The List of Continuity Mistakes

[gamesneal]

The Basilisk can look like whatever LA or Oe wants it to look like. We had the M-24 tank, the M-48, the M-60. Perhaps these are Mark-I, Mark-II Basilisks.

[Kissamies]

Eventually the revisionists are going to come out and change Virago's official description to mention that it was modeled after the ancient Basilisk war droids. Well, that's not so awful solution.

[Darth Nuke]

The Basilisk in KOTOR 2 is a Stealth model. So the Virago was designed off the stealth model, not the battle droid.

[Darth Nuke]

There was no Mandalore on Kashyyk. There were Mandalorians sent by, Mandalore the Ultimate, to kashyyk.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But that means they would've had to have been sent, before Mandalore the Ultimate perished?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Exactly

 

 

Hey, don't look at me, I always assumed that another Mandalore rose not long after Ultimate. And that a Mandalore was around during the time's of KOTOR.

 

But no, Obsidian wanted Canderous to be Mandalore.

[DarkLordSkorpion]

One thing I hated was that even after I became a Sith Lord, I was STILL reffered to as a Jedi. Sion, Telos military, etc. I mean come one, there's a big difference between the two. You'd think that with all the other things aside, you could at least be called a Sith ONE time. (Well I think you are on Onderon but that's beside the point!)

[Ulicus]

"new mistake

 

According to KOTOR, HK was built before Malachor. However according to KOTOR 2 HK is built after Malachor. Which can't be correct because HK is supposed to fight Mandalore the Ultimate, and since Mandalore the Ultimate was killed by Revan at Malachor Hk couldn' t have faught him.

 

Unless of course HK got beat by a Dead Man"

 

Unless you take the viewpoint, as I did- that Revan went evil right at the start of the Mandalorian Wars and thus his war to conquer the galaxy actually began then.

 

To be honest, I think that was more likely a mistake of Bioware than Obsidian. Since Canderous' stories made it clear there was no longer a Mandalore.

[Darth Nuke]

"new mistake

 

According to KOTOR, HK was built before Malachor. However according to KOTOR 2 HK is built after Malachor. Which can't be correct because HK is supposed to fight Mandalore the Ultimate, and since Mandalore the Ultimate was killed by Revan at Malachor Hk couldn' t have faught him.

 

Unless of course HK got beat by a Dead Man"

 

Unless you take the viewpoint, as I did- that Revan went evil right at the start of the Mandalorian Wars and thus his war to conquer the galaxy actually began then.

 

To be honest, I think that was more likely a mistake of Bioware than Obsidian.  Since Canderous' stories made it clear there was no longer a Mandalore.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Um, what?

 

HK in KOTOR 2 says he was built after Malachor. Mandalore the Ultimate, was dead then, and thus HK couldn't have faught him after Malachor.

 

KOTOR implys his creation before Malachor, because that's when Mandalore the Ultimate was still alive.

[213374U]

HK in KOTOR 2 says he was built after Malachor. Mandalore the Ultimate, was dead then, and thus HK couldn't have faught him after Malachor.

 

KOTOR implys his creation before Malachor, because that's when Mandalore the Ultimate was still alive.

Um, IIRC, there was no explicit mention to to the *exact* moment Mandalore was killed. But that's still irrelevant because HK implies that he was built after the battle of MV, and that was the final battle of the war. A continuity mistake indeed.

 

But that's the price you've got to pay to have old characters back, I suppose. Nobody likes to work with other people's characters and I can understand they took certain... liberties.

[Ulicus]

"new mistake

 

According to KOTOR, HK was built before Malachor. However according to KOTOR 2 HK is built after Malachor. Which can't be correct because HK is supposed to fight Mandalore the Ultimate, and since Mandalore the Ultimate was killed by Revan at Malachor Hk couldn' t have faught him.

 

Unless of course HK got beat by a Dead Man"

 

Unless you take the viewpoint, as I did- that Revan went evil right at the start of the Mandalorian Wars and thus his war to conquer the galaxy actually began then.

 

To be honest, I think that was more likely a mistake of Bioware than Obsidian.  Since Canderous' stories made it clear there was no longer a Mandalore.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Um, what?

 

HK in KOTOR 2 says he was built after Malachor. Mandalore the Ultimate, was dead then, and thus HK couldn't have faught him after Malachor.

 

KOTOR implys his creation before Malachor, because that's when Mandalore the Ultimate was still alive.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You meant that the other way around right?

