come out of this community in response, too. I may be a fan of the same games, but evidently that is as far as common cause goes.Kind of horrified at the bile that's come out of this community in response, too.

You thought it was a bad joke and thats okay. What is not okay is claiming that people should change it because you are offended. Being offended is not an argument of any kind. Being offended is a whine.

Maybe you should start questioning whether you being so ghastly offended by a harmless limerick hass less to do with it being actually offensive and you needing to see psychiatrist.

 

My mother is polish, my father is german. I have heard all kinds of jokes about myself, my country, my gender, my looks, my name, pretty much anything.  Some of those jokes are good and I laugh, some of those jokes a bad but nowhere do I get offended that I need to rally all my tumblr/twitter friends to pressure someone into an apology or change on my behalf.

Why? Because it is not healthy or sane behaviour.

 

 

Kind of horrified at the bile that's come out of this community in response, too

 

 

What are you horrified of? Dissenting opinion? A rational debate like in this thread? People - OH THE HORROR - disagreeing with you?

If any of those things above make you feel "horrified" then I can only repeat myself and tell you, that you should try seeing a psychiatrist since you clearly have **** issues than that.

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Making a semantic argument about how being offended is whining is to ignore that maybe it's not offence it's emotional hurt,  before you come up with a smart retort to that consider the number of people with OCD who find release in physical pain.

Edited by cake-teleporter

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When I was young we were taught:

 

"Sticks and stones may break my bones but names will never hurt me"

 

Do they not teach this anymore? People offended by a limerick need to go to the hardware store, buy a bag of cement and harden the  #@*! up.

 

When will something else be deemed to be offensive to the perpetually offended?

 You do realise that scientific study has proven this saying to be woefully inaccurate right ? Words are a powerful thing. They do lasting damage. Largely when someone resorts to hurting someone else with 'sticks and stones' it is after words have hurt them. 

 So hopefully no one ever gets taught this this silly misleading rhyme ever again.

 

Yes. I bet being horribly offended as an adult by people you dont know and should not care about calling you a mean poopy-head will totally turn you into a well-adjusted normal human being.

 

Yes words have power.  This doest not mean, that this rhyme is silly or misleading, in fact if you want to see something that does lasting damage to people you just need to look at the american education systems and things like common core and/or no child left behind were every child gets hammered into its head that it is a special little snowflake, then goes out in the real world and is surprised that the world does not, in fact, revolve around them.

 

I think we both can agree that wrong parenting and education in school does more harm and "lasting damage" than being called names or mocked in bad jokes.

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There is new bug. I didn't have it before this patch(1.03).

 

I have some scrolls and my characters cant use them. I placed them in quick item inventory, but I see in when hovering on a scroll: Requires 2 lore. And for example Aloth have many more lore...

 

It's really irritating...

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Cage Cursor setting should not turn off after loading a scene or cutscene and is now on by default.

Sweet, the 1 and only issue I have had with the game so far. Thanks for this great game :)

Now I wait for this patch to come out on GoG.

Edited by Death_Masta187

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There is new bug. I didn't have it before this patch(1.03).

 

I have some scrolls and my characters cant use them. I placed them in quick item inventory, but I see in when hovering on a scroll: Requires 2 lore. And for example Aloth have many more lore...

 

It's really irritating...

 

Did you check if they were combat only, by any chance.

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Making a semantic argument about how being offended is whining is to ignore that maybe it's not offence it's emotional hurt,  before you come up with a smart retort to that consider the number of people with OCD who find release in physical pain.

that maybe it's not offence it's emotional hurt

Whoa, whoa, whoa, WHOA, Hold on for a minute. My brain needs to process this level of mental.

You are saying that a joke is so bad that it can cause EMOTIONAL HURT to you? And you find a reaction like this to a joke to be a healthy and proper response? Are you for real?

Edited by Tigranes

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