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Ideas for kotor 3? returning people? planets?


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BEGINNING WORLD (assuming we have a new protagonist):

 

**Your planet** (at the beginning of the game, you choose your homeworld from a list of about 5 options)

 

--there would be some introductory stuff here, somewhat like Peragus in that sense. for instance, the list might include: Telos, Taris, Manaan, Dantooine, Tatooine.

 

 

 

TRANSITIONAL WORLD (this is where the story takes over but the game has not totally opened up yet)

 

**Coruscant**

--alot of cutscreens and sights to see. I agree with D Nuke, it would be nice to

address the Senate!

 

 

 

WORLDS THAT HAVE THE CLUES (you need 4 clues but you have to look in up to 8 places to find them):

 

**Korriban**

--you didn't know that there are catacombs that connect all the tombs and also connect the Valley of the Dark Lords to another part of the planet. Here, we have some serious dungeon crawl.

 

 

**Mandalore (or Dxun)**

--the Mandalorians will, undoubtedly, play a big part of the endgame.

No reason not to have an excuse to chat with Canderous before you really need him.

 

 

**Alderaan**

--the movies mention it but most casual fans of SW know nothing about it.

Let's find out about this world. (Ithor could substitute here, I guess.)

 

 

**Yavin4** (this is a moon...Yavin itself is a big, red ball of gas)

--alot of Sith history here and alot of sites to see

(it would also be nice to be able to trade with the Rodian in the orbital space station again.)

 

 

**Onderon**

--you are not finished with the Queen yet. She has other missions for you

and she provides help in the endgame.

 

 

**Ziost**

--the main Sith world in Known Space. 'nuff said.

 

 

**Stennis OR Korus Major OR another EU world**

 

 

**Nar Shadaa**

--We need a true urban center in the middle game, IMO.

We've already seen the slums. Perhaps now we could see the capital city.

 

 

 

ENDGAME WORLDS

 

**3 Worlds from the Unknown Regions**

--All 3 could be of the True Sith or possibly only 2 would be Sith.

 

**Droid World/HK Factory**

--need an army to fight the Sith?

 

 

ALSO:

--depending on the story, the endgame may end up being a massive invasion of the Core Worlds. (but I suspect most of that would be in space.)

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If you went dark side, queen talia is dead. But nice try, though.

 

I like the idea about Korriban, though. Especially the part about exploring another part of Korriban. And, yes, the Droid planet and HK Factory are mandatory.

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My ideas for KOTOR3...

 

Most important thing is the STORY. I have been happy with the first two KOTOR games (almost finished with STL), and I hope the story in KOTOR3 will be at least as good as it was for the first two.

 

A Strong relationship (good or bad) is important. I didn't get the same connections with Kreia/Exile, as I did with Revan/Bastila. Even though the relationships were different in nature, Kreia seemed more like an old hag that was tagging along, occasionally giving you some insight. You were "bonded" to her, but it seemed that was the only reason you kept her around. Bastila on the other hand, had far more character.

 

 

I like some of the improvements made to KOTOR2, such as (in no particular order)...

 

1. Improved customization of weapons/armor

2. Scaleable UI

3. Footlockers that tell you if they are empty

4. Better looking robes

5. Able to switch weapon sets on the fly (I don't use this, but a nice feature)

6. Influence (probably my favorite addition)

7. Prestige classes

8. Ability to use other skills (awareness) in conversations.

9. Lightsaber forms - not unbalancing, but it does make a difference.

 

There are some things that I think were not so good, such as lack of polish. In KOTOR1, once I had downloaded a new driver for my ATI, the game ran flawlessly. In KOTOR2, I don't crash, but there are always little hiccups in the transitions.

 

I haven't reached the end of the game just yet, so I can't comment on the ending.

 

It has been suggested by some (not necessarily in this thread) that you should start out KOTOR3 as the Exile, exactly where you left off (that way you get to own everybody right from the start, think of the fun!). I think this would be a mistake, as leveling up your character and learning more about your character is most of the fun. I would not mind a continuation of KOTOR2, but I think you would have to be a new character. Perhaps After playing a short amount of time (first planet), you could run into either Revan, or The Exile, who see your potential, and train you. For obvious reasons, they would not be able to come with you on your journey (you don't want to be the newb of the group), but you would have to complete some huge mission for him/her, while he/she does his/her thing elsewhere.

 

Another idea, is you could be somebody who was supposed to become a Padawan, but due to the Jedi Civil War you were unable to train with a Jedi. Therefore, you are FS, but have no training/saber. This allows you to level up like the previous games.

 

I am usually of the opinion that less is more. While I like in general the new feats/powers that have been added, I don't want the game to get carried away adding more, just for the sake of adding more. Unarmed combat became viable with KOTOR2, and with the exception of the Echani, I don't think it should be that way. Making special character that can fight well unarmed is ok, but for everybody to have the ability seems unrealistic (even for Star Wars).

 

I really liked the idea of your personal lightsaber crystal, that grows in power as you do. That gave me an idea for a Robe. Perhaps along the way, you can create your own special Robe that will grow in stats as you progress (you could also customize the colors). The ability to raise and lower your hood would be welcome also. I think this would be a great addition to the game.

