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As one of the people involved in the modding of the game - the only thing I'm kinda annoyed/disappointed about is the silence on whether we'll be given externalized scene files so we can edit stuff in areas (like place npcs and stuff like that). It is possible that it can be done in a rather hackish other fashion, but access to the scene files would be ideal.

inXile externalized their scene files for the Wasteland 2 areas. No reason why Obsidian can't do it either.

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No, you're not obligated to anything. But don't try to disguise your venom as arguments. Stop your false accusations.

 

If you feel that a polite, profanity-free and hearthfelt OP is venom, you need to sort out your priorities.

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It's not at all your manners I'm adressing, I didn't call you impolite. But making false claims that Obsidion is not fulfilling their promises, without any facts to back it up, that's venom to a game like PoE. 

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If legal issues are the reason we won't get certain tools, there is always certain "unofficial" ways of getting tools to the masses.

 

Leak the internal specs of the game to private persons to help them build custom converter tools in Java or C. From almost 15 years of modding experience, I can tell you that there is always a handful of guys in every community that can write 3rd party tools for almost anything, from simple converters to full-blown editors.

 

However, this requires to know what you are looking for.

It isn't that hard for private modders to gain access to certain unity tools in the anonymity of the internet. What we need, however, is intel on how it all comes together in the end.

Edited by Zwiebelchen
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they said the game will be mod-able with a mod friendly file structure as much as possible. they never said they will give us an sdk

a simple type of  moding would be the use of custom portraits. they wont include photoshop to help you make the portraits, but if you can make them, you can just put them in a folder and they will be available for in game use

The words freedom and liberty, are diminishing the true meaning of the abstract concept they try to explain. The true nature of freedom is such, that the human mind is unable to comprehend it, so we make a cage and name it freedom in order to give a tangible meaning to what we dont understand, just as our ancestors made gods like Thor or Zeus to explain thunder.

 

-Teknoman2-

What? You thought it was a quote from some well known wise guy from the past?

 

Stupidity leads to willful ignorance - willful ignorance leads to hope - hope leads to sex - and that is how a new generation of fools is born!


We are hardcore role players... When we go to bed with a girl, we roll a D20 to see if we hit the target and a D6 to see how much penetration damage we did.

 

Modern democracy is: the sheep voting for which dog will be the shepherd's right hand.

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If legal issues are the reason we won't get certain tools, there is always certain "unofficial" ways of getting tools to the masses.

Afaik, legal issues is not the problem here, lack of resources is.

 

Modability never was a selling point of PoE and was brought during Kickstarter campaign by community, not by developers. When the question appeared, devs answered like "Uh, okay, we'll do what we can to support modders as long as it won't require us to go out of our way too far", which is perfectly reasonable for game of this type and budget by me.

 

Now, developing dedicated modding tools definitely looks like going out of the way too far, so... externalizing certain game files is going to be about all in terms of modability.

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If legal issues are the reason we won't get certain tools, there is always certain "unofficial" ways of getting tools to the masses.

Afaik, legal issues is not the problem here, lack of resources is.

 

Modability never was a selling point of PoE and was brought during Kickstarter campaign by community, not by developers. When the question appeared, devs answered like "Uh, okay, we'll do what we can to support modders as long as it won't require us to go out of our way too far", which is perfectly reasonable for game of this type and budget by me.

 

Now, developing dedicated modding tools definitely looks like going out of the way too far, so... externalizing certain game files is going to be about all in terms of modability.

 

 

It's not about developing modding tools. I'm not asking for a world editor. I'm asking about getting full access to all assets in the game via a nicely done file structure.

Let's take for example the scene files, which supposedly contain all the area layers and the object data like items, npcs, dialogues, etc.

 

If the folder that contains these scene files is accessable, all we need is a code injection that loads a custom scene when the game starts (or even better: the game supports that by giving us the option to load a custom scene directly from the main menu - like a "start custom campaign" button) and the specs on how the scene file is structured internally.

 

It's then basicly up to the modding community to use the structure and the critical intel to create executables and tools that allow to convert and merge typical file formats like tga into a game-readable scene file. This is no rocket science and has been done before for hundreds of games.

