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Hey, I just found out that a spiritual successor to BG2 is coming out in a week so I spent most of yesterday slacking off at work while reading about POE and watching devs play it on youtube.

I really wanted to like the game but all it made me want to do was go back and play BG2 again. The UI looks inconvenient and click intensive. Is there no way to assign party abilities to a single bar and use keyboard shortcuts for each of them? Constant pausing to give basic instructions is a turn off and as far as I could tell there was no party AI. Combat in general seems more focused on attrition than strategy. The last straw for me was when I saw the fireball spell and instead of a massive explosion that incinerates everything and makes your whole party spread out and run for cover... a little campfire appeared.

Am I missing something? The story, graphics, and dialogue/scripted events look great. I'd give the game a chance and download a demo but right now a 45$ price tag doesn't seem justified.

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Honestly, it seems that the complaints you are making are related to the Baldur Gate games as well. That one is click intensive too, and lack a single bar for party abilities too. I can't say much about the combat system. Even though I played the beta, I am not as mechanically well-versed as some of the other members. To me it felt like there was enough strategy. And again, Baldur's Gate 1 and 2 weren't particularly strategic either. 

 

A lot of your complaints are in the game to evoke the memory of the old-style CRPGs. 

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The story, graphics, and dialogue/scripted events look great. I'd give the game a chance and download a demo but right now a 45$ price tag doesn't seem justified.

 

If the game has great story, graphics and scripted events I'd call it a success, even if the UI and controls were disappointing. Or if not a success, at least worth the average game price. *shrugs*

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You could just play BG2, sure, but don't be surprised when developers stop trying to make games like BG2.  If you want more games like BG2, then you should support the new products that come out.  

 

$45 is not too much to pay for a future where games like BG2 continue to get made.  

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... but right now a 45$ price tag doesn't seem justified.

"I saw some videos and didn't like the UI, this up to 100 hours long RPG is clearly not worth $45!"

...

Ok.

Literally every popular new game at every price point gets flooded in the first week or two with posts complaining about the price. This happens even with free to play games - people complain about the ads, the dlc, etc.

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You could just play BG2, sure, but don't be surprised when developers stop trying to make games like BG2.  If you want more games like BG2, then you should support the new products that come out.  

 

$45 is not too much to pay for a future where games like BG2 continue to get made.  

 

This right here. Everyone reading this forum has the ability to cobble together $45 and you are flat-out lying to yourself and us if you say otherwise. The game may be imperfect right at launch, but it will get patched. For that better experience down the road and for future games, it is worth supporting both this title and Obsidian at launch to give them the good press and good numbers they need when doing their strategic planning for future projects. 

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I'm a non backer and I have no problem with the $45 price tag. It actually seems to be on the cheap side for me when compared to other games. The game looks gorgeous and from what I've seen the game play looks to be enjoyable enough (what concerns me most in a rpg is immersion/story which I know obsidian does very well). If the game is able to keep my interest for at least one or hopefully multiple playthroughs it will be well worth the money (considering each playthrough will be around the 100 hour mark). I love the option of being able to create my own custom party too, it'll be a lot of fun to mess around with. 

 

As far as the interface is concerned, I just finished running through the BG saga (first time), the UI in Pillars of Eternity looks like a big improvement in comparison. The BG UI was pretty clunky and certain tasks (such as finding spells at higher levels and inventory management between characters) was a bit of a chore. In Pillars of Eternity spells appear a lot easier to access as they are clearly separated by level (instead of one long list where the position of spells would change depending on what you chose to memorize) and the inventory UI looks great making it really easy to manage items between characters (probably the thing I liked doing the least in BG). I know there are complaints about the stash, but you are able to restrict it if you like. I don't really see any difference between it and bags of holding/gem bags/potion cases. I never used AI in BG since I prefer to issue each order so that aspect doesn't really effect me. 

Edited by Trius
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I'd agree with the OP that $45 could be a bit steep for a game you don't know much about. And i'm not going to tell anyone how much money they have to spend on video games, or that they have an obligation to support new products. Saying that - it is my favourite genre and I blindly pre-purchased anyway :p Looks like it was a good move. 

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I saw the fireball spell and instead of a massive explosion that incinerates everything and makes your whole party spread out and run for cover... a little campfire appeared.

I agree with this. It almost looks like... a liquid splash instead of an explosion.

 

Which is quite strange, because every other spell effect in PoE looks super over-the-top flashy. Much more than they did in any IE game.

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If I wanted to play a mmo, I'd play a mmo. PoE is what it is. For quickbars and button mashing easymode combat there are consoles and gamepads.

 

I don't understand this comment. In BG and the other IE games you  had a quick bar for all of your spells and combat abilities.

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If I wanted to play a mmo, I'd play a mmo. PoE is what it is. For quickbars and button mashing easymode combat there are consoles and gamepads.

 

Any game today and moving foward should still be able to take bits and pieces of modern ui's and incorporate. One of the big advancements you can do to BG is improve upon its UI. I don't need clunky acting as a "thinkers UI". Higher resolution allows for much more elegant designs. What I want in a UI, whatever I'm thinking in my head to do next, make it as easy as possible to execute. That doesn't mean I only want 4-6-8 choices.

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If I wanted to play a mmo, I'd play a mmo. PoE is what it is. For quickbars and button mashing easymode combat there are consoles and gamepads.

 

I don't understand this comment. In BG and the other IE games you  had a quick bar for all of your spells and combat abilities.

