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  1. 1. What type of storyline whoud you like to play ? (one choice)

    • Linear (one ending with cosmetical difrences, decisions don't make any big difrence)
      7
    • Halflinear (in most of the type you can act, "Good", "Evil" or "Neural" or just 1,2,3. At the end you will have 3 difrent endings, but for example in first ending they may be some cosmetical difrences base on your decisions)
      24
    • Nonlinear (many possible endings, not only split to good, bad or neutral, Decision is leading to another so makeing decision 1 may lead to other decisions that you coud have if your taken other way, decisions "open" new decisions but also "...
      70


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Welcome.

 

In many previos games we seen how davs are developing thei games, and how thei are developing thair plots. This thred was made becouse i;ve enchounter opinions that games today are not "linear" and even some that skyrim is not linear becouse it has "sandbox" xD

 

In general you coud progress a story in 3 difrend ways, Linear, halflinear or nonlinear. And i will exmplainf how that work.

 

Linear

You play thu pint A to point B next to point C, you have no influence on the story and no decisions, or you influence is reather cosmetical. The funny thing is that Skyrim in this poit of view is one of the most linear game ever made xD

 

The only freedom that you have is "when" you take some quest, witch is reather cosmetical way of "adding nonlinear feeling". You take quest and you go to poin A then to pint B, next to point C, regardless if you are good, bad, mage or a warrior.

 

The only 1 decision that affects skyrim storyline is "Will you join Stormcloaths, imerals or don't join any of them". Ony 1 decision xD and people think that game is non linear, the funny thing is that when you join stormcloath or imerials you mostly do the same thing but from "other perspeciv", you go to the same cript but you are on difrent side, you fight for the same city, but from other point of view, you conqer rival citys.

 

Of course skyrim, is not good example of linear plot, good example was Neverwinter 1, Balfours Gate 1 or easterd Final Fantasy 7, 8 etc.

 

Simplest definicion - 1 ending with at most some "cometical" difrences.

 

Halflinear

 

This type of games, are linear storylines but cut thos some stages in which you make a decision and change the possible "ending" of ech stage. We encounter this in dragon age orgins, Neverwinter nights 2 etc. This element is perfectly shonw on skyrims "Ulfric-Imperial" issu where you may join ulfrik, imperials or none of them, so this makes skyrim something between linear and halflinear xD.

 

In general Halflinears have 2 big issues.

 

1. Decisions are in best cases, split to "Good", "Neutral" or "Evil" decisions. And regardles of how many possible endings we have they are Good, Neutral or Evil and only diffrence between 1 good ending and second good ending is cosmetical, co at the end we end up with 3 endings that have some cosmetical difrences inside them ... xD

 

2. Rewords for gridning (taking an decicion base on the "outcome" like xp, gold") reather then roleplaying, in whith some peaple may 1 time save the kitten, then kill whole city and still say "Im tru neutral damit" XD

 

Nonlinear

 

Hardest story line to input. I've never encouter it in any new highly advanced game, only in 2d games with low graphical level and some of game "novels".

 

Nonlinear plot meant that 1 decision leads to andother, then means that if we for example make decision numer 1, all decision that coud be unlocked by taking decision number 2 or number 3 are closed.

 

I will give an example of game of thrones ts series.

 

Stark has a decicion, marry freys daughter or not, marrying her has a big risk becouse frays daughters are mostly ugly but will lead to make powerfull anti-lannister ally, not marring her may lead to freys betreyal and death of young stark xD

 

This how tru nonlinear decision shoud look like, and ant the and we will have 14 compleatly diffrent endings, in many cases that we cound not put to any bag like "evil" "Good" or neutral becouse they whoud be to complexed.

 

This also whoud protect agind "grinding" decision makeing becouse taking decision like "i will save this poor lad from those bandits" whoud look down any decision like "i will help those bandits kill that lad", becouse it whoud be logical, that a person whou whoud "act like a good person" in "rescueing lad from bandits" whoud do the same in other cas or at least be "neutral" and say "i will not put my boot in this goodbye". Not like in 1 decision char acts like total walking evil, but lawfull good and gantle in second xD and still say "Hey, im neutral damit xD"

 

Im, wainting for your opinion xD

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I would like if my decisions have impact, but I wouldn't like if the game dictates how I should react even if I reacted otherwise before.

