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Platform games kind of lost their appeal to me when we moved to 3D games and shooter has always been a hardsell for me just as I'm not inclined to be good at them.

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I never particularly cared for Hordes of the Underdark, in fact i'd say that Undrentide was far more enjoyable personally, i'm very much alone in this view however I realise.

 

Personally I think that simplifying those who raise legitimate criticisms of any developers games as haters is a little prejudicial, I care for neither Bioware or any other company, because most assuredly they care not a whit for me and i'll no doubt recieve neither birthday cards nor a pack of socks at Christmas. Criticism is a good thing, well ordered and logical criticism even better, and to dismiss any criticism and just rabidly defend all problematic aspects seems a touch too impassioned and involved.

 

Obsidian at the moment makes content I generally like, it does not mean that I wish to take warm baths with the gentlemen and ladies of that establishment, merely that our tastes are at the moment generally sympatico. If they fail to be so then I shall most assuredly move on as a good consumer should, without hurt feelings or a strange belief that they may "redeem" themselves.

 

Shame Nonek, I feel bad for you now. Why do you say " Bioware doesn't care for you "...the fact that they have active forums and take fan feedback seriously, like Romance, tells me they most definitely do care :wub:  But you right its unlikely you will receive presents from Bioware but don't mistake that for a lack of genuine affection.

 

But don't you think there is such a thing as gratuitous and unnecessary criticism..so in other words not all criticism is good?

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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I'm shocked by how many people never played MDK2:bat:

 

That was an awesome tough as nails shooter/platformer.

I bought it in a sale the other day (the version with enhanced graphics), so I intend to rectify that problem, now please don't hit me! ;(

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I never particularly cared for Hordes of the Underdark, in fact i'd say that Undrentide was far more enjoyable personally, i'm very much alone in this view however I realise.

 

Personally I think that simplifying those who raise legitimate criticisms of any developers games as haters is a little prejudicial, I care for neither Bioware or any other company, because most assuredly they care not a whit for me and i'll no doubt recieve neither birthday cards nor a pack of socks at Christmas. Criticism is a good thing, well ordered and logical criticism even better, and to dismiss any criticism and just rabidly defend all problematic aspects seems a touch too impassioned and involved.

 

Obsidian at the moment makes content I generally like, it does not mean that I wish to take warm baths with the gentlemen and ladies of that establishment, merely that our tastes are at the moment generally sympatico. If they fail to be so then I shall most assuredly move on as a good consumer should, without hurt feelings or a strange belief that they may "redeem" themselves.

 

Shame Nonek, I feel bad for you now. Why do you say " Bioware doesn't care for you "...the fact that they have active forums and take fan feedback seriously, like Romance, tells me they most definitely do care :wub:  But you right its unlikely you will receive presents from Bioware but don't mistake that for a lack of genuine affection.

 

But don't you think there is such a thing as gratuitous and unnecessary criticism..so in other words not all criticism is good?

 

I would say criticism is good as long as it is genuine, presented in a respectful manner, and with a level head, otherwise it crosses over into rage or trolling territory. 

 

 

I'm shocked by how many people never played MDK2:bat:

 

That was an awesome tough as nails shooter/platformer.

I bought it in a sale the other day (the version with enhanced graphics), so I intend to rectify that problem, now please don't hit me! ;(

 

It's okay marelooke, since you plan to play the game you are no longer part of the problem, you are part of the solution.  :thumbsup:

Edited by Keyrock
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I wonder if there is beer on the sun

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I never particularly cared for Hordes of the Underdark, in fact i'd say that Undrentide was far more enjoyable personally, i'm very much alone in this view however I realise.

 

Personally I think that simplifying those who raise legitimate criticisms of any developers games as haters is a little prejudicial, I care for neither Bioware or any other company, because most assuredly they care not a whit for me and i'll no doubt recieve neither birthday cards nor a pack of socks at Christmas. Criticism is a good thing, well ordered and logical criticism even better, and to dismiss any criticism and just rabidly defend all problematic aspects seems a touch too impassioned and involved.