 

In a retreat from "less is more", I think we should be able to take more party members out (5 counting yourself seems like a good number). Being limited to 3 (yourself + 2) makes it so most of your party members are forgotten. I tend to pick the same people over and over. Once you have a total of 3 Jedi in your group, you never part with them unless you are forced to. I realize this makes replay ability more difficult, but perhaps we could just have a larger pool to choose from. I want to be forced to have people in my group that aren't Jedi. If I have another 2 Jedi in my group, it would be great to still have somebody (HK-47 or similar) with a couple of blasters, and perhaps an echani who is unarmed.) Of course, the NPCs would have to be tougher to for it, but that is easy to do. Perhaps this could be activated. For example, at a certain point in the game, when you get to a more linear story line (see the next paragraph), you could get the skill "Leadership", which allows you to bring a 4th party member, and then Leadership 2 (maxed out) that allows you to bring a fifth.

 

NPCs (especially boss NPCs) need to be harder. I just defeated the person you fight before you head to the last place (vague for spoiler reasons), and I defeated this NPC in ONE ROUND! I am playing on the "hard" setting, and with Master Speed/Flurry, Form VII, and a good saber, I beat this person in one round (I think I got a couple of crits in there). This is probably my biggest gripe with the game. Now, I understand that you can't have really hard NPCs and still allow players the freedom to visit planets in any order. You can't have a super hard NPC on Dantooine, and have the player there at level 10, unable to defeat it. For this, there should be a fairly linear story line for a decent portion of the end game (as you will be very powerful by then), so they can put in worthy foes without fear of making them unbeatable. As it is, I really don't care about looting stims and such, as I never have a need for them. The linear end game (say the last half would also make it easier to incorporate a group of 5, instead of 3. If the game knows you will have 5 people in your group, it can be designed to have a challenge worthy of such a group.

 

Regarding the engine. I would welcome a new graphics engine, but I would not be too disappointed if KOTOR3 used the same old engine. I have the PC version, and my PC has no problems playing the game, and it looks great. Better graphics would be welcome, but I would hope my current system (p4 2.4c, Gig, R9800Pro 256MB, WD Raptor 74GB) could handle it.

 

Lightsaber combat. Maybe it's just me, but I like carrying a traditional single saber into combat. As all but one saber wielding person in the movies has carried this configuration, I have to assume they were doing it for a reason (don't tell me Yoda wasn't skilled enough to do it). I think a single blade saber should have more benefits than it does (with Jedi Weapon Master, you can get duals at nearly the same penalties, but still roughly double dmg). I would like to see more benefit to compensate for less damage.

 

Final thought, please stop making the best headgear in the game a mask. I like to see my face, as the masks just look stupid. The sunglasses face gear is ok, but the kind that totally cover your face (think of the Sith mask from KOTOR1) make you look stupid if you are walking into a Cantina.

 

Well, that is all I can think of right now, please feel free to comment on any of my suggestions.

 

Edit: I just thought of something else. There really HAS to be more variety in the NPC faces. When I can see roughly 20 different people with an identical face, that is just plain wrong. You don't even need to change the graphics engine for that (I don't think).

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I wholeheartedly agree with you, playloud, on most of the stuff that you said, like NOT adding a whole bunch of new Force Powers and Feats simply for the sake of adding more. Actually, I think that they should remove a few Force Powers, Like Force Body, Force Barrier, and some other stupid 30-second Force Powers.

The hood is good idea, but the thing is it was brought up numerous times as an idea for KotOR 2, by forum members, but the dickheads never did it. So, my guess is they must have some bullsh*t reason for not doing it. And, yes, the masks are the stupidest idea I've ever seen. First, the Vacum Mask in KotOR 1, but Obsidian really got carried away with this mask bullsh*t. One or two, and maybe three is okay, but they added just way too many. Maybe they thought that they looked "cool."

 

The idea about your own personal robe, like the lightsaber crystal in K2, is a good idea. I like your thinking. Maybe even a personalized Lightsaber!!!! Now THAT is a good idea. They had the PC Armband which was a good idea, but only +1 Constitution? Give me a break!!! How about a little more stat boosting. And, also, maybe a personalized headset, like THE Circlet of Saresh in KotOR 1 and all 6 or 7 or them in KotOR 2.

 

The "Leadship" feat idea. Again, I like your thinking. Allowing you to have more party members in your group by gaining a feat or two is a good idea.

but I think you would have to be a new character. Perhaps After playing a short amount of time (first planet), you could run into either Revan, or The Exile, who see your potential, and train you. For obvious reasons, they would not be able to come with you on your journey (you don't want to be the newb of the group), but you would have to complete some huge mission for him/her, while he/she does his/her thing elsewhere.

 

 

Another idea, is you could be somebody who was supposed to become a Padawan, but due to the Jedi Civil War you were unable to train with a Jedi. Therefore, you are FS, but have no training/saber. This allows you to level up like the previous games.

