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I would hope to see prejudice where it makes sense for prejudice to have arisen—against females, males, elves, orlans, Vaelians, Aedyr, whatever. It adds a measure of believability to the setting wherever there's obvious fuel for this to happen and it's meaningful for those who would like to counteract it.

 

Without a publisher, it would be nice if nothing was sacred.

Edited by Saerain
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Also, for those of you confused about the problem of "realism" and why it matters in games (as in all media), I suggest Nathaniel Chapman's blog post on realism and verisimilitude:

 

http://forums.obsidi...f-expectations/

 

 

If someone chooses to have the men in full armour but the women in bikinimail and stilettos, as many games do, they're contradicting the rules of the world they've created, where it makes no sense why all of the men need to wear full armour but the women somehow don't.

 

Also, big, muscular men are not the equivalent of massively-breasted women in sexual poses and fetish gear. That's an example of false equivalence. The equivalent of big muscular men would be big muscular women.

 

2011-12-02-sexy.png

 

http://www.shortpack...lseequivalence/

Edited by Joukehainen
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The idea that, as a male, I fantasize about being a disgusting stubbly hulk thing, is what makes me uncomfortable. I'll take Hot Batman.

Edited by Saerain
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They should make the first or second city female dominated 8)

 

No.

 

They could certainly have a city (or tribal village), especially one populated by non-humans, in which females fulfill certain administrative roles. An advanced human matriarchal society would be ridiculous. This hasn't happened once in the history of mankind and there's pretty obvious reasons for that.

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They should make the first or second city female dominated 8)

 

No.

 

They could certainly have a city (or tribal village), especially one populated by non-humans, in which females fulfill certain administrative roles. An advanced human matriarchal society would be ridiculous. This hasn't happened once in the history of mankind and there's pretty obvious reasons for that.

 

‘Female dominated’ doesn't have to mean what you seem to assume here it would mean, and in a fantasy world surely you can imagine many ways it could happen. Especially once you get into non-humans and bring magic into it, but not necessarily.


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Lol feminist agenda

 

Hey, you made a comprehensive post here just to...what? Boob armor?

I'm not the one who designed that in the first place, but Obsidian.

I'm also not the one who backed off from that creative vision at the first intersection, because of a VERY loud minority.

And finally I didn't make a thread trying to discuss the *very important* issue of feminism being present/included in the game, which apparently seems to be one of the top issues along with romances instead of actually talking about game issues or design, look up in the topic title it's right there before you "lol" about it again.

 

The chip on your shoulder is more like a side order of fish and chips with a tray attached to your body.

 

You seem one of those guys that think you know what an RPG is and how people are caving to a new order.

 

And finally

 

LOL


Ka-ka-ka-ka-Cocaine!


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It'd be interesting to find a Sappho-like character somewhere in the world; a female Chanter who is talented and not easily characterized.

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"It has just been discovered that research causes cancer in rats."

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They should make the first or second city female dominated 8)

 

No.

 

They could certainly have a city (or tribal village), especially one populated by non-humans, in which females fulfill certain administrative roles. An advanced human matriarchal society would be ridiculous. This hasn't happened once in the history of mankind and there's pretty obvious reasons for that.

 

IjNeo.jpg

 

I am so done

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They should make the first or second city female dominated 8)

 

No.

 

They could certainly have a city (or tribal village), especially one populated by non-humans, in which females fulfill certain administrative roles. An advanced human matriarchal society would be ridiculous. This hasn't happened once in the history of mankind and there's pretty obvious reasons for that.

 

IjNeo.jpg

 

I am so done

 

Queen Victoria is not amused.

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[Quote

Queen Victoria is not amused.

 

You do realize that having a female queen once in a while has nothing to do with having a female dominated society?

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[Quote

Queen Victoria is not amused.

 

You do realize that having a female queen once in a while has nothing to do with having a female dominated society?

 

You do realise that when discriminated social groups, be they LGBT, an ethnic minority, women, etc seem "absent" from positions of power it is not evidence of their inferiority, but evidence of their oppression?

Edited by Joukehainen
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[Quote

Queen Victoria is not amused.

 

You do realize that having a female queen once in a while has nothing to do with having a female dominated society?

 

You do realise that when discriminated social groups, be they LGBT, an ethnic minority, women, etc seem "absent" from positions of power it is not evidence of their inferiority, but evidence of their oppression?