 

 

It would be cool if in the end it becomes as easy as creating 5 TGA files (containing all the background layers of the game) via photoshop or 3dsmax/blender, some XML sheets for NPC or mob data and text files for the dialogues and events and then merge them into a new scene via the pressing of a button to throw into the scenes folder.

Edited by Zwiebelchen
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It's not about developing modding tools. I'm not asking for a world editor. I'm asking about getting full access to all assets in the game via a nicely done file structure.

Let's take for example the scene files, which supposedly contain all the area layers and the object data like items, npcs, dialogues, etc.

 

If the folder that contains these scene files is accessable, all we need is a code injection that loads a custom scene when the game starts (or even better: the game supports that by giving us the option to load a custom scene directly from the main menu - like a "start custom campaign" button) and the specs on how the scene file is structured internally.

 

It's then basicly up to the modding community to use the structure and the critical intel to create executables and tools that allow to convert and merge typical file formats like tga into a game-readable scene file. This is no rocket science and has been done before for hundreds of games.

 

It would be cool if in the end it becomes as easy as creating 5 TGA files (containing all the background layers of the game) via photoshop or 3dsmax/blender, some XML sheets for NPC or mob data and text files for the dialogues and events and then merge them into a new scene via the pressing of a button to throw into the scenes folder.

That's pretty much the way it supposed to be done for now (as you already found out from Mod Support thread in Beta section :D).

 

Giving the fact that PoE's Beta being modded even before full game is out, I wouldn't worry about post-release modability at all.

Edited by Yellow Rabbit
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It's not about developing modding tools. I'm not asking for a world editor. I'm asking about getting full access to all assets in the game via a nicely done file structure.

Let's take for example the scene files, which supposedly contain all the area layers and the object data like items, npcs, dialogues, etc.

 

If the folder that contains these scene files is accessable, all we need is a code injection that loads a custom scene when the game starts (or even better: the game supports that by giving us the option to load a custom scene directly from the main menu - like a "start custom campaign" button) and the specs on how the scene file is structured internally.

 

It's then basicly up to the modding community to use the structure and the critical intel to create executables and tools that allow to convert and merge typical file formats like tga into a game-readable scene file. This is no rocket science and has been done before for hundreds of games.

 

It would be cool if in the end it becomes as easy as creating 5 TGA files (containing all the background layers of the game) via photoshop or 3dsmax/blender, some XML sheets for NPC or mob data and text files for the dialogues and events and then merge them into a new scene via the pressing of a button to throw into the scenes folder.

That's pretty much the way it supposed to be done for now (as you already found out from Mod Support thread in Beta section :D).

 

Giving the fact that PoE's Beta being modded even before full game is out, I wouldn't worry about post-release modability at all.

 

 

Well then, I'm there to create and share 3D art assets such as landscapes and armors. ;)

What I can't do, however, is writing some neat Javascript tools to convert my photoshop or 3dsmax files into scenes... I hope Sensuki and Besker will step in on that and provide us with tools along the road...

Edited by Zwiebelchen
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Obsidian didn't promised comprehensive mod support or mod tools for PoE, but they said they try their best to make game's files such that they are edit able and there is no systems that prevents such editing.

 

They also made deal with nexus for distribution of mods

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/obsidian/project-eternity/posts/323119

 

 

Mod Support

From Neverwinter Nights 2 to Fallout: New Vegas, we've enjoyed supporting the mod community, and we are continuing that with Project Eternity. It is awesome to see how you extend the worlds we make.

To make getting mods easy, we are excited to announce that our friends at the Nexus will be the official spot to download Project Eternity mods once the game is released. They have been a great host for mods for our past games, and we want to continue the trend with the Project Eternity Nexus. Check out the Nexus Network at www.nexusmods.com.

 

Our plan is to release our file-format information and expose as much of the data in the game as possible for you to extend and edit. We traditionally do not "hard-code" numbers so that our designers, and you, have the power to easily change and iterate on RPG data. We also plan on releasing localization tools to let communities around the world create localized versions for languages we are not translating Project Eternity into.

 

As we get more familiar with Unity during production, we will be extending Project Eternity even more for mod makers. Look forward to announcements in the months ahead as we make further progress and can provide you with more information about tools and mod support.

 

Their publishing deal with Paradox is distribution deal, and money that they got/saved (which way you want to look it) because of that deal went to improve PoE itself.