 

And, yes, there needs to be a greater advantage to single wielding. I mean, with Weaponsmaster/Marauder, you got increased melee damage 1,2, and 3. and 3 additional 2-weapon feats, and 3 addition lightsaber feats. I think that they should have similar feats for single wield. I mean, with dual wield, you've got one lightsaber per hand. With single wield, you've got both hands on one lightsaber, yet the only advantage is a higher attack modifier? BULL. SH*T!!! How about in addition to a higher attack modifer, you get 1/4, 1/3, or 1/2, more damage?! I mean in only makes sense. Actually, that could be Dueling 4, 5, and 6. They add attack modifiers and increased damage.

 

YES, YES, YES, YES, YES!!!!! Yes, the faces need to change, not add more. Just enough with the F*CKING SKINHEADS!!! Who's bright idea was THAT!?!?! No more skinheads, damn Neo-Nazi-looking bastards. I have a selection of only 3 or 4 male character faces that I can stand to look at and about 5 or 6 female faces. No more Bardara Streisand-looking bitches. Make them hot, okay? There was a couple of B.S. (Barbara Streisand) looking faces in KotOR 1 and couple more ugly ones in KotOR 2. Please, no more ugly chick faces.

 

Okay, I'm done.

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I think the most important thing an RPG game should have is a storyline that allows for more questions but gives you a decent wrap-up at the end of the game that makes you feel like your time wasn't wasted. I feel the first installment did that and I feel the second one came up short -- I believe a good, solid, and somewhat exciting and/or mysterious storyline is the essential.

 

Graphics are just not that important when you have a game that isn't like Battlefront or quick action games in which you jump right into the thick of it and blast away. Sure Knights has action but storyline is what drives us forward and thats what'll keep us happy and keep us playing.

 

Next, I want the current system balanced -- all current items balanced: things that aren't needed cut and items that need tweaking tweaked as well as a system that is moderate. I don't want a thousand Force Powers -- I want the Force Powers to mean something since this is, while a long game, not a universe in which I can get adequate training that will rival Yoda who has lived 900 years. I want blaster weapons to have just as much potential when invested heavily in as the vibroblades have -- it may be a war in which shields require close combat but Jedi shouldn't have to be about close combat all the time.

 

I see no need to impress us with stunning new graphics. I see the need for a balanced, well-thought out story that either wraps the current two games up, or proceeds forward and leaves open more possibilites but nonetheless closes up quite well. While graphics are neat, I played Halo 2 for about three hours and didn't find it interesting -- the first one pulled me in; the second one, while pleasing to the eyes, was unpleasing to play (for me).

 

For others, they may like it -- they want the quick stuff, the I don't have to think to hard and invest too much time and get my uber-l33t lightsaber that destroys everyone and their mother, but I want a good story, progression, and something that challenges me for the time I spend in it.

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With that said, I think its time we have a character that is either really old or really young -- preferably really young. Why? I want a game in which the Master-Padawan bond is actually displayed and in which I can participate. I want to be the newbie brought up; I don't want to be someone who's been apart of the Jedi Order who's lost himself.

 

Like I mentioned before, I think one of the surviving Masters -- you know there's gotta be at least one (and if not, GO WITH IT!) or a trainer or near enough Master finds you -- has a vision of you and comes and gets you (on a Core Planet) and you have to escape the Core Planet. Why? Because no one trusts the Jedi, period.

 

The Senate has declared (as in the third movie) that Jedi are no longer to be trusted for they are just as much a problem as the Sith (or so they believe). You have to flee because you're caught with whatever Master or whatever circumstances. You have goals and things you need to meet to get off the planet for whatever reason: Master wants to see if you're worthy enough (lotta Yoda stuff) or you need to find a way to get off. Basically, its a Taris/Peragus situation except I think it'll be non-stop action since you can open the game up with a holovid of the Supreme Chancellor or Senate passing a vote through their hall that all Force-sensative members are under arrest/koa/etc. Pan to character and have a knock at the door -- its Master Sunrider (jk).

 

Either way, I think a young character has more realism to it when it comes to making hard and/or bad choices. Kids/young adults don't have a lot of experience and it can be easier for them to fall. With that I have my biggest issue.

 

Dark Side and Light Side need to be revamped. The choices are way too obvious. I want real choices, and many of them -- I want to feel like I'm a real person and not Buddy Jesus or Lucifer -- I mean honestly, I don't have to have evil intentions by going into a cantina and threatening everyone instead of inquiring about them. I want a Dark Side that is plausible and a Light Side that isn't so mamby pamby or however Alec Guinness said it.

 

Returning characters: For the Light Side, I think Bastila Shan, who is a favourite character of mine, should be back as a Non-Player Character. I think, since they showed their capablities with Hanharr and Mira, this is plausible -- if you're a Dark Side character you could get someone like Hanharr or Mandalore. I think influence should really matter -- I really want to see characters leave your group, put you on ice, or make you choose. None of this heavy influence -- influence is okay but I think it should have a limit and I think we should see NPCs be light-side oriented.

