Confirmed: more than a hack & slash

[Wombat]

Resource pools are pretty wide open, for instance. Just having a resource pool doesn't mean it works like mana in a traditional RPG - you can change how the pool fills, how it's consumed, attach passive effects to various levels of the resource pool, have abilities that can spend variable amounts of the pool, and on and on.

Aha...then, you indeed had some ideas on resources as expected.

 

The concern I have with ammo management is that I feel a game's mechanics should reinforce its narrative and setting. In a game like Fallout, scrounging for bullets is completely setting appropriate as it reinforces the theme of scarcity in a post-apocalyptic world. But, when you think of epic fantasy, arrow management just feels out of place a lot of the time. Additionally, more than almost any other collection mechanic, it can act as a brick wall to the pacing of the game as players run out of ammo and immediately have to stop playing and run back to town.

I cannot agree with this more. Even with PnP rules, good designers know how to let their rules dictate their worlds/atmosphere. The video game designers have many more tools but the unification does seem to be difficult seeing some conflicting presentation of Alpha Protocol, ranging from voice over, graphics and game plays.

 

I'd like to say that this is a "game design theory" discussion at this point. Don't take what I've said in the thread as anything more than an indication of my inclinations when it comes to epic fantasy RPG design. None of this is DS3 specific information.

Don't worry... I guess I'm accustomed to keep rooms for possible interpretations about what you designers mention but, yes, you are right at that making it clear.

 

Mostly I just find the discussion of ammo actually pretty interesting because I think it's something that is such a core part of people's experience with RPGs even though it's something that's glossed over frequently in discussions of fantasy RPG systems.

Yea...without considering possible usages of it, if you ask me...

[Amentep]

Inventory clogging and constant trips to store are certainly a issue but besides being part of the class flavor doesn’t every character type in arpg constantly replenishes some supplies? Tanks need health potions after all and wizards constantly purchase something that refills mana. I think the point should be not to force players to overrelay on such items or at least use them is such way that acquiring them doesn’t turn into mindless grind or annoyance.

 

Depends on the game. You can use a combo of having some slow health/mana regen + making potions fall so frequently one rarely has to buy them, for example. I don't think I ever bought a potion in Titan Quest. heh But yeah, I do get your point. Most games there's something you're going to go back to town for on a too-often basis, where to buy or sell or turn in quests if there's a main town hub etc.

 

I think one thing to remember in the difference between tanks and archers though, is that - assuming a system with health potions and limited arrows - a tank is not going to be required to use a health potion after every fight but that an archer will use part of their arrow inventory in every fight. This will necessitate an archer having to go back to the stores much more often than a tank (and possibly more often than a mana using magic caster who replenishes with mana potions).

 

I remember my archer character in CHAMPIONS OF NORRATH for example. To be useful I often maxed my carry weight with arrows. Because other players were tired of having to go back to the merchants for me to buy arrows (and as an archer based character I wasn't terribly useful switched to combat). But that meant I couldn't pick *anything* up without a lot of dropping and picking up items so I could switch a worn item with a new drop or requesting another player to pick it up for me until I had enough "weight" free to pick up the item from them.

 

I also remember in the IE games feeling forced by ammo limitation for characters whose primary attack was non-magical distance attacks - bows, crossbows, darts or slings - to load them down with ammo so that they didn't rush into melee barehanded before I could replenish their stock (a type of inventory micromanagement I never enjoyed). At least IWD2 gave me plenty of returning Ice Darts as loot.

Edited June 17, 2010 by Amentep

[pmp10]

The concern I have with ammo management is that I feel a game's mechanics should reinforce its narrative and setting. In a game like Fallout, scrounging for bullets is completely setting appropriate as it reinforces the theme of scarcity in a post-apocalyptic world. But, when you think of epic fantasy, arrow management just feels out of place a lot of the time. Additionally, more than almost any other collection mechanic, it can act as a brick wall to the pacing of the game as players run out of ammo and immediately have to stop playing and run back to town.

I suppose that

[Wombat]

Isn

[Irrelevant]

If deciding what type of ammo or how much ammo to carry is not meaningful or fun then it should be left out. like health.