Jump to content

Welcome to Obsidian Forum Community
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

Poor beastiary, Unsatisfying Creature variety "Unacceptable".

Beastiary Creatures Wildlife Animals Monsters

  • Please log in to reply
82 replies to this topic

#41
BSoda

BSoda

    (3) Conjurer

  • Members
  • 157 posts
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
  • Deadfire Backer
  • Fig Backer
Monster variety ? Who cares about this stuff ?

Combat is just the filler between the good stuff, anyways.

#42
TrashMan

TrashMan

    Holy Avenger of the Obsidian Order

  • Members
  • 1523 posts
  • Location:Nabeshins afro
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer

Hearing that the list is "huge" gives me a good sense of security. I wonder what diabolical creations and artistic nightmares you've concocted for that menagerie you speak of... Hopefully things that surprise and appear unexpectedly...

Like the Spanish Inquisition?


Well played good Sir!

Well played!

#43
descalabro

descalabro

    (3) Conjurer

  • Members
  • 102 posts
  • Location:Portugal
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer

Monster variety ? Who cares about this stuff ?

Combat is just the filler between the good stuff, anyways.


Not really. Combat is very important, specially in a game where you control an up to 6 members party. Combat gives real meaning to gear, skills, gold, etc, and monster variety, more than visual variety, means tactical variety and gear variety. We must go back to those book/board games: imagine how boring it would be if every fight had the same monsters described. If combat is just filler why not go for an adventure game instead of a RPG?

I hope there will be a good variety of monsters with different methods to be defeated.

#44
descalabro

descalabro

    (3) Conjurer

  • Members
  • 102 posts
  • Location:Portugal
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
Well, with games like IWD2 and BG2 it was different: those games already had an enormous list of creatures available from previous IE games, whereas in this case they have to design and animate all of them from scratch.

To me what matters the most is that every visually different creature requires a different killing method/tactic, besides having a good deal of monsters which can be killed with normal weapons, I hope to see some really unique creatures akin to their geography too, and I also hope to see some really BIG monsters to defeat. Makes things all the more epic.

I wasn't very hopeful about how the game would look but I was positively surprised, so I'm trusting Obsidian on this matter too.

Edited by descalabro, 15 October 2012 - 04:16 AM.


#45
Kilroy_Was_Here

Kilroy_Was_Here

    (3) Conjurer

  • Members
  • 176 posts
  • Pillars of Eternity Silver Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer

Other than that, I'd be completely happy if all the opponents were humans. Wouldn't even need elves or dwarves.


Exactly! Who needs monsters when man is the most dangerous game...

#46
beerflavour

beerflavour

    (1) Prestidigitator

  • Members
  • 25 posts
  • Pillars of Eternity Silver Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
  • Deadfire Silver Backer
  • Fig Backer
If Obsidian got the time and resources they could add this terrible rodent from "Monty Python and the Holy Grail". You know that dangerous but fluffy white rabbit. *just kidding*

#47
nikolokolus

nikolokolus

    Bridge Troll of the Obsidian Order

  • Members
  • 1164 posts
  • Pillars of Eternity Silver Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer

Who needs dinosaurs???


Me! I want to ride a triceratops into battle while wearing nothing but a loincloth, screaming at the top of my lungs, alternating between flinging fireballs at my enemies and using the beast's massive head plate as a shield! Too much to ask? :p

Mega-flora could be cool... but only if there's a hot Poison Ivy lookalike, too...


With any luck there's a LARPing group out there somewhere just for you

;)

#48
SarcasmoTheGreat

SarcasmoTheGreat

    (1) Prestidigitator

  • Members
  • 23 posts

Anyone else here getting the feeling Obsidian is spreading themselves really thin with all this talk on BIG goals. And that Mega dungeons a WHOLE new story in itself if its the same creatures and monsters on "every" floor.

Yeah, Just imagine it. This big huge world filled with a miniscule amount of wildlife and fauna, that after like two hours of playing you'd have seen near everything? Does that sound fun?! I can see it now, they'll be all like, "We got bears,wolves, and boars, that's a wrap for wild animals". And lets not get started with a lackluster variety of undead(there's more then zombies and skeletons), but I'm sure some folks don't even want to see "that".

You know what I'd like to see, Maybe not as they are in our prehistoria... But I'd love to see dinosaurs, Yeah YOU can bet JURASS I'd like to see dinosaurs! Though once again I'm sure AGAIN people wouldn't want to see this either... Or better yet, how about some original Creations? Dungeons and Dragons was Bloated with the sort. From Carrion Crawlers, to Ankhegs, to Vrocks(You know, the demons)... And even I remember my first encounter with the now WAY overdone Gelatinous cube(still welcome sight)

Do people even care if their adventure is full of bizarre creatures? Maybe folks really do just want to kill the same things... Over and over and over... And never want to slay something truly Bizarre and monstrous... I'm sure Obsidian knows this too...

