83 replies to this topic

[godsend1989]

Maybe you guys can add the Harpers in the game, a badass organization that appears out of nowhere to restore balance at a crucial point in the game ( maybe before a great villain is killed or evil is too strong and its on rampage ).

I just like the ideea of secret mage organization that teleport near you ( 1 member or more ) out of nowhere doing some crazy spells that doesnt make any sense for the player at some point in the game, just an ideea.

[Isamael]

Much as I enjoy scheming wizard organisations and the like, the Harpers are a fictional organization native to the Forgotten Realms, this isn't a FR game.
I think what you are advocating is to have the player be confronted with/by a group and their schemes, possibly at semi-regular intervals throughout the story -
without understanding the ramifications of their actions until, (either through a big reveal, or simply when you figure it out yourself) there is a - pardon the expression -
brick-sh*tting experience as the pieces fall into place?

Or do you really simply want the harpers or a clone thereof in the game?
In case of the latter, put me down for "Not very tempting."

Edited by Isamael, 16 November 2012 - 05:05 AM.

[ShiftClick]

Ah, Sire! I must commend you on yet another excellently vague update!
Must say that I've been thoroughly enjoying these; albeit brieft, they're really quite informative. Also, positively giddy with excitement to see what else is to be revealed further along into development!


So, yeah.. Keep 'em coming!

[Hassat Hunter]

..Your alone

I just think that with 18 months to go, we get a bit too many updates. They just can't keep that up. And it would be better to be updated nearer release (when there is stuff), rather than so early in pre-production when there is barely naught to talk about. Unless they're fishing for story ideas like with armor ideas a few updates back, but I don't get a similar vibe here. Heck, I wouldn't even want them to listen to us here, with Avellone and Ziets already working on it and most likely doing a way better job of it than anyone here can.

Also, there are people who actually think cRPG writing and book writing is the same? Even with a choose-your-own-adventure type book that's hard to believe.

Just want to say an introverted journey (KOTOR2, PS:T) is much more prefered to me than "Epic" (*cough*) save the world from doom-stories. Although of course, it's probably not the same opinion the masses hold. Then again, kickstarter. It would be interesting to know what the status-quote about this is amongst backers (and not just forum members)...

[Keyrock]

For the record, it's almost impossible for a RPG story to be too political for me. I much prefer power struggles, conflicts, and betrayals both within kingdoms and between them, than "save the noble world from the awakened ancient evil".

[Hormalakh]

Just want to say an introverted journey (KOTOR2, PS:T) is much more prefered to me than "Epic" (*cough*) save the world from doom-stories. Although of course, it's probably not the same opinion the masses hold. Then again, kickstarter. It would be interesting to know what the status-quote about this is amongst backers (and not just forum members)...

no no you can't say that. you didn't want updates, so this update doesn't really pertain to you. they shouldn't take your input into account. :D see?

Edited by Hormalakh, 16 November 2012 - 07:57 AM.

[rjshae]

Thank you for the update.

[Tethros]

Something that I would like to see, that I haven't seen yet, is a set of non-linear good and evil paradigms. This was partially accomplished in AD&D by adding a law-chaos axis to the good-evil graph. But there is still overwhelmingly this idea that bad is bad and good is good. Perhaps a more complex reality based more on current conceptions of evil in social science would be interesting. For instance, evil isn't accomplished by evil people, but by people who are obedient to authority. Or that evil itself doesn't really exist at all, what really matters are interests.

To some degree, insofar as there must be conflict, there must be an "us" and a "them", but that doesn't necessitate the creation of a "good" and an "evil". What would be most interesting story-wise, would be to have all the various sides of the conflict be justifiable in some moderately reasonable light. And the evil in the world should be the aggregate cognitive error of many people doing small evils (like the evils of complacency, segmentation of responsibility, etc.), not the man in the top hat and the pointy mustache.

[Archmage Silver]

Nice update (#31). Not much content, but Josh had a mace. I have one as well. I've also got some other weapons like swords, daggers and an axe - no guns or projectile weapons though, they don't make for good replicas IMO.

[Quadrone]

Anyone think upgrades may be a bit too frequent?

I would rather like it when they could just, well, tell us stuff. Rather than mumble stuff. Just because there need to be weekly or so updates. While there is no clear definition of stuff.
Or am I alone there?

Yes and no. I don't think the updates are too frequent but I would like it as well if they could start telling us stuff.
I know they've all their hands full and are still in early concept phase but... just something little? A smidgen of lore, some rough ideas about the Aumaua or an example of those "...various small ideas, big ideas, minor tweaks, radical overhauls, and brand new storylines." that were mentioned in this update. It's fine if it's short.

I already said something like this in a previous thread and it didn't go over well, but these kind of updates are just too vague for me.
Not to be a stick in the mud but I'd prefer to hear stuff about PE and not about Obsidians general design philosophy.

Edited by Quadrone, 16 November 2012 - 10:46 AM.

[Brannart]

http://penny-arcade....story-structure[/url]

Wow something trashing Fall Out New Vegas and praising Fall Out 3. Blasphemy.

[Cantousent]

Anyone think upgrades may be a bit too frequent?

I would rather like it when they could just, well, tell us stuff. Rather than mumble stuff. Just because there need to be weekly or so updates. While there is no clear definition of stuff.
Or am I alone there?

Yes and no. I don't think the updates are too frequent but I would like it as well if they could start telling us stuff.
I know they've all their hands full and are still in early concept phase but... just something little? A smidgen of lore, some rough ideas about the Aumaua or an example of those "...various small ideas, big ideas, minor tweaks, radical overhauls, and brand new storylines." that were mentioned in this update. It's fine if it's short.

