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Ongoing discussion of Ukraine

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Reports are coming in from people who have lost family in the crash, and have found their loved ones credit cards and phones have been used after the crash.

 

But I am sure the usual suspects will decry it all as Western propaganda again.

 

This forum really needs a tinfoil hat emote at this rate.

Wipe that scum off the face of the earth already.


The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.

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Who ? Eastern Ukrainians ? 

 

Also, apparently US confirmed that Russian artillery is firing into Ukraine.  Though "can't say" what that was based on, obvious reasons for that.

 

http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/07/24/ukraine-crisis-usa-artillery-idINL2N0PZ2AH20140724


Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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Also, apparently US confirmed that Russian artillery is firing into Ukraine.  Though "can't say" what that was based on, obvious reasons for that.

 

http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/07/24/ukraine-crisis-usa-artillery-idINL2N0PZ2AH20140724

Lol. We have evidence but don't show for you. I think they talking about these facebook fake accounts where brave Russian warrior's post photos of very secret operations in Ukraine, this fat trolling cause nice ****storm in Russian pro-West media, if Pentagon repeat this nonsense this is become most epic trolling evar.

But if seriously this is not important really... Because non-Russian meteo satellite suddenly give video evidence how Ukrainian Army launch "Buk" missile and shot down Boening.

We take big amounts of popcorn and await reaction of "international" community.

http://youtu.be/sdqIDYnSNq8

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And those fine democrats in Kiev, having overthrown the democratically elected President, have started on dissolving democratically elected rival political parties, too. But in totally democratic fashion, via the former caretaker President and current speaker's say so, for 'low membership'. The communists actually got more votes than Svoboda did in the PR segment...

 

Plus, Yatsenyuk has quit. What an utter shambles. No need to buy a turkey for christmas, EU, you've got one on lay by.

 

Reports are coming in from people who have lost family in the crash, and have found their loved ones credit cards and phones have been used after the crash.

 

Actually, I'd be amazed if that wasn't happening. Young men, guns and little oversight are never a good recipe for civilised behaviour and even under the best circumstances you find some people willing to steal off the dead, and these are far from the best circumstances. I'd take issue with some of the criticism given to the rebels over body treatment since there were two contradictory requirements, but looting should not happen.

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Reports are coming in from people who have lost family in the crash, and have found their loved ones credit cards and phones have been used after the crash.

 

But I am sure the usual suspects will decry it all as Western propaganda again.

 

This forum really needs a tinfoil hat emote at this rate.

Suspect, singular. Honestly, It'd be nice to get real Russian's input on these things rather than the slavophile equivalent of a North Korea fetishist.

Edited by AGX-17

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Because non-Russian meteo satellite suddenly give video evidence

 

 

1.  Meteosat satellites do not transmit "streaming video" but rather provide a single image at 15 minute interval or 3 pictures at 30 minute intervals (depending on the version of the sat)

2.  the resolution of the alleged video far exceeds anything produced from the Metosat satellites which measures their resolution in kms (!)

3.  and finallly, none of the Meteosat satellites are or were positioned over Ukraine; particularly Meteosat 8 which is the alleged source of the "video".

 

 

http://en.allmetsat.com/satellite-meteosat.php

 

There is nothing to indicate any location of the video. Given the shaky provenance of the video I'm beyond skeptical.   That video is total bull**** and so is your claim. 

 

Next time try one of these conspiracy theories oby:

 

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2014/0722/What-really-happened-to-MH17-Russia-s-media-have-the-answer-video

Edited by kgambit
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Also, apparently US confirmed that Russian artillery is firing into Ukraine.  Though "can't say" what that was based on, obvious reasons for that.

 

http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/07/24/ukraine-crisis-usa-artillery-idINL2N0PZ2AH20140724

Lol. We have evidence but don't show for you. I think they talking about these facebook fake accounts where brave Russian warrior's post photos of very secret operations in Ukraine, this fat trolling cause nice ****storm in Russian pro-West media, if Pentagon repeat this nonsense this is become most epic trolling evar.

