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Grotesque

My old school solid UI mock-up for Pillars of Eternity

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Its a real shame they cant do a UI like this. This is exactly what a solid UI should look like. A simple box image floating behind a minimalistic UI does not capture the spirit of what a solid ui should be.

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Mods will fix it.

I'm fully prepared to delay my playthrough for a couple of months in order to have the best gaming excperience. Game fully patched, polished, with Grotesque's UI and Bester/Sensuki's IE mod.

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Your UI looks very beautiful @Grotesque, and the bottom bar in particular looks like it would be more player-friendly and efficient than any other I've encountered in existing cRPGs.

 

Regarding the vertical portrait bar, I've previously argued against such a layout, but if the portraits are allowed to be as big as this (rather than as tiny as in BG2) it apparently works quite well.

 

The only thing I don't like in your mockups, is the left bar. It doesn't really seem to pull its weight in terms of usefulness, considering the amount of viewport space it obscures:

  • Map screen, character record screen, settings screen, etc. are things that I always access via keyboard anyway, and from what I hear I'm not the only one. If those buttons are just there to help newbies learn the keybord shortcuts, having a full sidebar blocking a significant amount of viewport area seems like a waste.
     
  • Having 8 different formation buttons visible at all times, is just excessive - I doubt anyone has a use for that. I, for one, only tend to use 2 different formations in the entire game when playing BG2 or IWD - a tight one for dungeons, and a more sparse one for open maps (like wilderness areas). And even players who use more than that, likely won't mind if they were accessed through a single button (i.e. two clicks instead of one to change formation)... Unlike selecting spells and quick items, this is not something players will typically want to do on every single "round" of combat, so having a single-click access scheme with always visible buttons provides much less benefit than it does for the bottom bar items.

With that in mind, I wonder how your UI would look with these changes:

  • remove the current left bar completely
  • move the portraits bar to the left (i.e. make the UI "L shaped")
  • squeeze both the clock (current bottom left corner) and the bare minimum number of necessary buttons from the current left bar, into the bottom right corner. A round clock with (tiny versions of) the other buttons arranged around it in a semi-circle, might work.
Edited by Ineth
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"Some ideas are so stupid that only an intellectual could believe them." -- attributed to George Orwell

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Well for what it's worth I like the left side bar. I still have my original BG1 discs and I never used the keyboard shortcuts for map/inventory/etc.

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"Wizards do not need to be The Dudes Who Can AoE Nuke You and Gish and Take as Many Hits as a Fighter and Make all Skills Irrelevant Because Magic."

-Josh Sawyer

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  • Map screen, character record screen, settings screen, etc. are things that I always access via keyboard anyway, and from what I hear I'm not the only one. If those buttons are just there to help newbies learn the keybord shortcuts, having a full sidebar blocking a significant amount of viewport area seems like a waste.

I myself don't use the left bar often, but I know of people with disabilites who can only play with the mouse. For those people, it is important to be able to control the game with mouse alone. So I say, keep the left bar, just make it a little narrower.


J_C from Codexia

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The only thing I don't like in your mockups, is the left bar. It doesn't really seem to pull its weight in terms of usefulness, considering the amount of viewport space it obscures

 

In the mockup for wide monitors, I don't think the left side obscures too much of the view (and zooming a little bit out negates the problem even).

I think that you don't even need a wide view gameplay wise, considering you have shroud and fog of war, so my response is that the wide view is excessive instead. :)

The left side also visually balances the entire UI (the secret of beauty is simmetry)

Also I will never support a main UI design that is missing buttons to other areas of the player-game interface (map, inventory, etc)

 

As for the formation buttons, why not have them?  

The main purpose of this UI besides immersion and flavor was "why I have to click twice when I can click once?"

Also having 8 formations at the ready accommodates more playstyles. Maybe players that play on hardcore or hard difficulty change formations every 30 seconds.

 

 

 

Thank you all of you for the appreciation.

It was a lot of work considering it was the first I touched Photoshop.

 

 

edit: the 4:3 UI mockup, for me has the strongest  vibe because it reduces the viewable area to a square like in the old BG

Edited by Grotesque
  • Like 6

  After my realization that White March has the same XP reward problem, I don't even have the drive to launch game anymore because I hated so much reaching Twin Elms with a level cap in vanilla PoE that I don't wish to relive that experience.