 

With that said, I don't think there are too many NPC Jedi characters left outside of the ones mentioned and with that, we can assume we'll have with the right choices, Bastila Shan, Handmaiden, Mira, Visas Marr, The Disciple and whoever based upon choices made at the beginning of the game. Heck, I think options for how the previous games played should occur in the character creation area and with that, you could even have the aforementioned scenario -- a Master showing up, have any of those Jedi show up as a Master-like character.

 

I think the game should start lightsided, no matter what and from there it gets tough -- decisions need to be made and giving in to the Dark Side may become necessary if you want to win at all. I think the Lightside, in the third game, should be absolutely, positively the most difficult thing out of all three and restricted to true gamers. Dark Side/Light Side have been both, too easy, credit-wise, living-wise, power-wise, and whatever you can name in both games. I think it should change.

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deciding how kotor 1 and 2 ended at the character creation screen. You know, that idea has crossed my mind I don't know how many times. I guess I never thought it was a very good idea; other people might think it was stupid because it's so direct. No subltety like the questions Atton asked. But really, the time for subtlety and big surprises is over. If Revan and/or The Exile are going to be in KotOR 3, it needs to be decided what class, face, and alignment they are RIGHT at character creation.

 

And I also agree that the characters (Jedi, as well) need to be more blaster and ranged weapon oriented. I mean, in KotOR 2 the unarmed specialist feats were freebees. Why not ever other level up or so, you get 1 or 2 feats that you can use only toward ranged weapons feats, like Blaster or Rifle Focus or Imp. Power Blast, Sniper Shot, Rapid Shot, Precise Shot, etc. Maybe some Ranged Weapon Forms that gives certain bonuses and penalties and whatnot, like the Lightsaber Forms.

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I don't know if this has been mentioned before, because it got tiresome reading through six pages (so I primarily read this last one), but what I would really like to be added in KOTOR3 is the option to change your name when you turn darkside: as in, "Darth Whoever"

 

I didn't know if it would happen in KOTOR2, and since I just recently selected the rank of Sith Lord in this, my third game, I see it doesn't happen in this one.

 

But I really think this would be a great addition to the next one.

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I notice alot of people posted earlier on about wanting to have Revan and/or the Exile in your party. Fact is... thats pretty much impossible, or at least extremely difficult. If you were to play as Revan or the Exile as Playloud said... you would be taking away what KOTOR good at, and thats giving your character a rich and mysterious background. Even if he/she was in your party, how would go about giving the character a voice, gender, face and skills. Its just too complex, unless you want to end up generating your old characters again (Which would give away the secret).

 

Personally though... I'd like some things cleared up. Such will the Jedi come back on its feet? Considering the recent amount of events the Jedi has been through (The Mandolorian Wars, The Jedi Civil War, and the Events of TSL). The Jedi Masters are all dead... and the only ones that remain are those dependant on your PC through both KOTORs. Actually the question is will there even BE a Jedi Order.

 

Heres a nice idea on my part. How about introducing a Companion System. I notice that in both KOTORs most of your party members will argue with each other rather than get along. So how about the option to actually bring your companions together. Possibly only to work while traveling with more than one person. Just my 2 cents. :ermm:

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I notice alot of people posted earlier on about wanting to have Revan and/or the Exile in your party. Fact is... thats pretty much impossible, or at least extremely difficult. If you were to play as Revan or the Exile as Playloud said... you would be taking away what KOTOR good at, and thats giving your character a rich and mysterious background. Even if he/she was in your party, how would go about giving the character a voice, gender, face and skills. Its just too complex, unless you want to end up generating your old characters again (Which would give away the secret).

 

Personally though... I'd like some things cleared up. Such will the Jedi come back on its feet? Considering the recent amount of events the Jedi has been through (The Mandolorian Wars, The Jedi Civil War, and the Events of TSL). The Jedi Masters are all dead... and the only ones that remain are those dependant on your PC through both KOTORs. Actually the question is will there even BE a Jedi Order.

 

Heres a nice idea on my part. How about introducing a Companion System. I notice that in both KOTORs most of your party members will argue with each other rather than get along. So how about the option to actually bring your companions together. Possibly only to work while traveling with more than one person. Just my 2 cents. :ermm:

 

but it getting old in a hurry. i mean could understand two games like that but not three. and to me and alot other people we want closure to both their stories. but there one thing i totally agree with you and playcloud that having them in your party. i rather play them. or them not return at all. there to many varible in having them as party members.

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Since other people have voiced their likes and dislikes on the possible KotOR3, I guess I will too...

 

Not sure about planets, but since I prefer the story to build on the what we've already seen, I'd prefer we see some of the worlds beyond the outer rim where Revan and the Exile went to find the "true Sith".

 

Coruscant might be a good place to begin, though, and I really want to see Alderaan at some point. We could also have the main character go to worlds like Yavin IV and Korriban to look for clues to the Sith. Ossus would also be interesting, except it is already more or less destroyed by this point...

 

As for the cast, it depends a lot on what changes are made to the engine itself. I like most of the characters in the games so far, but let's face it - with only three places open in the group, and one of those always taken by the main character, chances are you'll use only a few characters, and those tend to be the same characters every time.