 

Obsidian at the moment makes content I generally like, it does not mean that I wish to take warm baths with the gentlemen and ladies of that establishment, merely that our tastes are at the moment generally sympatico. If they fail to be so then I shall most assuredly move on as a good consumer should, without hurt feelings or a strange belief that they may "redeem" themselves.

is something we rare mention, but in the present situation it is worth noting that bioware did not put Gromnir in their game because we rabidly defended problematic aspects of their games. quite the contrary. bg1 were, in our estimation, an extreme flawed game, and we shared our opinions on the matter with bioware ad nauseum. things has changed a bit at the bio boards, but while vol and others may suggest that critics o' bio is just butthurt, bioware is/was far more accepting (and even appreciative) of criticism than those misguided fans who believes it is their duty to defend biowarian honor.

 

HA! Good Fun!

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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It's okay marelooke, since you plan to play the game you are no longer part of the problem, you are part of the solution.  :thumbsup:

 

 

I like you Keyrock, you are funny and friendly :biggrin:

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Alternatively, if you're making a Star Wars game, why try to develop it into a moody, introspective rumination on interconnection and how slippery ethics can be? 

 

Because you hate everything Star Wars stands for?  ;)

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"Lulz is not the highest aspiration of art and mankind, no matter what the Encyclopedia Dramatica says."

 

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I don't get Uncharted and Infamous. Kind of hard to mix those up.

It's based solely on the name, since I know nothing about the content of either game. I mean the commonality itself isn't that great, but for me it's just a combination of a negating prefix plus some random word.

 

I also used to get Company of Heroes mixed up with Medal of Honor, up until the point I played the former.

 

So you're not a native English speaker, then (that's your best excuse at this point)? The words are phonetically quite distinct, and their meanings are practically polar opposites. To be uncharted is to be unknown, to be infamous is to be well-known.

 

 

Also, something about Dragon Age 3 or something.

Edited by AGX-17
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I don't get Uncharted and Infamous. Kind of hard to mix those up.

It's based solely on the name, since I know nothing about the content of either game. I mean the commonality itself isn't that great, but for me it's just a combination of a negating prefix plus some random word.

 

I also used to get Company of Heroes mixed up with Medal of Honor, up until the point I played the former.

 

So you're not a native English speaker, then (that's your best excuse at this point)? The words are phonetically quite distinct, and their meanings are practically polar opposites. To be uncharted is to be unknown, to be infamous is to be well-known.

 

 

Also, something about Dragon Age 3 or something.

 

Give the guy a break, its hard to tell these middle age bald men protagonists from each other.

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I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"*

 

*If you can't tell, it's you. ;)

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"but while vol and others may suggest that critics o' bio is just butthurt, bioware is/was far more accepting (and even appreciative) of criticism than those misguided fans who believes it is their duty to defend biowarian honor."
 

Defend their honour? Considering I've been terashed and called a troll for criticizing BIO games. That's hilarious. Then again, you probably loved KOTOR and think it's BIO's best game when , in reality, it is their worst CRPG outside of ME3.

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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Alternatively, if you're making a Star Wars game, why try to develop it into a moody, introspective rumination on interconnection and how slippery ethics can be? 

 

Because you hate everything Star Wars stands for?  ;)

 

another possibility:

 

first three movies and original kotor already occupied the shallow end o' the thematic pool.

 

no doubt lucas faced a similar quandary when developing 2nd trilogy-- how does one follow up a story that didn't ask any complex questions that remained unanswered? kotor were successful in part 'cause, following the prequel movies, folks were longing for the nostalgia o' episodes 4-6. bioware gave folks nostalgia by the bucket-- recreated characters, story-lines and themes o' episodes 4-6 and altered setting to a few thousands years previous. gamers were hungry for a star wars crpg, and giving them the stuff that worked in the beloved trilogy were a good idea. unfortunately, crafting a kotor sequel left obsidian in same situation lucas were finding himself when developing phantom menace.  

