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2 hours ago, Samugol said:

This is so much true. I mean working on some crazy crafting system when combat, visuals, magic and other core systems are not done well is utterly pointless. However, if these things are done well and the team has resources. It would be a waste not to do it. Take Outer Worlds. The game had great core elements, so adding simple crafting system was a great addition. I think that choosing to only alter some statics and not make completely new things was a brilliant decision. And honestly if a game like Outer Worlds can have crafting with a FRACTION of budget Avowed has, it fills me with great hope that we will not only see great crafting but other non traditional elements, that we might not even fathom at this point.

The Outer Worlds does have a simple crafting system.

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44 minutes ago, the_dog_days said:

The Outer Worlds does have a simple crafting system.

Mmmmm is it not what I wrote? "so adding simple crafting system was a great addition".¬† I did not play too much of the game yet (I am waiting for all the DLCs so I can get the GOTY edition) I was under the impression that you can only add some things to weapons from what my friend told me (like a scope or something). If you can completely craft new things, it just underlines the point I was trying to make ūüėĄ If decent crafting can be in a budget title, it sure can be in a much bigger project.

Edited by Samugol
typos
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10 hours ago, the_dog_days said:

The Outer Worlds does have a simple crafting system.

I can’t say I remember crafting being there. You could upgrade weapons, to keep them relevant, but I don’t remember crafting anything. 

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4 hours ago, Wormerine said:

I can’t say I remember crafting being there. You could upgrade weapons, to keep them relevant, but I don’t remember crafting anything. 

I think he means mods and tinkering.  It's borderline crafting I suppose.

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I guess you could make the case that enchanting and upgrading are crafting mechanics. 

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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I'm fine with "crafting" as long as it's more or less what we had in deadfire.

Being a full time Smith or  an armorer makes no sense in a videogame where you are neither, but an adventurer.

Romances are cringe and have no place in a proper RPG, unless they are super subtle. Or well done, which won't happen unless they waste a considerable amount of time and resources on romances, which is a waste in that caste.

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I dunno I made a high level career out of crafting in LOTRO, it was like fetch quests but on my own initiative.  Maybe strike a balance between resource gathering and killing the multi-faceted landlord in East Bogland.

There's a right way to do everything, you just have to balance personal opportunities with....the big picture.

Edited by ComradeMaster

'He who seeks to defend everything, defends nothing."

King Frederick the Great of Prussia

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On 8/18/2020 at 7:07 AM, Armon said:

I know there might be another post with something similar to what mine is but I wanted to start fresh.

I've heard it said on many YouTube videos that Avowed is going toe to toe with Elder scrolls and if that is ultimately true then here is my list of what I want to see done in Avowed that wasn't done right in ES.

CRAFTING -

I want to see a more expanded crafting system, if I hunt Deer or Boar then I want Deer hide/ Boar hide to be a useable crafting material offering different stats/bonuses when crafting.

The crafting system must include a far more expanded list of items, for example in ES - Here is the materials needed to craft leather armor - craft it in the one style with same materials - now you're done. There is no other style or materials that could alter the appearance or bonuses on that armor. If I kill a Dragon in Avowed and loot Dragon hide then craft Dragon hide leather armor - I want it to not only look different from bear hide leather armor and again look different from boar hide leather armor but on top of that I want the hide to offer bonuses like +str +res + major fire resist* with an armor value fitting dragon hide. Troll hide leather armor could offer me +str +con +average regen buff with an armor value fitting troll hide.

The same applies to weapons, I want to craft different weapon parts to mix and match making a 1h I craft at lvl 3 look different from the next 1h I decide to make at lvl 10 and so on ...

This system should be applied to blacksmithing offering different types of ore with different bonuses and buffs.

STORAGE & PLAYER HOMES-

I know there won't be an infinite storage box in Avowed (unless it's a magical storage box we summon at any time) and that there will be more likely player homes or temporary storage devices until we as the player get a more permanent setup.

This topic falls back on crafting as I want to be able to craft different size backpacks, satchels, bandoliers with the different types of leathers that will be available in world and again offering me different sizes and storage space.

Player homes - this is something I felt Bethesda seriously failed at with Hearthfire offering players 3 homes in identical locations with the exact same building options only through mods was I able to change locations or add further building options. ( I saw that Avowed will support mods  8D Awesome).  I want player homes to not only be in unique locations but also offer different building options that match that region. If I buy a house that is situated next to a river then I want the option to build a fishery that can supply me with a reasonable amount and different variety of fish per day. If I buy a house that is in the mountains I want the option to build a mine that I can go to each day and mine different basic - medium ore.

LIGHTING -

This is a major requirement for me in Avowed. During my playthrough of Skyrim I tried 3 different lighting mods that each improved certain aspects of lighting in different areas/zones. For example- Lighting in towns or inside buildings where lighting is present would be very different from the lighting seen in outside areas or dungeons. While using the same mod the lighting in dungeons would be almost non existent even with torches or braziers in the area. I want dungeons to give me a sense of darkness not completely blind me so I can't even see my weapon in front of me.

I would also like the inclusion of lanterns that can be equipped to my characters belt or backpack as I won't always play a character with one free hand to use a torch  and having to switch from S&S to sword and torch breaks the immersion for me. 

SOUND -

This is another major aspect for me and is very simple to summarize - I want to hear everything and I mean EVERYTHING! I want epic music.

CLASSES -

This is an epic must have no matter the cost in the game content.

