Interview with Josh Sawyer tomorrow, Thursday the 19th at 8 p.m. EST on my Twitch channel!

[Horrorscope]

just watched the interview. it was really awesome, and i liked where you actualyl can toggle on/off inventory limit. most of the time, it is jsut frustrating instead of challenging

 

Same. Enjoyed it, first time listening to Sawyer, you can sense the wisdom and thought in his decision making.

Edited March 20, 2015 by Horrorscope

[armorb]

Well, I don't agree with some of his points of view, but Sensuki deserves a whole outlaw band named after him for his effort to improve the game. Make it happen, Obsidian!

[ryukenden]

 

youtube version for those who missed it.

[Arvan Eleron]

 

youtube version for those who missed it.

Thanks, Ryu--was just coming over here to link this!  :D

 

     --Arv

     http://www.twitch.tv/arvaneleron

[Osvir]

@Arv: It was a nice stream and interview, really cool chat and it felt really friendly overall, and pretty down to earth. I checked out a little bit on your Icewind Dale play, was pretty cool (I don't look at LP's, 6 player co-op, never tried it/seen it).
 

Well, I don't agree with some of his points of view, but Sensuki deserves a whole outlaw band named after him for his effort to improve the game. Make it happen, Obsidian!

 

They need to be overpowered and have no movement penalties or engagement rules either (That could be a pretty darn difficult challenge). Essentially: not follow the designed rules

 

"The Infinite Rulebreakers". Or "Infinity Outlaws" xD

Edited March 21, 2015 by Osvir

[Ashen Rohk]

Heya Arv,

 

Really great interview, very informative. If I had one piece of feedback for you, it's that sometimes you put over your opinions in your questions a bit too much so some things can come off a little bit loaded, and you do talk almost as much as Josh did for the interview.

 

But again, really interesting stuff.

[Arvan Eleron]

Thanks for the kind words, folks...I appreciate them! As for the questions, I also tried to pass along a number of questions from chat, and a couple of those definitely had a particular slant--in those cases I have to balance not giving the interviewee a question which obviously reflects the viewer's particular opinion, on the one hand, and not giving my audience a chance to ask things about the game which matter most to them on the other. Definitely a balancing act, for sure.

 

--Arv

http://www.twitch.tv/arvaneleron

 

P.S. Because I was curious, I went back and timed it, and Josh spoke about twice as much as I did--which is how it should be, since the interview should be about the guest, not the interviewer. Josh was really thoughtful and gracious with his replies, which made my job a lot easier!

Edited March 21, 2015 by Arvan Eleron

[Luckmann]

 

Also Sensuki would love JE's explanation....lol...someone really asked him why does he restrict movement so much in PE.

 

Pretty much said nuh uh.

Someone I know asked two questions that I was interested in and both of them were deflected/dismissed.

 

 

I don't think anyone that's come to know the Sawyer school of game design is surprised by that.

[GreyFox]

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees. That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

[Arvan Eleron]

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees. That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

I'm genuinely curious about this, though--I was actually surprised how much he emphasized community involvement, more than many of the other devs I've spoken with over the years. It seems like they pay a good deal of attention to feedback--is that not the case? *prepares to bolt if bringing this up is like leaping into the hornet's nest*

 

--Arv

http://twitch.tv/arvaneleron

[Luckmann]

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

 

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees.

 

That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

 

I don't know. At some point, I think it is a bigger problem when someone thinks like this about oneself, rather than others thinking it about you. There's no shortage of input, and we're not talking about the level of cognitive isolation that an actual celebrity might end up living in because of their surroundings and underlings or their sheer wealth. I think he's just a deeply conservative person that would rather not see or engage criticism, or discuss decisions, and as often have been seen, would rather deflect or dismiss it. I think that he's still a thinking person and the level of misunderstanding I've seen when he's asked certain questions just have to be have to be because he's either unaware of the context and discussions, or just him being wilfully obtuse.

 

 

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees. That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

I'm genuinely curious about this, though--I was actually surprised how much he emphasized community involvement, more than many of the other devs I've spoken with over the years. It seems like they pay a good deal of attention to feedback--is that not the case? *prepares to bolt if bringing this up is like leaping into the hornet's nest*

 

--Arv

 

http://twitch.tv/arvaneleron

 

When he says "community feedback", he is likely referring to his own community of 10ish friends on the $10 SomethingAwful forums that have no idea how things actually fits together at the end of the day. A cursory trudge through these forums should tell you as much after a while.

 

 

Welcome... to the ECHODOME..! dome.. ome...

 

Edited March 21, 2015 by Luckmann

[Elerond]

 

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees. That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

I'm genuinely curious about this, though--I was actually surprised how much he emphasized community involvement, more than many of the other devs I've spoken with over the years. It seems like they pay a good deal of attention to feedback--is that not the case? *prepares to bolt if bringing this up is like leaping into the hornet's nest*

 

--Arv

http://twitch.tv/arvaneleron

 

 

They take heed on community feedback, which of course don't mean that they always change things like some members of community would like and usually they don't defend their choices which frustrates some members of community, but as Josh said if it is somewhat straightforward to offer option to toggle things so that people can customize their experience as they want they usually offer such toggle in options. But often things that some community members want can't simply made as optional toggle, then they have often offer some sort compromise solution, like for example they first had only quest objective based xp system, but some community members were quite loud about how they want to get xp from combat and some other things like lock picking and disarming traps, and so they changed system so that you can now get minor xp from those tasks. But sometimes they just decide that their version is better for the game or that they don't have resources to offer implementation that community members want.

