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BG fans counting  

148 members have voted

  1. 1. Count me in as a supporter of Baldur's Gate legacy

    • Yes
    • I like BG series, but don't want to be counted


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i like ALL the IE games, the BG saga included...

 

i even hope P:E has sequels were i can import my character and continue his story.

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Thanks HeedlessHorseman ! I guess steam and gog decided to drop NWN 2....

 

You're welcome. :)

 

I know that Steam had it for a short time (like a year). I am not sure if GOG ever had it though.

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Something really weird happened to NWN2, it was available for a really short time (couple of months) on the Mac App Store, and then it poofed. :shrugz:

 

I haven't actually played Baulder's Gate yet, so I'll get back to you after BG:EE comes out. Really looking forward to it.

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You should also try Amazon, which has a few random copies of NWN2 and expansions. You could get MOTB for like 2 dollars at times.

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BG series is badly written...or at least written in an extremely sloppy fashion, filled with poorly explained retcons and other such plot irritants. That doesn't mean it isn't a fantastic series, which it is. It just isn't fantastic because of its writing.

 

As for Bioware as a whole, the Bioware that made BG and BG2 is dead and buried. It died of a severe case of EA. RIP.

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Hamster is very happy to see 81 supporters of Baldur's Gate legacy on this forum.

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No to experimentation!

No to fixing that is not broken!

No to changes for the sake of change!

Do not forget basis of Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale and Planescape Torment. Just put all your effort to story, fine-tuning and quality control.

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BG series is badly written...or at least written in an extremely sloppy fashion, filled with poorly explained retcons and other such plot irritants.

 

can you give examples? I personally find the whole Bhaal Child story extremly interesting and dont think it was poorly written

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BG series is badly written...or at least written in an extremely sloppy fashion, filled with poorly explained retcons and other such plot irritants.

 

can you give examples? I personally find the whole Bhaal Child story extremly interesting and dont think it was poorly written

 

I also don't get this, I thought the narrative in BG2 was superlative


"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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For me Baldur's Gate will always have a soft corner in my heart. It had everything I wanted. Epic Fantasy, meaningful dialogue, satisfying combat (killing dragons was challenging and fun). Planescape is a thinking man's game, a philosophical jaunt in the woods. It tickles the brain cells and invites you to think on deeper subjects.

 

Both were fantastic games that allowed you to do different things in different settings. One does not make the other less so. They are both relevant and great games.

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I like Bioware games, I've played all of them except for TOR (because: MMO), they're on my short list of devs whose games I buy/play when they first come out, and they provide a high quality, polished-if-bland experience with a combination of action and roleplaying.

 

Having said that all that, there are numerous reasons why Obsidian games are consistently superior to anything Bioware has put out.

 

1. Bioware reuses structural and narrative elements repeatedly. 3 of their games (NWN, KotOR, and Jade Empire) are nearly exact retellings of the same story. It's safe, people like it, but it also comes across as intellectually and creatively lazy. On the other hand, Obsidian games are ambitious both narratively and mechanically. New Vegas is probably as close as anything in their catalog to being what I'd consider "safe" and it still managed to push the envelope of what is possible in a Bethesbryo game.

 

2. Obsidian stories, while arguably better written on the whole, provide a more fulfilling narrative experience because they emphasize the player's interaction with the story through real choices and consequences and non-superficial relationships with NPC's. NPC's in Obsidian titles provide the player with feedback on how he/she is playing the game, and come with fully fleshed out personalities, opinions, alignments, weaknesses, etc. that the player can interact with or manipulate. Bioware NPC's exist for the purpose of handing out sidequests, conforming to RPG archetypes, and satisfying awkward nerd sexual fantasies. In Obsidian games, the NPC's encourage roleplaying by behaving in believable ways to the player's dialog choices and in-game actions, creating intrigue through a system of influences and alignments. In Bioware games, being nice to people means you get to boink them later and/or they help/hinder you in some way. In Obsidian games, if the player does have a major impact on the world (New Vegas), the repercussions of his choices are widespread and varied. In Bioware games, you have a good ending or a bad ending, occasionally even a multi-colored ending, that reflects whether you chose the good dialog or the bad dialog.