But if seriously this is not important really... Because non-Russian meteo satellite suddenly give video evidence how Ukrainian Army launch "Buk" missile and shot down Boening.

We take big amounts of popcorn and await reaction of "international" community.

http://youtu.be/sdqIDYnSNq8

 

Lol, obvious Arma footage.

 

After ukrainians got discovered that their SBU was making fake videos, they decided to make an obvious fake for their enemy to discredit them as well. But they're still not even trying, I mean arma footage, come on.

 

Nobody is going to comment on that fake, don't hold your breath, nobody is that stupid.

Edited by Bester

IE Mod for Pillars of Eternity: link

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Obama backs Kiev's civilian murderers with military specialists from Pentagon to help them kill even more civilians

 

Imagine a situation where Mexico is in a state of civil war. One side is pro-american, another is anti-american, and Putin sends his military specialists to help one side. I think that would be like a declaration of war. But it doesn't count when the US does it.

 

>“Clearly, we have an interest in what happens in Ukraine"

Point me on a map where you don't have interests.

Edited by Bester

IE Mod for Pillars of Eternity: link

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The Human Right Watch report had an amusing effect. The Ukrainian spokesman, tried his usual spiel ("the rebels were shelling themselves to make us look bad!") and claimed there were no Ukrainian grads near Donetsk, Al Jazeera then showed footage of... Ukrainian grads near Donetsk, shot a few days ago. Also pretty stupid when you're trying to claim you couldn't possibly have shot down an airliner because you had no SAMs nearby to be caught in such an obvious lie about a different type of rocket.

 

I rather like Al Jazeera's snideness on occasion as well. Mentioning that Yatsenyuk resigned partly because of a refusal to allow US companies to drill for gas, something no one else did, I'm sure Joe Biden will be disappointed. Or his son, at least.

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Obama backs Kiev's civilian murderers with military specialists from Pentagon to help them kill even more civilians

 

Imagine a situation where Mexico is in a state of civil war. One side is pro-american, another is anti-american, and Putin sends his military specialists to help one side. I think that would be like a declaration of war. But it doesn't count when the US does it.

 

>“Clearly, we have an interest in what happens in Ukraine"

Point me on a map where you don't have interests.

 

Actually we have a defined written treaty interest. Of long standing. We're not just making this crap up on the fly.


"It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"."

             -Elwood Blues

 

tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp.

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Pictures released by the US proving that Russia is shelling Ukraine.

 

http://imgur.com/a/c6TJr

 

Interesting. Although wouldn't have been hard to fake.


"It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"."

             -Elwood Blues

 

tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp.

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http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-28/shrapnel-from-rocket-caused-mh17-crash/5630400

 

Well, that was about as much as we expected from the recorder.


Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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Doesn't even conclusively mean a missile either, let alone indicate a type of missile.

 

The satellite photos aren't very good either, they're just... lazy for want of a better term. They really should have stumped up the cash for colour rather than just b/w images or provided something from their own spy satellites that everyone knows they have; b/w photos are easier to manipulate in just about every respect as they really need to be taken on the same azimuth and at the same time of day or you get problems, for example with different shadow lengths and alignments, and indeed you can see what might charitably be called 'exposure differences'* on some of the images. Mostly though I am amused that their maps would come close to failing a 5th form Geography map making question; no scale, inconsistent north alignment, insets without scale etc.

 

But in any case it's not at all convincing unless you're already convinced, one of the two 'smoking gun' type pictures is even of firing that is clearly labelled as being wholly internal to Ukraine and not from Russia at all.

 

*For example, look at the insets on the top map, note how light the trees are on the one in Ukraine, then how relatively dark the trees (mostly cropped) of the one showing the scorch marks- that image has clearly been darkened. That really should not be done if you know that one of the things that will be said is that they've been manipulated.

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Not saying that the photos are legit, just that the media posted them as proof from the US.

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Not saying that the photos are legit, just that the media posted them as proof from the US.

 

Not my intention to poke holes in your integrity for posting them. I just felt that I had to question their real provenance.

