Faith and Conviction - Paladin question

[Samugol]

Hi,

I am about to finish PoE1 and I am close to starting Deadfire. Since I decided to play a Paladin multiclass (based on some nice feedback from the lovely people here). I do have some question about the paladin's Faith and Conviction, more specifically:

There are some dialogue options in PoE1, where it is simply impossible to choose the right conviction answer. For example if I play a kind wayfarer in PoE, whose favorite dispositions are Benevolent and Passionate, I am not able to choose these in some conversations as only Cruel, Rational, Aggressive and Stoic options are available. Since the negative ones for Kind Wayfarer are Deceptive and Cruel, I avoid those and choose one of the Rational, Aggresive or Stoic and it does not affect the Faith and Conviction. Furthermore, in PoE1, dispositions that are "neutral" - not favored or disfavored do not play a role in Faith and Conviction. Also, it is possible to max out the Faith and Conviction bonus with just a single one disposition, let us say that as a Kind Wayfarer you only choose Benevolent, but not passionate, you are able to max the Faith and Conviction bonus. Is this the same in Deadfire? What are the differences? Is it possible to mas Faith and Conviction with only one of the favored dispositions? Do neutral dispositions play any role? How about negative dispositions?

I always try to roleplay, so I want to know what I am getting myself into. If the Faith and Conviction would be too limiting, I may rethink what paladin order I play. Thanks for any info on this.

 

[thelee]

you might want to consult the bottom part of my guide for the specific mechanics about how faith & conviction work: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/227477-pillars-of-eternity-ii-deadfire/faqs/76599/paladin

 

the tl;dr is that you need to get both your two favored dispositions up to at least three to max it out, you can't get away with just one disposition. neutrals don't help and are essentially just "safe" options for RP purposes. negative dispositions hurt you one for one against positive dispositions, though a total "negative score" isn't as bad as one might think because of how badly the designers messed up inversion math for this. however, unlike poe1 where you could take a talent to reset your negative dispositions, there's no such option in deadfire so you need to be more careful.

FYI, i'm not sure if you meant this, but you seem to indicate that it was possible to max out faith and conviction in poe1 with just a single disposition - this is not true. You needed at least 5 total favored disposition scores to do that, and you could only get as high as 4 in any given score. you might be confusing it with the effect of faith and conviction on hired adventurers, which didn't benefit/suffer from disposition at all (but they are affected by disposition in deadfire, so you have to be careful to only hire compatible paladins and priests. this doesn't apply to obsidian-created NPCs). FYI I also have a pillars of eternity 1 guide that goes into this a lot more: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/687020-pillars-of-eternity/faqs/72035 (it's older, so it's in text and you have to do a search for "Faith and Conviction" to find the details)

 

final note - "favored" dispositions doesn't mean "only correct" dispositions. There's no problem for RP purposes in picking a neutral option - your deity or order doesn't mind. They only mind if you pick a disfavored reputation.

Edited August 28, 2020 by thelee

[Samugol]

Thank you very much sir, and yes, I may have been misinformed about the PoE1 dispositions a bit. I want to play The Steel Garrote paladin. I actually really like "rational" but I am not a huge fan of "cruel". I do not mind being cruel to some bad characters, or to those that deserve it. What I am worried about is that the "cruel" disposition = puppy killer disposition. I remember in PoE1 you could attack a child and kick him on the ground... That is not a nice option. It is great to pick the safe neutral dispositions though.

I will check the math you posted, hopefully, it will become clearer. Thanks agains sir.

[thelee]

3 minutes ago, Samugol said:

I actually really like "rational" but I am not a huge fan of "cruel". I do not mind being cruel to some bad characters, or to those that deserve it.

if it helps, there are a couple of "cruel" options that are just more "i'm sometimes a jerk" versus "i'm a sociopath." i don't know if it's enough to get to a high cruel disposition, though. an example is you can be a jerk to queen onekaza for some major cruelty points, and depending on how you've been RP-ing, your response is less like "i'm a candy-stealing jerk" and more like "i'm definitely going to be siding with a different faction than work for you, lady"

[Samugol]

43 minutes ago, thelee said:

if it helps, there are a couple of "cruel" options that are just more "i'm sometimes a jerk" versus "i'm a sociopath." i don't know if it's enough to get to a high cruel disposition, though. an example is you can be a jerk to queen onekaza for some major cruelty points, and depending on how you've been RP-ing, your response is less like "i'm a candy-stealing jerk" and more like "i'm definitely going to be siding with a different faction than work for you, lady"

That actually helps a lot :D. The thing is, that if I take a whole lot of Rational and a Couple of Cruel options, I do not think it will affect the defenses of a character that much. Even if it would be something like 10 in all defenses vs 15 in all defenses, I do not think it would be worth it, role play wise. I also do not plan to play on the highest difficulty, so it will probably work out anyway...

[thelee]

also just wanted to add an extra note - i haven't played a steel garotte, but i have played several priests of skaen, who feature cruel as one of the dispositions. in deadfire, you actually get some skaen-specific dialogue given that you follow a deity that has a portfolio that includes overthrowing slaveowners and violent revolution. in that sense, some cruel options works out in an RP sense as caring about people, but definitely not caring about people with power. i'm sure there's some good RP reason for cruel options with a paladin order that followed woedica as well (it would be kind of the flip side to skaen i imagine, being cruel to people outside the boundaries of norms and law)

[Boeroer]

Well... "keeping your oath" applies to nobles as well as peasants. If a nobleman breaks his oath to protect his peasants: "Nobody expected the woedican inquisition - with a few skaenite henchmen!"  

Edited August 28, 2020 by Boeroer