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Update #79: Graphics and Rendering

Graphics Rendering Lighting Programming Adam Brennecke Update 79

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#181
Lephys

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Well, they've already got all those subtle animations in the environment with flora and such blowing in the wind, etc. Water rippling... It might be possible they're already doing this. I mean, they did show off all that fancy dynamic lighting on a 2D image early on, in sort of a "huzzah!" fashion. It'd be a shame if all the scene-baked lightsources in the land were "static" (even if they change in intensity and/or over time, if they didn't "flicker" and such in an animated fashion at all.)
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#182
Dark_Ansem

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so, if we wanted to create our own custom map based on a 2d image... we'd need to pass through all that?

Or the game also supports standard textures (diffuse, normal, ambient, specular)?

 

would images need to be already isometric or they'd need to be flat, and the engine "makes them isometric"?


Edited by Dark_Ansem, 31 October 2014 - 09:30 AM.


#183
Silent Winter

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^You'd need to create at least an image map, z-depth-map, walk-mesh, (specular map makes it look better), and probably normal map.

You'd need to render it in isometric view, yes.  (Or the other angle for outdoor scenes).

(Edit: Just to clarify, that's a flat 2D image of a scene from an isometric POV)


Edited by Silent Winter, 31 October 2014 - 07:41 PM.

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#184
Dark_Ansem

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I can do the diffuse texture, the normal map, the specular mask (despite the fact that it gives everything a sort of shiny look). Any idea if also the ambient occlusion map is needed?

But I have no idea what a z-depth map is, and I doubt the walkmesh can be done without a sort of official tool.

Add to that, no idea what the "albedo" is.

 

normal sizes allowed or only gigantic textures? :p

 

will extra 2d images be required for doors opened\closed and other interactibles, like Baldur's gate required?

 

what about interactables and lighting?

 

The diffuse map must come with architectural shadows?


Edited by Dark_Ansem, 01 November 2014 - 12:21 AM.


#185
Silent Winter

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^AO map would just make it look better

If specular makes everything too shiny, then you're overdoing the specular settings ;)

(tip - specular colour needn't be white - try dark colours on paper for example)

 

z-depth map tells the engine how far everything is from the camera so it can calculate whether your character is in front of / behind the tree etc.

 

Walkmesh would require unity (possibly pro if you're going to add it to PoE) (I guess the mesh itself could be made in any 3D program but I think Unity would be needed to make it work with PoE)

 

Extent of modding options is uncertain at the moment - but there are some clever modders out there.

I'll be happy if even adding in NPCs/Quests/Items/Dialogue is possible a la IE games.

 

Edit: Not sure about 'albedo' either - it appears to be just the diffuse map


Edited by Silent Winter, 01 November 2014 - 12:08 AM.


#186
Dark_Ansem

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Unity Pro would be a terrible idea. while the devs can update without hassle to it, considering the kickstarter funding, others cannot spend $1500, I fear.

 

Have you seen any use of Parallax in this game?

 

About the z-map... is it the same as "displacement", in your opinion?


Edited by Dark_Ansem, 01 November 2014 - 12:37 AM.


#187
Silent Winter

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^not displacement map - that's used when rendering the diffuse/spec/AO maps to add detail to the 3D mesh, (different objects have their own diffuse,spec and displacement/bump maps).  (It isn't a separate map applied at game time)

The occlusion map (per-pixel occlusion) would be the z-depth map.  It tells the engine how far the pixel is from the camera.  ('z' as in the z-axis).  So it knows whether to hide one object behind part of the 2D map (e.g. a character walking behind a tree)



#188
Dark_Ansem

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then I cannot do that. I know how to do the AO, but not the occlusion map.



#189
Silent Winter

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^same here, but I don't think it would be that difficult to do with the right software - you basically need a program that will render it, same as for a diffuse/AO map.

Not sure if Blender would but I'd be surprised if it couldn't (perhaps with a plugin).

 

The biggest obstacle is getting the area into the game - we'll have to wait and see what modding tools become available through the community.



#190
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agreed. A world editor, while most probably NOT coming, would be amazing. also for the placement of 3d emitter sounds and lights, if the game allows it.



#191
SirChristian

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World editor comes maybe later, we don't need him at start anyway. Game will be long and some of us try her more times:)



#192
Lephys

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I don't think we'll be getting a world editor. It's not your typical world-editing process, and they're already using a very small budget compared to other games/teams. You never know, though. Maybe if they make enough from sales, they'll easily be able to support something like that. *shrug*

#193
Amit Ravid

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Hi, sorry for bumping a post that is 2 years old.

 

I have sent an email for the support but i think it is better to ask this here.

Im also developing RPG (smaller), using similar methods.

 

 

I am writing scripts that will handle GI bleeding and everything needed to make character look authentic inside the scene.

But some other things I can learn from your awesome work if it is ok with you. if you can help me with this it will be great for me because I did not find any material for it on the web.


- the image is sitting as a texture on a polygonal plane or a 2d sprite (or something else?) ? 

- Why the depth pass is looking like a regular mesh with stripes in it? how did you made it inside maya ? and how do you use it in unity?  (im more then 10 years CG artist but I prefer to know your exact method because it will be better for sure)

- how you use the normal map to fit this kind of tasks the 2d background demands? 

Thank you very much and sorry for the bump..I did not knew where to ask.








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