 

If I save the first poor lad, why should it be dissalowed by the game to kill the second poor lad? Maybe I liked the color of the trousers of the first one but the first sentence of the second one makes me decide that I don't like him. Maybe I have a good and a bad day. Doesn't matter, I want my choice.

 

What matters is if that choice will have any impact. Something like this:

 

lad vs bandits (lad has a wife but you don't know this yet, you meet her later in the game)

 

1. help lad/kill bandits

1.1 lad gives quest to retrieve object A from bandit leader, you get the option to talk to the bandit leader before the fight

1.1.1 switch sides for money, go back and kill the lad - tag "lad killed"

1.1.2a persuade the leader to give you object A (or buy it)

1.1.2b kill the leader and his man and take object A - tag "bandits killed"

1.1.2.1 give object A a to lad and take money - tag "object retrieved for money"

1.1.2.2 give the object to lad but refuse to take money - tag "object retrieved"

1.1.2.3 kill lad and retain object A - tag "lad killed"

 

2. kill lad/help bandits, they take you to their leader  - tag "lad killed"

 

3. you do nothing, bandits kill the lad and go away - tag "lad killed by bandits"

 

If you talk to the bandit leader outside of questline 1 he will offer you membership if you proof yourself.

You get various "evil" quests, including stealing, robbing and murdering. (Each is moraly more "bad" than the one before.)

1. You do them all. - tag "bandit membership"

2. You refuse at one point.

2.1 You kill the leader and his man and take object A. - tag "bandits killed"

2.2 You run away.

 

If you talk to the leader while you have the tag "bandit membership" you can fight with him for leadership, take object A. - tag "bandit leader"

 

 

You later meet the wife of the lad with following tags:

"object retrieved for money" - She recognizes you and thanks you.

"object retrieved" - She recognizes you, thanks you and gives you object B.

"lad killed by bandits", without "bandit mebership" or "bandit leader" - She doesn't recognize you and asks you to find the murderer of her man, you go to bandit leader and talk.

1. You kill the leader and his man, take object A and get object B as reward. - tag "bandits killed"

2. You switch sides for money and kill the woman. (And you can now follow the mebership line.)

"lad killed" or "lad killed by bandits" with "bandit mebership" or "bandit leader"- She doesn't recognize you and asks you to find the murderer of her man.

1. Frame bandits and follow the line as "lad killed by bandits".

2. Kill her, take object B.

3. Tell her who you are (murderer, member, leader) and treat her so she won't do anything about her husband.

 

Other effects of the tags:

"bandits killed" - While you travel in this area, no random encounters with bandits anymore.

"bandit membership" - While you travel in this area, random encounters with bandits as friendlies and humans or monsters as enemies.

"bandit leader" - While you travel in this are, no random encounters with bandits anymore and you can periodically retrieve some money in the bandit hideout.

People in this area will sometimes react on one of these tags.

 

 

This is how a good non-linear questline is built, several decisions who lead back and forth to different points between the lines and influence other decisions you can make ultimately ending in different outcomes that each have a different impact on your future doings.

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I would like if my decisions have impact, but I wouldn't like if the game dictates how I should react even if I reacted otherwise before.

 

If I save the first poor lad, why should it be dissalowed by the game to kill the second poor lad? Maybe I liked the color of the trousers of the first one but the first sentence of the second one makes me decide that I don't like him. Maybe I have a good and a bad day. Doesn't matter, I want my choice.

 

What matters is if that choice will have any impact. Something like this:

 

lad vs bandits (lad has a wife but you don't know this yet, you meet her later in the game)

 

1. help lad/kill bandits

1.1 lad gives quest to retrieve object A from bandit leader, you get the option to talk to the bandit leader before the fight

1.1.1 switch sides for money, go back and kill the lad - tag "lad killed"

1.1.2a persuade the leader to give you object A (or buy it)

1.1.2b kill the leader and his man and take object A - tag "bandits killed"

1.1.2.1 give object A a to lad and take money - tag "object retrieved for money"

1.1.2.2 give the object to lad but refuse to take money - tag "object retrieved"

1.1.2.3 kill lad and retain object A - tag "lad killed"

 

2. kill lad/help bandits, they take you to their leader  - tag "lad killed"

 

3. you do nothing, bandits kill the lad and go away - tag "lad killed by bandits"

 

If you talk to the bandit leader outside of questline 1 he will offer you membership if you proof yourself.

You get various "evil" quests, including stealing, robbing and murdering. (Each is moraly more "bad" than the one before.)

