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Some changes are necessary


kronos1221

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Dear Obsidian entertainment, I was recently playing fallout new vegas and I think a few changes nees to be made

1. for The House Always Wins V quest you should add it were the Mr. House ignores the BoS, it kinda ticked me off that you had to destroy the brotherhood of steel

2. for the quest For the Republic Part 2, the NCR and Mr. house should be able to have some kind of diplomatic solution so both sides are happy, because I really liked both factions and I wanted them to work together

3.There should be a choice in he game where some major factions are able to join sides for example Yes Man is able to work under Mr House command or NCR and Mr.House are able to have a treaty, There should be more diplomatic solutions in the game.

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There must be consequence in choice, and there must be consistency in characterization. I don't disagree with the specifics. I think the design team could have found a way to work with your demands, but I don't think the demands, in a larger sense, would have improved the game. For the choices to be meaningful, there should not always exist a pleasant outcome for all or even both sides. Moreover, real life is far more harsh. Games manage to provide a lot of good endings for players in situations where, realistically, a person would just be screwed.

 

I don't mind games giving players who work hard for good solutions a chance to achieve the best result possible, but I don't think games should get to the point where everyone ends up happy. Not in an RPG. Not in an Obsidz RPG.

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I guess the closets possible thing to NOT killing Mr. House is disabling him, but what i don't like is that you lose karma for disabling him or disconnecting him.

But still I think there should be a choice, unless Obsisian Entertainment adds him in Fallout 4 if you didn't kill him or something of that nature.

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You need to consider the psychology of Mr House : for him, both NCR and Brotherhood are a threat for New Vegas. When he identifies threats, he doesn't hesitate to eliminate such threats. It's like business.

Since he knows that a peace agreement with one or the other would only be temporary (one day they would be sufficently powerful to overpower Houses robots), he'd rather destroy definitively the threats than keeping the Damocles sword above his head.

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Yeah, to be honest the whole Brotherhood or House choice was huge for me, it really bothered me that House wanted me to take them out. In the end it turned me against him.

 

And really that is why I love Obsidian. They create difficult moral dilemmas in their games, and they do so gracefully.

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Dear Obsidian entertainment, I was recently playing fallout new vegas and I think a few changes nees to be made

1. for The House Always Wins V quest you should add it were the Mr. House ignores the BoS, it kinda ticked me off that you had to destroy the brotherhood of steel

2. for the quest For the Republic Part 2, the NCR and Mr. house should be able to have some kind of diplomatic solution so both sides are happy, because I really liked both factions and I wanted them to work together

3.There should be a choice in he game where some major factions are able to join sides for example Yes Man is able to work under Mr House command or NCR and Mr.House are able to have a treaty, There should be more diplomatic solutions in the game.

 

... Like Sawyer said in regard to his NV mod, New Vegas is over. That ship has sailed. Nobody's working on it anymore, the proverbial lights are off, doors closed, offices cleaned out, etc. Nothing is going to change from the complete/GOTY edition except for modding. You are barking up a tree stump with the mistaken belief that it is a standing tree.

 

Which is all tangential to the fact that you're wrong on all counts simply because the game was written as it was because that was the story and those were the characters Obsidian wanted to convey. They didn't accidentally get their own characters wrong from the Akashic Record versions that exist in the universe that they're simply acting as mediums to express, they created the characters and designed the game as they saw fit.

 

Mr. House clearly states that the NCR would invade the Strip if Caesar's Legion weren't a bigger threat, he clearly states that the Brotherhood of Steel is a threat, their only concern is keeping the flashiest toys out of everyone's hands but their own, and House has got some of the flashiest toys around. The BoS would kill House and then hoard his tech without recognizing the fact that House himself is far more valuable an asset than the tech he's produced, because he designed and produced it. House, again, states with crystal clarity that he had sent Securitrons to the area of the BoS bunker and they were all attacked and destroyed. The BoS has no interest in making contact with house to learn from one of the greatest minds of the pre-war world.