 

3. Bioware games are epic fantasies where someone rises to a great challenge that threatens to destroy the world. Obsidian games are games about the player character's growth and generally limited impact on the world. In Bioware games there is a great evil that needs to be destroyed or aligned with, in Obsidian games the player deals with personal challenges that primarily center around the player character.

Edited by Jason Moyer
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BG was a fine game with lots of stuff never seen before, not as good as FO1 but good anyway.

BG2 improved what was good in BG1every way possible, maybe to same level as FO2 and maybe not.

PST had a good plot and I'm glad I got around to play it, but it's not as good as BG2 or FO2.

 

NWN had the finest game engine, only a decent OC but with tons of fan made modules

(some of which rival or surpass the games done by Bio or Obs) it's my all time favorite crpg.

 

ToEE, IWD, IWD2, fun combat romps. ToEE had the best looks before DA:O and the finest gameplay.

But they're not on the same plot level as the others (even NWN OC) so...

 

KotOR is better than anything before it, 2nd part is better in many ways but not as good overall package.

 

ME1 was great, but not as good as KotOR.

 

DA:O is better than KotOR or anything before it.

 

ME2, ME3, DA2 were all disappointments and I have no great expectations from Bio anymore.

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I think people just like to jump on bandwagons. It's cool to hate on Bioware in this forum.

 

ROFL. nice generalisation.

 

You'll find that in every discussion and poll since the Obsidian forums opened as well as the old BIS boards that the majority of people here preferred the BG games over the IWD games. Yes, you'll get some people that prefer IWD, but those people are in the minority.

 

For some reason people like to compare the two. eg. BG1 vs IWD1, BG2 vs IWD2. I find they're both very good and different games which I enjoy for different reasons.

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I love BG, I hate post-EA bioware games. I LOVED DA:O and ME1, but those games were in developement for years...

Edited by SeekDWay

Derpdragon of the Obsidian Order

Derpdragons everywhere. I like spears.

 

No sleep for the Watcher... because he was busy playing Pillars of Eternity instead.

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So we are to share our BW experience in this topic, right?

Baldur's Gate - I was pretty much late for the party with this game, playing it after both Fallouts and tons of other later RPGs. So for me it was absolutely unimpressive. Companions you can't really talk to, fetch side quests appearing in your journal automatically without asking if you are even interested in taking them, clunky combat etc. Stoped playing it right after arriving to the city of Baldur's Gate, so it was pretty late in the game I guess. Newer even started Baldur's Gate II. Looking how everyone is prizing those games pretty much everywhere I may give them another chance with Enhanced Editions.

Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic - really good game, yet not good enough to be awesome. KotOR2 blew it out of the water completely being much better in almost everything even in the butchered state it has been released at.

Jade Empire - characters were pretty dull and uninteresting, I newer liked how the word's philosophy has been handled so I stopped playing after completing like 70% of the game.

Mass Effect - solid good game. Not awesome, but pretty enjoyable.

Dragon Age: Origins - absolutely awesome, one of the best games I ever played.

Mass Effect 2 - big improvement over the first one. There were some flaws like killing and resurrecting the MC in first five minutes for lulz, but in overall it was awesome.

Dragon Age II - was rushed and full of obvious flaws like those cursed recycled areas everywhere (no one can argue with that). Enemies running in waves were also silly. Still I liked party interactions very much and the main plot was really good mostly, so it is a good game for me in the end. Not as good as it should have been, not superb, but also not terrible like a lot of people suggest.

Mass Effect 3 - worst game ever. People involved did bad and should feel bad. Also it was ruined by all the streamlining and autodialogues long before the ending.

