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Torment: Tides of Numenera


Gorth

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I think it will be around the level of the original PS:T, or KotOR 2. With some, you could easily tell, while you had to work a little more to see it in others.

I do hope that you're right as I recall Chris A. in all seriousness saying something about thinking that having some twisted individual psychically enslaving people and forcing them to love either that individual or each other in a ghastly parody of legitimate love was an excellent idea. That's all fine and good for a freak we're supposed to take down, but I don't want a surfeit of dysfunctional or outright broken NPCs amongst my companions.

 

Good ol' terra firma has enough sphincters, loons, and PMS sufferers that I need to deal with on a monthly basis, thank you very much. I'd rather not spend too many of my recreational hours sorting out more of them in a non-violent fashion if such can be avoided.

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Go afield with a good attitude, with respect for the wildlife you hunt and for the forests and fields in which you walk. Immerse yourself in the outdoors experience. It will cleanse your soul and make you a better person.----Fred Bear

 

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Companions are "broken people"?  I hope that this isn't universal as I'd like to encounter at least a couple of potential companions with their heads screwed on straight.  :blink:

 

Then that would probably exclude Morte. :skull:

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Now i'm not sure, if you liked the post for the pun and then posted to add something, or you missed the pun and just like Morte. Or something else entirely . :S

1.13 killed off Ja2.

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Morte was still a less than perfect character.

Being a little odd or having a few quirks is all fine and good in a companion as it fleshes them out and makes them more believable. Whining "emos", however, will have me ejecting them from the party or killing them in short order depending on the general morality of my player character. I've always enjoyed the Planescape milieu, but there is a tendency amongst those who write fan fiction or create Planescape modules to let things become too grim and craptastic. Life isn't all razorvine and the Hive, after all. Edited by Tsuga C

http://cbrrescue.org/

 

Go afield with a good attitude, with respect for the wildlife you hunt and for the forests and fields in which you walk. Immerse yourself in the outdoors experience. It will cleanse your soul and make you a better person.----Fred Bear

 

http://michigansaf.org/

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Broken characters need not be "whining emos."

 

I'd argue many of the characters in Torment were broken in some way (maybe not Nordom and Ignus, although I never really played with Ignus), while none of them are really whining emos.

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I'd argue that companion brokenness was one of the main themes of PST really, along with how the brokenness was generally 'your' fault in some way, illustrating how much damage the deal with Ravel had done.

 

Nordom was a broken Modron, hence the reversed name- and actually having a name- and while it was not as explicit a brokenness as Fall From Grace was with respect to being a Succubus (ie celibate lawful good rather than, er, promiscuous chaotic evil) it was still there as he should have been a personalityless cog. I'd tend to parallel Ignus with Sion from KOTOR2 in terms of brokenness as well, more literally broken than figuratively so. He is, after all, a big vengeful ball of fire and pain due to your betrayal/ manipulation.

 

Vhailor would arguably be the one who isn't broken- unlike Nihilus, his K2 counterpart- as he's just a logical progression of his type of belief in a place where to an extent belief does shape reality. Even there though he's the one who you can talk to death by showing the contradictions at his core and that he isn't actually infallible, literally breaking him.

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Agreed on all counts.

 

I don't know much at all about Ignus, and Nordom was also a lesser used character as well, so I happily concede those points.


Though, when the game is called "Torment" I don't really find it that surprising.

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The more I am reading it here about original PST, the more and more I want to replay it... But with my huge backlog accumulated over last 6 months and my almost non existant free time... *sighs*

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Nordom was a broken Modron, hence the reversed name- and actually having a name- and while it was not as explicit a brokenness as Fall From Grace was with respect to being a Succubus (ie celibate lawful good rather than, er, promiscuous chaotic evil) it was still there as he should have been a personalityless cog.

I believe he has a chaotic neutral alignment to further highlight how from a modron perspective he is broken, since they are ruled by rationality and chaotic is anathema to their existence.

 

It was very much a theme with PS:T, yes. I don't think Vhailor is much of an exception, but that might depend on perspective. He is a belief given shape but that belief is so unforgiving and unremitting that that becomes a brokenness in its own right.

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We have an interview with project director Kevin Saunder and creative lead Colin McComb on GameBanshee.

 

Keep in mind that it took a bit of back and forth and revisions but it was largely written before the latest updates, so some questions might read slightly weird in light of the info we already know now. Should be an interesting read, though!

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All right, all right ... I must be in a good mood or something. I put in my small fund for the game/soundtrack tier. Never played the original game so it's mostly a "I want to show support for good KS gaming projects" gesture, but who knows...maybe it'll end up as my new fave game. :biggrin:

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All right, all right ... I must be in a good mood or something. I put in my small fund for the game/soundtrack tier. Never played the original game so it's mostly a "I want to show support for good KS gaming projects" gesture, but who knows...maybe it'll end up as my new fave game. :biggrin:

Pretty sums up my feeling to Divinity Kicsterter.  Guess I'd do the same to the project by Larian Studios.

