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Coronavirus Goes Fourth


Amentep

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10 hours ago, Elerond said:

Like I said there seem to be no information where they were meant to go. AZ says that EU and COVAX program, but considering as most of them are from Halix factory which AZ has not applied approval from EMA, that seems bit strange.

EU still has not given any official statement about their investigation about those doses. So admitted isn't probably right term to use at least yet.

They've told the press to stop saying they were going to Britain- and the stated destination on some packages was Belgium. That's certainly enough to say that they weren't going to Britain, which was the initial accusation. Expecting an out and out admission or apology from the EU is not realistic in the current climate, they will just hope that everyone forgets about it.

Approval for Halix has also been sought.

10 hours ago, Darkpriest said:

And EU still does not want to look into a Russian vaccine.

As Elerond mentioned it's under EMA consideration now. The Russian approach was to do bilateral deals eg with Hungary, rather than approach the EU. That approach was definitely done as a 'wedge' issue, but it wouldn't have been a wedge issue if the EU rollout had been halfway decent and not left countries scrambling.

10 hours ago, Elerond said:

But Sputnik probably will not help EU any way as Russia don't have enough production capacity. Russia offered to Finland technology and patents to produce Sputnik here, but there isn't any realistic scenario where we could produce significant amount of doses before autumn 

Multiple countries will be making Sputnik pending approval including some with significant capacity like Italy. Adenovirus vaccines are not difficult to make, and if you can make the AZ one you can make Sputnik. The only complication is it using 2 different vectors instead of one, but then that's why its efficacy is a decent amount higher than others and only just behind the far more expensive Pfizer/ Moderna.

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38 minutes ago, Zoraptor said:

They've told the press to stop saying they were going to Britain- and the stated destination on some packages was Belgium. That's certainly enough to say that they weren't going to Britain, which was the initial accusation. Expecting an out and out admission or apology from the EU is not realistic in the current climate, they will just hope that everyone forgets about it.

Initial accusation was from Italian equivalent of The Sun. EU has still not given any official information about they investigation.

Belgium was not the final destination for the doses, but where they would have packed for shipping. 

AZ is only one that has given any official statements about their final destination, which they say were EU and COVAX program, even though most of the doses where from the mentioned Halix factory, which AZ sought approval from EMA after EU had started its investigation. 

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The EU briefed on the basis that they doses were intended for the UK, there's no doubt of that as it can be read in literally every story about the '29 million dose cache', not just an Italian Scum equivalent. Even the use of the word 'cache' is clearly designed to be emotive and set a specific narrative- it was clandestinely and deliberately hidden- since it was used instead of a neutral word. There was zero evidence that that was true, all they had was speculation and a desire to make anyone apart from them the villain of the piece.

Let's be frank here.

Fundamentally, the EU could have ordered AZ vaccine earlier than the UK did and avoided all of this, but they didn't. That's the core issue, everything else is window dressing- or faecal matter thrown at a fan.

Not ordering early was a deliberate, calculated position made 100% voluntarily by the EU and in retrospect, but also to many at the time, utterly stupid*. They only ordered AZ doses after Sanofi had failed, and well after the UK had ordered theirs. If Sanofi had succeeded and AZ failed would the EU let the UK queue jump to cover up their failure? Not on your fricking nelly; they'd be snickering into their sleeves about the rosbifs backing the wrong horse and how terribly terribly tragic it was that the UK wasn't in the EU any more so missed out. The EU deliberately gambled with their strategy and lost; now the toys are coming out of the cot and they're resolved to fix things by threatening to just grab as much of the stake as they can back unilaterally.

How did they gamble? They tried to cheap out by not ordering enough doses under the belief they could leverage better deals, and they backed the wrong horses for something like 350 million doses worth; and having done that they've whined like nothing else in existence in the hope that they'd be allowed to queue jump over the UK that ordered 100 mln doses, early. They're now threatening to steal doses on the basis of 'fairness'. Fairness that would never in a million years have been in evidence if the roles were reversed. To quote the great philosopher Scott Steiner again: "no simpy". 100% a crisis manufactured in the EU, by the EU. To be fair, partly by bad luck, but then they were also the only bloc that managed to back two losing horses for the large majority of the vaccines they ordered because they were European. Ironically the only successful Euro vaccine is one most people think is actually American...

*even if Sanofi and CureVac succeeded (on time for CureVac, since at least it recently passed Phase 2 unlike Sanofi) they'd still only ordered enough doses for 1 per citizen. And if you're altering reality to make them succeed then that reality might have the BionTech vaccine not work in which case they're down 100 mln doses again. OTOH we've ended up with 4 doses per citizen here, despite having no covid, because we ordered early from multiple vendors. The EU could have done that but they cheaped out, so now they'll just steal other countries' vaccines while still claiming the moral high ground.

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There's an interesting chart on the bottom of this NPR article:

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/01/28/960901166/how-is-the-covid-19-vaccination-campaign-going-in-your-state

What really stands out to the eye is how larger states are having a more difficult time getting their population vaccinated. The states of CA, FL, NY, and TX are all on the low end. They must be having more of a challenge getting the vaccine distributed.