1. You do them all. - tag "bandit membership"

2. You refuse at one point.

2.1 You kill the leader and his man and take object A. - tag "bandits killed"

2.2 You run away.

 

If you talk to the leader while you have the tag "bandit membership" you can fight with him for leadership, take object A. - tag "bandit leader"

 

 

You later meet the wife of the lad with following tags:

"object retrieved for money" - She recognizes you and thanks you.

"object retrieved" - She recognizes you, thanks you and gives you object B.

"lad killed by bandits", without "bandit mebership" or "bandit leader" - She doesn't recognize you and asks you to find the murderer of her man, you go to bandit leader and talk.

1. You kill the leader and his man, take object A and get object B as reward. - tag "bandits killed"

2. You switch sides for money and kill the woman. (And you can now follow the mebership line.)

"lad killed" or "lad killed by bandits" with "bandit mebership" or "bandit leader"- She doesn't recognize you and asks you to find the murderer of her man.

1. Frame bandits and follow the line as "lad killed by bandits".

2. Kill her, take object B.

3. Tell her who you are (murderer, member, leader) and treat her so she won't do anything about her husband.

 

Other effects of the tags:

"bandits killed" - While you travel in this area, no random encounters with bandits anymore.

"bandit membership" - While you travel in this area, random encounters with bandits as friendlies and humans or monsters as enemies.

"bandit leader" - While you travel in this are, no random encounters with bandits anymore and you can periodically retrieve some money in the bandit hideout.

People in this area will sometimes react on one of these tags.

 

 

This is how a good non-linear questline is built, several decisions who lead back and forth to different points between the lines and influence other decisions you can make ultimately ending in different outcomes that each have a different impact on your future doings.

 

You know in some way you are prefect example what im tlking about.

 

Of you cou coud "Save" lad from difrenf reasnons, but if you enchouter same situation, (sam nuber of bandits etc) why whoud you go other road like "i will help killing tihs lad"... this isint fight beteen good vs neutral ... but fight adins Lawfull good vs chaotic evil, it whoud be .. stupid unleass your char i mentali "woundet" (sory for poor english) to akt like  "lawfull good" paladin if you know that "reword is big for this kind of behavir" and in second quest like "chaotic evil" becouse you may got logsword +5 xD

 

Besides, you are showing "nonlinear" point of view one decision lead to another, some are "locked" if you chose some way, some are opend ... . xD

Edited by Ulquiorra

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I'm against Branching Story. Plot is fine for locked content, but please don't lock me out of the story because I wanted to go down one path.

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Welcome.

 

In many previos games we seen how davs are developing thei games, and how thei are developing thair plots. This thred was made becouse i;ve enchounter opinions that games today are not "linear" and even some that skyrim is not linear becouse it has "sandbox" xD

 

In general you coud progress a story in 3 difrend ways, Linear, halflinear or nonlinear. And i will exmplainf how that work.

 

Linear

You play thu pint A to point B next to point C, you have no influence on the story and no decisions, or you influence is reather cosmetical. The funny thing is that Skyrim in this poit of view is one of the most linear game ever made xD

 

The only freedom that you have is "when" you take some quest, witch is reather cosmetical way of "adding nonlinear feeling". You take quest and you go to poin A then to pint B, next to point C, regardless if you are good, bad, mage or a warrior.

 

The only 1 decision that affects skyrim storyline is "Will you join Stormcloaths, imerals or don't join any of them". Ony 1 decision xD and people think that game is non linear, the funny thing is that when you join stormcloath or imerials you mostly do the same thing but from "other perspeciv", you go to the same cript but you are on difrent side, you fight for the same city, but from other point of view, you conqer rival citys.

 

Of course skyrim, is not good example of linear plot, good example was Neverwinter 1, Balfours Gate 1 or easterd Final Fantasy 7, 8 etc.

 

Simplest definicion - 1 ending with at most some "cometical" difrences.

 

Halflinear

 

This type of games, are linear storylines but cut thos some stages in which you make a decision and change the possible "ending" of ech stage. We encounter this in dragon age orgins, Neverwinter nights 2 etc. This element is perfectly shonw on skyrims "Ulfric-Imperial" issu where you may join ulfrik, imperials or none of them, so this makes skyrim something between linear and halflinear xD.

 

In general Halflinears have 2 big issues.