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Update 11 - Nathan Long talks story


 

 

 

TL;DR: Nathan Long tells a story (video). Five Fathoms deep. Dust and Water concept by Andree Wallin. Collaboration with Obsidian Entertainment. 2D pre-rendered graphics.
Hi Forgotten Ones,
 
Thanks to you, we had a record-breaking debut at the beginning of the month. With the announcements of Pat Rothfuss and Chris Avellone last week, we sailed past Wasteland 2’s total of nearly $3M. You’ve seen how great Wasteland 2 is coming along. We’ll have even more resources for Torment.
 
In the early morning of March 6th we had no way of knowing how powerful your response would be. We were humbled and inspired by your outpouring of support. And as we come upon our final week, we again do not know what to expect. Perhaps RPG fans will surprise us a second time. Whatever the outcome, we can assure you that Torment will provide a powerful, profound role-playing experience – you’ve already ensured that. But just how far we’ll be able to take it depends on all of you.
 
We have a couple surprises left. We hope you'll enjoy them.
 
Nathan Tells a Story (several, in fact)
 
In our Tales of Torment episodes, we’ve talked about many aspects of the game’s creative elements. Writer and designer Nathan Long (also a Wasteland 2 designer) brings all of those pieces together, explaining how we use these components to craft an RPG story. He talks about this in the context of possible subplots within a small section of the Bloom. This episode is a bit longer than most, but I think you'll find it’s worth it. =)
 
Fathoms
 
The ranks of the Forgotten have grown to over 57,000, thus bringing us five Fathoms deep in the Castoff’s Labyrinth. And we’re already 1/3 of the way to Fathom six! We’ll also add a bonus Fathom to the Castoff’s Labyrinth when we reach 10,000 Likes on our Facebook page, so spread the word!
 
Some of you have wondered if the Castoff’s Labyrinth will play such a strong role in the game, and be such a cool location, that it could even encourage players to die on purpose. We won’t design it that way. =) Like every area in the game, it has its part to play in the narrative, in your story. Its exact role will be part of your legacy – but it’s just a part, and it will vary based upon your choices, your priorities.
 
We’ve been expanding the Labyrinth both through Stretch Goals and by going into deeper Fathoms, which might give the impression that it’ll cover a majority of your game time. But while death is very relevant to legacy, abandonment, and mystery, death on its own isn’t one of our themes. The Castoff’s Labyrinth will absolutely be an exciting and awe-inspiring area, both for you to play and for us to design. =) But it’s just one small component of the full game, and not by any means the most exotic aspect we have planned.
 
It's also worth noting that Dana Knutson’s concepts aren’t necessarily literal representations of the Labyrinth's size or contents – your mind is malleable and the pathways it houses change and shift under your feet. Who can say what lies within its deepest recesses?
 
Collaborating with Obsidian on Tech
 
As you know, we’ve been working on Wasteland 2 in Unity and will be implementing Torment in Unity as well. Meanwhile, about 20 minutes away, Obsidian Entertainment is creating Project Eternity, also in Unity. Though there are major differences between our games, there are also similarities as all are RPGs built in the same engine. As many of you have suggested, it only makes sense that we collaborate where we can.
 
We are happy to announce that we at inXile and the great guys over at Obsidian have reached an agreement to share tools and technology when it makes sense. This will allow both companies to be more cost-effective on these projects, allowing your pledges to go further in terms of creating art, content, gameplay, and game polish. Vive le classic RPG revolution!
 
Another Major City
 
You’ve already seen Sagus Cliffs, which will be a major hub in the game. As part of an upcoming Stretch Goal, we’ll be adding the Oasis of M’ra Jolios as another prominent city location. Here’s Andree Wallin’s concept, Dust and Water, of this complex and bizarre urban ecosystem (wallpaper versions will be available soon at our website):
 
 
A gigantic dome of water shimmers in the middle of a vast desert, seemingly impervious to the cruel rays of the sun's heat. Curved obelisks from another age rise from the sands to cup and surround the bubble like gentle fingers.
 
This impossible oasis is home to numerous kinds of water-breathing abhumans. Some sport fins for legs like merpeople, some wear flippers for hands, while others appear almost human, being marked with only a dorsal fin from their head to their waist. No two are quite the same. Indeed, some are immigrants from far away, come to this aquatic utopia through strange pathways in reality.
 
But humans live here too, mostly for trade or work. They use various numenera to breath underwater – implantable gills, breathing apparatuses, portable air bubbles, and so forth. A town of air-breather buildings has grown up around the outside of the dome. These air-breathers are reliant on the dome, as most of their food (and all of their water) comes from within, but they make a good trade in the unique foods, animals, and textiles grown under the water. And of course visitors can find multiple shops in the air-breather town that will provide the varied numenera they need to enter the dome themselves.
 