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To me, the purpose of such old school UIs is all about planting an ambiance. Am i the only one who feels like the whole game screen is way more beautiful with this old style UI? To me, it's stunning, obvious. That's true that it's not the most functional type, but i feel like theses details won't really matter, and i would definitely use this UI if available as a mod.

 

On the other hand, i think that this kind of UI may be ok only with people who played and loved these old IE games. I know that OE said they wanted to capture these old IE games' vibe, but the game needs to be sold well enough and i can't help but think that if the game is to be released with this kind of old school UI, many newcomers who could have been interested in it would just flee, without even trying it (just reading some french forums on some video games websites make me think it's true). To me, the point is to show that RPG is not all about expensive 3D with nothing else. Too much old school vibe could kill the old school type, and for a public release, it may be better to use a modern and minimalistic UI like PoE's one. Even if it's true that this kind of UI may seem just plain and ambiant killing. Poor world :(

 

Still, about the mock ups. I'm agree with Zack. The left bar should be narrowed with just one button for formations and all put in one column. I don't feel like the asymmetry between the 2 side bars is a problem. And about the 9 spell slots. The advantage of the PoE's UI is that it's adaptable. What if an add-on or a mod add some spells? The UI should at least have scrolling possibilities. The Poe's one seems more "mod ready". Still, once more, fantastic job here Grotesque.

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To me, the purpose of such old school UIs is all about planting an ambiance. Am i the only one who feels like the whole game screen is way more beautiful with this old style UI? To me, it's stunning, obvious. That's true that it's not the most functional type, but i feel like theses details won't really matter, and i would definitely use this UI if available as a mod.

 

On the other hand, i think that this kind of UI may be ok only with people who played and loved these old IE games. I know that OE said they wanted to capture these old IE games' vibe, but the game needs to be sold well enough and i can't help but think that if the game is to be released with this kind of old school UI, many newcomers who could have been interested in it would just flee, without even trying it (just reading some french forums on some video games websites make me think it's true). To me, the point is to show that RPG is not all about expensive 3D with nothing else. Too much old school vibe could kill the old school type, and for a public release, it may be better to use a modern and minimalistic UI like PoE's one. Even if it's true that this kind of UI may seem just plain and ambiant killing. Poor world :("mod ready". Still, once more, fantastic job here Grotesque.

 

This has nothing to do with beeing a newcomer. I bought almost every IE game (exept IWD 2) at launch and I hated the UI from the very first moment I saw it. Developers back than usualy made UI's like that so they dont have to render the whole screen with ingame graphics. For me UI's ruin the immersion, I want to see the actual game not a menu. The old IE UI's covered at last one third of the whole screen. You couldnt actually see what was around you at 640x480 or 800x600 pixels, you had zero overview and it forced you to constantly pan around to actually see what was going on. I personaly think that most people that prefer big solid UI's just want them for nostalgica sake. I feel way more comfortable with UI's that do not create the feeling of seeing the actual game through a second window (the screen is the first one). The best UI's for me are those that are intregrated into the actual game and do not district from it. It all comes down to personal opinion.

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We won't be doing anything this substantial for our solid UI. It could be a couple of weeks of programming to implement this.

That's it? A couple weeks?

 

Do it.

 

 

Erm, no ! 

 

I'd rather they take the time to fix the game instead. 

 

You want a solid UI, good for you, but don't assume that everyone feels the same.

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Developers back than usualy made UI's like that so they dont have to render the whole screen with ingame graphics.

You've never accidently hit the "H" button while playing Bg2. How n00bishly adorable.

 

I want to see the actual game not a menu.

Aah but that's the thing. The "menus" ARE the actual game. As any of the old schoolers will tell you, the world screen is just the visual feedback. The heart and soul of the game was everything else. The menus, as you call them, is where you find the combat logs; the spell books; the portraits; the abilities; the inventory; the formation choices; the wood or stone themes that add to the entire game's feel and atmosphere; the controls...etc.

 

Games are meant to be played, not just watched.

 

You minimalists are a scourge and the genre would be better off without your poison.

Edited by Stun
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To me, the purpose of such old school UIs is all about planting an ambiance. Am i the only one who feels like the whole game screen is way more beautiful with this old style UI? To me, it's stunning, obvious. That's true that it's not the most functional type, but i feel like theses details won't really matter, and i would definitely use this UI if available as a mod.