 

1. Decisions are in best cases, split to "Good", "Neutral" or "Evil" decisions. And regardles of how many possible endings we have they are Good, Neutral or Evil and only diffrence between 1 good ending and second good ending is cosmetical, co at the end we end up with 3 endings that have some cosmetical difrences inside them ... xD

 

2. Rewords for gridning (taking an decicion base on the "outcome" like xp, gold") reather then roleplaying, in whith some peaple may 1 time save the kitten, then kill whole city and still say "Im tru neutral damit" XD

 

Nonlinear

 

Hardest story line to input. I've never encouter it in any new highly advanced game, only in 2d games with low graphical level and some of game "novels".

 

Nonlinear plot meant that 1 decision leads to andother, then means that if we for example make decision numer 1, all decision that coud be unlocked by taking decision number 2 or number 3 are closed.

 

I will give an example of game of thrones ts series.

 

Stark has a decicion, marry freys daughter or not, marrying her has a big risk becouse frays daughters are mostly ugly but will lead to make powerfull anti-lannister ally, not marring her may lead to freys betreyal and death of young stark xD

 

This how tru nonlinear decision shoud look like, and ant the and we will have 14 compleatly diffrent endings, in many cases that we cound not put to any bag like "evil" "Good" or neutral becouse they whoud be to complexed.

 

This also whoud protect agind "grinding" decision makeing becouse taking decision like "i will save this poor lad from those bandits" whoud look down any decision like "i will help those bandits kill that lad", becouse it whoud be logical, that a person whou whoud "act like a good person" in "rescueing lad from bandits" whoud do the same in other cas or at least be "neutral" and say "i will not put my boot in this goodbye". Not like in 1 decision char acts like total walking evil, but lawfull good and gantle in second xD and still say "Hey, im neutral damit xD"

 

Im, wainting for your opinion xD

If you want a non linear story, play Age of Decadence Early Access. It's exactly what you describe. But it's extremely hard to do this kind of story, as the amound of scripting required is ridiculous.

AoD is in development for 10 years now by an indie studio, and the game isn't ready yet, though it closes. No major game company can afford to spent 10 years making a game just to have a true non linear story.

Edited by Malekith
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Right now the main quest (in the beta) about the missing girl has 3 ways to get into the final area, 4 if you count randomly finding it.

 

Their are 4 endings + 1 extra ending if you play a cipher. Their might be more endings gated behind very high attributes.

The quest will always end in you getting xp but choosing one is actually hard because the moral dilemma makes you rather uncomfortable.

Theirs no clue about how your decision will influence the story but another quest, the bandit one hints that different endings lead to different side quest later in the game.

 

The endings might be meaningless but what I really liked about it was that their was a option for every way you could possible solve it.

 

With other words: Did you ever think about letting the blood thirsty demon free in some rpg's even if that means the end of dozens of (maybee) innocent bystanders because the angry mob that wants him dead is as guilty as the monster? Well it seems like you can do such things in PoE. Its approach to moral is quite similar to the witcher series.

Edited by Mayama
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Non linear is quite more expensive if you also pretend to keep the length of the game. And the branching can get quite nuts. I'm ok with somehow linear as long as there are meaningful choices with consequences.

 

Time and money are limited for most developers. Must compromise.

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I think the underlying narrative should be linear for the main storyline. What you do should still have consequences, but not in the way that you get to a good, bad or mediocre ending.

 

Maybe you need an army for the final fight, but everyone hates you because you burnt down some towns and are a horrible monster, so you have to ask a powerful underground cult of animancers to provide you with an army of the undead. The underlying narrative is the same - get army, kill the antagonist - but the story still feels drastically different. It becomes your personal story in a very satisfying way (because burning all those innocents was so, so satisfying).

 

Basically I'm a huge fan of "cosmetic changes" like this one. They're easier to implement than drastically changing storylines, and they are just as great. Maybe even greater, because this way you don't have to write three or more different storylines and outcomes at the same time. You can focus on one storyline and how it subtly changes. Also, when you have multiple vastly different endings, which one will be canon? Which one will feel like the "right one" to the player? Sometimes I think a single ending that has strong writing is much more preferable to this madness of having dozens of different endings.

 

BTW this kind of poll is always like asking "Do you want one piece of cake, half the cake or the full cake?" :p Of course "nonlinear with 1000 branching storylines that are all exciting and well-written" is going to win this.

Edited by Fearabbit
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BTW this kind of poll is always like asking "Do you want one piece of cake, half the cake or the full cake?" :p Of course "nonlinear with 1000 branching storylines that are all exciting and well-written" is going to win this.