 

*shrug*

 

as an aside, up to point where you confront 3 jedi masters on dantooine (sp?), we would argue that kotor 2 were a superior game to kotor in virtual all meaningful ways.  sadly, obsidian frequent has difficulty ending games-- pulling all the threads back together so as to have a satisfying conclusion that is both surprising And inevitable is a skill obsidian lacks.  regardless, we thinks mc's query ain't near as perplexing as she were thinking.

 

HA! Good Fun!

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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"but while vol and others may suggest that critics o' bio is just butthurt, bioware is/was far more accepting (and even appreciative) of criticism than those misguided fans who believes it is their duty to defend biowarian honor."

 

Defend their honour? Considering I've been terashed and called a troll for criticizing BIO games. That's hilarious. Then again, you probably loved KOTOR and think it's BIO's best game when , in reality, it is their worst CRPG outside of ME3.

as you are clearly insane, the fact that you could criticize bio and defend them in same breath is not surprising.  oh, and your oft repeated weak sauce o' pointing out that you only gives the nwn sp game a score in 70s is hardly convincing neither. not change fact that you is one suggesting that if folks don't like bio or thinks they make games inferior to bio, the reason for their butthurt is 6.  more volism from vol. shocking.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited by Gromnir

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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So you're not a native English speaker, then (that's your best excuse at this point)? The words are phonetically quite distinct, and their meanings are practically polar opposites. To be uncharted is to be unknown, to be infamous is to be well-known.

 

It's to do with how people's brains work. I have to concentrate in order to tell Robert de Niro and Al Pacino apart and their names are dissimilar in fact if not in 'style' and they don't look particularly alike. I can also only remember one out of Alan Rickman and the guy who was in Leon/ Batman (Gary Oldman, but I seriously did have to look his name up). Why? Some mental wire crossings related to them tending to take similar roles and having moderately similar style names, most likely. Memory and associations aren't really rote/ literal things like a computer hard drive with a specific location that stores "Alan_Rickman.jpg" for comparison even if they have traced the Jennifer Aniston neuron.

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Yeah, sort of that, but also a large part due to them only really existing at the periphery of my awareness - not owning the platform they are native to. I'd give the example of the various generic rom-coms that get released each year, it's very easy to get them confused.

L I E S T R O N G
L I V E W R O N G

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I can't pronounce Baccaruda...Barracadu...BAH...RAH...CUD...AH...Baharadacadudah...that fish.

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Quite an experience to live in misery isn't it? That's what it is to be married with children.

I've seen things you people can't even imagine. Pearly Kings glittering on the Elephant and Castle, Morris Men dancing 'til the last light of midsummer. I watched Druid fires burning in the ruins of Stonehenge, and Yorkshiremen gurning for prizes. All these things will be lost in time, like alopecia on a skinhead. Time for tiffin.

 

Tea for the teapot!

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"as you are clearly insane, the fact that you could criticize bio and defend them in same breath is not surprising.  oh, and your oft repeated weak sauce o' pointing out that you only gives the nwn sp game a score in 70s is hardly convincing neither. not change fact that you is one suggesting that if folks don't like bio or thinks they make games inferior to bio, the reason for their butthurt is 6.  more volism from vol. shocking.

 

HA! Good Fun!"

 

You ain't making sense.

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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"as you are clearly insane, the fact that you could criticize bio and defend them in same breath is not surprising.  oh, and your oft repeated weak sauce o' pointing out that you only gives the nwn sp game a score in 70s is hardly convincing neither. not change fact that you is one suggesting that if folks don't like bio or thinks they make games inferior to bio, the reason for their butthurt is 6.  more volism from vol. shocking.

 

HA! Good Fun!"

 

You ain't making sense.

...

 

am wondering if you is aiming for irony.

 

...

 

is pointless, but we will try.  a sane person would recognize that your volish blanket dismissal o' any and all bio critics in this thread makes your dismay at being cast as a misguided defender o' biowarian honor less than convincing.  