 

In KotOR1, I mostly used the Jedi characters (Bastila, Jolee, Juhani) next to Revan, and only occasionally the rest. HK-47 would make it into the group only for his responses, and I never used T3 at all. Ever! Yes, you need him to enter the Sith base on Taris (since Mission can't open no matter what her Security is), so I bought at the droid shop, walked the short way over the Sith base, had T3 unlock the gate, then removed him from the party before entering the base and never used him again.

 

In KotOR2 I used T3 a lot more because Peragus demanded it (and because I could level him up to his maximum while leaving all the potential Jedi undeveloped), but it still doesn't mean I use all the characters - in KotOR2 I instead never or very rarely used G0-T0...

 

Now, that's just waste of good character potential. I guess the large cast is there so you have something to choose between as a player no matter what sort of characters you like, but to me it looks like wasted character potential since you'll never be using all those characters. Besides, many of them are still forced on you in specific situations, or you have to deal with during cutscenes in the plot.

 

My suggestion would be to either increase the number of available characters in the active group (there really is no logical reason to limit the number anyway) or else simply trim the number of potential characters down. Having so many characters in the group that you just cannot use due to forced game mechanics is rather annoying.

 

That doesn't necessarily mean that the overall number of NPCs has to be smaller, though - you can still have a large cast of characters walking in and out of the group instead of, like now, have them remain permanently once they join. For example, you could have characters like the disciple or the handmaiden early in the game only to later leave the group when other characters join. There could even be hateful relationships between characters, where some characters refuse to stay in the group if others join. At bit like the Mira/Hanharr relationship in KotOR2.

 

As for the plot, the events of the previous games have left the galaxy rather short on jedi for us to play in the next game. It can change, but at least we should begin where the games have left us until now. In all probability, the game will set up situations similar to that in KotOR2, where the alignment and gender of both Revan and the Exile will be decided by the player.

 

If the Exile is set to light side, then the new character could be a student from a Jedi academy built by one of the Jedi characters from KotOR2 (Visas might be the most obvious). If not, then the character might begin as a Sith. In either case, I'd like the game to begin with the new character following a master as an apprentice in a Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan or Obi-Wan/Anakin relationship. Isn't it a bit odd that the KotOR games haven't really explore the master/apprentice relationship yet?

 

It could also be interesting to have the master be Revan in disguise. After all, Revan can be both good and evil and male or female, but the teacher is just mysterious and secretive for a very long time. Or the main character could have a teacher who is killed early in the game and who is then hunted by the enemy while looking for a new master to learn from.

 

Another interesting option might be to have the main character be a powerful force sensitive character (like Anakin) who still hasn't committed to either side of the force (force adept is a legal class in the tabletop d20 RPG), and who is then promptly sought out for apprenticeship by both the Jedi and the Sith. Which way to go is then for the character to decide. The character could being as a 0-level character making the choice to be apprentice during the intro. A character thrown into the middle of things in such a way would be a nice homage to Luke Skywalker.

 

Or the character could be a former Mandalorian Jedi, who was thrown from the Jedi order due to his or her background, or who left in disgust at what the Jedi did to the Mandalorians. That could set up some really interesting situations with both Revan and the Exile (and Mandalore, too, come to think of it...).

 

The plot will be more difficult because it needs to consider all the potential choices made during the previous games, and to be perfectly honest it looks to me like a storyteller's nightmare to reconcile all that has potentially happened into one plot... No idea how they'll do it (well, maybe an idea, but it still looks daunting), but it'll be interesting to see, unless they just ignore all the loose ends.

 

Size is likely to be a problem, but I'd say cut down a bit on the dialogue in some cases. You should be able to talk to lots of people, but especially in KotOR2 I find that there are a large number of people who have little or nothing to say, while there are a few people who go on and on and on. Some of the conversations with Kreia or the HK-50 unit on Peragus are mind-bogglingly long. I want dialogue, but keep it to the point - I'll continue asking questions if I feel like it, so I don't need the game to force it on me.

 

Whatever happens, we need to have a character that is rather easy to identify with, as that was a major problem for me with the Exile in KotOR2. I mean, in the first game you don't know that you're Revan (though there are certainly clues), and once you find out, you've heard so much about Revan that you're somehow ready for it. In KotOR2, however, the Exile is a general of the Mandalorian Wars who did a lot of things he or she is not so happy about and which he or she doesn't like to talk about, and so I don't actually know the character I'm suppossed to play very much. That makes it all but impossible to identify with the central character, and I'm actually still rather uncertain about what the Exile did and didn't do during the Mandalorian Wars. That's not a good basis for a role-playing game.

 

The search for Revan and the Exile should also be important. Personally I'd really like the idea of getting both of the previous PCs in the group as NPCs at very high levels (starting at level 20+) at some point. Of course, they should both have unique abilities. For example, the Exile should definitely have Force Sight and either Force Crush or Force Enlightenment based on whether he or she is set to dark or light side.

 

While there were no unique powers for Revan in KotOR1, he can easily have learned unique powers during his long seclusion and study of the ancient Sith or even simply remembered some of the powers he used to have as the dark lord.