 

Yes Man was designed to be a threat to House. Why would House want the ONE thing that can take his fledgling empire away anywhere near him? Every Securitron is already programmed to follow his will, Yes Man will do whatever anyone tells him. How does that benefit House in any way? And finally, House and the NCR already have a treaty and he explains its terms clearly.

 

Your ideas are just bad. If you don't like House wanting the BoS, a legitimate threat to his position, destroyed, don't side with House. You can't have everything your way.

 

Yeah, to be honest the whole Brotherhood or House choice was huge for me, it really bothered me that House wanted me to take them out. In the end it turned me against him.

 

And really that is why I love Obsidian. They create difficult moral dilemmas in their games, and they do so gracefully.

 

It was House's appraisal of the BoS that turned me against them. The fundamental basis of their beliefs is flawed ("energy weapons destroyed the world, we will prevent that from happening again!" no, they didn't, 20th century technology destroyed the world, what does that have to do with stealing pew pew laser guns from everyone who's not part of your secret club?) Especially note the way he remarks that they don't raid old hospitals for Auto-Docs and advanced medical technology. They're just a tribe of raiders who possess and worship high-tech weapons. They steal those weapons from anyone who's not part of their secret club out of a religious fervor and jealous attempts to maintain their position of "superiority" over the "savages."

Edited by AGX-17
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it's pointed out through history and dialogue a few times that NCR aggressively expand and assimilate the same way Caesar's Legion does, and the NCR bite more than they can chew. It would have made sense after upgrading the Securitrons for the NCR to back off, as they'd do with the Boomers, as you can do with the BoS, but it's pretty much inevitable that New Vegas, the BoS, and the Boomers will get annexed if NCR win. Negotiating a better treaty would have been acceptable to the NCR if the alternative is them being kicked out or wiped out, so that New Vegas isn't colonized and made a vassal.

 

House is a tyrant, of course he's going to want to exterminate the BoS because they're powerful, and House wouldn't admit to himself that he needs the Courier, so he'd probably turn against the Courier anyway if the Courier denied him. Yes Man also serves no purpose to House, and is a legitimate threat to him. Same with the NCR, they're a threat. House will try to eliminate the threats to his plans for New Vegas, the only way to keep him is to lock him up in a closet Deus Ex style.

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I accidentally insulted House on my playthrough (asked for more cash or somesuch), causing all the robots to go hostile. Being pretty durable but lacking the firepower to kill him, I ran around his pad for a while (since I think the exit is disabled) until I stumbled upon him and killed him. Ah well, that's what being a cheapskate over a few hundred caps while being a millionaire gets you.

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I accidentally insulted House on my playthrough (asked for more cash or somesuch), causing all the robots to go hostile. Being pretty durable but lacking the firepower to kill him, I ran around his pad for a while (since I think the exit is disabled) until I stumbled upon him and killed him. Ah well, that's what being a cheapskate over a few hundred caps while being a millionaire gets you.

 

He's not going to pay you millions or even tens of thousands of caps because that would break the game economy. It's about game design and balance, not House being an a-hole (still not a four letter word, Obsidian naughty language filter.) That's why they dramatically reduced casino payouts with one of the updates. I used to roll into the strip with 9-10 luck and walk out with about 200,000 caps because you could get upwards of 50,000 caps per casino. All you needed was a jackpot on the slots with a maximum bet to get around 40k caps. For a typical wasteland nobody 1000 (or 1250) is a lot of caps, and unless you've been really busy with faction jobs, you're generally walking in as a nobody in the eyes of all the factions of the Mojave. Except Mr. House, who sees your potential and your value.

 

Besides, it's necessary to continue the main quest, which is more pressing than what the reward is.

Edited by AGX-17
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Dear Obsidian entertainment, I was recently playing fallout new vegas and I think a few changes nees to be made

1. for The House Always Wins V quest you should add it were the Mr. House ignores the BoS, it kinda ticked me off that you had to destroy the brotherhood of steel

2. for the quest For the Republic Part 2, the NCR and Mr. house should be able to have some kind of diplomatic solution so both sides are happy, because I really liked both factions and I wanted them to work together

3.There should be a choice in he game where some major factions are able to join sides for example Yes Man is able to work under Mr House command or NCR and Mr.House are able to have a treaty, There should be more diplomatic solutions in the game.