 

Personallly I think they're real, but I'm not basing that on any criical judgement. I'm just basing that on the principle that I'm convinced the events have taken place, and that the US has satellites that could have taken photos. Those images could still be fake though. 


"It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"."

             -Elwood Blues

 

tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp.

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US (government) satellites would certainly have been taking pictures. Those pictures are specifically, per their copyright info- provided by a commercial satellite vendor, Digital Globe, rather than by a US intelligence satellite- that's how I know that there are colour versions available, you can look up their services on their website. At least in theory one could even buy the pictures oneself to check them, though I'd suspect they'd not sell such sensitive stuff to Joe Public.

 

I didn't really think they were being posted here as outright 'proof' of anything anyway.

 

(I've never actually used Digital Globe*, but have used images from their competitors (Ikonos, SPOT), some time ago when I was tutoring relevant courses at university.)

 

*IIRC they provide a lot of imagery for Google Earth commercially, so I have kind of used them.

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heh some stupid russian soldier just pissed Putin hard, I am curiouse how long he will live now xD

 

http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/does-this-soldiers-instagram-account-prove-russia-is-covertl

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I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think, I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech, and freedom of choice. I'm the kinda guy that likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecue ribs with the side-order of gravy fries?" I want high cholesterol! I wanna eat bacon, and butter, and buckets of cheese, okay?! I wanna smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section! I wanna run naked through the street, with green Jell-O all over my body, reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly may feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiene"

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heh some stupid russian soldier just pissed Putin hard, I am curiouse how long he will live now xD

 

http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/does-this-soldiers-instagram-account-prove-russia-is-covertl

 

Yeah that's what you call a career limiting move

 

I suppose it could be fake but the reality is we already know Russia is giving military aid to  Ukraine in several ways


"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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heh some stupid russian soldier just pissed Putin hard, I am curiouse how long he will live now xD

 

http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/does-this-soldiers-instagram-account-prove-russia-is-covertl

 

Yeah that's what you call a career limiting move

 

I suppose it could be fake but the reality is we already know Russia is giving military aid to  Ukraine in several ways

 

I think it's definitely possible that the soldier meant to write that he was working on a notebook computer (laptop), and not a "BUK" missile system. That said, there is no explanation for him being located in Ukraine. The word for the missile system and slang for a laptop is the same word in Russian, so I think it is also possible the vagueness in the statement might have been an intentional joke from his side. "Working on a "book", if you know what I mean..."

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"Well, overkill is my middle name. And my last name. And all of my other names as well!"

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Yeah already heard that, but as you point out it doesnt expain why he was on separatist controlled teritory. Also from what I know he is trained to operate such devices as BUK.


I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think, I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech, and freedom of choice. I'm the kinda guy that likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecue ribs with the side-order of gravy fries?" I want high cholesterol! I wanna eat bacon, and butter, and buckets of cheese, okay?! I wanna smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section! I wanna run naked through the street, with green Jell-O all over my body, reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly may feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiene"

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heh some stupid russian soldier just pissed Putin hard, I am curiouse how long he will live now xD

 

http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/does-this-soldiers-instagram-account-prove-russia-is-covertl

Using social network account as proof... :facepalm:

 

It's just remind me times when i play role of hot Russian mail bride in facebook, lol.

 

P.S. As ex-military officier i can say - all these cool stories about soldiers posting something in internets during secret operations is unbelievable bull****, IRL in such situation any possibilities of   communications are cutted... Though it's can be provocation of some forces from Russia... some people here do want big war...

 

P.P.S. I think everyone easily recognise if Russia really decide make war against current Ukrainian government - Russian tanks in Kiev, Kievan junta flee into Europe/US but even this don't save them from assasins with icebreakers/polonium tea, Russian troops on Polish-Ukrainian border, Georgia 2008, epic butthurt in NATO HQ and other unseen yet things. This Ukrainian-Ukrainian war yet not looked as Russian-Ukrainian war exactly. Just some traitors in Kiev clean own lands from local population, just West do want make landgrab, but dont want native people inhabitted here.

 

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