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movies vs. kotors

So what do you think, which is the better story?  

66 members have voted

  1. 1. So what do you think, which is the better story?

    • the movies were a lot better
      11
    • the kotors were a lot better
      30
    • the movies were slightly better
      3
    • the kotors were slightly better
      11
    • kind of the same
      8
    • what movies?
      2
    • I liked the matrix
      1


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> is 'Greater Than':

 

KotOR 1 > A New Hope > The Phantom Menace;

 

The Empire Strikes Back > KotOR 2 > The Clone Wars;

 

Revenge of the Sith > Return of the Jedi > KotOR 3?

(No Jar Jar vs tons of Ewoks, no Jar Jar wins.)

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The problem with the Movies, is just that.... They are movies...

 

 

Find a book thats been turned into a movie, how well does the movie compared the the original story? Not well in a lot of cases.

 

I know SW didn't start out that way, but now their are books, comics and video games... In these things, they is no 2 hours time frame, or anything else like that. Not that the movies weren't any good... They are simply lack the depth that all the other SW related things have.

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I think the KOTOR games are on par with the ORINGAL intended vision... The Original Trilogy... That George Lucas started with... In that they are grand adventures that don't take themselves too seriously (KOTOR at least; TSL is another story)...

 

And are ten times better than the prequels... RotS not withstanding as we haven't seen it yet, but I am not holding my breath regardless of the cool trailer that just premiered.

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I really liked the original trilogy, expecially ANH and ESB

 

comparing them to KOTOR1 i think the movies are a bit superior

but JTL in my opinion is very superior than both.

 

 

also generally during movies is difficult to go deep into characters, expecially for movies like SW that try to build an heroic adventure.

 

in a game (or a book) there is much more time to go explaine and develop both characters and story making them complex and deep. (of course if the game is really well done)

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I think it's hard to compare movies to games... but the KotOR games are definately more dark and supernatural than the movies. The force is more powerful in the games, and especially TSL is in my opinion far from the movies. In fact, I'd argue that the SW setting put aside, it have very little in common with SW at all...

 

The story is simple too complicated, too "serious", for the rather laid back and adventure-ish SW style in the movies.

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KotOR 1 is on a par with the original trilogy. You can easily spot the elements of the first films in the first game: Train an adult as a Jedi, stop the evil bad guy, cheesy yet at the same time shocking plot twist.

 

KotOR 2 is very different from the films, and takes itself much more seriously than either the first game or the original films. As such, I don't think they can really be compared.


Hawk! Eggplant! AWAKEN!

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Movies are bound to be simpler, you only have 3 hours or less to tell the story in a fashion that will make sense. You also dont have the option to replay a movie for many months (unless your a naughty person).

 

Thats why Squenix spirits within went totally over most peoples heads. Too much for them to take in over that ammount of time and too much going on. The movies are also intended to a younger audience where as the games are more mid-late teen.

 

One of the major failings of KOTOR 1 is that playing DS makes little sense in the context of the story. It's not like the Jedi council would give you such a personality is it? While you could say that it was because they didnt erase you old one, you still then play the entire game in ignorance until the Leviathon.


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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One of the major failings of KOTOR 1 is that playing DS makes little sense in the context of the story. It's not like the Jedi council would give you such a personality is it? While you could say that it was because they didnt erase you old one, you still then play the entire game in ignorance until the Leviathon.

 

The council erased Revan's mind, but couldn't "form" it as they wanted it to be.

 

But Revan was their only hope, so they just hoped that Revan would not fall to the dark side yet again. Revan wasn't DS from birth or anything, but fell to the dark side sometime during the Mandalorian Wars for reasons not quite known.

 

So it wasn't the person Revan who was evil to the bone, but rather an event or a series of events that turned Revan to the DS. Like with Bastila.

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The council erased Revan's mind, but couldn't "form" it as they wanted it to be.