 

 

Maybe I was a little snarky, so I apologise upfront for it. As a veteran RPG payer, it's just a little frustrating to see that every step the gaming industry takes towards making games more mainstream and casual-friendly, is a step towards the demise of quality RPGs. Just one example, BioWare selling its soul to the mainstream just led to the realms of day-one paid DLCs, micro-transactions, pushing out unrealistic release dates with bugged products, etc. It was like a heartbreak, and it's just one of many lately.

 

The OP states that it takes too much micromanagement to get through fights. For me it's not too much, it's just right, and it's what I want, and I dare say that's what about every IE veteran that misses games like BG wants.

 

There is enough market for ripped off and soul-less button mashing RPGs, and I'm pretty sure EA will happily have that kind of player. I fear if PoE takes the route of "pleasing everyone" and "making it all easier" it'll end up like every other generic RPG these days. Personally I want PoE to be exactly what it is. A PC RPG for PC RPGers, with the good old feel of Baldur's Gate saga. Perhaps too hardcore/oldschool for a lot of people, and perhaps that's why publishers wouldn't take the risk of embarking in a project like Eternity, and it needed to be crowdfunded. That's fine. It's crowdfunded now, and I hope the game stays true to its roots and style.

 

Bottom line is: Don't consolize my IE games. It's fine to not like how PoE plays out, but PoE is a bastion of hope these days, and needs to remain being what it is.

Edited by Emerwyn
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If I wanted to play a mmo, I'd play a mmo. PoE is what it is. For quickbars and button mashing easymode combat there are consoles and gamepads.

 

I don't understand this comment. In BG and the other IE games you  had a quick bar for all of your spells and combat abilities.

 

 

Maybe I was a little snarky, so I apologise upfront for it. As a veteran RPG payer, it's just a little frustrating to see that every step the gaming industry takes towards making games more mainstream and casual-friendly, is a step towards the demise of quality RPGs. Just one example, BioWare selling its soul to the mainstream just led to the realms of day-one paid DLCs, micro-transactions, pushing out unrealistic release dates with bugged products, etc. It was like a heartbreak, and it's just one of many lately.

 

The OP states that it takes too much micromanagement to get through fights. For me it's not too much, it's just right, and it's what I want, and I dare say that's what about every IE veteran that misses games like BG wants.

 

There is enough market for ripped off and soul-less button mashing RPGs, and I'm pretty sure EA will happily have that kind of player. I personally want PoE to be exactly what it is. A PC RPG for PC RPGers, with the good old feel of Baldur's Gate saga. Perhaps too hardcore/oldschool for a lot of people, and perhaps that's why publishers wouldn't take the risk of embarking in a project like Eternity, and it needed to be crowdfunded. That's fine. It's crowdfunded now, and I hope the game stays true to its roots and style.

 

Bottom line is: Don't consolize my IE games. It's fine to not like how PoE plays out, but PoE is a bastion of hope these days, and needs to remain being what it is.

 

 

I believe we are in the new golden age of TB/Pause. In the past two years, I'd put that up against any other two years in gaming history, so they are no longer rare and precious. They are just warmly welcomed.

 

IMO a game would be a hassel if...

You had to pause all the time to give just a single order, otherwise they do some mundane default order.

That when you pause, not everyone is ready to take an order. So you fight through that.

That there would be no scripting AI, so if you don't pause every 6 they can act reasonably well.

That when you pause to give an order, it is several clicks to make that order sometimes.

 

We've all played the "dumbing down" card, there is a place where both worlds can come together to make it better than it ever was. Yesteryear UI's have plenty of room for improvement.

 

What I write is a generality and not pointed towards PoEt.

Edited by Horrorscope
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All I want from the AI is that if I leave a unit auto-attacking a target, that unit sticks to auto-attacking that target until I give it a different order. Same for holding positions, or staying idle. That's really the only thing that has frustrated me in other games, when a party member doesn't stick to doing exactly what you told them to do without suddenly and randomly deciding they feel like doing something else and run into a fireball when you told them to stay put, or stay still while you told them to keep shooting arrows at X target.

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Many pausing, no AI for teammates, no easy access to spells...

 

Did the OP just describe Baldur's Gate II? It sounds like it to me...

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^

 

 

I agree that that is such a stupid idiotic pathetic garbage hateful retarded scumbag evil satanic nazi like term ever created. At least top 5.

 

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Well I kinda agree. The combat is not particularly great even in recent beta - its a bit of a clusterf***, and they failed to improve the UI much from the old games. I understand this is basically a nostalgia game but I am disappointed they didn't look to advance it much - same story with giving up on the moving shrubs/trees in the wind. Maybe for expansion or PoE2 or a new iso RPG they will advance it more. However assuming all the talk isn't lies and gameplay videos aren't vertical-slices then I think this game will be well worth $45 or more, I paid more for South Park RPG that was only 13 hours and that was worth it

 

I wish the action bars were better. I don't mean they should make us only be able to use 6 abilities, but the ability UI is just...old. I feel like when I click a character it should have a few action bars pop up immediately, and I can drag and drop abiltiies wherever I want on these bars and keybind them. Then if I get more abilities than will fit on these bars have an arrow to go down to more bars, or have an option to have as many action bars as I want stacking up on the left. It just seems irritating to click on the character then hover over "I" or "II" then find and select the ability, also looks like you can't drag the abilities around (correct me if I'm wrong) which sucks

 

This isn't dumbing down or culling abilities, I just want to be able to tailor action bars to my liking and have instant access to all of my abilities when I click my character rather than through pop-up menus that I can't even customize

Edited by Bli1942
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