 

 

You see, many people complain about resources, i not becouse it's devs work to "make it good". If most poeple like "full nonliner" that that is a devs work to make a plot as much nonlinear as it can, if at the and they make half linear or mostly linear with some consequences that meant that they coud not go any more "nonlinera" but it's wery important to talk about this subiect beacouse it's whoud remaind devs what WE like :p

 

In hudge fan of nonlinears not only becouse they are much whay "personal" if whe coud be mage, warior, pirest etc (beaouce roads to succes, decisions etc whoud also be from class perspectiv, chanter can do other things then druid, mage other then warrior, rogue other then barberian, so as an example...

 

Why in nwn 2 all classes have only "City Watch" and "Gangs" roads ? (this is half linear sotry line) in full linear ther where also mages, mercenraries, orders, gulids etc etc ... mych way more options to role play you character ...

 

Halflinear was good in Dragon Age orgins, beacouse we have where only mages (that there more like combat Sorcerers), fighters and rogues ... so their playstyle whoud be simmilar in many ways ...

 

But ... chanter, druid, paladin, cipher, ranger ... those classes ar much more complex ten simple "the fights witch magic, he fights with stword, he fights with dagger" like we seen in Dragon age ogrins ... in with is pull off good only becouse their classes ther ... poor xD whats funny a little xD

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POE has a definite storyline. Knowing this I would still like to see some choices have very large consequences. I want non trivial consequences.  Examples of this would be lose out the option of a entire map/town cause that area is destroyed because of a choice, and or that area is non 100 percent hostile. A choice made causes one or more party members to attack the player.

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POE has a definite storyline. Knowing this I would still like to see some choices have very large consequences. I want non trivial consequences.  Examples of this would be lose out the option of a entire map/town cause that area is destroyed because of a choice, and or that area is non 100 percent hostile. A choice made causes one or more party members to attack the player.

 

And what nonlinear is no definite storyline ? XD

 

Non linear mean 1 decisions brings you to another. For example, We have Gorion and "mistirous sranger" (lets assume that not Sarevok ;) ) Stanger says "Hey kid, i can make you rich and powerfull join me" if you are bad character you whoud sey "Hell yeah" and help kill Gorion, Then Stranger gives you a mission to Invistigate Neshkiel mine, and you say "OK" and says, hey i have to companions near the road speak to them ... you meet Xan and other Halfing guy (i dont remember his name xD) but when you meet Jaheira and Khalid they become hostile.

 

1 Decision, chenges everithing you still go to the same playces xD Game can be COMPLEATLY diffrent becouse that one decision, if you make others, then the gameplay whoud change on simillar level and the ending coud be also compleatly diffrent even if you visit the same places xD

 

In General Fallout New Vegas, is one of the most non-linear, but still ONLY few decisions matter, mostly at the ending.

Edited by Ulquiorra

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non-linear story in a crpg is a myth. multiple paths is not actual non-linear, but am s'posing that is semantics.

 

HA! Good Fun!


"Those who won our independence by revolution were not cowards. They did not fear political change. They did not exalt order at the cost of liberty. To courageous, self-reliant men, with confidence in the power of free and fearless reasoning applied through the processes of popular government, no danger flowing from speech can be deemed clear and present, unless the incidence of the evil apprehended is so imminent that it may befall before there is opportunity for full discussion. If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."--Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

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non-linear story in a crpg is a myth. multiple paths is not actual non-linear, but am s'posing that is semantics.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Good to know there are still some people that have something to bring to the table, good to know that you have so much repect to us that you didn't even bother to say something that whoud show us, what to you think about "Non-linearity" how it looks in you opinion etc ...

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non-linear story in a crpg is a myth. multiple paths is not actual non-linear, but am s'posing that is semantics.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Good to know there are still some people that have something to bring to the table, good to know that you have so much repect to us that you didn't even bother to say something that whoud show us, what to you think about "Non-linearity" how it looks in you opinion etc ...

 

we have... literal dozens of times. many people on these boards would consider our posting on the matter to be the equivalent of spam. 

 

*shrug*

 

HA! Good Fun!