 

But Revan was their only hope, so they just hoped that Revan would not fall to the dark side yet again. Revan wasn't DS from birth or anything, but fell to the dark side sometime during the Mandalorian Wars for reasons not quite known.

 

So it wasn't the person Revan who was evil to the bone, but rather an event or a series of events that turned Revan to the DS. Like with Bastila.

 

Common misconception but not true. They gave Revan a new persona. This is confirmed when you talk to Bastila and she asks you questions and you get those er wth is going on here answers...

 

In which case why would the Jedi give you an evil persona? Of course they wouldnt. And the only rationale is that Revans evil persona was surfacing dosnt work because your still totally ignorant of it until you get to the Leviathon even after you piece together those obvious clues on the planet.


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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Common misconception but not true. They gave Revan a new persona. This is confirmed when you talk to Bastila and she asks you questions and you get those er wth is going on here answers...

 

No. They gave Revan a new background, that's all.

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Common misconception but not true. They gave Revan a new persona. This is confirmed when you talk to Bastila and she asks you questions and you get those er wth is going on here answers...

 

No. They gave Revan a new background, that's all.

 

You cant give someone a background without giving them a personality. A person is the sum of their experiences. Your not playing an amnesiac in KOTOR your playing a lie created by the council. Which is why it makes no sense to play DS in KOTOR in the story context until you get to the leviathon.


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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^

 

That's right. Bastilla specifically says that the council re-programmed Revan with a mind loyal to the Republic.

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KotOR does sorta follow the story pattern in the movies:

K1: has a Jedi-involved war, like Episode 2

K1 to K2 transition: like Episode 3, how all the Jedi are taken out

(except in Ep3 they have the guts for a last ditch fight)

 

K2: Empire Strike Back - story expanded and things were learnt but no real final outcomes

K3 (?): Hopefully a Return of the Jedi thing with Revan (cos since all the Jedi are basically gone, it would be Return of the Jedi).

 

As a side note with the games, I also think that K2 has the length and depth of a full game, but at the same time, it's like an expansion to K1 like Jedi Academy of Half-Life: Opposing Force & Half-Life Blue-Shift. Why? Well in all these games you refer a lot to the original character (Kyle and Gordon) but play someone different, and everything you do is from a consequence from the original character.

 

 

Half-Life Blue Shift is when you play a security guard in Half-Life (you're the guy banging on the stuck door at the start).

Half-Life Opposing Force is when you play as an army grunt, also during the same period as the original.

Jedi Academy is where you're Jaden Korr and you deal with a threat which continues from Jedi Outcast/Valley of the Jedi.

 

 


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Pure Pazaak - The Stand-alone Multiplayer Pazaak Game (link to Obsidian board thread)

Pure Pazaak website (big thank you to fingolfin)

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^

 

That's right. Bastilla specifically says that the council re-programmed Revan with a mind loyal to the Republic.

 

Thats the problem , because you dont become aware of it till late on it turns into a huge plothole.


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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^

 

That's right. Bastilla specifically says that the council re-programmed Revan with a mind loyal to the Republic.

 

Yes... and no matter what you do, basically, you're on the Republic's side untill after the Leviathan...

 

But what side you are on doesn't necessarily determine whether you are DS or LS. Canderous, HK-47, Visas, Atton are all more or less DS - yet they still fight for the republic.

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Also, the Jedi council didn't erase your memory in KotOR 1 as I remember it, you suffered brain damage and they couldn't restore your mind properly. At least the way I interpreted it, they just put the personality they wanted over the top of your own memories and supressed them, which if you went dark side overcame you as your damaged mind slowly repaired itself. If you were light side, your memories simply returned but without the personality.


Hawk! Eggplant! AWAKEN!

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According to your point of view.

 

Funny, I thought we were allowed to have differing opinions on this board, but whenever you're around... Everyone is always wrong. Hmm...

 

Please show where Revan is an amnesiac then. There are opinions and there are facts, and in this case it's a fact that Revan was programmed with a new personality and was not just mindwiped.