 

On the other hand, i think that this kind of UI may be ok only with people who played and loved these old IE games. I know that OE said they wanted to capture these old IE games' vibe, but the game needs to be sold well enough and i can't help but think that if the game is to be released with this kind of old school UI, many newcomers who could have been interested in it would just flee, without even trying it (just reading some french forums on some video games websites make me think it's true). To me, the point is to show that RPG is not all about expensive 3D with nothing else. Too much old school vibe could kill the old school type, and for a public release, it may be better to use a modern and minimalistic UI like PoE's one. Even if it's true that this kind of UI may seem just plain and ambiant killing. Poor world :("mod ready". Still, once more, fantastic job here Grotesque.

 

This has nothing to do with beeing a newcomer. I bought almost every IE game (exept IWD 2) at launch and I hated the UI from the very first moment I saw it. Developers back than usualy made UI's like that so they dont have to render the whole screen with ingame graphics. For me UI's ruin the immersion, I want to see the actual game not a menu. The old IE UI's covered at last one third of the whole screen. You couldnt actually see what was around you at 640x480 or 800x600 pixels, you had zero overview and it forced you to constantly pan around to actually see what was going on. I personaly think that most people that prefer big solid UI's just want them for nostalgica sake. I feel way more comfortable with UI's that do not create the feeling of seeing the actual game through a second window (the screen is the first one). The best UI's for me are those that are intregrated into the actual game and do not district from it. It all comes down to personal opinion.

 

 

Yeah Stun, feel and atmosphere, that's it. I agree that back in the day, an invasive UI with a max screen size at 640X480 was a pain in the ass because, yeah, you couldn't see much on the game screen with a camera to close. But now, we are in 2015. And Grotesque have proved that this is a problem no more, unless you want to play PoE with a zoom level that makes you feel you're actually playing in 640X480.

 

I will agree with one of your points Mayama. It's a matter of tastes, and i can understand yours. And for what i've read here and there, i confirm that it is MOSTLY a matter for newcomers. But hey, there are exceptions, there is no need to explain me this, because it's obvious to me. It's just that many people who are really used to minimalistic UIs feel confortable with them, and you explained why quite well. I've no problem with that. That's why i said it would be better for the game sales to ship PoE with this kind of minimalistic, trendy UI (kind of publishers way to think i guess :p). But to me, and to others, this kind of solid UI bring some sort of atmosphere and immersive feeling that enlighten the whole game screen. I really think the whole game screen is way more beautiful with Grotesque's solid UI. Can't explain it better, it was shocking when i saw it. Things i felt quite plain were suddenly beautiful and charming. So, NO, it's not about nostalgia, because i suffered the same problems than you with solid UIs back in the day. I've never asked for a solid UI before. But now, i understand the positive things such a solid UI can bring to the game, according to my aesthetic tastes. I may have changed my opinion. I'm not a nostalgic fanatic, so, please, stop saying that whoever is not agree with you is just a nostalgic freak when you don't know anything. Even if you said "most people", you answered me, and i can't help but feel that to you, i was part of this "most people" thing. That's all.

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And.... what if it's only a matter of nostalgia? Is that supposed to be some massive dismissal to the argument for a solid 3-border UI? It isn't. The point of PoE IS Nostalgia. If you're looking for a radical, cutting edge, 'finger-on-the-pulse-of-today' experience, you've stumbled upon the wrong game.

Edited by Stun
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You're totally right and i never meant to say that nostalgia was a bad thing :). It's just that people who "presume" to argue is a problem to me. "Nostalgia" seems to be the easiest argument nowadays. "Hey mate, you're a nostalgic, so shut up, you opinion has to be biased", or "Dunno what to oppose him, so let's accuse him to be a nostlagic freak". Just my impression? I saw this a whole lot of times on some french forum. Some people doesn't seem to accept that there could be some good reasons to like some old school things besides only nostalgia. I don't have to like everything just because it's trendy. I'm fed up with trends governing tastes. So, i just like some old things just because i feel they're cool. I wanted to point this. I must say that i don't know if Mayama is like this, i don't accuse him.

Edited by Abel
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Some people doesn't seem to accept that there could be some good reasons to like some old school things besides only nostalgia. I don't have to like everything just because it's trendy. I'm fed up with trends governing tastes. So, i just like some old things just because i feel they're cool. I wanted to point this. I must say that i don't know if Mayama is like this, i don't accuse him.

