Light and Dark

[FireWolf]

I've been thinking about this. I've been reading the New Jedi Order series from the Expanded Universe, I enjoy the books apart from one or two things which I feel were entirely unnecessary. I won't mention what, because that'd be spoiling things, and likewise no spoilers here from anyone else.

 

One thing I have noticed in the books is the constant battle faced by light-side Jedi against falling to the Dark side. I don't think anyone can disagree that, in the original Kotor, you were using the force aggressively. There are some things which don't make sense. In the NJO series it points out how all Jedi use force persuasion to attain their needs. Luke, for example, uses a force "nudge" on his words to increase his persuasive powers. They use force persuasion to make guards forget their passing when it suits them and so on.

 

Where does the line between light and dark blur? In kotor, if it followed the established means of going to the dark side (using the force to directly harm people, like force lightning) using those powers would send you down the dark side path. Every time you used that power aggressively, you'd be gaining dark side points. Conversely, when Qui Gon Jin tries to use Force Persuade to use Republic credits, that's not considdered a dark side move. But in Kotor, it would be because it's manipulating people for your own ends.

 

Another discrepency seems to be that, in the books, normal actions don't send you down one or the other path. Its only the misuse of the force that truely sends you down that path. In Kotor, though, its through personal actions that you gain the most dark side points, not through power use.

[Darque]

Conversely, when Qui Gon Jin tries to use Force Persuade to use Republic credits, that's not considdered a dark side move. But in Kotor, it would be because it's manipulating people for your own ends.

 

How do you really know?

 

From what I remember Qui Gon followed a jedi path different from the norm. (some sort of living force philosophy or something that most others didn't subscribe to)

 

Maybe it was a dark side move... but not enough to make him a darksider :ph34r:

[Darth Sun_Tzu]

Yes but he did not do it for his own personal gain, instead he did it to help the queen leave tatooine and reach the capital. I would say it was a selfless act!

[Ratamacue]

Yes but he did not do it for his own personal gain, instead he did it to help the queen leave tatooine and reach the capital. I would say it was a selfless act!

Right. You have to look at it in context. Ordinarily, if Qui-Gon had been trying to just buy something for personal gain, yes, that would have been a dark act. But in the grand scheme of things, it would have made things much simpler in obtaining a hyperdrive in order to get the Queen to Coruscant in order to try to find a way to end the siege on Naboo.

 

However, despite that example, there are some inconsistencies between the movies, games, books, etc. However, with the NJO, you have to remember that Luke had very little guidance on how to rebuild the Jedi Order, hence there are going to be some dissimilarities between the "policies" of the old and new Jedi Orders.

[FireWolf]

Whatever policies Luke chose to base the NJO on, falling to the dark side remains the same path. I can't see how personal interpretation affects the path. If Luke decreed that using force lightning in defense of others was ok, it would still lead to the darkside, regardless of intentions.

 

Problem with Qui-gon's example is that, if you look at the grand context of the Kotor game, the credits you "liberate" from people via force persuade can be used to purchase weapons and equipment which furthers your cause to save the galaxy. So is that a bad act? Its still forcing people against their will, exactly what qui-gon was doing. Regardless of the way you look at it, Qui Gon was trying to rob Watto since he was offering a currency that was not legal tender. He could have traded the droids or actually worked for the item.

 

Taking the easy way is not necessarily the right way. Qui-gon was a rebel, more like Jolee with the whole neutral thing, but he still has to answer for his short term consequences as well as long term.

[Indalecio]

Problem with Qui-gon's example is that, if you look at the grand context of the Kotor game, the credits you "liberate" from people via force persuade can be used to purchase weapons and equipment which furthers your cause to save the galaxy. So is that a bad act? Its still forcing people against their will, exactly what qui-gon was doing. Regardless of the way you look at it, Qui Gon was trying to rob Watto since he was offering a currency that was not legal tender. He could have traded the droids or actually worked for the item.

 

Taking the easy way is not necessarily the right way. Qui-gon was a rebel, more like Jolee with the whole neutral thing, but he still has to answer for his short term consequences as well as long term.

The thing here, nowhere in KOTOR does your success rest solely on one use of Affect Mind. You have plenty of ways of solving puzzles and overcoming obstacles. Qui-Gon had very little recourse. Watto's was the only shop that sold the hyperdrive he needed, and he wasn't taking Republic credits.