Jump to content

Politics 20/20 now with extra hindsight!


Recommended Posts

13 minutes ago, Elerond said:

image.png.4bf61bd9356fa5d1a55516e6c0b2a3be.png

Mysteriously in swing state Florida there seem to be quite lot counties where votes went only to Trump. But as they are for Trump we know there was now cheating in these republican controlled counties 😇

I think there were dems calling some issues with votes in FL. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

Grab some snacks and booze

I wonder what other things people will latch onto during this process of vote counts, recounts and lawsuits

Poor US Rebel. The world must seem like such a scary place for him. :(

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, uhm. I hear a sound too, but it's certainly not victory. :p

  • Haha 3

We all have signed the pacts, we knew so well nothing was left
We are being born at the sound of ends, and yes we still believe in beauty
It used to be the pride of Man, now a flame put out by the cold in his hand

Link to post
Share on other sites

So if Trump doesn't win, does that mean God clearly anointed Biden and the evangelicals will all fall in line?

  • Hmmm 1

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Achilles said:

So if Trump doesn't win, does that mean God clearly anointed Biden and the evangelicals will all fall in line?

No way, it just means Satan won with some heavy voter fraud.

We all have signed the pacts, we knew so well nothing was left
We are being born at the sound of ends, and yes we still believe in beauty
It used to be the pride of Man, now a flame put out by the cold in his hand

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, majestic said:

No way, it just means Satan won with some heavy voter fraud.

Frickin' Satan. Always with the antics.

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites

Disregard. Thought that was a clip, not a livestream.

Edited by Achilles

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Achilles said:

If I'm an elected politician, I'm focused on keeping my constituency happy so that I can stay in office.

If Action X makes 30% of the people I represent happy, but pisses off the other 70%, then not taking it makes sense but only if I know I face a real political consequence for doing so.

If Action X makes 30% of the people happy and every single one of them votes, while only some of the other 70% will, then it absolutely makes sense for me to take Action X.

Every single person in that other 70% can vote "no confidence" and I'm still safe as houses so long as I'm keeping my 30% happy.

It's not until voters coalesce around another candidate who can garner 31% or more that I face any real threat. And if the only vehicle they are using to attempt this is a mark on a ballot every couple of years or some white-hot memes on social media, then it's entirely possible that I could die in office before that threat materializes.

I mean sure, but that certainly isn't a 'practical' example, in any sense.

If the Biden/ Trump race had resulted in 70% of people voting no confidence it would be very, very difficult politically for either* to claim victory because more than 2/3 of people expressly wanted neither of them. You'd be looking at nearly 5 times as many people voting no confidence as for either candidate individually. While it may not be a tangible thing 'confidence' is the one critical factor in every single successful democratic process. I guess there's some question about whether the US qualifies for having a 'successful democratic process', at the moment, but it should, and dissatisfaction with that process is exactly what a no confidence option would express.

In any proper process under the situation outlined above you'd be gone if 70% actively voted no confidence- because you'd be an active embarrassment to your party or there would be credible alternatives. You'd be encouraged to resign, primaried, deselected, whatever; or you'd simply lose to that alternative. Ultimately a 'no confidence' option expresses exactly what it says, no confidence in the candidates or process. If you're winning with 30% turnout and 70% voting no confidence then as above it's pretty much QED that the process deserves no confidence in it. I'd go further than that even, if you win under those circumstances and remain as elected your system simply isn't a democracy at all.

*Trump would anyway though, of course, but then Trump is the outlieriest of outliers and doesn't care about things like 'confidence' except his own sense of it. Biden might too, but only to stop Trump

Link to post
Share on other sites

All day today: Do we have an official Pres. yet? ... Nope, nope, nope.  (repeat, repeat, repeat)

This is probably the most keenly interested I've been in a Presidential race/outcome in my lifetime and ... argh.  Maybe by the weekend?

Side note:  I wouldn't want a vote-counter job.

“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Zoraptor said:

If the Biden/ Trump race had resulted in 70% of people voting no confidence it would be very, very difficult politically for either* to claim victory because more than 2/3 of people expressly wanted neither of them.

No it wouldn't. The exact same process would play out, but with significantly fewer votes to count. Whoever got the plurality of the EC would be President and 70% of the electorate would get the warm satisfaction of knowing that the world went on without them.

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, LadyCrimson said:

All day today: Do we have an official Pres. yet? ... Nope, nope, nope.  (repeat, repeat, repeat)

This is probably the most keenly interested I've been in a Presidential race/outcome in my lifetime and ... argh.  Maybe by the weekend?