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/65751-pillars-of-eternity-%E2%80%93-partnership-faq-for-backers/

 

EDIT: Of course it would be nice if they open even more PoE's files in released version or in future patch.

Edited by Elerond
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Modding however was a big selling point.

 

Then you are imagining things.

 

Counter-cites:

 

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-10-08-obsidian-promises-mod-support-for-project-eternity (Oct 8th, 2012)

 

 

"Our plan is to release our file-format information and expose as much of the data in the game as possible for you to extend and edit. We traditionally do not "hard-code" numbers so that our designers, and you, have the power to easily change and iterate on RPG data. We also plan on releasing localization tools to let communities around the world create localized versions for languages we are not translating Project Eternity into," wrote Obsidian senior programmer Tim Cain and project director Adam Brennecke in the update.

 

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/obsidian/project-eternity/posts/323119 (Kickstarter update #16, Oct 6, 2012)

 

 

Our plan is to release our file-format information and expose as much of the data in the game as possible for you to extend and edit. We traditionally do not "hard-code" numbers so that our designers, and you, have the power to easily change and iterate on RPG data. We also plan on releasing localization tools to let communities around the world create localized versions for languages we are not translating Project Eternity into.

As we get more familiar with Unity during production, we will be extending Project Eternity even more for mod makers. Look forward to announcements in the months ahead as we make further progress and can provide you with more information about tools and mod support.

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64794-interview-with-josh-sawyer-pcworld-update-69-modding/ (Dec 10th, 2013 -- link goes to a forum post specifically discussing mod support / lack thereof):

 

 

Is the game mod-friendly?

JS: It’s not mod-unfriendly...

There are certain elements of it that I think are probably going to be easier to mod than others. Environments are probably going to be pretty tough to author on your own, because even for us they’re complicated, they’re time-consuming to build, they’re very hi-res, they involve a number of special passes and things.

Other things I think are friendlier to modification, but we’ll have to see.

AB: It depends...we’re still investigating how much...since we’re using Unity there’s a lot of things we need to work around for modability, but we want to do everything we can do for the mod community. We’ll be really open, if they have questions. It’s nice because with publishers a lot of times they don’t like us talking about the technology and ways of doing things, but people can ask us on the forums and we can answer them.

So it would be hard to make a new environment but easier, maybe, to do a quest line or...

AB: Or an item pack. Adjust the rules system a little bit.

JS: Some of that stuff we’re externalizing. Weapons, some of the racial modifiers, we’re putting them in separate things so some of that stuff will be easier to modify than others.

 

http://www.examiner.com/article/e3-2014-obsidian-s-pillars-of-eternity-strives-to-be-another-classic-pc-rpg?cid=rss (June 24, 2014):

 

One unfortunate revelation is that because the Unity Engine used to create Pillars of Eternity has been highly customized by Obsidian, the game itself will *not* be modder-friendly, nor will mod tools be released with the game. Probably not a big deal to most of us, but still a bit disappointing—mod communities can often contribute significantly extended value for games that support them.

 

And I know that there is at least one more major interview out there discussing modding, because I remember the long discussion that it spawned on the forums when they described how hard it would be to create a new map.  For the record:  it is very difficult, due to the fact that maps in PoE have 7 (?) layers of data beyond the image that you see, while Infinity Engine games (which have very, very few map mods made for them) had only one.

 

So, if you bought into this game expecting extensive mod support, then you were the one seeing what you wanted to see -- Obsidian has consistently stated that there position on mods is "We aren't going to go out of our way to make it harder, but we aren't going to spend any money on making it easier".  You may disagree with this position (lots of people do), but if there are backers who backed this game because they expected mod support and are disappointed now I have zero sympathy for them.

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[An incredibly well constructed and proved point. I wish I had the time to do so.]

Such an incredible effort just to prove me wrong. I have to say, I like the comments of the other users more, trying to be constructive rather than destructive. Your last phrase especially shows just how terrible this kind of attitude is.

I did contribute to the map-making discussion. It was difficult, but not impossible. and the layers are supposed to be 4.

You've proved your point, anyway. Guess that being overly optimistic - I did miss the last interview, anyway.

Edited by Dark_Ansem
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For the record:  it is very difficult, due to the fact that maps in PoE have 7 (?) layers of data beyond the image that you see, while Infinity Engine games (which have very, very few map mods made for them) had only one.