 

It's not evidence of anything other than their absence.

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[Quote

You do realise that when discriminated social groups, be they LGBT, an ethnic minority, women, etc seem "absent" from positions of power it is not evidence of their inferiority, but evidence of their oppression?

 

 

Your point being?

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With regards to the original topic, I say the dev's should go with whatever artistic style they want. If you don't like it, that's what mods are for.

Edited by Sykid

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It's not evidence of anything other than their absence.

 

Looks like someone needs to read up on their history. If you make it illegal for women to vote or own property or get an education for hundreds of years, that's going to have an impact when that ban is removed. Change will come but it won't be immediate, because society is full of unwritten rules and coda. If you're going to have slavery of certain ethnic groups be legal, that's going to likewise have far-reaching consequences past that law being changed.

 

Edit: But no, that alone isn't evidence, that's of course in conjunction with an overwhelming amount of scientifically verifiable data on wages, work hours, health care info, etc and qualitative data such as examining dominant social ideologies, prejudices, opinions, and how those are created and reproduced (for example, representation).

 

Your point being?

 

My point was exactly what I said.

Edited by Joukehainen
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Come again, a female dominated society? "What, kinky stuff? Yeah, I'm game."©

 

I would certainly no want such a thing. No matter the intentions, it will just end up being some perverted sexual fantasy come true. Very much like the DnD drow.

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Come again, a female dominated society? "What, kinky stuff? Yeah, I'm game."©

 

I would certainly no want such a thing. No matter the intentions, it will just end up being some perverted sexual fantasy come true. Very much like the DnD drow.

 

Good point! Then again, the Bosmer didn't turn out that way. Er, not until the mods hit... :p

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Looks like someone needs to read up on their history. If you make it illegal for women to vote or own property or get an education for hundreds of years, that's going to have an impact when that ban is removed. Change will come but it won't be immediate, because society is full of unwritten rules and coda. If you're going to have slavery of certain ethnic groups be legal, that's going to likewise have far-reaching consequences past that law being changed.

 

...

What Sykid said was correct. An absence from positions of power is, at face value, evidence of absence, nothing more. Everything beyond that requires interpretation and further evaluation.

 

 

My point was exactly what I said.

 

Define "inferiority". It can definitely be seen as evidence of an inferiority at reaching positions of power under the given circumstances. Please note that this is not necessarily "bad".

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[Quote

Queen Victoria is not amused.

 

You do realize that having a female queen once in a while has nothing to do with having a female dominated society?

 

I was making a joke but fine:

 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazons

Glory Season by David Brin is an interesting concept for a female-dominated, pastoral society. I could see a similar society existing based on magical manipulation. Have a read, you might enjoy it.


"It has just been discovered that research causes cancer in rats."

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Come again, a female dominated society? "What, kinky stuff? Yeah, I'm game."©

 

I would certainly no want such a thing. No matter the intentions, it will just end up being some perverted sexual fantasy come true. Very much like the DnD drow.

memes-and-it-felt-so-painful.jpg

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Everyone always forgets the Minoans. ;(

You shouldn't mention Minoans. With their women outfits I can foresee them becoming another fantasy iteration of a drow-like society. Only with bulls and double-sided axes this time around.

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...

What Sykid said was correct. An absence from positions of power is, at face value, evidence of absence, nothing more. Everything beyond that requires interpretation and further evaluation.

 

Everything is interpretation and evaluation. In order for you to even understand what you're looking at, your brain has to interpret and evaluate it. That's what science is - the evaluation of observations and the interpretation of that data. And when we interpret and evaluate things, we often unconsciously make associations based on what we were taught, how we were brought up, what ideas we were exposed to, etc; and part of that is going to be prejudices and assumptions that certain people are "inferior" as in worse than other people based on what social category the observer feels they are in. There is no such thing as complete objectivity, and there is no denying that we have institutionalised discrimination of different social groups.

 

Also, I think you missed my edit:

But no, that alone isn't evidence, that's of course in conjunction with an overwhelming amount of scientifically verifiable data on wages, work hours, health care info, etc and qualitative data such as examining dominant social ideologies, prejudices, opinions, and how those are created and reproduced (for example, representation).

Edited by Joukehainen
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