"It has just been discovered that research causes cancer in rats."

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1 hour ago, Zoraptor said:

The EU briefed on the basis that they doses were intended for the UK, there's no doubt of that as it can be read in literally every story about the '29 million dose cache', not just an Italian Scum equivalent. Even the use of the word 'cache' is clearly designed to be emotive and set a specific narrative- it was clandestinely and deliberately hidden- since it was used instead of a neutral word. There was zero evidence that that was true, all they had was speculation and a desire to make anyone apart from them the villain of the piece.

Let's be frank here.

Fundamentally, the EU could have ordered AZ vaccine earlier than the UK did and avoided all of this, but they didn't. That's the core issue, everything else is window dressing- or faecal matter thrown at a fan.

Not ordering early was a deliberate, calculated position made 100% voluntarily by the EU and in retrospect, but also to many at the time, utterly stupid*. They only ordered AZ doses after Sanofi had failed, and well after the UK had ordered theirs. If Sanofi had succeeded and AZ failed would the EU let the UK queue jump to cover up their failure? Not on your fricking nelly; they'd be snickering into their sleeves about the rosbifs backing the wrong horse and how terribly terribly tragic it was that the UK wasn't in the EU any more so missed out. The EU deliberately gambled with their strategy and lost; now the toys are coming out of the cot and they're resolved to fix things by threatening to just grab as much of the stake as they can back unilaterally.

How did they gamble? They tried to cheap out by not ordering enough doses under the belief they could leverage better deals, and they backed the wrong horses for something like 350 million doses worth; and having done that they've whined like nothing else in existence in the hope that they'd be allowed to queue jump over the UK that ordered 100 mln doses, early. They're now threatening to steal doses on the basis of 'fairness'. Fairness that would never in a million years have been in evidence if the roles were reversed. To quote the great philosopher Scott Steiner again: "no simpy". 100% a crisis manufactured in the EU, by the EU. To be fair, partly by bad luck, but then they were also the only bloc that managed to back two losing horses for the large majority of the vaccines they ordered because they were European. Ironically the only successful Euro vaccine is one most people think is actually American...

*even if Sanofi and CureVac succeeded (on time for CureVac, since at least it recently passed Phase 2 unlike Sanofi) they'd still only ordered enough doses for 1 per citizen. And if you're altering reality to make them succeed then that reality might have the BionTech vaccine not work in which case they're down 100 mln doses again. OTOH we've ended up with 4 doses per citizen here, despite having no covid, because we ordered early from multiple vendors. The EU could have done that but they cheaped out, so now they'll just steal other countries' vaccines while still claiming the moral high ground.

You making lots of assumptions and speculating Zora, I understand you dont like the EU but you have to move on from the days of Serbia being bombed for its belligerence ....and anyway that was the USA that was involved in those punitive military strikes 

Remember Serbia is part of the EU now, even they didnt  decide to join Mother Russia despite the unfortunate time after the collapse of the USSR with the wars in Bosnia and Kosovo

Dont be a hater. The EU is your friend and despite all your predictions of its imminent collapse( and you keep bringing up Gromnirs mispredictions around the 6 month collapse of Russia) the EU is still here  and will continue to be here tomorrow

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"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Zoraptor said:

I'm sure Sarex will be surprised to find out that Serbia is part of the EU now.

For that matter, the EU itself would be surprised to find that Serbia is part of it.

You nitpicking now, you know very well that Serbia wants to join the EU and is basically in negotiations and has been for years. The point being its not part of the failed Russian block that the likes of Belarus are part of and it could join the Russian block anytime it wants 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1414638/AstraZeneca-EU-vaccine-row-warning-Pfizer-profit-Covid19-jab-von-der-Leyen-latest-VN

ASTRAZENECA insiders have revealed they would not repeat their vaccine at cost model for another pandemic after they faced criticisms from the EU and after seeing the profits made by rivals.

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"Cuius testiculos habeas, habeas cardia et cerebellum."

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The most UK press headline ever there.  Well, no, I am sure the Mail could come up with worse.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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The beaches are FULL. A lot of people in Brazil simply don't care about lockdown and covid. At all.

Last year only about 40% of people respected lockdown. I hoped they would have learned a lesson.

Ew-o-S1a-XEAAv-Sht.jpg

Edit: this was two weeks ago, but it continued to increase at least until yesterday or two days ago. Haven't checked any news today.

Edited by InsaneCommander
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sign.jpg

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https://www.dispatchlive.co.za/news/2021-03-29-aspens-gqeberha-factory-to-make-millions-of-covid-19-vaccines/

At last some good news for SA around the Vaccines and our  battle to address the virus  spread

Aspen Pharmaceuticals is a SA listed company and will be producing the J&J vaccine, it cant be sooner enough  for me to take the vaccine 🥳

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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15 hours ago, InsaneCommander said:

 

The beaches are FULL. A lot of people in Brazil simply don't care about lockdown and covid. At all.

Last year only about 40% of people respected lockdown. I hoped they would have learned a lesson.