"Those who won our independence by revolution were not cowards. They did not fear political change. They did not exalt order at the cost of liberty. To courageous, self-reliant men, with confidence in the power of free and fearless reasoning applied through the processes of popular government, no danger flowing from speech can be deemed clear and present, unless the incidence of the evil apprehended is so imminent that it may befall before there is opportunity for full discussion. If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."--Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

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non-linear story in a crpg is a myth. multiple paths is not actual non-linear, but am s'posing that is semantics.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Good to know there are still some people that have something to bring to the table, good to know that you have so much repect to us that you didn't even bother to say something that whoud show us, what to you think about "Non-linearity" how it looks in you opinion etc ...

 

we have... literal dozens of times. many people on these boards would consider our posting on the matter to be the equivalent of spam. 

 

*shrug*

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

 

Let me play the telepath, im thinking that you are saying "real nonlinear storyline" just like realt life, whoud never be done becouse we whoud allways limited to some decisions regardless if we do them 10, 100, 1000 becouse in realy non linear storyline there are always way more deciosions, and always way bigger randomless and chaos in with it coud not be compleatly coverd in any game ...

 

Im catching your meaning i i shoud work more on my telepatic skills ?

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You simply cannot create paths in crpg... the closest thing would be in a sandbox world where time passes by and even if you (protagonist) don't do anything, the game world move on its own like simulator games.  Meanwhile if your character doesn't achieve something particular and grew to old age, (s)he dies from old age. If your character gets captured by enemy lord who simply has no mercy sparing you, your character dies.  

 

You can join lords or their vassals to help them rule the world, buy castle from declined lords and fight to become the emperor, join ninja or pirates, become sword master and start your school or simply be the best in competition, be a doctor, be a "tea man," be a merchant, and such to beat the game.

 

That was the most table rpg like pc game that I have played, but it still got default routes therefore still linear.

Edited by sorrowofwind

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You simply cannot create paths in crpg...

 

 

Yest you can, mosly becouse even crating linear plot you create ... 1 path xD So creating anotherones are still possible on the same way ... but with much more effort xD

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You simply cannot create paths in crpg...

 

 

Yest you can, mosly becouse even crating linear plot you create ... 1 path xD So creating anotherones are still possible on the same way ... but with much more effort xD

 

 

Within a crpg, there is only to do or not to do the main quest, while it may offer different ways to solve a confrontation, the path led the players to the confrontation still exist and can only be delayed, not erased.  

 

There are no opinions such as

"Screw saving the world, let other heroic npcs do it themselves!!!"  

"I'll stay in the brothel having fun till the evil villain die of old age!!!"  

"Instead of fighting the evil baddies, my character shall from a organized criminal groups and corrupt the city"

"I'll tutor a student for him/her to be the hero(ine) while I stayed behind."

"Let's support our evil government and let it become something more fearsome than the baddies!"

"Why fight evil when you can join it right at start!" (most games offer this opinion until the very end...)

"Err, I dunno, let's find someone to get married. The formidable opponent hides within marriage!"

 

The list can go on. Yes, crpgs are railroaded to "set destinations" (usually a confrontation) despite they may seem to have choices.

 

Sometimes choices don't matter, they're simply fluffs.

 

Sometimes choices seem matter but you're leaving the area the choices had effect on right away, forever, therefore you have a sense of accomplishment while the only effect you would see is the ending slide.

 

Other times, choices matter, but only in resource providing, support or the opposite, but would not change the path to the final confrontation.

 

As long as there are major objectives ingame, the paths are set. You may solve the quests in different manner or in different time order, but the path "solving these objectives" is unaltered.

Edited by sorrowofwind

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You simply cannot create paths in crpg...

 

 

Yest you can, mosly becouse even crating linear plot you create ... 1 path xD So creating anotherones are still possible on the same way ... but with much more effort xD

 

 

Within a crpg, there is only to do or not to do the main quest, while it may offer different ways to solve a confrontation, the path led the players to the confrontation still exist and can only be delayed, not erased.  

 

There are no opinions such as

"Screw saving the world, let other heroic npcs do it themselves!!!"  

"I'll stay in the brothel having fun till the evil villain die of old age!!!"  

"Instead of fighting the evil baddies, my character shall from a organized criminal groups and corrupt the city"

"I'll tutor a student for him/her to be the hero(ine) while I stayed behind."

"Let's support our evil government and let it become something more fearsome than the baddies!"

"Why fight evil when you can join it right at start!" (most games offer this opinion until the very end...)

"Err, I dunno, let's find someone to get married. The formidable opponent hides within marriage!"