Do "you" care if they save their budget on this feature, and keep the creature variety limited to an amount countable on ones hands? If there were only "ten" creatures in the game(not including the main humanoid races), would that be something that hurts your enjoyment of this game?

Hell, What creatures would you be upset "not" seeing? Or better yet, what creatures would you "BE" upset seeing?


Did you play Icewind Dale or Baldur's Gate? Did you have fun? Were the worlds teeming with 12,000 types of flora and fauna?

#49
NerdBoner

NerdBoner

    (5) Thaumaturgist

  • Members
  • 463 posts
*ahem*

Will there be Dragons?
  • Wyrm likes this

#50
bronzepoem

bronzepoem

    Kung Fu Master of the Obsidian Order

  • Members
  • 393 posts
  • Location:China
  • Pillars of Eternity Gold Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
  • Deadfire Silver Backer
  • Fig Backer
Yes, that is a very important element. No good enemies, combats arenothing.


Good night everyone.

#51
kabaliero

kabaliero

    (4) Theurgist

  • Members
  • 323 posts
  • Location:Russia, Moscow
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
Sounds like TS bought D3.

#52
Rosveen

Rosveen

    Obsidian Order's Prophet of Woe

  • Members
  • 708 posts
  • Location:GdaƄsk
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
  • Lords of the Eastern Reach Backer
  • Deadfire Backer
  • Fig Backer

*ahem*

Will there be Dragons?

Dragons, dragons everywhere! :aiee:

Please, don't include them. Lizards are good, even dragonlings, but not full-sized dragons in yet another game.

#53
kabaliero

kabaliero

    (4) Theurgist

  • Members
  • 323 posts
  • Location:Russia, Moscow
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
Deathclaws! :devil:

But yeah. Dragons are alrdy pissin' every1 off.

Not mentioning that now every kid knows that they're nothing more than a primitive people's interpretation of ancient flying machines.

#54
Tamerlane

Tamerlane

    (8) Warlock

  • Members
  • 1125 posts
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
Cliff Racers.

I demand nothing but Cliff Racers.
  • Rosveen likes this

#55
WorstUsernameEver

WorstUsernameEver

    Arch-Mage

  • Members
  • 5869 posts
  • Location:Whateverland
  • Pillars of Eternity Silver Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
  • Deadfire Backer
  • Fig Backer

Cliff Racers.

I demand nothing but Cliff Racers.


How about respawning cliff racers??!!


#56
Kurumi Morishita

Kurumi Morishita

    (1) Prestidigitator

  • Members
  • 27 posts
  • Location:Kuldahar
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
Yes.. NO Dragons and NO Demons, too, please.. at least not the Balor/Balrog etc. types.. we've really seen enough of them.. I think, that especially a greater variety of mystical, natural or even unique creatures would be very welcomed.. for example I really loved the giant toads in TToEE or Myconid/Plant-like creatures (except Treants and Shamblers).. what about Fauns, Manticors and Centaurs for example, special "creaturized" Worms/Snails, .. or even "lovecraftian" creatures?

Edited by Kurumi Morishita, 08 December 2012 - 02:32 AM.


#57
Osvir

Osvir

    Arch-Mage

  • Members
  • 3799 posts
  • Location:Stockholm, SE
  • Pillars of Eternity Silver Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
  • Lords of the Eastern Reach Backer
  • Deadfire Silver Backer
  • Fig Backer
  • Black Isle Bastard!

*ahem*

Will there be Dragons?

*ahem*

Will there be Dragons?

Dragons, dragons everywhere! :aiee:

Please, don't include them. Lizards are good, even dragonlings, but not full-sized dragons in yet another game.

Deathclaws! :devil:

But yeah. Dragons are alrdy pissin' every1 off.

Not mentioning that now every kid knows that they're nothing more than a primitive people's interpretation of ancient flying machines.

Yes.. NO Dragons and NO Demons, too, please.. at least not the Balor/Balrog etc. types.. we've really seen enough of them.. I think, that especially a greater variety of mystical, natural or even unique creatures would be very welcomed.. for example I really loved the giant toads in TToEE or Myconid/Plant-like creatures (except Treants and Shamblers).. what about Fauns, Manticors and Centaurs for example, special "creaturized" Worms/Snails, .. or even "lovecraftian" creatures?


One single Dragon can really set a tone in any fictional work (Smaug).

13-14 Dragons ruins it and makes Dragons boring (Skyrim).

How would the inclusion of one or two dragons (and not more) affect your experience of the game? A Full-Grown Dragon (in whatever way it is) in my opinion needs to be "Epic", Legendary and Rare. Not something you stumble upon in your first dungeon to say the least.

Hormalakh brought up this, and although it isn't entirely true for a Dragon (but it could be another monster/object) I can see it being more interesting if some "Ancient Beast of Wisdom & Destruction". Who doesn't want to cook and eat a Dragon's heart and gain an insightful Dragon's Wisdom?

More Dragons.

Edited by Osvir, 08 December 2012 - 03:03 AM.