 

KotOR *implies* his creation after Malachor, but doesn't explicitly state it:

 

"You created me shortly after you and your apprentice began your war to conquer the galaxy"

 

Now when is that hmmm? Everyone assumed it was *after* the Mandalorian Wars, I'd say it was pretty much at the start of the Mandalorian wars, especially with what we know about Revan's motivations from KotOR2.

 

(also think about it- why would Revan send HK-47 into "Mandalorian Space" after there WASN'T ANY MANDALORIAN SPACE LEFT????!!!! The clans had disbanded after the MW. "Mandalorian Space" was no more. Also, I think Revan would want to assassinate mandalorians during the Mandalorian Wars as opposed to after them)

 

I haven't had enough influence with HK to get his KotOR 2 conversations so there might be some confusion.

 

Also, where the HELL has this "Mandalore the Ultimate" stuff come from? It sounds distinctly Supershadow in origin...

[Goodwood]

Agreed, when did this "the Ultimate" get added to the last Mandalore's title?

 

Also, in KotOR I, if you talk to Canderous enough, he mentions the Sith in the MW. Something to the effect of "the Sith came to us with an offer -- to fight the best the galaxy had to offer", which refers to the Republic and the Jedi by extension. At that time he says he's been fighting "across the galaxy for forty of your years", which implies that he did not fight in the Sith War started under Exar Kun.

 

However, I too did not have the influence necessary to get HK to spill his guts insofar as his memories go. Such is the price of being an LS player...

[Ulicus]

Agreed, when did this "the Ultimate" get added to the last Mandalore's title?

 

Also, in KotOR I, if you talk to Canderous enough, he mentions the Sith in the MW. Something to the effect of "the Sith came to us with an offer -- to fight the best the galaxy had to offer", which refers to the Republic and the Jedi by extension. At that time he says he's been fighting "across the galaxy for forty of your years", which implies that he did not fight in the Sith War started under Exar Kun.

 

However, I too did not have the influence necessary to get HK to spill his guts insofar as his memories go. Such is the price of being an LS player...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Or a DS player who gets him too late to find enough moments to influence him...

 

I still think if you had a high repair skill you should have been able to "hack influence" into HK-47. I mean, everyone deserves to hear his story... I did get the soundfile of his description of the past party members on the net though. Funny.

 

Apart from the fact that in a moment of geekness I said, "No, Bastila and Revan kissed in the dormatories not the cargo hold!"

 

I suck.

[Darth Nuke]

"new mistake

 

According to KOTOR, HK was built before Malachor. However according to KOTOR 2 HK is built after Malachor. Which can't be correct because HK is supposed to fight Mandalore the Ultimate, and since Mandalore the Ultimate was killed by Revan at Malachor Hk couldn' t have faught him.

 

Unless of course HK got beat by a Dead Man"

 

Unless you take the viewpoint, as I did- that Revan went evil right at the start of the Mandalorian Wars and thus his war to conquer the galaxy actually began then.

 

To be honest, I think that was more likely a mistake of Bioware than Obsidian.  Since Canderous' stories made it clear there was no longer a Mandalore.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Um, what?

 

HK in KOTOR 2 says he was built after Malachor. Mandalore the Ultimate, was dead then, and thus HK couldn't have faught him after Malachor.

 

KOTOR implys his creation before Malachor, because that's when Mandalore the Ultimate was still alive.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You meant that the other way around right?

 

KotOR *implies* his creation after Malachor, but doesn't explicitly state it:

 

"You created me shortly after you and your apprentice began your war to conquer the galaxy"

 

Now when is that hmmm? Everyone assumed it was *after* the Mandalorian Wars, I'd say it was pretty much at the start of the Mandalorian wars, especially with what we know about Revan's motivations from KotOR2.

 

(also think about it- why would Revan send HK-47 into "Mandalorian Space" after there WASN'T ANY MANDALORIAN SPACE LEFT????!!!! The clans had disbanded after the MW. "Mandalorian Space" was no more. Also, I think Revan would want to assassinate mandalorians during the Mandalorian Wars as opposed to after them)

 

I haven't had enough influence with HK to get his KotOR 2 conversations so there might be some confusion.

 

Also, where the HELL has this "Mandalore the Ultimate" stuff come from? It sounds distinctly Supershadow in origin...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

There is still a Mandalore Sector. Which IS MANDALORIAN SPACE.

 

Well according to HK, he faught Mandalore the Ultimate, or another Mandalore.

[Darth Nuke]

Agreed, when did this "the Ultimate" get added to the last Mandalore's title?

 

Also, in KotOR I, if you talk to Canderous enough, he mentions the Sith in the MW. Something to the effect of "the Sith came to us with an offer -- to fight the best the galaxy had to offer", which refers to the Republic and the Jedi by extension. At that time he says he's been fighting "across the galaxy for forty of your years", which implies that he did not fight in the Sith War started under Exar Kun.