 

... Like Sawyer said in regard to his NV mod, New Vegas is over. That ship has sailed. Nobody's working on it anymore, the proverbial lights are off, doors closed, offices cleaned out, etc. Nothing is going to change from the complete/GOTY edition except for modding. You are barking up a tree stump with the mistaken belief that it is a standing tree.

 

Which is all tangential to the fact that you're wrong on all counts simply because the game was written as it was because that was the story and those were the characters Obsidian wanted to convey. They didn't accidentally get their own characters wrong from the Akashic Record versions that exist in the universe that they're simply acting as mediums to express, they created the characters and designed the game as they saw fit.

 

Mr. House clearly states that the NCR would invade the Strip if Caesar's Legion weren't a bigger threat, he clearly states that the Brotherhood of Steel is a threat, their only concern is keeping the flashiest toys out of everyone's hands but their own, and House has got some of the flashiest toys around. The BoS would kill House and then hoard his tech without recognizing the fact that House himself is far more valuable an asset than the tech he's produced, because he designed and produced it. House, again, states with crystal clarity that he had sent Securitrons to the area of the BoS bunker and they were all attacked and destroyed. The BoS has no interest in making contact with house to learn from one of the greatest minds of the pre-war world.

 

Yes Man was designed to be a threat to House. Why would House want the ONE thing that can take his fledgling empire away anywhere near him? Every Securitron is already programmed to follow his will, Yes Man will do whatever anyone tells him. How does that benefit House in any way? And finally, House and the NCR already have a treaty and he explains its terms clearly.

 

Your ideas are just bad. If you don't like House wanting the BoS, a legitimate threat to his position, destroyed, don't side with House. You can't have everything your way.

 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

I get that players want a plethora of choices available to them, but sometimes it goes overboard because the choices conflict with the beliefs of those characters involved. The OP's wishes, IMO, are a case of this.

"Console exclusive is such a harsh word." - Darque

"Console exclusive is two words Darque." - Nartwak (in response to Darque's observation)

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I accidentally insulted House on my playthrough (asked for more cash or somesuch), causing all the robots to go hostile. Being pretty durable but lacking the firepower to kill him, I ran around his pad for a while (since I think the exit is disabled) until I stumbled upon him and killed him. Ah well, that's what being a cheapskate over a few hundred caps while being a millionaire gets you.

 

He's not going to pay you millions or even tens of thousands of caps because that would break the game economy. It's about game design and balance, not House being an a-hole (still not a four letter word, Obsidian naughty language filter.) That's why they dramatically reduced casino payouts with one of the updates. I used to roll into the strip with 9-10 luck and walk out with about 200,000 caps because you could get upwards of 50,000 caps per casino. All you needed was a jackpot on the slots with a maximum bet to get around 40k caps. For a typical wasteland nobody 1000 (or 1250) is a lot of caps, and unless you've been really busy with faction jobs, you're generally walking in as a nobody in the eyes of all the factions of the Mojave. Except Mr. House, who sees your potential and your value.

 

Besides, it's necessary to continue the main quest, which is more pressing than what the reward is.

 

I'm well aware of the metagame reasoning behind it, just pointing out the amusing (in my own mind) result that in the end he died over a couple hundred caps because of his overreaction. :p

L I E S T R O N G
L I V E W R O N G

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Well if obsidian is not working on Vegas anymore, then there should at least be some sort of mod to fit people's needs of how they think things should have gone and when I said yes man should work for mr. House I meant as his litennaunt, and it was stated the yes man does whatever anyone tells him, how is that a problem for mr. House? He could help mr. House without any back talk and for the BoS it was actually suppose to be added in the game where mr house could leave the BoS alone but was never added to the final version of the game( there is mod for their alliance though) but I think me. House should have been a representative of New Vegas so both sides could agree, or Covince the ncr to leave mr. House alone, a dimplomatic solution of sort. But if obsidian is not working on NV anymore then maybe they should add them to fallout 4

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There are metagame reasons that Mr. House won't accept Yes Man, but the logical reasons suffice for me.