 

They should also both have other unique abilities that define their individually established strengths. For example, the Exile is the perfect general, while Revan is the master strategist and tactician.

 

The influence system was a nice addition in KotOR2, but it really is in bad need of severe revision. It's basically a good idea, but it fails to take into account what sort of influence you've had over the characters. For example, it's fine that the Handmaiden is intended to be basically light side and want you to do benign things, but if you're very dark sided and have influenced the Handmaiden a lot toward the dark side, then she shouldn't continue to react positively only to light side choices. That's inconsistent and needs to revised badly.

 

I mean, of course influence is and should be more relevant to a light side character - friendship and trust are light side concepts after all, while nobody likes being manipulated and treated like dirt, so naturally the dark side options should cost allies - nobody will like you if you tell them they're stupid and worthless except as expendable sacrifices. Then again, KotOR2 didn't do that either, and if that's too problematic, then it's better to remove the influence system entirely.

 

Well, just a few thoughts...

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Influence-wise, I would like a [Lie] option to manipulate party members. That way you could be a DS guy/girl, but still get them to like you. It would open up more things like a "Why did you lie to me???">"[Lie (Again :) )] It was for the good of the galaxy", etc., and could be really cool if used right...

Geekified Star Wars Geek

 

Heart of the Force, Arm of the Force

 

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes!"

-Obi-wan to Anakin (NOT advocating Grey-Jedidom)

 

"The Force doesn't control people, Kreia controls people."

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Since other people have voiced their likes and dislikes on the possible KotOR3, I guess I will too...

 

Not sure about planets, but since I prefer the story to build on the what we've already seen, I'd prefer  we see some of the worlds beyond the outer rim where Revan and the Exile went to find the "true Sith".

 

Coruscant might be a good place to begin, though, and I really want to see Alderaan at some point. We  could also have the main character go to worlds like Yavin IV and Korriban to look for clues to the  Sith. Ossus would also be interesting, except it is already more or less destroyed by this point...

 

As for the cast, it depends a lot on what changes are made to the engine itself. I like most of the  characters in the games so far, but let's face it - with only three places open in the group, and one of those always taken by the main character, chances are you'll use only a few characters, and those tend to be the same characters every time.

 

In KotOR1, I mostly used the Jedi characters (Bastila, Jolee, Juhani) next to Revan, and only occasionally the rest. HK-47 would make it into the group only for his responses, and I never used T3 at all. Ever! Yes, you need him to enter the Sith base on Taris (since Mission can't open no matter what her Security is), so I bought at the droid shop, walked the short way over the Sith base, had T3 unlock the gate, then removed him from the party before entering the base and never used him again.

 

In KotOR2 I used T3 a lot more because Peragus demanded it (and because I could level him up to his maximum while leaving all the potential Jedi undeveloped), but it still doesn't mean I use all the characters - in KotOR2 I instead never or very rarely used G0-T0...

 

Now, that's just waste of good character potential. I guess the large cast is there so you have something to choose between as a player no matter what sort of characters you like, but to me it looks like wasted character potential since you'll never be using all those characters. Besides, many of them are still forced on you in specific situations, or you have to deal with during cutscenes in the plot.

 

My suggestion would be to either increase the number of available characters in the active group (there really is no logical reason to limit the number anyway) or else simply trim the number of potential characters down. Having so many characters in the group that you just cannot use due to forced game mechanics is rather annoying.

 

That doesn't necessarily mean that the overall number of NPCs has to be smaller, though - you can still have a large cast of characters walking in and out of the group instead of, like now, have them remain permanently once they join. For example, you could have characters like the disciple or the handmaiden early in the game only to later leave the group when other characters join. There could even be hateful relationships between characters, where some characters refuse to stay in the group if others join. At bit like the Mira/Hanharr relationship in KotOR2.

 

As for the plot, the events of the previous games have left the galaxy rather short on jedi for us to play in the next game. It can change, but at least we should begin where the games have left us until now. In all probability, the game will set up situations similar to that in KotOR2, where the alignment and gender of both Revan and the Exile will be decided by the player.

 

If the Exile is set to light side, then the new character could be a student from a Jedi academy built by one of the Jedi characters from KotOR2 (Visas might be the most obvious). If not, then the character might begin as a Sith. In either case, I'd like the game to begin with the new character following a master as an apprentice in a Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan or Obi-Wan/Anakin relationship. Isn't it a bit odd that the KotOR games haven't really explore the master/apprentice relationship yet?

 

It could also be interesting to have the master be Revan in disguise. After all, Revan can be both good and evil and male or female, but the teacher is just mysterious and secretive for a very long time. Or the main character could have a teacher who is killed early in the game and who is then hunted by the enemy while looking for a new master to learn from.

 

Another interesting option might be to have the main character be a powerful force sensitive character (like Anakin) who still hasn't committed to either side of the force (force adept is a legal class in the tabletop d20 RPG), and who is then promptly sought out for apprenticeship by both the Jedi and the Sith. Which way to go is then for the character to decide. The character could being as a 0-level character making the choice to be apprentice during the intro. A character thrown into the middle of things in such a way would be a nice homage to Luke Skywalker.