Miscellaneous
 
April Fools’ Day
 
We’ll have a significant Update for you on Monday. It just so happens that’s April Fools’ Day. Rest assured that our Update will be real. =)
 
Video Q&A
 
We’ve opened a new Q&A forum on UserVoice. Post and vote for your biggest questions and Colin will make a video that answers some of the top voted ones. Ask away!
 
Closing Party
Just a reminder that if you want to celebrate with us at our closing party on Friday, April 5th beginning at 2 PM PDT, please login at tormentRPG.com and let us know – we’re looking to finalize the guest list today. We plan to broadcast live from the event and will send information next week on how to watch.
 
Some Words on Graphics
 
I’ve advertised that we’d say more about graphics this week. The most popular Stretch Goal request from you, our backers, is for 2D pre-rendered graphics, which would mean that Torment would have a fixed, isometric camera with 2D backgrounds. A primary disadvantage is that this approach requires a longer, and therefore more expensive, pipeline for art assets, but its advantages are numerous:
 
The same basic feel as classic RPGs (such as the Baldur’s Gate series and Planescape™: Torment) in terms of camera and environments
Environments will have a more “painterly” look, allowing us to more closely represent our concept pieces
By designing the art for a fixed camera view, every scene will look its best
System requirements will be lower
Because we are using a 3D engine, characters, effects, and some environmental props would still be modeled in 3D. This allows them to be changed dynamically during play (a 3D box could be opened, for example) and enables us to still adapt Wasteland 2 pipelines and underlying systems (such as for character animation).
 
A famous recent example of this approach in practice is the screenshot released by Obsidian for Project Eternity last fall. We agree with you that it would be the best way to realize our vision for Torment and have been investigating its feasibility throughout this Kickstarter campaign.
 
We’ve been carefully evaluating the costs and trade-offs, and it looks like a 2D pre-rendered graphics approach may be possible. We'll be showing you an example of what we intend, so you'll be able to see for yourselves why we're so excited about this approach. Being able to achieve this quality bar is only an option because of your great support – we are thrilled at the possibility that Torment could be as strong in its aesthetics as it will be in its storytelling and choices and consequences.
 
So what exactly will a Torment environment look like in-game? For that, I’ll have to ask for your patience a little longer – stay tuned next week!
 
Kevin Saunders
Project Lead


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Ooh, that second city (bottom picture) looks pretty awesome. I do hope they go the 2D backgrounds with 3D characters route, like Project: Eternity, and it makes all the sense in the world for the two companies to share tech and collaborate whenever it makes sense. If it saves both projects money and makes more efficient use of technology, I'm all for it.

8)

Edited by Keyrock
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...while none of them are really whining emos.

Good to know. This is my sliding scale of social puissance/maladaption: Well Adjusted > Quirky > Odd > Bizarre > Broken > Useless. As such, when I heard "broken" my mind conjured up visions of a lot of hand holding and other such aggravating nonsense. I don't envision very many of my characters as shrinks or social workers, so I found that word alarming.

 

Edit: typo.

Edited by Tsuga C

http://cbrrescue.org/

 

Go afield with a good attitude, with respect for the wildlife you hunt and for the forests and fields in which you walk. Immerse yourself in the outdoors experience. It will cleanse your soul and make you a better person.----Fred Bear

 

http://michigansaf.org/

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Good to know. This is my sliding scale of social puissance/maladaption: Well Adjusted > Quirky > Odd > Bizarre > Broken > Useless. As such, when I heard "broken" my mind conjured up visions of a lot of hand holding and other such aggravating nonsense. I don't envision very many of my characters as shrinks or social workers, so I found that world alarming.

 

There was no hand holding in Planescape Torment. Even the times when you assisted/guided npcs on their personal journey to less-brokeness, it was very much optional, far from having a whining Alistair forced onto you and took more the form of discovering a neat new facet.

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Got the latest update, and I'm considering asking for my money back. NOT IMPRESSED.

I mean the example story given, is a steaming no, screaming pile of ****. Obvious and trite.

 

Mr. Long doesn't inspire me with confidence either. His resume speaks against him.

Edited by JFSOCC
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EH, he has likely pledged to contribute.  That his account hasn't been charged yet is mostly just semantics.

 

I haven't been following the updates, but I am somewhat curious what is in that video now.... Hahaha.

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Mr. Long doesn't inspire me with confidence either. His resume speaks against him.

 

 

Is that the Black Library / Games Workshop "author" who's one novel I tortured myself with I threw in the recycling bin?

Then it's part of the reason I am very reluctant with pledging myself.

Going to read through all the updates carefully and possibly pledge a few minutes before the end of the campaign.

Edited by melkathi

Unobtrusively informing you about my new ebook (which you should feel free to read and shower with praise).

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so one bad writer out of a dozen means the whole project is doomed?

 

internet critics so critical


Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete.

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