 

I actually tried to use the word nostalgic in a neutral form. Its for some people the selling point for a product like old timer cars. The problem is its a emotional quality so everyone has another opinion on it. For me a problem with nostalgica for nostalgicas sake is that our modern computers dont suffer the restrictions that forced developers back than into doing certain things. Nowadays its more or less a budged restriction. Like for example games dont need pretty icons for items anymore because we can render 3D objects in the same quality, it only costs time and money and thats why its not in a game like PoE. The second restriction today is your audience, to be specific the gpu build in their pc's. The target audience of PoE isnt the most cutting edge gameing pc crowd. We dont need prerendered backgrounds anymore, modern pc's can handle the same quality in realtime 3D but you need a very fast gpu for it.

 

What I personaly dont like is the mentality of some people that do not accept the embrace of anything that has advanced in the last 10 years after those games got released. Those things did advance for a reason and its imo just stuborn and ignorant to ignore things because of a backward looking mindest. Its like refusing to put a catalytic converter in a old timer car.

 

Actually prerendered versus real time 3D is a good example. I bet some people would call for the torches and pitchforks if they would have went the real time rendering route. It doesn't matter that nowadays the quallity is at the same level (even better because you would have dynamic lighting etc) as PoE prerenderet background its just because they dont want it that way. 

 

Edit: 

 

I dont think the dev's should try to make a second UI because it looks like its modable and mods are something people can easily get nowadays. Steam Workshop etc. made it possible. Making stuff better that can't be modded is way more important right now.

Edited by Mayama

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Some people doesn't seem to accept that there could be some good reasons to like some old school things besides only nostalgia. I don't have to like everything just because it's trendy. I'm fed up with trends governing tastes. So, i just like some old things just because i feel they're cool. I wanted to point this. I must say that i don't know if Mayama is like this, i don't accuse him.

 

I actually tried to use the word nostalgic in a neutral form. Its for some people the selling point for a product like old timer cars. The problem is its a emotional quality so everyone has another opinion on it. For me a problem with nostalgica for nostalgicas sake is that our modern computers dont suffer the restrictions that forced developers back than into doing certain things. Nowadays its more or less a budged restriction. Like for example games dont need pretty icons for items anymore because we can render 3D objects in the same quality, it only costs time and money and thats why its not in a game like PoE. The second restriction today is your audience, to be specific the gpu build in their pc's. The target audience of PoE isnt the most cutting edge gameing pc crowd. We dont need prerendered backgrounds anymore, modern pc's can handle the same quality in realtime 3D but you need a very fast gpu for it.

 

What I personaly dont like is the mentality of some people that do not accept the embrace of anything that has advanced in the last 10 years after those games got released. Those things did advance for a reason and its imo just stuborn and ignorant to ignore things because of a backward looking mindest. Its like refusing to put a catalytic converter in a old timer car.

 

Actually prerendered versus real time 3D is a good example. I bet some people would call for the torches and pitchforks if they would have went the real time rendering route. It doesn't matter that nowadays the quallity is at the same level (even better because you would have dynamic lighting etc) as PoE prerenderet background its just because they dont want it that way. 

 

Let me call you out on some of your BS. Solid UI didn't exist in the IE games because the computres couldn't handle the rendering of the whole screen. That is bull****, you could disable the UI whenever you wanted, and the game performance didn't suffer. Second, liking solid UIs, prerendered backgrounds over glorious 3D is not because of nostalgia for many of us. We like it better because they look better in our opinion. Prerendered backgrounds are sharper, cheaper to make and take less manpower than doing the same quality in 3D. And are you gonna argue that 3D looks better than quality prerendered backgrounds? Please, the washed out textures of Skyrim and Dragon Age look awful, and lets not compare how much more money it takes to make those. If you want to make quality 3D, you need an enourmous budget, a budget which is better spent of content creation.

 

Solid UIs add to the atmosphere, add to the visuals. Come on, just look at the UI of Dragon Age: Inquisition. it sticks out of the visual style of the game. Sure, you can barely see it, but their icons and bars are like from a mobile game, they don't fit into the visual representation of the game world. Solid UIs are like an extension of the visible game world. We have ****in 1080p monitors, the solid UI won't obscure much of the viewing space.

 

I hate the argument of "oh, you just like these old stuff because of nostalgia". NO! We liked it back then, and we like it now, because we think that it looks better.

Edited by Zack Fair
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J_C from Codexia

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Update: wider combat log and view area. 1920x1080

 

This is the most refined version of this mock-up to date. Small changes to weapon sets layout for the future.