 

Or the character could be a former Mandalorian Jedi, who was thrown from the Jedi order due to his or her background, or who left in disgust at what the Jedi did to the Mandalorians. That could set up some really interesting situations with both Revan and the Exile (and Mandalore, too, come to think of it...).

 

The plot will be more difficult because it needs to consider all the potential choices made during the previous games, and to be perfectly honest it looks to me like a storyteller's nightmare to reconcile all that has potentially happened into one plot... No idea how they'll do it (well, maybe an idea, but it still looks daunting), but it'll be interesting to see, unless they just ignore all the loose ends.

 

Size is likely to be a problem, but I'd say cut down a bit on the dialogue in some cases. You should be able to talk to lots of people, but especially in KotOR2 I find that there are a large number of people who have little or nothing to say, while there are a few people who go on and on and on. Some of the conversations with Kreia or the HK-50 unit on Peragus are mind-bogglingly long. I want dialogue, but keep it to the point - I'll continue asking questions if I feel like it, so I don't need the game to force it on me.

 

Whatever happens, we need to have a character that is rather easy to identify with, as that was a major problem for me with the Exile in KotOR2. I mean, in the first game you don't know that you're Revan (though there are certainly clues), and once you find out, you've heard so much about Revan that you're somehow ready for it. In KotOR2, however, the Exile is a general of the Mandalorian Wars who did a lot of things he or she is not so happy about and which he or she doesn't like to talk about, and so I don't actually know the character I'm suppossed to play very much. That makes it all but impossible to identify with the central character, and I'm actually still rather uncertain about what the Exile did and didn't do during the Mandalorian Wars. That's not a good basis for a role-playing game.

 

The search for Revan and the Exile should also be important. Personally I'd really like the idea of getting both of the previous PCs in the group as NPCs at very high levels (starting at level 20+) at some point. Of course, they should both have unique abilities. For example, the Exile should definitely have Force Sight and either Force Crush or Force Enlightenment based on whether he or she is set to dark or light side.

 

While there were no unique powers for Revan in KotOR1, he can easily have learned unique powers during his long seclusion and study of the ancient Sith or even simply remembered some of the powers he used to have as the dark lord.

 

They should also both have other unique abilities that define their individually established strengths. For example, the Exile is the perfect general, while Revan is the master strategist and tactician.

 

The influence system was a nice addition in KotOR2, but it really is in bad need of severe revision. It's basically a good idea, but it fails to take into account what sort of influence you've had over the characters. For example, it's fine that the Handmaiden is intended to be basically light side and want you to do benign things, but if you're very dark sided and have influenced the Handmaiden a lot toward the dark side, then she shouldn't continue to react positively only to light side choices. That's inconsistent and needs to revised badly.

 

I mean, of course influence is and should be more relevant to a light side character - friendship and trust are light side concepts after all, while nobody likes being manipulated and treated like dirt, so naturally the dark side options should cost allies - nobody will like you if you tell them they're stupid and worthless except as expendable sacrifices. Then again, KotOR2 didn't do that either, and if that's too problematic, then it's better to remove the influence system entirely.

 

Well, just a few thoughts...

 

question what jedi acadmey? there no more councilm jedi are nearly wiped out. yea i understand we all having different ideas on three. but some of you are totally disregarding what happen in two. sorry i offend anybody.

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question what jedi acadmey? there no more councilm jedi are nearly wiped out. yea i understand we all having different ideas on three. but some of you are totally disregarding what happen in two. sorry i offend anybody.

 

I'm not ignoring what happened in the last game, but the thing is that if you played light side and set Revan to light side, then there can still be Jedi left such as the Exile's companions (Atton, Handmaiden, Visas, Bao-Dur, Mira...) and possibly even Atris, if she turned back to the light side. And we know Bastila is still around.

 

Also, while the academy on Dantooine was rebuilt only to have all the Jedi masters there die and most others were killed on Katarr by Nihilus, we still haven't heard anything about what, if anything, happened to the Jedi Council on Coruscant.

 

And we do know there is a Jedi council on Coruscant. When Revan reaches the enclave on Dantooine in KotOR1, he/she comments that he thought the council was on Coruscant. Vandar replies that this is correct, but that the enclave is simply a training facility. So the fate of the council on Coruscant is still uncertain.

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question what jedi acadmey? there no more councilm jedi are nearly wiped out. yea i understand we all having different ideas on three. but some of you are totally disregarding what happen in two. sorry i offend anybody.

 

I'm not ignoring what happened in the last game, but the thing is that if you played light side and set Revan to light side, then there can still be Jedi left such as the Exile's companions (Atton, Handmaiden, Visas, Bao-Dur, Mira...) and possibly even Atris, if she turned back to the light side. And we know Bastila is still around.

 

Also, while the academy on Dantooine was rebuilt only to have all the Jedi masters there die and most others were killed on Katarr by Nihilus, we still haven't heard anything about what, if anything, happened to the Jedi Council on Coruscant.