I already said something like this in a previous thread and it didn't go over well, but these kind of updates are just too vague for me.
Not to be a stick in the mud but I'd prefer to hear stuff about PE and not about Obsidians general design philosophy.

The way I see it is that the haven't been able to get more into the nitty-gritty of PE yet. So, the result is that they're giving us what they can, which won't satisfy folks who want more detailed information that they cannot, as yet, give. Since that's the case, you're essentially asking that they cease the interaction they can provide because you only want interaction they cannot. ...But you have a choice about reading these updates and, even if it doesn't tell you anything, it doesn't take anything from you either. On the other hand, if they follow your advice, folks like me who genuinely enjoy these updates won't get anything. ...And neither will you. So, keep pestering for more detailed information. I'm with you one hundred percent. Just try not to begrudge me the updates I enjoy reading at the same time. Just because they can't provide what everyone wants doesn't mean they shouldn't provide stuff that some folks want.

I'm not putting you guys down. It's more a matter of perspective. That, and I don't want them to get into spoilerish stuff. Backstory things are fair game and a certain level of story specificity are expected. I'm a grown up. I know I'm taking my chances coming here and I have to take my chances on getting something or another spoiled. I just want the to save a little something for the wedding night. So, at some point, I'm probably going to regret reading one or two updates and I can live with that. See, you're going to live with too much general info now and I'm going to live with getting some specifics I probably didn't want to know later but someone is going to get something out of each of these updates.

[Hormalakh]

http://penny-arcade....story-structure[/url]

Wow something trashing Fall Out New Vegas and praising Fall Out 3. Blasphemy.

LOL yeah... wanted to see how many people actually watch the links I send out. It does make some pertinent points though. I'm not sure if the EC staff has actually played FO1 and 2 though, so that might be part of the reason they're actually crazy.

[CheeseGraterSuicide]

I'll just leave this here.

5 Very Good Reasons to Punch a Dolphin in the Mouth

[Tychoxi]

You know you are something else when your job prescription includes playing Arcanum in 2013AD.

Edited by Tychoxi, 16 November 2012 - 02:11 PM.

[norolim]

Nice update, again. And i don't mind it being a bit vague. What I get from those frequent updatres is that Obsidian just want to stay in touch with us, give us something to think about and comment on. Good stuff.

Edited by norolim, 16 November 2012 - 02:32 PM.

[Parmenides]

As long as being evil doesn't necessarily mean being a jerk. Some evil people don't mind being nice when it benefits them, or when they are likely fo find that the person return the favor down the road. High charisma and all that.

I enjoyed the update. I don't need candy artwork and screenshots to hold me over. It will come when it's ready.

Edited by Parmenides, 16 November 2012 - 05:08 PM.

[TensaiOni]

http://penny-arcade....story-structure[/url]

Wow something trashing Fall Out New Vegas and praising Fall Out 3. Blasphemy.

LOL yeah... wanted to see how many people actually watch the links I send out. It does make some pertinent points though. I'm not sure if the EC staff has actually played FO1 and 2 though, so that might be part of the reason they're actually crazy.

I think it's just that EC have their favourite elements in game design and when a game is not doing it their favourite way (even if it's for a good reason, like in F:NV case), it's doing it wrong - in their opinion of course.

[Hormalakh]

I think it's just that EC have their favourite elements in game design and when a game is not doing it their favourite way (even if it's for a good reason, like in F:NV case), it's doing it wrong - in their opinion of course.

They're ultimately trying to take the genre to a new level. It's jut nobody is willing to risk that first, very risky step.

Edit: Oh and nobody wants to buy those kinds of games.

Edited by Hormalakh, 16 November 2012 - 06:06 PM.

[Thumister]

I enjoy stories that challenge preconcieved nottions about things (people, ideologies, history, etc.). As a GM, there's nothing I enjoy more than smashing my PCs preconcieved notions about a story elemet. We recently played a Babylon-5 adventure where the PCs had to infiltrate a cell of the Free Mars terrorist organization. They were expecting a bunch of rather stereotypical "crazy terrorists". Instead - I unabashedly ripped off part of the story line from Les Miserable which I knew none of them had seen and they were confronted with a bunch of disorganized college kids who saw themselves as liberators attempting to overthrow the oppressive Earthgov. Stories like Game of Thrones, Harry Potter, and The Full Metal Alchemist (which my players are all fans of) - have meant that I had to up my game as the GM and bring a lot more political intrigue to the party. When we were kids, we enjoyed smashing the orcs and piling up gold. As we've gotten older the campigns have become much more politically motivated. Smashing up orcs (or mechs) still works when we don't feel like thinking too hard. My larger point I guess, is that if you're going to make an M-rated game for people who played a lot of D&D when they were kids, I'd expect most of your older players to appreciate the political machinations more than the kids who will likely be playing the game in spite of the M rating. My players enjoy the opportunity to be heroes (or anti-heroes like Clint Eastwood). They prefer obvious moral delimmas (opportunities to behave good or evil) to moral delimmas where the outcome is ambiguous. They dislike choices between two or more equally bad outcomes (you can save the father or the mother but not both). They enjoy being able to set factions against each other. And as they've gotten older they enjoy playing weaker characters where they're awareded for more creative gameplay. One adventure, they were too weak to kill ogres digging up the graves in the graveyard so they came up with idea of bathing in whitewash, pretending to be ghosts, and attempting to scare the ogres away. That was totally not a solution I had come up with, so I gave it to them.