 

It should also noted that it has been rare occurrences where community has been somewhat single minded about some specific issue and those times Obsidian has always tried to solve the issue. But usually things are so that community is quite split how they feel about issues and usually loudest voice (most post) always belongs to those who have issues with current implementation.

[Arvan Eleron]

 

 

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees. That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

I'm genuinely curious about this, though--I was actually surprised how much he emphasized community involvement, more than many of the other devs I've spoken with over the years. It seems like they pay a good deal of attention to feedback--is that not the case? *prepares to bolt if bringing this up is like leaping into the hornet's nest*

 

--Arv

http://twitch.tv/arvaneleron

 

 

They take heed on community feedback, which of course don't mean that they always change things like some members of community would like and usually they don't defend their choices which frustrates some members of community, but as Josh said if it is somewhat straightforward to offer option to toggle things so that people can customize their experience as they want they usually offer such toggle in options. But often things that some community members want can't simply made as optional toggle, then they have often offer some sort compromise solution, like for example they first had only quest objective based xp system, but some community members were quite loud about how they want to get xp from combat and some other things like lock picking and disarming traps, and so they changed system so that you can now get minor xp from those tasks. But sometimes they just decide that their version is better for the game or that they don't have resources to offer implementation that community members want.

 

It should also noted that it has been rare occurrences where community has been somewhat single minded about some specific issue and those times Obsidian has always tried to solve the issue. But usually things are so that community is quite split how they feel about issues and usually loudest voice (most post) always belongs to those who have issues with current implementation.

 

Really good and detailed answer, Elerond--thanks.

 

     --Arv

     http://www.twitch.tv/arvaneleron

[Gromnir]

 

To be fair he could honestly be surrounded by yes men...

I mean some people think of these guys as celebrities and such so if one of those were working there they may not want to challenge the decisions or come hard with opinions, especially newer employees. That's why I don't buy the whole "well QA isn't complaining about it" schtick.

I'm genuinely curious about this, though--I was actually surprised how much he emphasized community involvement, more than many of the other devs I've spoken with over the years. It seems like they pay a good deal of attention to feedback--is that not the case? *prepares to bolt if bringing this up is like leaping into the hornet's nest*

 

--Arv

http://twitch.tv/arvaneleron

 

one of the greatest strengths of poe will also be one of its greatest weakness.  josh did mention in the interview just how much impact the input the community had on the game, which should be reassuring.  to know that there is a possibility that features will be changed based on some kinda community consensus, which is 'bout as rare as a unicorn in central park, results in more folks becoming invested in the game, and not just monetarily.  fans already see poe as their game, which is a good thing. more than a few things has been changed in poe as a result o' fan requests, and so fans see that they has made a difference. unfortunately, that is a double-edged sword.

 

fans can be idiots.  the fact that we can be idiots in large numbers is cause for concern rather than applause.  josh, in the interview, made comment about dealing with the feeling requests.  sadly, more than a few o' the feeling changes arguably make the game worse rather than better.  a fighter that is exceptional at simultaneous exacting and absorbing damage were a given in the ie games, so that is what the fans o' poe expected and clamored to get included into poe even though the poe fighter had a more limited role in poe. similarly, the paladin, were meant as a support character that were excellent in defense.  the paladin's role were important to the developers 'cause it helped differentiate the numerous classes they created.  got multiple support characters that is all good offensive and defensive and is great with melee weapons? what is point o' making multiple classes f they is all capable o' fulfilling the same role? even so, the fans wanted a poe paladin who could smite the wicked rather than one who were mere able to hold up a shield and defend against such villains and monsters. well, in response to public demand, we received a smite ability.  is not that smite is bad, but it don't improve the paladin more than giving folks more o' the paladin feel they expected. wasted resources?  perhaps.  

 

from the interview we could see that josh saw value in the way 4e differentiated the roles o' classes.  rogues and wizards in 4e played very different, they had different roles and each class could excel in that role.  unfortunately, 4e rogues didn't feel enough like 3e or ad&d rogues, and 4e wizards didn't feel enough like mordenkainen or tenser to d&d fans. the obsidians ran into the same problem with the poe community.  expectations got/get in the way o' obsidian making progress, and their obstacle is the feelings o' the community.

 

is nothing wrong with fulfilling wishes based on nothing save feel, as long as such stuff doesn't measurably impact developer notions o' balance and their ever-shrinking pool o' man-hours. add token bestiary, exploration and traps/lock xp?  were easy to add, and so we got such token features included in poe.  why?  feel.  were not a tough fix and it appeased those who wanted some kinda throwback to ie game xp awards.  token xp grants didn't fundamentally alter the quest & objective xp mechanic obsidian adopted and were a cheap fix.  win-win, eh?

 

Gromir paid money to obsidian to make poe 'cause we trust that they can make a good pc crpg.  at some point we gotta step back and let the folks that know what they are doing, do their work.  why hire somebody if you aren't gonna trust 'em to do the actual work they were hired to do?  Gromnir wants input, but if developers offer a rational and reasonable reason as to why they chose to do A instead o' B, we typical trust 'em.  yeah, we want explanations and, from time to time, we will rail and moan like a little kid if we disagree, but for the most part, what we is looking for is transparency more than control.  

 

am thinking poe will be a stronger 'cause o' its transparency.  at the same time, we believe that the game were somewhat diminished by the obsidian decision to actual listen to us, 'cause as we said already, we are idiots.

 

HA! Good Fun!