 

dundun.png

 

 

dundun.jpg

 

 

If even now you are not satisfied with the wider view angle, nothing will. :)

Edited by Grotesque
  • Like 12

  After my realization that White March has the same XP reward problem, I don't even have the drive to launch game anymore because I hated so much reaching Twin Elms with a level cap in vanilla PoE that I don't wish to relive that experience.

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Some people doesn't seem to accept that there could be some good reasons to like some old school things besides only nostalgia. I don't have to like everything just because it's trendy. I'm fed up with trends governing tastes. So, i just like some old things just because i feel they're cool. I wanted to point this. I must say that i don't know if Mayama is like this, i don't accuse him.

 

I actually tried to use the word nostalgic in a neutral form. Its for some people the selling point for a product like old timer cars. The problem is its a emotional quality so everyone has another opinion on it. For me a problem with nostalgica for nostalgicas sake is that our modern computers dont suffer the restrictions that forced developers back than into doing certain things. Nowadays its more or less a budged restriction. Like for example games dont need pretty icons for items anymore because we can render 3D objects in the same quality, it only costs time and money and thats why its not in a game like PoE. The second restriction today is your audience, to be specific the gpu build in their pc's. The target audience of PoE isnt the most cutting edge gameing pc crowd. We dont need prerendered backgrounds anymore, modern pc's can handle the same quality in realtime 3D but you need a very fast gpu for it.

 

What I personaly dont like is the mentality of some people that do not accept the embrace of anything that has advanced in the last 10 years after those games got released. Those things did advance for a reason and its imo just stuborn and ignorant to ignore things because of a backward looking mindest. Its like refusing to put a catalytic converter in a old timer car.

 

Actually prerendered versus real time 3D is a good example. I bet some people would call for the torches and pitchforks if they would have went the real time rendering route. It doesn't matter that nowadays the quallity is at the same level (even better because you would have dynamic lighting etc) as PoE prerenderet background its just because they dont want it that way. 

 

Let me call you out on some of your BS. Solid UI didn't exist in the IE games because the computres couldn't handle the rendering of the whole screen. That is bull****, you could disable the UI whenever you wanted, and the game performance didn't suffer. Second, liking solid UIs, prerendered backgrounds over glorious 3D is not because of nostalgia for many of us. We like it better because they look better in our opinion. Prerendered backgrounds are sharper, cheaper to make and take less manpower than doing the same quality in 3D. And are you gonna argue that 3D looks better than quality prerendered backgrounds? Please, the washed out textures of Skyrim and Dragon Age look awful, and lets not compare how much more money it takes to make those.

 

Solid UIs add to the atmosphere, add to the visuals. Come on, just look at the UI of Dragon Age: Inquisition. it sticks out of the visual style of the game. Sure, you can barely see it, but their icons and bars are like from a mobile game, they don't fit into the visual representation of the game world. Solid UIs are like an extension of the visible game world. We have ****in 1080p monitors, the solid UI won't obscure much of the viewing space.

 

I hate the argument of "oh, you just like these old stuff bedause of nostalgia". NO! We liked it back then, and we like it now, because we think that it looks better.

 

 

I said "MOST of the games back than" read bevor you "call out my BS"... and BG2 is actually not that old anyways.

 

Why do you try to attack me with exactly the same stuff I have writen? Like you didnt even really read what I have writen. I said that BUDGED and the GPU of the target audience is the usual restriction of games nowadays. You are basicaly trying to belittle me by repeating what I have said in a more aggressive and borderline personal way. 

 

Everyone can decide for himself if he thinks that a solid UI adds to a game or not, also please try to speak for yourself and not for everyone. If you like it or not you like solid UI's because its nostalgic, liking things now that are part of the past is the definition of beeing nostalgic. It does not define if their is a quality to it or not.

 

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"liking things now that are part of the past is the definition of beeing nostalgic."

 

sorry, but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen today

 

 

 

coming to a movie theatre near you!

Edited by Grotesque
  • Like 2

  After my realization that White March has the same XP reward problem, I don't even have the drive to launch game anymore because I hated so much reaching Twin Elms with a level cap in vanilla PoE that I don't wish to relive that experience.

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"liking things now that are part of the past is the definition of beeing nostalgic."

 

sorry, but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen today

Come on seriously? Just get a dictionary and search for the word and the definition of it. Sorry its not "liking" its "longing or yerning" which is actually alot stronger. Also thanks for the insult.