 

I agree with Humanoid, if we look at it logically, Mr. House would be willing to pay much much more. I agree with AGX that sometimes players have to be willing to suspend disbelief in order to accomodate a workable game story.

 

In this case, we don't need to overlook anything. There's really nothing Yes Man can do that Mr. House can't do just as well and probably better. Yes Man is a mobile Mr. House. Mr. House's enforcer created Yes Man in order to do the things that only Mr. House could do up to that point. Mr. House doesn't need a mobile self who could be caught and turned against him. He needs to replace his enforcer who actually did turn against him. The idea that Mr. House use Yes Man is probably the worst request of your original post, Kronos. I'm not trying to put you down, just saying that logically there would be no reason.

 

However, I will own that I thought it was sad to make the choice about the Brotherhood of Steel. There could actually be reasons for Mr. House to make some overtures towards the BoS, although I frankly think there's a case to be made that he wouldn't bother because of their history, but he might try to find a way to use them. I still wouldn't want Obsidz to change how they designed it. There have to be tough decisions in order to make the choices mean anything in the game world.

Fionavar's Holliday Wishes to all members of our online community:  Happy Holidays

 

Join the revelry at the Obsidian Plays channel:
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Remembering tarna, Phosphor, Metadigital, and Visceris.  Drink mead heartily in the halls of Valhalla, my friends!

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After you kill House, you'd think the PC would be the controller of the Securitrons and the Strip. House was getting half of everything sold on the Strip, he was also probably getting a percentage from the casinos. I would have liked more options in how the PC as an independent could leverage the soft and hard power at their command, an army of securitrons, a massive fortune. If the PC kicked the NCR off of the dam then they could sell electricity to the NCR. The PC could wipe out the three major slaving or raiding factions, Khans, Legion, and Fiends. Alliances with the Boomers, BoS, and Kings could have provided at least some security. Supporting the Followers with major resources. I think the independence ending was a bit too bleak when you hear what happens to the Followers, how violent and unstable Vegas is. The NCR ending is a little too good considering what corrupt authoritarian **** ups they are, can't even defeat the fiends or legion, considering the PC managed to do that virtually by themselves. I was not pleased when I first found out that my independent Vegas was worse than a NCR controlled Vegas.

 

The endings are pretty awesome though. I would have liked to have been able to tell Veronica to go to the Sierra Madre instead of wandering the wastes alone. Dead Money's ending left me cold, that would be an incredible turn around, having that ending after how terrible they had it, how sad and lonely their endings are.

Edited by AwesomeOcelot
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Cantousent what I'm trying to say is why would it be bad for yes man to work under mr house? Yes man does whatever you tell him to do, I also think that obsidian did a great job with their endings and such but what I'm trying to say is that it ticked me off that there was no diplomatic solution for the ncr and mr house

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Cantousent what I'm trying to say is why would it be bad for yes man to work under mr house? Yes man does whatever you tell him to do, I also think that obsidian did a great job with their endings and such but what I'm trying to say is that it ticked me off that there was no diplomatic solution for the ncr and mr house

 

It would be bad for Yes Man to work for Mr. House because Mr. House has no use for him, and he's useless unless Mr. House is dead. Yes Man is House's single greatest threat, because he's the one securitron AI House can't control, and the one AI that can do everything he does. House would do anything to have him eliminated. Even if he did work for House, ANYBODY can tell him what to do. He would be more of a liability than a help. Tell him all of House's secrets, his weaknesses, his strengths, his plans? You can't just tell him not ttt ell anybody, to ignore others, because that conflicts with his programming, how he HAS to obey anyone. Send him on a top-secret mission, someone can easily ask "What are you doing?" and he would spit it all out.

 

House and the NCR can't have a diplomatic solution because the NCR wants New Vegas and Hoover Dam, and so does House. They have conflicting interests, and the NCR will never stop until they have taken over both New Vegas and the Dam. The only reason you can convince them to leave in the first place is because they know that they can't survive another war with their current condition. They can't strike a deal with House, because House controls the entire New Vegas Strip, and he's not one to share his dreams with a greedy upstart Republic.