 

However, I too did not have the influence necessary to get HK to spill his guts insofar as his memories go. Such is the price of being an LS player...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The Mandalorian War, Mandalore, was given the title in the Mandalorian Article in insider issue 80. So according to continuity he will forever be known as, Mandalore the Ultimate.

 

Why?

 

First the Sith: In KOTOR 2, again it is implied that the the Sith were the reason for the Mandalorian Wars. The True Sith.

 

Back to the Why? (The article doesn't mention the sith, but since they were apart of the reason, I'll add them) The Sith put into the mind of the Mandalore/Mandalorians that the great climatic war was coming for the Mandalorians. This made the Mandalorian see there leader as the Great God that would lead them into war. Thus he became, Mandalore the Ultimate.

[Darth Nuke]

Oh and just incase you might wonder, "What were the other Mandalore's called?"

 

Mandalore the First: first Mandalore, and the conquerer of Mandalore

Mandalore Indomitable: Sith War

Mandalorian the Ultimate: Mandalorian War

Mandalore the Resurrector: Clone War

[213374U]

I haven't had enough influence with HK to get his KotOR 2 conversations so there might be some confusion. 

Um, actually, HK explicitly states that he believes that the battle of Malachor V could have made Revan reflect on other ways than genocide to achieve his goals. Thus, HK-47 was born. Even if HK is wrong, he wouldn't make this assumption if he had been created before Malachor V. So, yes, it's a continuity mistake no matter how you look at it.

[Ulicus]

I haven't had enough influence with HK to get his KotOR 2 conversations so there might be some confusion. 

Um, actually, HK explicitly states that he believes that the battle of Malachor V could have made Revan reflect on other ways than genocide to achieve his goals. Thus, HK-47 was born. Even if HK is wrong, he wouldn't make this assumption if he had been created before Malachor V. So, yes, it's a continuity mistake no matter how you look at it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Ok, fair enough. I'll just choose not to listen to that dialog... (well I'll listen to it, then reload and not listen to it)

 

As for the Mandalorian titles... yuk.

 

Not fond of that idea- personally I always liked the notion that the Mandalorians tried to present Mandalore as unkillable- so if Mandalore was about to face death he'd leave his mask behind (or if he died it would be on him obviously) and then whatever mandalorian happened upon him would know that "their tradition must continue" and just take on the mantle of Mandalore. Thus Mandalore would be presented as this ever-living being (in terms of tradition, obviously they'd know he was mortal)... kinda like what happens with the Phantom.

 

Of course that was thrown out with KotOR2 (probably other EU stuff before too) saying they were selected (it makes more sense, but it's not as cool). Of course, Canderous also says "I *am* too Mandalore, I found his helmet!" which I found funny.

[AlanC9]

The fact that Malachor V was the last major battle does not mean that the war was over. There probably was a lot of mopping-up to do.

 

And Mandalore the Ultimate (ick) was still alive after Malachor V. Mandalore the not-so-Ultimate (i.e., Canderous) states that Revan executed him.

 

So it's all reconcilable. Revan built HK-47 to try and track down Mandalore so the war would be conclusively over. That didn't work, but Revan eventually caught up with Mandalore anyway.

[AlanC9]

You can ride IN your car, I don't know many people who ride ON their cars. Be a little dangerous. Oh and Canderous does say that it's his armor protecting him, 6 centimeters of armor that is. Canderous also speaks of how his Basilisk squad destroyed an entire section of a fleet. Those Virago's couldn't have done that, but the weapons on the beast could.

 

Man -- doen't anyone remember how to open dialog.tlk?

 

Canderous actually says both "riding in" and "riding on top of" Basilisks, so I don't know what kind of conclusion to draw. Unless the pilot rides outside and passengers ride inside? In that case, the only continuity problem in K2 is that we don't see the pilot sitting on the Basilisk

 

Also, it's 15 centimeters of armor plate, not six. That's awfully thick for personal armor.

 

And he does not specifically mention using Basilisks in that fleet action. He only speaks of them when talking about planetary assaults.

[Darth Nuke]

I haven't had enough influence with HK to get his KotOR 2 conversations so there might be some confusion. 

Um, actually, HK explicitly states that he believes that the battle of Malachor V could have made Revan reflect on other ways than genocide to achieve his goals. Thus, HK-47 was born. Even if HK is wrong, he wouldn't make this assumption if he had been created before Malachor V. So, yes, it's a continuity mistake no matter how you look at it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Ok, fair enough. I'll just choose not to listen to that dialog... (well I'll listen to it, then reload and not listen to it)

 

As for the Mandalorian titles... yuk.