 

Its kinda interesting, how aggressive, defensive and personal people get here about that topic even if my post were neutral and only talked about the topic in general and its a opinion and you cant force it on everyone.

 

Edit:

Nice mature addition to your post, that snide vid joke. Do you know what I find pretty idiotic? People that do not even know what a word means and trying to be funny about it. Not like I forced you to defend you or anything, dont be so insecure please.

Edited by Mayama

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"liking things now that are part of the past is the definition of beeing nostalgic."

 

sorry, but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen today

Come on seriously? Just get a dictionary and search for the word and the definition of it. Sorry its not "liking" its "longing or yerning" which is actually alot stronger. Also thanks for the insult.

 

Its kinda interesting, how aggressive, defensive and personal people get here about that topic even if my post were neutral and only talked about the topic in general and its a opinion and you cant force it on everyone.

 

But this has nothing to do with nostalgia. I'm longing for prerendered backgrounds and solid UIs because I like them. I like how they look. The solid UI is a great addition for the visuals, and prerendered backgrounds is a cheap, hardware efficient way of doing great looking enviroments. Unfortunately somewhere around the late 2000s, some people just said that "ok, That's it, gamers don't want these anymore, lets start making expensive 3D enviroments". 3D has its place, almost all genre benefitted from it. You cannot have FPS or racing games without good 3D. But prerendered games should have a place in strategy and roleplaying games.

 

 

 

 

 

Its kinda interesting, how aggressive, defensive and personal people get here about that topic even if my post were neutral and only talked about the topic in general and its a opinion and you cant force it on everyone.

 

I think the reason for that is people were longing for these type of games for a long time, and the things you say are similar to those that were said by publishers and developers who decided that gamers don't want these kind of games anymore, and the switch to full 3D happeend. When in fact there was always an audiance for these types of games, yet it was just taken away from them.

Edited by Zack Fair
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J_C from Codexia

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"liking things now that are part of the past is the definition of beeing nostalgic."

 

sorry, but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen today

Come on seriously? Just get a dictionary and search for the word and the definition of it. Sorry its not "liking" its "longing or yerning" which is actually alot stronger. Also thanks for the insult.

 

Its kinda interesting, how aggressive, defensive and personal people get here about that topic even if my post were neutral and only talked about the topic in general and its a opinion and you cant force it on everyone.

 

But this has nothing to do with nostalgia. I'm longing for prerendered backgrounds and solid UIs because I like them. I like how they look. The solid UI is a great addition for the visuals, and prerendered backgrounds is a cheap, hardware efficient way of doing great looking enviroments. Unfortunately somewhere around the late 2000s, some people just said that "ok, That's it, gamers don't want these anymore, lets start making expensive 3D enviroments". 3D has its place, almost all genre benefitted from it. You cannot have FPS or racing games without good 3D. But prerendered games should have a place in strategy and roleplaying games.

 

Ugh what is your problem with the word nostalgic?!?!?!

 

Solid UI's is a part of the past. Can we agree on that? I assume yes. It is part of the past. They usually dont make games with such UI's anymore. Like they dont make cars like they did in the 50ties or no one wears a top hat anymore. Its nostalgic. What is everyones problem with that single word. It perfectly defines it. It has nothing to do with why you like it its just says "its from the past and I like it". Gosh seriously I guess the problem here is that some people have a problem with beeing called nostalgic, whatever.

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"liking things now that are part of the past is the definition of beeing nostalgic."

 

sorry, but this is the most idiotic thing I've seen today

Come on seriously? Just get a dictionary and search for the word and the definition of it. Sorry its not "liking" its "longing or yerning" which is actually alot stronger. Also thanks for the insult.

 

Its kinda interesting, how aggressive, defensive and personal people get here about that topic even if my post were neutral and only talked about the topic in general and its a opinion and you cant force it on everyone.

 

But this has nothing to do with nostalgia. I'm longing for prerendered backgrounds and solid UIs because I like them. I like how they look. The solid UI is a great addition for the visuals, and prerendered backgrounds is a cheap, hardware efficient way of doing great looking enviroments. Unfortunately somewhere around the late 2000s, some people just said that "ok, That's it, gamers don't want these anymore, lets start making expensive 3D enviroments". 3D has its place, almost all genre benefitted from it. You cannot have FPS or racing games without good 3D. But prerendered games should have a place in strategy and roleplaying games.

