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FoF is not the be-all-end-all of spells for a wizard, no matter how much you want to claim it is. Aloth is a very useful and powerful caster in my party and FoF isn't even in his grimoire 90% of the time because it's more trouble than it's worth.

Out of curiosity, what are your favorite Wizard spells? I agree with you that it is not the be-all end-all spell, but I've found it to be among the better spells on either level 1 or 2 (haven't gotten to 3 yet).

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That Fan of Flames is overpowered is crazy talk. That is almost the only spell the Wizard has that is worth a damn. Per day cast limitations necessitate potent spells--especially when combat is as frequent as in PoE. Otherwise you end up with the PoE Wizard--a bastardized, impotent, shadow of a proper class.

 

That Fireball is two spell levels higher than it is incredibly significant. The Wizard's highest level is the Wizard's most appropriate spell level to whatever equivalent leveled foes they are facing. That spells do not scale in PoE makes this all the more imperative. Improvements in aim are moot when your spell isn't worth the effort to use. Improved convenience is not an appropriate trade off, particularly when the Wizard class is the sum of their spells. Right now, PoE wizards are slightly more than the sum of FoF uses per day. That is is pitiful and disgraceful.

 

If they balance should shift--which it needs to, then Fan of Flames should be used on the basis of being a floor, where other spells are brought up to or beyond it.

 

It's not that FoF is OP, it's that it's just extremely imbalanced when compared to other spells.  It's not the only one either, there are a lot of spells that just seem flat out better/worse to spells they should be on par with.

 

So I'm not saying here to nerf FoF, I'm saying that the spells need to be brought in line with each other more.  Noxious blast should not just be flat out better than fireball in all regards for example.

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I'm gonna agree with Nameless here.  A third level spell should have some advantage over a first level one.  I'm not saying that first level spells should be useless, but I shouldn't be coveting my first level spells lots WAY more than my third level ones which is what i'm doing now.

Tartantyco just pointed out how it does, though. If Fireball has a larger AoE radius, then that means you can do X damage to more targets than with fan of flames. So, if you hit 10 people with less damage, instead of 4 people with more damage, you're still able to deal more damage to the greater number of people. And more easily hit them all without having to get them to cluster up. AND without having to get so close to them, or take the time to reposition so that you can cast Fan of Flames, etc.

 

I'm not saying it's perfect, but there are advantages. You can't just look at one spell's base damage number, then another's, and go "3rd level should be higher!". Yeah, if they both function identically. If they were both just single-target fire spells, the 3rd level should most definitely deal higher damage.

 

Now, that being said, it's possible that the encounter design is lacking in the "allow you to take advantage of those advantages" department. But, that isn't the spell's fault. What you CAN do with the spell is not the same thing as what you end up being able to do.

 

But, that's kind of the whole point of this game being "tactical combat." How you use your spells should be just as important as which ones you use. If they were all just "see enemy - fire off spell straight at them", it would be rather bland.

 

Fireball has a smaller AoE radius, actually.

 

It's ONLY advantages are faster casting time and longer range. In every other way it's simply worse than Fan of Flames.

 

Do those advantages make up for the huge drop in damage (especially given that higher level spells are supposed to be stronger, not weaker)? Not in my book.

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Fireball has a smaller AoE radius, actually.

 

It's ONLY advantages are faster casting time and longer range. In every other way it's simply worse than Fan of Flames.

 

Do those advantages make up for the huge drop in damage (especially given that higher level spells are supposed to be stronger, not weaker)? Not in my book.

Does it? Hmm. If that's the case, then yeah, there's probably a pretty big discrepancy there.

 

I kind of expect a lot of numbers tweaks, though, in the coming patches, after/alongside the major bug fixes. This kind of thing almost always happens with new RPGs like this. There are just so many ability values, it's difficult to get them all properly tuned. Though, again, if Fireball doesn't have any other advantages over FoF, then it's indeed a bit strange for there to be such a damage discrepancy.

Should we not start with some Ipelagos, or at least some Greater Ipelagos, before tackling a named Arch Ipelago? 6_u

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It's not easy to position to use Fan of Flames well without frying your own folks in the process. You have to flank and get fairly close (or drop your wizard on the frontline). Once I've accidentally fried my frontline by not getting it right and I've also found my wizard getting in trouble after deploying it as well because foes decided to target him. And in narrow spaces/dungeon corridors it's often just not practicable at all.

 

If you did want to frontline your wiz, i guess you could combine with the easier escape from engagement talent and the cloak that does the same. Could be fairly brutal against a fast-closing horde, then hide behind a higher-deflection ally.

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Fan of flame is more powerfuly damagingl than any other level 1 skill in the game and most level 2-3 etc skills.

 

Slicken is beyond unbalanced, equally (and terrifyingly) effective against low and high level enemies

Edited by Lightzy
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With high Intellect there's a sweet spot about four meters behind your front line where you can catch it and the enemy front line in the yellow part of the targeting wedge, without exposing your Wizard.

 

Plus FoF is in the first tier of spells to become per-encounter at higher levels. You get a fan, and you get a fan, and you get a fan...  :aiee:

Exoduss, on 14 Apr 2015 - 11:11 AM, said: 

 

also secret about hardmode with 6 man party is :  its a faceroll most of the fights you will Auto Attack mobs while lighting your spliff

 

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I think the real problem behind all this is the way that INT affects your AoE effects.

 

I was preaching this all throughout the backer beta: the safezone extra AoE range that only affects enemies is bull. It destroys all balancing of spells as you can almost always hit enemies with AoEs without endangering your party members.

The way you do it now is that you just move away from the mob until the yellow part of the cone hits all enemies but your fighter tank is not touching the red cone and boom, happy killing.

Cone effects are meant to damage your tank! The way the safezone AoE works it's way too easy to land those spells, making them overpowered as ****.

 

 

Again, this solution has been around since backer beta, but the devs decided that it was too hard to implement (for whatever reason I don't understand):

Instead of adding a friendly-fire safezone to spells with INT, allow players to use the mousewheel to scale the size of the spell area based on a range defined by INT! In other words: INT allows you a larger scaling range, making the spell more flexible without adding an ez-mode non-friendly fire zone.

Edited by Zwiebelchen
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