Ew-o-S1a-XEAAv-Sht.jpg

Edit: this was two weeks ago, but it continued to increase at least until yesterday or two days ago. Haven't checked any news today.

Its strange behavior we see throughout the world when it comes to this rejection of the virus and how it spreads despite all the deaths and hospitals getting full in numerous countries which have mishandled the pandemic. What I think makes it worse is  when any government also rejects the virus and science like Bolsonaro still does 

The same thing  happened in the USA, and still does to certain degrees, under Trump where in certain states you can see people not wearing masks and restaurants and beaches full with people not adhering to virus protocols like social distancing. But you see less of this under Biden because they have a cogent and established virus policy and acceptance of the pandemic 

Edited by BruceVC
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"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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This is worrying. 

https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/new-covid-19-waves-sweep-through-asia

 

Also this

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-56517495

 

And this

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/a-city-in-brazils-amazon-rain-forest-is-a-stark-warning-about-covid-to-the-rest-of-the-world/

 

These two strains give me a headache, how to approach the topic, and if we are not running head first into some major outbreak. Like we had an earthquake first, and now we will be caught by a tsunami. 

 

 

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23 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

This is worrying. 

https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/new-covid-19-waves-sweep-through-asia

 

Also this

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-56517495

 

And this

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/a-city-in-brazils-amazon-rain-forest-is-a-stark-warning-about-covid-to-the-rest-of-the-world/

 

These two strains give me a headache, how to approach the topic, and if we are not running head first into some major outbreak. Like we had an earthquake first, and now we will be caught by a tsunami. 

 

 

The numerous virus strains we see globally should be a huge concern to all of us. And as these articles mention this is caused when you allow the virus to spread exponentially and dont try to stop it

The only sustainable solution to stop these mutations of the virus is vaccines so that the virus is not able to mutate as it spreads to thousands of different people 

The good news at the moment is the current  vaccines just need to altered in documented cases to stop spread of most virus variants. Because it is normal and expected for any virus to mutate in order to survive, we just need to slowdown and eventually eradicate the spread from most of  our countries

But without an effective vaccine strategy you have very little  chance of stopping the virus and its mutations  

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Texas cases continue to drop after Governor lifted lockdown and masks order. He was heavily criticized that getting rid of those will increase the cases. Opposite happened, proving that neither lockdown or masks had positive effects but rather negative ones. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/covid-19-hospitalizations-cases-continue-dropping-in-dfw-across-texas-thursday/2595409/%3famp

166215__front.jpg.45518d58bdab611f0e3a026d3b8c6489.jpg

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19 minutes ago, Skarpen said:

Texas cases continue to drop after Governor lifted lockdown and masks order. He was heavily criticized that getting rid of those will increase the cases. Opposite happened, proving that neither lockdown or masks had positive effects but rather negative ones. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/covid-19-hospitalizations-cases-continue-dropping-in-dfw-across-texas-thursday/2595409/%3famp

I'd be careful here, as correllation does not equal causation. 

There might be other factors affecting the drop. 

We've seen with Sweden, that 'no-masks' had not have some major positive outcome (other than not going into excessive debt) 

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Covid cases dropping after vaccination begins? Who could've thunk

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Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary. - H.L. Mencken

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https://apps.texastribune.org/features/2020/texas-coronavirus-cases-map/

Vaccine doses reported
 INCREASED
An average of 250,448 vaccine doses were reported each day in the last week.
As of March 31, 14.3% of Texans have been fully vaccinated.

Average new cases
 INCREASED
by 166 cases compared with the seven-day average a week ago.
On April 1, 2,409 new confirmed cases and 797 new probable cases were reported.

Hospitalizations
 DECREASED
by 456 patients compared with a week ago.
As of April 1, 2,954 Texans are hospitalized for the coronavirus.

Average new deaths
 DECREASED
by 20 deaths compared with the seven-day average a week ago.
On April 1, 118 new deaths were reported.

I am not sure if those statistics with that vaccination rate give any case for celebration. Especially if average new cases continue to rise there is high probability that hospitalizations and deaths will follow

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The U.S. isn't losing to Russia and China on vaccine diplomacy. It's not even playing. (msn.com)

The U.S. is so internally fractured and divided and suffering from an identity crisis that it gives others a shining opportunity to exploit it.

“If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.” 

-Ulysses S. Grant

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16 hours ago, Skarpen said:

Texas cases continue to drop after Governor lifted lockdown and masks order. He was heavily criticized that getting rid of those will increase the cases. Opposite happened, proving that neither lockdown or masks had positive effects but rather negative ones. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/covid-19-hospitalizations-cases-continue-dropping-in-dfw-across-texas-thursday/2595409/%3famp

Coo

Too bad the same isn't happening in Florida.

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Guess we'll see what effect Easter has in Texas.  Also, Austin's still under mask mandate, and people may be wearing masks because they choose to.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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1 hour ago, Malcador said:

Guess we'll see what effect Easter has in Texas.  Also, Austin's still under mask mandate, and people may be wearing masks because they choose to.

Texas is also not a densely populated state. 

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