 

I don't really agree with this.

 

From what we know, there's definitely 5 maps for each background (and one optional I just assume is there, even though I haven't found any information on that yet):

 

- The basic texture layer; a bitmap, containing all the classic background information

- the depth map, containing height information of the background (so that occlusion appears properly)

- the normal map, containing facing information of the background (so that they get lit properly)

- the lighting map, containing areas that emit light (this one is probably greyscale but might have colored information)

- the pathing map, containing gameplay data on where characters can walk (this one is probably binary)

- a specular map, which contains information about the surface type of materials (reflective surfaces like metal, non-reflectives like wood)

 

From these maps, the first 3 can be rendered directly from a 3D landscape in any modelling software like 3dsmax, Gmax or blender (of which two of them are free!), given the crucial information on viewing angle, ambient light coordinates and camera distance.

The lighting map can basicly be hand-painted from the original texture bitmap; just color everything that doesn't emit lights black and open windows white.

The pathing map is even easier: just take the bitmap and color everything walkable white, everything non-walkable black. This is, if the pathing is binary, but I don't see a reason why it should not.

A specular map (if it's even there ... still not sure on that) is more or less only about defining reflective surfaces. Just color metal faces in the reflective color and use the diffuse color on all other surfaces and you're done. While it's possible to make this very sophisticated, a simple two-color scheme is already enough visual fidelity for most applications.

 

I don't see how this should be a huge problem. It all boils down to getting a renderer that allows to create the normal and depth maps from a 3D scene.

 

 

The reason why almost nobody made custom maps for the IE games is that when 3D modelling became accessable for amateurs (and commercial hardware became strong enough to support millions of polys in a scene) the IE modding scene was already in decline.

Edited by Zwiebelchen
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For the record:  it is very difficult, due to the fact that maps in PoE have 7 (?) layers of data beyond the image that you see, while Infinity Engine games (which have very, very few map mods made for them) had only one.

 

I don't really agree with this.

 

From what we know, there's definitely 5 maps for each background (and one optional I just assume is there, even though I haven't found any information on that yet):

 

- The basic texture layer; a bitmap, containing all the classic background information

- the depth map, containing height information of the background (so that occlusion appears properly)

- the normal map, containing facing information of the background (so that they get lit properly)

- the lighting map, containing areas that emit light and will not get covered by shadows (this one is probably greyscale but might have colored information)

- the pathing map, containing gameplay data on where characters can walk (this one is probably binary)

- a specular map, which contains information about the surface type of materials (reflective surfaces like metal, non-reflectives like wood)

 

From these 5 maps, the first 3 can be rendered directly from a 3D landscape in any modelling software like 3dsmax, Gmax or blender (of which two of them are free!), given the crucial information on viewing angle, ambient light coordinates and camera distance.

The lighting map can basicly be hand-painted from the original texture bitmap; just color everything that doesn't emit lights black and open windows white.

The pathing map is even easier: just take the bitmap and color everything walkable white, everything non-walkable black. This is, if the pathing is binary, but I don't see a reason why it should not.

A specular map (if it's even there ... still not sure on that) is more or less only about defining reflective surfaces. Just color metal faces in the reflective color and use the diffuse color on all other surfaces and you're done. While it's possible to make this very sophisticated, a simple two-color scheme is already enough visual fidelity for most applications.

 

I don't see how this should be a huge problem. It all boils down to getting a renderer that allows to create the normal and depth maps from a 3D scene.

 

 

The reason why almost nobody made custom maps for the IE games is that when 3D modelling became accessable for amateurs (and commercial hardware became strong enough to support millions of polys in a scene) the IE modding scene has shrunk to just a handful of people.

 

 

I'm really really trying hard to this. I am trying to get at least the normal map, the specularity map and possibly the occlusion map done properly.

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For the record:  it is very difficult, due to the fact that maps in PoE have 7 (?) layers of data beyond the image that you see, while Infinity Engine games (which have very, very few map mods made for them) had only one.

 

I don't really agree with this.