#58
Kurumi Morishita

Kurumi Morishita

    (1) Prestidigitator

  • Members
  • 27 posts
  • Location:Kuldahar
  • Pillars of Eternity Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer

One single Dragon can really set a tone in any fictional work (Smaug).

13-14 Dragons ruins it and makes Dragons boring (Skyrim).

How would the inclusion of one or two dragons (and not more) affect your experience of the game? A Full-Grown Dragon (in whatever way it is) in my opinion needs to be "Epic", Legendary and Rare. Not something you stumble upon in your first dungeon to say the least.

Hormalakh brought up this, and although it isn't entirely true for a Dragon (but it could be another monster/object) I can see it being more interesting if some "Ancient Beast of Wisdom & Destruction". Who doesn't want to cook and eat a Dragon's heart and gain an insightful Dragon's Wisdom?

More Dragons.


True.. and esp. if it would be really some kind of unique or mythic Dragon-like creature such as a Lindworm, then I guess I could live with it, but on the other hand I've to ask.. would P:E so much worse without a Dragon.. did Baldur's Gate need a Dragon to be great? did Icewind Dale? ..
  • Osvir likes this

#59
steelshark

steelshark

    (1) Prestidigitator

  • Members
  • 23 posts
  • Location:Vienna, Austria, Europe
  • Pillars of Eternity Silver Backer
  • Kickstarter Backer
Hi everyone,
I guess I'll just chip in my 2 cents:

There are a few things that came to my mind when reading over the posts.

Now, as probably everyone, I'd wish for a good variety of enemies. But I'd restict that to the kind of variety that actually makes sense. To me it seems some settings are way to crowded with overly powerful monsters, for civilization to actually be able to survive. Also, intelligent, humanoid monsters automatically make more interesting enemies (IMHO), since they can have wildely differing equipment and agendas, whereas wolves, zombies or even very exotic, yet unintelligent, monsters mostly come only in one or two flavours.

As for "epic" monsters/enemies, my thought is that it's not the "toughness" of that enemy that matters so terribly much, but the "uniqueness". If there is one, and only one, giant balrog-type demon, say as an optional enemy summmoned during a ritualdone by long standing enemies, i'd feel it's ok. It does however become bland if you walk into "hell" and the very same demon becomes your average "mob". I think that devaluates previous encounters with such monsters.

On the topic of "don't bring monster X, it's so stereotypical", I can only say that some stereotypes persist because they make sense. Dragons, Zombies, Skeletons, Orcs, Demons, and Wizards are tried and true elements of d&d-type, tolkien-esque settings.

Lastly I think that an overcrowding of the world with monsters should be avoided, for the sake of immersion/realism. If I get ambushed by trolls, dragons, demons and whatnot every 5 meters as soon as i step out of the city gate, I (outgame) am going to wonder how economy in this setting is still existing.

br,
Rizzo

edit:
Oh, one more thing that i just thought of:
To give the world a subtle hue of ... "matureness"? I guess (don't know how I should put it), It would be interesting to get a feeling that the "monsters" are not all purely evil, and just waiting to kill me and my friends, and that there is something of a world outside my screen. A bunch of zombies with the ragged clothes of a farmer familiy, perhaps including a somewhat smaller zombie, is going to make me think "who where the poor people that turned into zombies". An evil cultist with a loveletter from another cultist makes them more human, less one-dimensional. And in consequence it could make my actions not seem as "purely white" as it's sometimes the case in such games. I really like the thought of the stormcloak vs. imperial war in skyrim, as there was no "right" or "good" side.

Edited by steelshark, 08 December 2012 - 03:41 AM.

  • aluminiumtrioxid, Kurumi Morishita and DreamDancer like this

#60
Hormalakh

Hormalakh

    Lone Locust of the Obsidian Order

  • Members
  • 1981 posts
Honestly, my feeling about monsters is this: Let's have as many as we can put in there, with one very big disclaimer. Since this game is in a completely new universe, I would hope that the monsters would tell part of the story too. A lot of times, the story can be told straight through exposition and dialogue, but especially in a game/interactive media, you can utilize other methods of telling your story. Just like some games utilize the backgrounds and settings to tell part of the story, I would hope that the monsters could do the same. We have the beginnings of such a thing with the biamhac (wind spirits) but I'd like as much of the monsters to tell part of the story as possible.

If there are goblins in there, why are there goblins? What's their history? Where did they come from? Why are they there? And so on and so forth. We don't have to be given an exposition for each one: perhaps the places that they can be found, the items found nearby, the setting that they're in can help tell that story too, but ultimately they should feel like they belong in the universe.

I know this is difficult to do with a large bestiary, so it might be nice to get a couple of them fleshed out and perhaps we can know about the other monsters in a later game. This is what I think Fallout did quite well. Each monster found in the game had a reason to be there: it wasn't always immediately clear why they were found in the universe, but there was always a reason.
  • Infinitron, Kurumi Morishita, Malekith and 1 other like this





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Beastiary, Creatures, Wildlife, Animals, Monsters

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users