 

to stay on-topic, we woulds petition bio to include a quirky jester character in their next game... maybe a jan jansen with turrets syndrome and an inexplicable penchant for non-sequitur. unfortunately, as bio aims for full voice-over, a catchphrase of "lulz" wouldn't work. bruce and chis would want the jester to be romancable, but we finds such a notion repellent... for multiple reasons.

 

HA! Good Fun!

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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I can't pronounce Baccaruda...Barracadu...BAH...RAH...CUD...AH...Baharadacadudah...that fish.

I can't spell "anonymous" without the aid of spell check.

"I am the expert, asshat." - Hurlsnot

"You need to be careful, lest I write another ten page essay on mythology and how it relates to Sailor Moon." - majestic

"I won't say what just in case KaineParker is reading" - Bartimaeus

"Oh no! Is there super secret ending as well? I don’t care." - Wormerine

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Yeah, sort of that, but also a large part due to them only really existing at the periphery of my awareness - not owning the platform they are native to. I'd give the example of the various generic rom-coms that get released each year, it's very easy to get them confused.

 

I get it, I also don't know the difference between the 2 games as I don't own a console. But the real point is " who cares about those 2 games, if they aren't on PC they dead to me " !!!!

 

:p

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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I liked ME3 and hated ME2. I also liked DA2 and hated DAO. What the hell is wrong with me?

 

At least you're consistent. During my current DA2 gameplay I can say that I feel it suffers from the same dragon age disease, but on a different level than DAO. In DAO my issue is that every segment runs on for too long... in DA2 the segments, "levels" if you will, are of pretty much the correct length... but due to the overuse of the reinforcement mechanic, every damn encounter runs for too long. I really wish they'd pared that back and saved it for the battles where it actually improves the encounter instead  of just extending it...

 

I loved ME2 until (the ending of ME3) ruined the whole series for me.

 

 

Totally stealing Tepid's template.

 

 

Me too!

 

Shattered Steel: 0

MDK 2: 0

Sonic Chronicles: The Dark Brotherhood: 0

Baldur's Gate: 2

Tales of the Sword Coast: 1

Baldur's Gate 2: 9

Throne of Bhaal: 2

Neverwinter Nights: 0.5

Shadows of Undrentide: 0

Hordes of the Underdark: 0

Knights of the Old Republic: 6

The Old Republic: 1,5 (jedi knight until the end, imperial agent until some later planet)

Jade Empire: 3

Mass Effect: 4

Mass Effect 2: 8

Mass Effect 3: 2

Dragon Age Origins: 4

Dragon Age 2: 4

 

 

A cover mechanic does not make something Gears of War.

 

And let's not forget that ME1 had a cover mechanic, it just wasn't very good. :)

 

 

Edited by Nepenthe

You're a cheery wee bugger, Nep. Have I ever said that?

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I don't need to.

 

The statement that money inherently is always bad is in itself a fallacy.

 

Oh, but that's not the argument I made, only the one you construed from amputating half my post. Pretty much in line with your tendency to mischaracterize the positions of others into black-or-white bull**** strawmen that you can then heroically ride in on your high horse and righteously put down. Try again! (protip: this time try making a rebuttal that is not a one-liner. You need to be witty and original for those to work, you are not quite there yet)

- When he is best, he is a little worse than a man, and when he is worst, he is little better than a beast.

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I keeping my expectations low for DA:I, after DA2 I know not to expect the same level of quality Pre-EA Bioware had, I guess we'll see what happens.

Edited by Chaz
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I don't need to.

 

The statement that money inherently is always bad is in itself a fallacy.

 

Oh, but that's not the argument I made, only the one you construed from amputating half my post. Pretty much in line with your tendency to mischaracterize the positions of others into black-or-white bull**** strawmen that you can then heroically ride in on your high horse and righteously put down. Try again! (protip: this time try making a rebuttal that is not a one-liner. You need to be witty and original for those to work, you are not quite there yet)

 

 

Wouldn't it just be easier and more cordial just to say " no that's not the argument I made" ?

 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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