 

The list can go on. Yes, crpgs are railroaded to "set destinations" (usually a confrontation) despite they may seem to have choices.

 

Sometimes choices don't matter, they're simply fluffs.

 

Sometimes choices seem matter but you're leaving the area the choices had effect on right away, forever, therefore you have a sense of accomplishment while the only effect you would see is the ending slide.

 

Other times, choices matter, but only in resource providing, support or the opposite, but would not change the path to the final confrontation.

 

As long as there are major objectives ingame, the paths are set. You may solve the quests in different manner or in different time order, but the path "solving these objectives" is unaltered.

 

 

 

I agree that to this day there are no no-linear plots in crpgs, but that doesnt meant that it isint "possible". It's only hart to input, way harder then linear or halflinears. xD

Edited by Ulquiorra

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The one with the best writing.

 

All of these types of game narratives have their virtues, and I'm happy to partake of any of them. The only thing that really matters to me is whether those virtues are successfully brought out or not.

 

Although, in practice, I find linear or halflinear stories tend to be the best-structured. But that may just be tautological - people who can write good stories want to tell at least partially linear stories.

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If I'm typing in red, it means I'm being sarcastic. But not this time.

Dark green, on the other hand, is for jokes and irony in general.

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Nonlinear plot meant that 1 decision leads to andother, then means that if we for example make decision numer 1, all decision that coud be unlocked by taking decision number 2 or number 3 are closed.

Uh, no, that's not what non-linear means. At all. Nonlinear is when the order of decisions and story elements isn't fixed.

 

If you were to graphically display them, linear would simply be a long(or not so long) line with one quest and story portion neatly arranged after the other and no options on how to proceed(at most allowing you to skip some trivial steps, like not having to ask around when you already know who to deliver your 20 bear asses to).

Novels are usually linear as well, telling a story from first to last page in order.

 

Halflinear or branching storylines would at certain quests branch out and create additional, in itself still linear, storylines. Basically, you have multiple linear stories with a certain amount of common elements.

 

Nonlinear can be anything where you have no fixed order. Sidequests are often non-linear. Usually this has a weak or nonexistent overarching storyline.

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If you were to graphically display them, linear would simply be a long(or not so long) line with one quest and story portion neatly arranged after the other and no options on how to proceed(at most allowing you to skip some trivial steps, like not having to ask around when you already know who to deliver your 20 bear asses to).

Novels are usually linear as well, telling a story from first to last page in order.

 

Halflinear or branching storylines would at certain quests branch out and create additional, in itself still linear, storylines. Basically, you have multiple linear stories with a certain amount of common elements.

 

Nonlinear can be anything where you have no fixed order. Sidequests are often non-linear. Usually this has a weak or nonexistent overarching storyline.

Well said.  How about some clear examples. 

 

Linear Story = Baldur's Gate 1.  There are side quests but they have no effect on the main plot and you have to do the main plot in order.

 

Partially Linear = Mass Effect 1.  You don't have to follow plot in a specific order.... but you do have to do all major plot events.  There are some side quests and they have slight influence on the story.

 

Non Linear = Elder Scrolls.  Yeah there is a story, but it is pretty weak.  Most people ignore it, and would rather just run around and do all the faction/side stuff which can have a big impact on the game world.  Meanwhile the main story in many ways can be done out of order and you can even accidentally wander into some parts of it.  Some Elder Scrolls games are even so open on plot you can kill key storyline npcs and still clear the main plot.

 

Meanwhile.... who hired you to get all that bear ass exactly, what is wrong with them, what do they need all that ass for, and how exactly are you carrying the 20 bear ass in question?

Edited by Karkarov
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 Some Elder Scrolls games are even so open on plot you can kill key storyline npcs and still clear the main plot.

 

 

I don't remember how things were in games before Morrowind, but in Morrowind even though you were able to kill storyline NPCs, killing them unable your ability to complete main plot and game informs player that this is the case (like for example killing Vivec) , in Oblivion and Skyrim you can't kill storyline NPCs until their role in plot is fulfilled. 

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In Skyrim, you may not even kill certain NPCs who have zero plots nor quests. ie. the commanders in the opposing faction camps.  Many minor npcs are also essential, despite the only quests related to them have little to no importance.

 

Morrowind is like Icewind dale 1&2 in this regard, if you killed certain important main quest npcs, you're stuck forever. 1st game wouldn't give a notice while in 2 it would show a screen claiming you've just killed someone important.

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