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A Beta is something that they should have offered every purchaser for free, so that they could collect the mentioned points. It is in their interest of having a beta so that the final product doesn’t fail. Our interest here is to get what we are promised, and you guys already give them money even tree times more than they have asked for. Nearly every backer is willing to help, but not pay again for the help. 

I got the beta "For free" (actually, anyone pledging $100 or more got it "for free", as it was just another bonus item for pledging).

 

Yes, OE could have put the "Backer Beta" on all the KS tiers of $25 or more (which was, IIRC, the lowest tier with "digital copy of the game" as a reward), but they chose to reserve it for the $100+ tiers.

 

After the KS plan ended, they put it in as a $25 additional buy-in so that they could get more people in who wanted it, but maybe couldn't afford it at the $100 KS tier (e.g. KS game tier + Backer Portal addon = $50). Or, perhaps they're picking and choosing what they want (game + beta + t-shirt) and it ends up cheaper overall than a tier that includes all the things (cheapest I see is $140 for that all in a single bundle).

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After the KS plan ended, they put it in as a $25 additional buy-in so that they could get more people in who wanted it, but maybe couldn't afford it at the $100 KS tier (e.g. KS game tier + Backer Portal addon = $50). Or, perhaps they're picking and choosing what they want (game + beta + t-shirt) and it ends up cheaper overall than a tier that includes all the things (cheapest I see is $140 for that all in a single bundle).

The cheapest you could get beta access on Kickstarter was 110 dollars.

 

People forget the addons didn't because available until like a couple weeks ago and the addons are getting shut down in 4 days.  This game is not going on steam early access, we are going to get codes, we put in the codes, we download to steam.  It isn't going to be on the steam front page, steam isn't going to sell it, hell you don't even lose your real game key by using your beta key to play it on steam.

 

If you really have a problem with Obsidian opening beta access and game purchase combined for around 50 bucks for all of 3 weeks or so then don't back the game.  Please don't compare it to Cash Citizen, Wasteland 2, or indie game X that either release a buggy alpha mess for full retail price like a year or more in advance and never take it down, or just constantly dry hump their backers for more money.

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After the KS plan ended, they put it in as a $25 additional buy-in so that they could get more people in who wanted it, but maybe couldn't afford it at the $100 KS tier (e.g. KS game tier + Backer Portal addon = $50). Or, perhaps they're picking and choosing what they want (game + beta + t-shirt) and it ends up cheaper overall than a tier that includes all the things (cheapest I see is $140 for that all in a single bundle).

The cheapest you could get beta access on Kickstarter was 110 dollars.

 

whoops  :shrugz: ... in either case, that doesn't make my point any less valid.

 

People forget the addons didn't because available until like a couple weeks ago and the addons are getting shut down in 4 days.

This is untrue -- they added the ability to buy addons alone (that is, without a separate tier purchase)a few days ago. However, I was able to add-on an expansion pack download to my tier a long time ago; though I can't recall if that was available from "day 1" of the backer portal, or if that came out a few weeks later (and I needed to talk to customer support to get my purchase reset).

 

If you really have a problem with Obsidian opening beta access and game purchase combined for around 50 bucks for all of 3 weeks or so then don't back the game.  Please don't compare it to Cash Citizen, Wasteland 2, or indie game X that either release a buggy alpha mess for full retail price like a year or more in advance and never take it down, or just constantly dry hump their backers for more money.

Don't really know where you're going with this paragraph -- I think it's awesome that OE gave people the ability to purchase addons they wanted (but couldn't necessarily afford due to KS tiering -- although there's disparity between the KS tiering and the current backer-portal tiering, so my prices were wrong in my OP -- turns out t-shirt + game + beta is unlocked at $110 if you were a KS backer (well, after they updated the rewards, I think -- the picture on the KS page doesn't show a t-shirt at $110), but it's $140 on the Backer Portal).

Edited by neo6874
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BUT! Asking people to pay for a Beta accesses is milking the consumer. And there is absolutely no room for discussion here. 

So, you're okay with fundraising as long as you don't have to pay too much to get the incentives to pay more.

 

That's some super logic.

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Personally undecided... pros and cons for both. 

 

Steam offers zero interference updates, so strong contender but it does chew itself up in its own cache every so often which requires scrubbing it and re-installing everything from scratch which can be... aggravating... 

 

I do, however, strongly support GoG so I may end up grabbing another copy there as well... 

Are you gonna throw rocks at me? What about now?

..

What about now?