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While I was always more a BIS game, yes, I do like Baldur's Gate.


"I'm a simple man, Hobbes."

"You?? Yesterday you wanted a nuclear powered car that could turn into a jet with laser-guided heat-seeking missiles!"

"I'm a simple man with complex tastes."

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I loved BG 1-2 with all their flaws, partly because of the Forgotten Realms setting, but also because of the general atmosphere/story in these games.

 

I find it pretty funny that people playing the game 10 years after its release critique gameplay and other aspects that are clearly linked to the time the game was published and which are "easy fix" issues. Why not talk about gameplay in Donkey Kong while we're at it ?

 

Also, lots of people extrapolating statements about BG to statements about BioWare as a whole.

 

I generally dislike post-EA BioWare, but what in the hell does that have to do with my appreciation of BG ?

 

Do we really have to get married with a brand ?

 

You should also try Amazon, which has a few random copies of NWN2 and expansions. You could get MOTB for like 2 dollars at times.

 

Nice ! I'll look into it.

Edited by atn

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I didn't realize Baldur's Gate needs an order of guardians. I thought everyone was overjoyed that Project Eternity is going to be similar to BG :p

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I'll throw my two cents in.

 

I think what I like most about BG and why I always come back to it is the atmosphere. The story is fairly generic and isn't consistently engaging. However, the art style, the music, the encounters, the "stuff" that you experience when playing the game is just excellent. It lost a bit of that for me in BG2, but BG2 was such a sexed up version of BG1 I was willing to let that loss of that special intangible something go.

 

PsT is probably my favorite of the bunch simple because the story is so engaging and the NPC interactions, at the time, were awesome (and are still pretty fun ;) )

 

IWD had a nice atmosphere, but in the end it's only a hack and slash game. I really wanted to beat IWD and IWD2, but I always just put it down and never finish.

 

Fallout 1-2 are masterpieces which I bring up here because of Tim Cain et al's involvement in eternity. These are masterpieces despite their not having aged well (Fallout 1 is full of windows 95isms). They had an engaging story, nice atmosphere, etc. Despite my love of the above titles I've probably replayed these the most - I'm a sucker for things with Tim Cain's name on them. I loved Arcanum too - which is a game more people should play just be sure to do it in turn based mode ;)

 

I was involved in the ALFA project for NWN and it was pretty dang sweet (although I didn't care for the sp-campaign). I didn't get the chance to pick up NWN2 :(

 

KOTOR 1-2 are fun games, although a bit stereotyped, and KOTOR 1 was pretty buggy in its day lol. I really came to love KOTOR 2 though because it was the first game where playing an evil character came naturally and was extremely rewarding.

 

DA:O was one of those games I thought I should have loved, and I played it through several times to find a way to like it - but it just never stuck. At the end of the day I couldn't help but feel the story should have gone in a much different direction. It had potential, and then said potential just evaporates.

 

ME1-2 were solid games. ME was a great game with bunches of needless tedium added in to pad out the game and that's pretty unfortunate. ME2 had an engaging story and the NPC development was solid (though a bit melodramatic and over-simplified) but my standards were dragged down by previous titles lol. So many years separate ME2 and PsT or the BGs.

 

Me3 and DA:II resulted in me writing a lot of hate mail to bioware. Me 3 was garbage right from the start - shepard ought to be arrested for stalking with all the eaves he's dropping. DA:II had no redeeming qualities whatsoever - they even managed to make the game look worse than the previous DA title. Despite my love for the people working at obsidian, I absolutely despise Bethesda's games, and I've always been really nervous about spending money on New Vegas - maybe i'll get bored over the next 2 years or somebody will convince me that it's all ok lol. I also give Pool of Radience (the remake) an honorable mention for being awful - because I never got to play it. I was one of the lucky folks who bought a copy that was bugged and copied itself over my windows .ini files - thus forcing me to reformat :(.

Edited by Gallenger

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