Edited by Yes Man

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Well if obsidian is not working on Vegas anymore, then there should at least be some sort of mod to fit people's needs of how they think things should have gone and when I said yes man should work for mr. House I meant as his litennaunt, and it was stated the yes man does whatever anyone tells him, how is that a problem for mr. House? He could help mr. House without any back talk and for the BoS it was actually suppose to be added in the game where mr house could leave the BoS alone but was never added to the final version of the game( there is mod for their alliance though) but I think me. House should have been a representative of New Vegas so both sides could agree, or Covince the ncr to leave mr. House alone, a dimplomatic solution of sort. But if obsidian is not working on NV anymore then maybe they should add them to fallout 4

 

Oh well there should be a mod abloobloobloo. Stop it with this sense of entitlement. You don't get to have everything your way. Learn to mod and script and make your own if it's so dear to you.

 

That still won't make it canon, though.

 

And why would House want Yes Man as his "liutenant"? That's what the Courier is. The Courier is a free agent with free will, and anyone could come along and tell Yes Man to sabotage House's plans in some way and he'd do it because he's programmed to do whatever ANYONE tells him to. House's Securitrons ALREADY are programmed to do only what HOUSE says. Yes Man literally does not differ from any other securitron except that he's a MASSIVE SECURITY RISK.

 

How does that not compute in your head? Yes Man is essentially a trojan horse backdoor security risk whereas every other Securitron is perfectly... secure.

 

You might as well say people should download this Russian pirated game .iso because it's exactly the same as the retail game except for the keystroke logger that's included in the file. It'll be just as fun and helpful, too! If you were in medieval times, in a beseiged castle, when a plague-infested corpse gets trebuchet'ed over the wall, you'd tell everybody to give it a hug and take turns bedding down with it because it is just so trustworthy and useful.

 

And cite a source when you claim that there was supposed to be a House-BoS alliance that was cut from the game. Because I have never seen a shred of evidence of that. House's dialogue is crystal clear that the BoS is not going to tolerate him and he is crystal clear that he is not going to tolerate the BoS. All they do is harass and rob the people who are coming to Vegas to enrich House's burgeoning empire. House reaps no economic benefit from the BoS' presence. Literally zero benefit. The NCR is his cash cow. The BoS is an enemy of the NCR. The BoS is a threat to his revenue streams. House has no use for fanatical humans devoted to some crackpot tech-worship religion when they fire on sight when they spot his Securitrons.

 

And Obsidian is not making Fallout 4. The only rumors out are that Bethesda staff have been doing recon in Boston and at MIT. Strongly alluded to in Fallout 3. Obsidian has stated clearly that they are not making a Fallout game and they would love to do another one (as they are currently not doing one, they are doing a South Park game and Project Eternity.)

 

I realize that know, the ncr needs to stop running over people, like Marcus the mutant said that they will regret t, its how revolution starts. I wonder if thats a hint of what may happen in the next fallout game?

 

And if you play the game oriented toward NCR and doing good, the problems of the NCR will be mitigated. If you play Caesar's Legion, the NCR will be defeated in the Mojave. There are myriad possible endings and no established canon.

Edited by AGX-17
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Agx-17 I respect your opinion but re problem is I don't know how to make a mod there are no mod making 101s around, and also did you not here when I said I know, there is no reason to continue arguing about it when we agree on the same thing okidokie? I recently played the game again and beat every ending (except Caesars I truly contempt him) and when I beat the ncr ending I realized why people say they are soooooo corrupt as general lee Oliver at the end says (SPOILER ALERT) sometimes the ncr losses track while trying to follow its instincts until people like the courier come along and put it back on track, one more thing when I disconnected mr house, I wanted to see if the ncr actually kills him, so before the battle of Hoover Dam I went to the lucky 38 to see if he was still alive, in fact he was which must of meant that they forgot to kill him or they do it after the battle but idk because it never says it in the endings

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