 

From what we know, there's definitely 5 maps for each background (and one optional I just assume is there, even though I haven't found any information on that yet):

 

- The basic texture layer; a bitmap, containing all the classic background information

- the depth map, containing height information of the background (so that occlusion appears properly)

- the normal map, containing facing information of the background (so that they get lit properly)

- the lighting map, containing areas that emit light and will not get covered by shadows (this one is probably greyscale but might have colored information)

- the pathing map, containing gameplay data on where characters can walk (this one is probably binary)

- a specular map, which contains information about the surface type of materials (reflective surfaces like metal, non-reflectives like wood)

 

From these 5 maps, the first 3 can be rendered directly from a 3D landscape in any modelling software like 3dsmax, Gmax or blender (of which two of them are free!), given the crucial information on viewing angle, ambient light coordinates and camera distance.

The lighting map can basicly be hand-painted from the original texture bitmap; just color everything that doesn't emit lights black and open windows white.

The pathing map is even easier: just take the bitmap and color everything walkable white, everything non-walkable black. This is, if the pathing is binary, but I don't see a reason why it should not.

A specular map (if it's even there ... still not sure on that) is more or less only about defining reflective surfaces. Just color metal faces in the reflective color and use the diffuse color on all other surfaces and you're done. While it's possible to make this very sophisticated, a simple two-color scheme is already enough visual fidelity for most applications.

 

I don't see how this should be a huge problem. It all boils down to getting a renderer that allows to create the normal and depth maps from a 3D scene.

 

 

The reason why almost nobody made custom maps for the IE games is that when 3D modelling became accessable for amateurs (and commercial hardware became strong enough to support millions of polys in a scene) the IE modding scene has shrunk to just a handful of people.

 

 

I'm really really trying hard to this. I am trying to get at least the normal map, the specularity map and possibly the occlusion map done properly.

 

 

As I said: most modern tools already support this by default. The only real problem is the camera data.

creating a normal map: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66ulKGSkJVo

creating a height map: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5QD6D9pYfE

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I'm glad that community patches will be possible. The currently existing mod already has quite impressive features imo. I never expected we'd be able to create our own areas.

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I'm glad that community patches will be possible. The currently existing mod already has quite impressive features imo. I never expected we'd be able to create our own areas.

 

Creating own areas is possible, but it is quite difficult task, because creating area is not easy task if you want keep visual quality that original areas have and scripting and 'hacking' in  those self made areas also demand coding+unity expertise that most people don't have. So to make new areas you (or your modding team) need to excel in 3d area design and have good knowledge about coding and unity, but it is possible, but same time I would not predict lots of new area mods.

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I'm glad that community patches will be possible. The currently existing mod already has quite impressive features imo. I never expected we'd be able to create our own areas.

 

Creating own areas is possible, but it is quite difficult task, because creating area is not easy task if you want keep visual quality that original areas have and scripting and 'hacking' in  those self made areas also demand coding+unity expertise that most people don't have. So to make new areas you (or your modding team) need to excel in 3d area design and have good knowledge about coding and unity, but it is possible, but same time I would not predict lots of new area mods.

 

 

I think this all depends on how robust the modding sites for this game will be.

 

It's not like you have to be directly involved in any modding projects to create new art assets for the game. Some people just make them for the sake of it.

I personally wouldn't mind creating empty 3D landscapes and uploading them for public use in other mods. I know some programming, but I don't have the time or dedication to code in unity, so I rather just spend my time making new "raw files" that can be used for zones or new armor/weapon models, then upload them to a community that might have a use for them.

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I'm constantly amused when people get upset over the lack of one feature or another in a game (like modding support) when they have basically no clue what's necessary to include such a feature in a game.

 

Even ignoring the probabality that the licence holder of the games engine makes their living selling or renting the engine, thus certainly isn't going to give it away for free, the tools needed to actually create content for a game are often commercial CAD and art programs, the makers of which also aren't going to give away the products they make their living selling.

Then we have the "minor" detail that a certain level of technical compentece/expertise, that most people just plain don't have, is needed even if you have the engine and tools.

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I'm constantly amused when people get upset over the lack of one feature or another in a game (like modding support) when they have basically no clue what's necessary to include such a feature in a game.

 

Even ignoring the probabality that the licence holder of the games engine makes their living selling or renting the engine, thus certainly isn't going to give it away for free, the tools needed to actually create content for a game are often commercial CAD and art programs, the makers of which also aren't going to give away the products they make their living selling.