If I decide to play a chanter I want to perform those songs in taverns/inns to pay for food and temporary lodging or if Obsidian is going for a make your own class while you play route then I want "perform" as a skill that can be used in taverns/Inns. I want meaningful class quests that allow me to expand my powers/abilities or offer unique loot. If I play a rogue then I want a quest to enter a town/city to be a stealth mission - If I play a warrior then the same quest becomes an assault quest. 

QUESTS & BOUNTIES - 

As stated above I want meaningful class quests that are tailored to class I'm playing. I don't want to be playing a warrior that gets a rogue quest to sneak in to a village - HOWEVER! this line of quests is still good as it encourages additional playthroughs to see the different choices I could/should/would have made if I was that class.

Bounties - I loved this aspect in PoE & PoE2 and I want to see it return in Avowed. I want bounty boards in small towns/villages and bounty npcs in all major cities.

PREPARATION, BUFFS, FOOD, POTIONS, SPELLS.

I wanted to add this while it was still fresh in my mind. I just finished the oracle fight in Forgotten dlc and had to drop the difficulty down from Veteran to classic. The biggest issue I had with this fight was zero preparation before hand. I can't use potions or spells until I enter combat forcing me to IMO "waste time" buffing while the Oracle casts multiples spells. I loved this aspect in The Witcher and TES and hope to see it in Avowed. If I know I'm going in to a difficult fight then I want to consult my Bestiary and prepare with potions + spells + food to get the maximum benefit during a fight and from there I only need to focus on keeping certain buffs active and healing myself when needed. 

This can also be applied to runes, traps, and if you're going to add things like shrines to give us a specific buff depending on what god we choose to support. This comment also falls back on my previous content about armor offering different buffs and stats. All of this would make the game not only far more enjoyable at harder difficulties but also the immersion of the world and the zone/area we're in.

 

I will continue to update this as I put my thoughts together because at the moment it's all a jumble. I'm excited for Avowed a lot more than I'm for the next ES game.

 

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2 hours ago, Armon said:

*anti-bloat snip*

While I always enjoy having some options such as unique player homes, specific class-tailored quests and abilities, and extensive crafting mechanics, I really hope they leave those for updates and DLC. Or as is most likely with such content, they put them in after some miraculous event causes them to have fully developed, implemented and succesfully tested every other game aspect four months before launch as Jeff Bezos walks in to give them a few millions in development dollars.

On a more serious note: about half of these options read like you want it to be like a tabletop game without taking into account both the actual cost and the opportunity cost: implementing niche features such as class-specific quests, or money sinkholes such as player housing, doesn't just cost way more than you're likely to receive for it, it also takes away from developing the main part of the game. As for your rather.... extensive desires for unique housing and crafting:  a bonus minecraft with your RPG isn't the most reasonable of expectations, I'm afraid.

Would I enjoy those things? Of course I would. But I'd rather they focus on building a good basegame with some simple crafting mechanics like in deadfire and perhaps some basic player housing if they still have the time/money, than end up sinking too much money in minor game aspects that are unlikely to return revenue while the main RPG aspects are left wanting. e.g. Deadfire's ship combat mini-game are fun additions, but hardly worth the money sink it reportedly was.

 

I agree concerning the visuals and sound: If this is going to be Skyrim-like, an attractive, immersive world with music and visuals that make you enjoy just wandering around for a few hours are THE key aspects. Add in an actually decent combat system, some simple modding/"crafting", quests that go beyond "stab *insert person/group*" or "grab *insert item(s)*", and some obsidian-quality writing (deadfire main quest excluded), and I think most of us'll be hooked. After that, you can look at adding companions with or without reactivity, and things like housing and a more developed crafting system. But those are the base elements you need in an immersive, sandboxy CRPG. Though I hope they don't make it too sandboxy: It'd reduce plot/general writing options quite a bit.

 

As for Romance, it's never good in games like Skyrim, though I actually respect Skyrim's simple, bare-boned implementation: "here's some romance for your sandbox, now we'll let you do what you want with it while we work on the actual sandbox". Bioware does them decently, but it's a key part of their brand and they're aided by the cinematic nature of their games; a 1st-person rpg doesn't require it, and is unlikely to do it well in the first place.  If I want to get an alright romance I'll go play a visual novel, and even then I'll have to be rather discerning.

I'll be annoyed if they give me infinite storage space though. I'm probably in the minority, but I always like having to deal with weight limitations in games like Dragon's Dogma and such, and usually find myself RP'ing it in games that lack it. Especially when said game is without a ship or castle I could conceivably store my personal zoo or 500 cheese wheels in.

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I’d really love them to add a master below type of dungeon. Loads of levels full of interesting stories and monsters on each floor. I loved how varied each floor was in PoE1. I think it could really work well in avowed. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 8/20/2020 at 4:10 PM, Samugol said:

It cannot be a grind. Crafting stuff over and over to get better at might be the real work thing, but in a game, I would rather shoot myself. You want to craft better gear? Lock it behind a skill on a level up, make it so you can only learn it from an NPC that first needs to be found or needs to complete some quest. There are plenty of ways to progress crafting without the tedium of boredom.

I wholeheartedly agree with all of your points on crafting, but the section above deserves to be framed. Grinding 500 pairs of useless leather pants is poison. I don't care if boar leather is slightly pinker and dragon hide has that greenish tinge.

I want Avowed to be mysterious, complex, and deeeeeeep. If it must be a  TES game*, please make it Morrowind.

* I don't particularly want a TES game, and it won't be one without thousands of mods.

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