 

If your opinion is contrary to that, then your opinion is wrong.


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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Yes... and no matter what you do, basically, you're on the Republic's side untill after the Leviathan...

 

But what side you are on doesn't necessarily determine whether you are DS or LS. Canderous, HK-47, Visas, Atton are all more or less DS - yet they still fight for the republic.

 

Becoming a Sith does not put you on the republics side. Only by revisionist history of KOTOR II.

 

No they fight for you , in both cases you are their only alligience.

 

(Jolee Juhani fight for the Jedi/republic which is evident by them trying to stop you).


I have to agree with Volourn.  Bioware is pretty much dead now.  Deals like this kills development studios.

478327[/snapback]

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Yes... and no matter what you do, basically, you're on the Republic's side untill after the Leviathan...

 

But what side you are on doesn't necessarily determine whether you are DS or LS. Canderous, HK-47, Visas, Atton are all more or less DS - yet they still fight for the republic.

 

Becoming a Sith does not put you on the republics side. Only by revisionist history of KOTOR II.

 

No they fight for you , in both cases you are their only alligience.

 

(Jolee Juhani fight for the Jedi/republic which is evident by them trying to stop you).

 

I'm afraid I don't get your point? Where are you going with this, what are you trying to say? :p

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For the time being I like the movies better (well Ep 1 excluded), I think they leave more room to the imagination in comparison with the video games.


And by the light of the moon

He prays for their beauty not doom

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I was just wondering what you ppl think

 

I feel I should qualify my vote. The Kotor games-story are on a par with the first trilogy of movies, but far better than the latest. Revan's (and Exile's) story is every bit as good as Luke Skywalker's. It's just not finished yet.

 

At their best, games are creative expression on a par with a good movie, or a good book. I would no more part with the older games I cherish than I would with some of the DVD's and novels that have earned a permanent place in my library. But as gaming has evolved, there have been fewer and fewer of the ones that really shine, and that's sad. The Kotors (both of them) are exceptional due to character development and compelling storyline.

 

Thinking back to how many fictional characters actually remained part of me in any of the above categories, I suspect the numbers are small. But PC games had a decent share. Planescape: Torment and Gabriel Knight, to name a couple.

 

Plain and simple, the later movies have nothing to commend them. The characters fall flat, and taking the last three as a separate entity (the only way to stay sane) I already know how that story ends. It's a tragedy. And a hard sell, unless it was really done well. Too late for the third movie to salvage it; even if the movie is excellent, it cannot stand on its own.

 

We've already moved past the Skywalker saga. LA would have better served the franchise by devoting more effort into being sure K2 was all it could be.

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You can't compare Star Wars Video Games, Books, Comic Books, Cartoons, TV Made Movies or Specials to the Movie. It is like comparing apples to oranges. I see no comparisons to teh movies to KOTOR thiose who do lay off the drugs. You ca't compare C-3PO to HK-47 HK-47 assassin droid C-3PO Protocol Droid that is more comparing a fruit to a vegetable now.

 

So my advice lay off the drugs and stop comparing. They are both unique in their own ways and those who deal with contunuity lay off the heavier drugs. You pay George Lucas 30% you can make Luke Skywalker marry Princess Leia and have Leia produce Luke's inbred children.

 

The only true continuity is Marvel Comics, Lucas never saw that much money coming from Marvel and also he helped create the comics so the real continuity lies in Marvel where Lucas cared about the fans. Think Lucas cares for the fans now? He wants that 30% so because those who like contunuity. This is how much George lucas loves continuity; put all the contunuity books, comics, video games and put in blender and turn blender on. George Lucas when Marvel made Star Wars cared about the fans when Geoge Lucas had Dark Horse make the Expanded Universe Comics did not care for the fans. I stick with a caring George Lucas who cared for the fans and use Marvel Comics as my guide any given day.

 

And, anyone has a problem lay off the drugs and see a psychiatrist.

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