Then we have the "minor" detail that a certain level of technical compentece/expertise, that most people just plain don't have, is needed even if you have the engine and tools.

 

So here we have it, a comment from someone who was probably never active in any modding community.

 

Let's just ignore the fact that Unity itself is free:

You can get a 3DS max licence for free if you are a student. GMAX, a dated 3DS max version is also completely free.

GIMP, a professional 2D graphic software is completely free aswell.

Blender is another modelling software which is free.

 

The "certain level of technical competence/expertise" of modding communities led to mods that surpassed their original platforms in success and popularity multiple times. DOTA, League of Legends, Counterstrike, Team Fortress; all those games had their origin in mods.

 

There are incredible talents to be found across amateur artists. Just check out some random 3D models on DeviantArt. You'll be amazed what amateur artists are capable of.

 

 

Modders turned Warcraft III, a game that looked like this:

http://www.buffed.de/screenshots/original/2012/03/Warcraft_3_Frozen_Throne.jpg

 

into this:

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/attachments/terrain-board-267/143562d1424528811-bits-hope-bits_hope.png

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/attachments/terrain-board-267/136678d1404476007-nature-tower.png

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/attachments/terrain-board-267/143003d1422394247-my-fantasia-fireflies2.png

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/attachments/terrain-board-267/140642d1415046365-honey-i-blew-up-planet-hibuap2.png

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/attachments/terrain-board-267/140775d1415306098-starscape-stars.png

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/attachments/terrain-board-267/140688d1415141864-all-alone-lone-loney.png

 

EDIT: Some more impressive works...

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/pastebin_data/zem6lh/Castle.jpg

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/pastebin_data/zem6lh/Twostepsfromhell.jpg

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/pastebin_data/zem6lh/Fatelesstemple.jpg

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/pastebin_data/zem6lh/Shade.jpg

 

All the models you see in the above screenshots are custom made by the community. There's a database of literally thousands of models (across all types like environmental, special effects and full fledged animated unit models) made by the community.

Edited by Zwiebelchen
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Let's just ignore the fact that Unity itself is free:

 

Small nitpick on this point: Unity does not allow the mixing of content produced with its free version with content produced with a licensed professional version - which Obsidian undoubtedly used.

 

From their software license agreement:

"You may not combine or integrate Licensee Content that you develop with Unity Personal simultaneously with any Licensee Content that you develop with Unity Pro or any Unity Pro Add-On Products. Licensee Content developed with Unity Personal will be tagged with an identifier that is used to enforce this restriction."

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Let's just ignore the fact that Unity itself is free:

 

Small nitpick on this point: Unity does not allow the mixing of content produced with its free version with content produced with a licensed professional version - which Obsidian undoubtedly used.

 

From their software license agreement:

"You may not combine or integrate Licensee Content that you develop with Unity Personal simultaneously with any Licensee Content that you develop with Unity Pro or any Unity Pro Add-On Products. Licensee Content developed with Unity Personal will be tagged with an identifier that is used to enforce this restriction."

 

 

Since when do private persons care about legalities?

 

And besides; as fanmods and user-created contents are usually non-profit, this point is moot. It's perfectly legal to use Unity Personal for non-profit content.

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Since when do private persons care about legalities?

 

And besides; as fanmods and user-created contents are usually non-profit, this point is moot. It's perfectly legal to use Unity Personal for non-profit content.

 

Being non-profit is irrelevant - in fact, you're explicitly allowed to make for-profit products with Unity Personal under certain conditions.

If I understand things correctly, the problem is that content created with Unity Perso (fan mods) is tagged as such by the software, and content created with Unity Pro (Pillars of Eternity) will simply refuse to run it. It would require more than just ignoring the ToS to get around that - cracking this security would be needed.

 

And as far as I know, modding communities usually make sure they stay on the legal side of things, simply as a matter of not having the developers turn against them. At the very least, mod-hosting websites will refuse to host mods created this way.

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We had a discussion about this topic before, it was one that I started. I suppose that I shouldn't be surprised to see it crop up again. basically some the tools used by obsidian are proprietary and can't be released, but whatever they can release, they intend to. (is what I understood)

 

edit: here you go:

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/65113-petition-for-comprehensive-modding-tools/

Edited by JFSOCC
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