 

Not fond of that idea- personally I always liked the notion that the Mandalorians tried to present Mandalore as unkillable- so if Mandalore was about to face death he'd leave his mask behind (or if he died it would be on him obviously) and then whatever mandalorian happened upon him would know that "their tradition must continue" and just take on the mantle of Mandalore. Thus Mandalore would be presented as this ever-living being (in terms of tradition, obviously they'd know he was mortal)... kinda like what happens with the Phantom.

 

Of course that was thrown out with KotOR2 (probably other EU stuff before too) saying they were selected (it makes more sense, but it's not as cool). Of course, Canderous also says "I *am* too Mandalore, I found his helmet!" which I found funny.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I don't think they called them by full title during the time they were living. Well perhaps, Mandalore the Ultimate.

[jedipodo]

Isn't it a continuity mistake that a "true" Sith Empire exists during the time of Kotor2? And here I don't think of the legend, that it has been totally smashed in the Hyperspace War, but rather of the story of Exar Kun and Ulic QuelDroma.

 

These two guys had been declared as the last Sith Lords by the ghosts of the former great Sith Lord Marka Ragnos and others. As the heirs of the Sith idea they should reestablish the old glory of the Sith and restore the Sith Empire (not to mention here that they failed).

 

And there is the problem. I think it is implausible that these ghosts shouldn't have known about an already existing Sith Empire, because time and space is not a bound for a Sith ghost like Ragnos or the one who persued Kun. And please don't say, that they simply weren't saying Kun the truth...

[Laozi]

The whole EU is one long lumbering contuinity mistake. Why get your panties in a bunch about people just continuing the continuity mistakes?

[jaguars4ever]

The whole EU is one long lumbering contuinity mistake. Why get your panties in a bunch about people just continuing the continuity mistakes?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Shocking lack in values! There's one in every production line! [/Nur Ab Sal]

 

^_^

[Chris Avellone]

Approved or not, LFL didn't look much into your concept art. They probably saw your design, said ok, and that's how it went. A month later they approve the Beast as the real Basilisk War droid in the Mandalorian article.

 

Really? Well, okay, if you say so. I really wouldn't feel comfortable making that kind of assumption myself.

 

Yeah, I think the Basilisk (10+ years before K2, if I recall correctly, I may be wrong) didn't look very good, along with certain other elements and design elements that were presented during that time period (mystical power amulets, the pace and reasons for Ulic's fall, huge insect ships, etc, etc). Warb Null, in particular, was a huge favorite around the office, and I can show you the cartoons at some point if you'd like.

 

In any event, there's probably hundreds of variations of the basilisk over the centuries. And if you have a problem with the Valley of the Sith Lords, well, I don't know what to tell you. I noticed the discrepancy, and didn't really care - it would have been nice if they could have somehow crammed the TOJ version into the X-Box (because I thought the TOJ was a good depiction, actually), but it was still beautiful to go down that valley in K1, see the sunset, and see the statues off in the distance. So just relax. Enjoy the view. Let Korriban seep into your veins and calm you.

 

My opinion is this: If you need the security a strong continuity provides, you may not want to seek psychological security in Star Wars, Star Trek, or any other science fiction series (or computer game continuity). There's holes, gaps, and other problems - my suggestion to you would be to just try to relax a little and enjoy the escapism. When escapism becomes work, an obssession, or is just stressing you out in general, then it's not doing its job and you need to take a step back and take a breather.

[Darth Nuke]

Problem is that the Mandalorian Article define's the Basilisk as a beast. You should read the article by Abel G. Pena sometime. Good Mandalorian info ,and I believe they say the Basilisk in KOTOR 2 was a Stealth version, not a battle droid.

 

So as far as I'm concerned the Beast still exist, and I would hope that some respect would come into the fold next time you need a Basilisk in a game. Some people, like myself, might actually like the beast. I mean would it have been nice of you to have redesigned the beast so it still looked like the beast, but less stupid? Or was completely copying a Virago Star Fighter the way to go?

 

It's not a matter of changing things, it's a matter of not having respect for other peoples stuff. Star Wars has a messy continuity, but a continuity that is fixed and patched up most of the time. If there's a problem, it's usually fixed.

 

But enough of Basilisk. Tell me Chris, how does HK fight Mandalore the Ultimate when he's dead?

[Chairchucker]

See, this is why Bioware is doing their own IP now. No fans whining about what they're doing to some other IP.