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Well, if this was publisher funded I might say that argument has a leg to stand on. Seeing as publishers rarely allow betas of this nature I can't say much more there. Steam Early Access has become popular among some developers. Most of them are small time, at best mid level, so power to them as well. I am not too apt to pay for those game's alpha/beta access because they typically aren't games I would care too much for. So I am not paying for that privilege.

 

However, as a crowd funded game the developers have 100% carte blanche to maximize funding in whatever way they see fit. It is also a game that is spiritual successor to a group of games I loved (and still play today) made by a developer that whose products I enjoy. I want to help and I want to play the title. I want to see how it feels and give feedback. I want this style of RPG to come back. I am completely willing to give Obsidian $25 to help with funds for the game and enjoy playing the beta while trying to help find bugs, balancing issues, etc to help make the game the best it can be. If Obsidian is successful then we may see more games like this and not just from Obsidian themselves. We could see other Studios make similar games. A cRPG renaissance, if you will. Well worth $25 in my book.

 

Milking consumers would be if EA put a game of this type, and equal level funding, on Origin for $60(which I am sure would be the amount EA would try to charge) as a beta (with equally limited content). A company with enough money to fund this game hundreds of times over asking $60 to test 3-6 hours of content is 100% consumer milking. A mid level developer that couldn't fund the game without crowd funding asking $25 is not.

 

I am also someone of very modest means. I am definitely not loaded.

 

Also, there is always room for discussion.

 

You have made some good points that are worth to think about and maybe chance my point of view.

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I've used both GoG and Steam, and Steam is hands down the better choice for me. The number of steps it takes to buy, install, and then play a game is just lot lower when it comes to Steam.

 

Granted, this may change when GoG Galaxy comes out.

Edited by illathid

"Wizards do not need to be The Dudes Who Can AoE Nuke You and Gish and Take as Many Hits as a Fighter and Make all Skills Irrelevant Because Magic."

-Josh Sawyer

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I've used both GoG and Steam, and Steam is hands down the better choice for me. The number of steps it takes to buy, install, and then play a game is just lot lower when it comes to Steam.

 

Granted, this may change when GoG Galaxy comes out.

 

How long is this going to take?

What I like about steam are the sales.

2€ for Magic 2014? Deal!

 

It is the only way to make me buy games, that I would never buy for a regular price.

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I've used both GoG and Steam, and Steam is hands down the better choice for me. The number of steps it takes to buy, install, and then play a game is just lot lower when it comes to Steam.

 

Granted, this may change when GoG Galaxy comes out.

 

How long is this going to take?

What I like about steam are the sales.

2€ for Magic 2014? Deal!

 

It is the only way to make me buy games, that I would never buy for a regular price.

 

 

I have no idea when GoG Galaxy is going to be released (assuming that's what you're asking). 

"Wizards do not need to be The Dudes Who Can AoE Nuke You and Gish and Take as Many Hits as a Fighter and Make all Skills Irrelevant Because Magic."

-Josh Sawyer

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I love both Steam and GoG with all my heart, but when the chips are down, and barring any significant price differences, I'll use GoG. I like the convenience of just having the game installed without the rigmarole of the Steam library (although Steam's auto-updating does balance this out). And I appreciate what GoG is doing as a company. I pre-ordered The Witcher 3 directly from GoG, partly because it was basically pre-ordering directly from the developer, but also because of their Fair Price package. For those who don't know, when GoG is forced (through publisher shenanigans) to sell a game under regional pricing, and if this significantly affects the relative price in different regions, then GoG offers free game codes to make up the difference. Essentially out of their own pocket. Which is awesome.

 

So yeah, GoG (marginally) wins.

 

I still love you, Steam.

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I would choose gog myself. Certain games are region-locked on steam, offer higher prices, and "updating" is simply annoying. 

 

Last time I got a fall of samurai boxed copy (cannot buy through steam due to region lock, gmg also blocks us), after installing through DVD, it required a "real installation" which took like 17gig download.  Why would I require a physical copy then? Because... well we get region locked yet the dvd we get is completely useless.

 

And since most boxed copies require steam as the platform, ever since I don't buy steam games no more. No reason for me to submit to a monopolization that treat me like third classed citizens.

Edited by sorrowofwind
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I love both steam and gog. Im giving one away on steam to a rl friend of mine who only has steam amd will use my other one for myself to have on steam as well. Ill buy one on gog for myself and problemly for another friend and hopefully be able to buy the boxed version when it comes out. If it goes on sale and my pnp group hasnt bought it yet, ill buy it for them as well when it goes on sale.

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