Side note:  I wouldn't want a vote-counter job.

 I think you might wait till Jan for the official 😅

Link to post
Share on other sites
35 minutes ago, Achilles said:

So if Trump doesn't win, does that mean God clearly anointed Biden and the evangelicals will all fall in line?

It just means that Biden is working with the devil and they need to pray harder to be heard. I'm not even kidding, I actually believe that's how some of those "evangelicals" think.

“He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein

Link to post
Share on other sites

Can some please clarify why are almost all states able to count all of their votes but  those who are tightly contested for some reason can't? Some like 80% counted in day, but the rest of 20% needs like three days to count? 

In some areas suddenly floods, in other areas ' hey counters, take it easy, go home and rest, no hurry here'. In other places they are returning ballots to be filled out properly because allegedly they are not. 40 000 votes can't be counted in one day because they have only 5 scanners for the ballots and don't have enough space to bring in more? 

What the hell?🤔

Link to post
Share on other sites

They aren't being exceptionally slow, you just don't hear about updates from, say, California because it's already massively in Biden's favour and the extra votes change nothing.

2 minutes ago, Achilles said:

No it wouldn't. The exact same process would play out, but with significantly fewer votes to count. Whoever got the plurality of the EC would be President and 70% of the electorate would get the warm satisfaction of knowing that the world went on without them.

They'd have exactly the same number of votes to count, we're talking an active no confidence option. Votes still have to be counted, whether someone has ticked Biden/Trump/ 3rd party/ No Confidence.

I have to admit, imagining Trump or Biden- even Obama, Reagan, Clinton- trying to lecture some other country over democracy having been elected by 15.1% of US voters would be highly amusing. You can't have a democratic system without the participation of the demos, it's, to coin a phrase, in the name. Sure, politicians could try and carry on as if everything was normal, but you wouldn't be doing so in a democracy.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Well that speech was something.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, LadyCrimson said:

All day today: Do we have an official Pres. yet? ... Nope, nope, nope.  (repeat, repeat, repeat)

This is probably the most keenly interested I've been in a Presidential race/outcome in my lifetime and ... argh.  Maybe by the weekend?

It might not be called by tonight, but it should be for sure by tomorrow if not. If yesterday looked 95% like Biden, it is 99% right now with Georgia, Pennsylvania, and Nevada all but his (and still likely but not certainly Arizona). I could see a network calling it tonight in order to get a head-start on everyone else when it seems so certain.

Relatedly, the second Georgian senate race has been officially called to go to run-off. Two Georgian senate elections in January!

Edited by Bartimaeus
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Hildegard said:

Can some please clarify why are almost all states able to count all of their votes but  those who are tightly contested for some reason can't? Some like 80% counted in day, but the rest of 20% needs like three days to count? 

In some areas suddenly floods, in other areas ' hey counters, take it easy, go home and rest, no hurry here'. In other places they are returning ballots to be filled out properly because allegedly they are not. 40 000 votes can't be counted in one day because they have only 5 scanners for the ballots and don't have enough space to bring in more? 

What the hell?🤔

Each state has their own rules and deadlines for mail-in and/or absentee ballots. The states that are taking a really long time are the states that either have terrible rules, generous deadlines, or some combination of both.

1 hour ago, Zoraptor said:

They'd have exactly the same number of votes to count, we're talking an active no confidence option. Votes still have to be counted, whether someone has ticked Biden/Trump/ 3rd party/ No Confidence.

You are correct, but still missing the point. The 70% will intentionally take themselves out of the game, which will be decided by the 30%.

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Hiro Protagonist said:

I'd say once PA flips, the networks will call it.

Yeah, Biden could lose NV and AZ and still win with PA.

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I’ve heard about Trump’s speech earlier my biggest fear isn’t far-right militias trying to live out their Turner Diary fantasies, but rather the fact that unless the 25th Amendment is invoked Trump will still have the Biscuit for two and a half months.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/12/01/no-one-can-stop-president-trump-from-using-nuclear-weapons-thats-by-design/

  • Like 1
Quote
"Turned wrong way round, the relentless unforeseen was what we schoolchildren studied as 'History,' harmless history, where everything unexpected in its own time is chronicled on the page as inevitable. The terror of the unforeseen is what the science of history hides, turning a disaster into an epic.”

 

-Philip Roth, The Plot Against America

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Gorth locked this topic
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...