 

Ugh what is your problem with the word nostalgic?!?!?!

 

Solid UI's is a part of the past. Can we agree on that? I assume yes. It is part of the past. They usually dont make games with such UI's anymore. Like they dont make cars like they did in the 50ties or no one wears a top hat anymore. Its nostalgic. What is everyones problem with that single word. It perfectly defines it. It has nothing to do with why you like it its just says "its from the past and I like it". Gosh seriously I guess the problem here is that some people have a problem with beeing called nostalgic, whatever.

 

Well, in many cases people used it as a negative adjective. Now I know that you used it as a natural, at least that's why you say, but I assume to many people nostalgic reads like "you only like it because it is like in the old games".

 

And all in all, the problem is not with the word nostalgic. It's about dismissin solid UIs, and prerendered backgrounds because of innovation.

Edited by Zack Fair
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J_C from Codexia

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Update: wider combat log and view area. 1920x1080

 

This is the most refined version of this mock-up to date. Small changes to weapon sets layout for the future.

 

dundun.png

 

 

dundun.jpg

 

 

If even now you are not satisfied with the wider view angle, nothing will. :)

Part of me wishes you wouldn't have posted this (ignorance is bliss, etc). Its far far better than what OE will have time to do. I almost wish they would wait on putting out the solid ui until after release so they can implement something like your mockup. Edited by Shevek
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yeah the newest one is the best, there's only a couple minor qips I see that could be tweaked, but overall even though I'm fairly neutral for solid and minimal ui, this is a pretty good alternative.

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Update: wider combat log and view area. 1920x1080

 

This is the most refined version of this mock-up to date. Small changes to weapon sets layout for the future.

 

dundun.png

 

 

dundun.jpg

 

 

If even now you are not satisfied with the wider view angle, nothing will. :)

 

I definitely like it. This version, the previous and the whole concept. I would be very curious to see the exact same screenshot with the defautl minimalistic UI, just to compare the general feeling :)

 

Ugh what is your problem with the word nostalgic?!?!?!

 

Solid UI's is a part of the past. Can we agree on that? I assume yes. It is part of the past. They usually dont make games with such UI's anymore. Like they dont make cars like they did in the 50ties or no one wears a top hat anymore. Its nostalgic. What is everyones problem with that single word. It perfectly defines it. It has nothing to do with why you like it its just says "its from the past and I like it". Gosh seriously I guess the problem here is that some people have a problem with beeing called nostalgic, whatever.

 

 

I see your point Mayama. It's true that today we can do things we couldn't 20 or 30 years ago. Nobody want to see a 2 colors game anymore (i assume, sorry if i'm wrong :D). It could be charming and all, but the 1984's "boulderdash" style has lived. I guess that claiming that someone who is yearning for a boulderdash style game nowadays is a nostalgic could be ok. And i think that if you can't see the appeal of this kind of old-school solid UI, then, your use of "nostalgic" is understandable. Now, the problem we have with the word "nostalgic" here, is that generally, it's linked to found memories that have to be revived (a dictionary won't help you all the time). It was my point in previous post. I didn't really liked solid UIs back in the day for the same reasons as you. And that's why i am not a nostalgic. If i'm nostalgic of something, it's about PC UIs, and not console ported PC UIs... The minimalistic one of PoE is very PC friendly, so, this is not why i like this solid UI either. So why? What i want to tell you is "even if i have seen yesterday a RPG solid UI for the first time, i'm pretty sure i would have reacted the same way". It's not about past, not about time, not about any other game or about past GPU limitations. It's about taste (like you said), and about aesthetics.

 

It's not because something has been done in the past that you must again and again take it as a universal reference years later. Some things can just exist on their own. Another detail. It seems you take as verified for sure that full 3D would have been equally or maybe even more beautiful than prerendered 2D for PoE (sorry if i misunderstood). I can't agree.

 

First, we have some kind of dynamic lighting, even with 2D stuff here (it's kind of magic, and i worship the guy who have done THIS!>>>

).

 

And second, the paintover is pretty awesome here. 3D can't allow this. Once more, it's a matter of taste, and you're free to prefer full 3D like other isometrics games used. I guess that what make some people nervous here is that you claimed that everybody can have his own tastes, but don't seem to have a clue about what other people feel, and don't seem to understand when explained.

 

Well it's not a crticism, since most people are like this, and, maybe, i am the same too. Promise, i really try to be more open minded :).

Edited by Abel
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