 

And we do know there is a Jedi council on Coruscant. When Revan reaches the enclave on Dantooine in KotOR1, he/she comments that he thought the council was on Coruscant. Vandar replies that this is correct, but that the enclave is simply a training facility. So the fate of the council on Coruscant is still uncertain.

 

very true, but i said nearly wiped out. yea your right i forgot about the high coucil for moment. but i don't see intruducing a new character that has no idea what going story wise. i believe three will be a epic ending not a beginning. i wasn't refering to you. find some of ideas good. i was refering to the ones like the hutt with lightsabers and such.

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Either way, I think a young character has more realism to it when it comes to making hard and/or bad choices. Kids/young adults don't have a lot of experience and it can be easier for them to fall. With that I have my biggest issue.

 

Dark Side and Light Side need to be revamped. The choices are way too obvious. I want real choices, and many of them -- I want to feel like I'm a real person and not Buddy Jesus or Lucifer -- I mean honestly, I don't have to have evil intentions by going into a cantina and threatening everyone instead of inquiring about them. I want a Dark Side that is plausible and a Light Side that isn't so mamby pamby or however Alec Guinness said it.

 

 

right, I also think there needs to be a clear "non-bully" DS response everytime and a clear "I don't want DS or LS points right now" response just about everytime.

 

The reason why you are playing someone with a "hidden past" is that it makes it much easier to write the game with both a DS path and a LS path because by simply expressing your views on what you have already done, that allows you to customize the character dark or light very quickly.

 

However, I would ask the larger question: "Why should you go LS instead or DS?"

OK, yes, the roleplay side is important to some of us but gameplay-wise what is the reason? I personally would like to see two seperate games, one geared to LS path and one geared to DS path. In either game, you could still stray from your path but you are ultimately trying to do two different things. The LS guy is trying to save the Republic and then rebuild the Jedi Order, the DS guy is cooperating with the Sith and, ultimately, hopes to supplant the Sith leadership (with himself).

 

I like the influence thing in general but I thought it was too easy to shift the NPCs' alignment. Influence should not be alignment-based at all, IMO. The answer to the alignment problem of NPCs is to simply have the ability to let some passengers go and take on others that are closer to your alignment (or for whatever reason you choose).

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Man there is some good idea moving around in this thread!

 

I don't really have much to add, but one thing is for sure, regardless of what they do, they need to close it properly! Give the people closure! For pete's sake don't leave us hanging again.

 

My list of things I hope for in KOTOR3 is pretty simple:

 

- find some way to give some closure to the key elements of KOTOR2 that were left unfinished

- end this one properly

- take the time to iron out bugs in the game and in the plot

 

In some ways I think there are hints given to what characters are likely to return from Kreia's future-telling at the end... eg: Mira's future didn't sound like it was made for a return in kotor3, however visas' just sounded like it had more potential... or maybe thats just wishful thinking :thumbsup:

 

On top of that though, im not even sure how the dark side/different paths affected the appearance of party members... is it possible that you can play the game so that Visas isnt there at the end? If so (for any of the main party characters) then maybe it introduces too much complexity for the developer to deal with when starting the new game?

 

Either way, if they dont work them in, please find some way to tie up the end to kotor2! ahh!

 

- Dan

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Either way, I think a young character has more realism to it when it comes to making hard and/or bad choices. Kids/young adults don't have a lot of experience and it can be easier for them to fall. With that I have my biggest issue.

 

Dark Side and Light Side need to be revamped. The choices are way too obvious. I want real choices, and many of them -- I want to feel like I'm a real person and not Buddy Jesus or Lucifer -- I mean honestly, I don't have to have evil intentions by going into a cantina and threatening everyone instead of inquiring about them. I want a Dark Side that is plausible and a Light Side that isn't so mamby pamby or however Alec Guinness said it.

 

 

right, I also think there needs to be a clear "non-bully" DS response everytime and a clear "I don't want DS or LS points right now" response just about everytime.

 

The reason why you are playing someone with a "hidden past" is that it makes it much easier to write the game with both a DS path and a LS path because by simply expressing your views on what you have already done, that allows you to customize the character dark or light very quickly.

 

However, I would ask the larger question: "Why should you go LS instead or DS?"

OK, yes, the roleplay side is important to some of us but gameplay-wise what is the reason? I personally would like to see two seperate games, one geared to LS path and one geared to DS path. In either game, you could still stray from your path but you are ultimately trying to do two different things. The LS guy is trying to save the Republic and then rebuild the Jedi Order, the DS guy is cooperating with the Sith and, ultimately, hopes to supplant the Sith leadership (with himself).

 

I like the influence thing in general but I thought it was too easy to shift the NPCs' alignment. Influence should not be alignment-based at all, IMO. The answer to the alignment problem of NPCs is to simply have the ability to let some passengers go and take on others that are closer to your alignment (or for whatever reason you choose).

 

i can see intruducing a young padawan in a new storyline not the the current storyline though. in fact i like the idea just not for the ending to this current storyline. but i do agree the ls and ds need to be revamped. and influcence need to better too.

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