The Ultimate discussion thread Pt 2

[thelee]

19 minutes ago, abot said:

the isle position in the video was the first thing i tried, the only difference is that Vela walks there in the middle of dialog instead of teleporting, hopefully it is a matter of finding some way to crit her with a scroll so it lasts more

hm, are you using a scroll of binding web?

 

this is wild speculation, but it's possible that effects stop during dialogue, and scroll of binding web relies heavily on shorter duration immobilizes except the effect ticks periodically. if the binding web ends during dialogue, then you don't have a very long immobilize

[abot]

dunno, no scroll seem to work so far, I had 2 binding webs + 2 pull of eora + hitting/critting her still when I pressed the final dialog option to start the fight she walked in

[Waski]

@abot

-trigger summon from the belt

-withdraw frightened Vela

-go for a talk with beast (blight will follow you)

[abot]

I already tried that, but tried it again

-trigger summon from the belt ok

-withdraw frightened Vela ok

-go for a talk with beast (blight will follow you)
what happens to me is: blight will follow to the dialog place, nothing happens until blight is dead/combat stops. then the dialog triggers and vela is teleported

As a note, I managed to pass past a similar problem during the fight with the dragon, IMO the script there moves all allies in a certain range without nuking the summons, so keeping vela terrified on bottom works if you move near the script trigger zone 3 weapon summons + 4 skeletons + fire blight, the script on the beast of winter area is much worse

Edited December 2, 2020 by abot

[thelee]

sorry i'm being a nub here, but is there an important reason to why the blight is triggered *before* the fight begins, and not after? the combat ending is probably what's messing things up.

[abot]

1 hour ago, thelee said:

sorry i'm being a nub here, but is there an important reason to why the blight is triggered *before* the fight begins, and not after? the combat ending is probably what's messing things up.

I am not sure I understand the question, but I'll try. If by triggered you mean hitting vela until the blight is spawn, that is to start the fight and make her stand still while terrified, else I'm unable to keep her still with scrolls and she follows/is teleported when dialog with the beast starts normally out of combat.
if after starting combat with blight I go to the eastern area where the dialog usually triggers though, dialog/encounter with beast does not trigger any more while in combat mode, it only triggers when combat stops, and vela walks/is teleported depending on her distance right there

Edited December 2, 2020 by abot

[thelee]

i think i get it. i don't think fire blights will work at all, because you have to end combat to do dialogue, and ending combat will end all non-item-based effects on you or vela (which would include binding web), even if normally you can cast those effects outside of combat.

 

i think relatedly, (this is some speculation), the periodic effects from binding web and pull of eora will halt when you enter dialogue, so you'll only be relying on the last debuff that binding web managed to apply to vela, which isn't very long compared to a decent halt (which is like 30s, versus binding web will be less than half that, which is definitely not enough based on my experience with grazed halts).

 

you might just have to fight the beast of winter while keeping vela withdrawn somehow via scrolls or something. how did that single-class blood mage do it? are their replays anywhere?

[Waski]

10 minutes ago, thelee said:

i think i get it. i don't think fire blights will work at all, because you have to end combat to do dialogue, and ending combat will end all non-item-based effects on you or vela (which would include binding web), even if normally you can cast those effects outside of combat.

idk how its with the Beast but with fire dragon you can start dialog during combat and and it wont stop anything

 

13 minutes ago, thelee said:

you might just have to fight the beast of winter while keeping vela withdrawn somehow via scrolls or something. how did that single-class blood mage do it? are their replays anywhere?

mostly with temporal cocoon, it has big advantage over withdraw because you can cast it out of combat

[MT.tachi]

Did you try bounding boots?

You may be able to erase vela temporarily.

https://youtu.be/r2BcsSJVThI

[abot]

thanks! the boots work (albeit just a second before vela is able to run over the falling ice LOL), I've already managed to pass that fight in a more risky way using a lot of scrolls and staying near vela with lethandria shield healing cheese, but I will surely try the boots trick next time I have to fight the beast of winter

Edited December 5, 2020 by abot

[Waski]

Assassin attempt,  it's my second run and won't be submitted/validated so I didn't shy off from underhanded tactics.

Warning! Cheese hurts eyes.

 

 

Edited December 11, 2020 by Waski
typos

[thelee]

oh nice, i don't know why i never realize that re-equipping strand of favor stacks its beneficial effect duration lengthening.

also lol at the display bug that causes the orlan to grow to and shrink from human size in the process.

 

edit: also, i cannot imagine being such a glutton for punishment to do the ultimate more than once. more power to ya

edit 2: @Waskimind pointing out where the cheese magic starts? i'm skipping around, so i don't know at what point you apparently become perma-vanishing striked

Edited December 10, 2020 by thelee

[Waski]

hey

51 minutes ago, thelee said:

oh nice, i don't know why i never realize that re-equipping strand of favor stacks its beneficial effect duration lengthening.

also lol at the display bug that causes the orlan to grow to and shrink from human size in the process.

 

edit: also, i cannot imagine being such a glutton for punishment to do the ultimate more than once. more power to ya

edit 2: @Waskimind pointing out where the cheese magic starts? i'm skipping around, so i don't know at what point you apparently become perma-vanishing striked

i buff myself before and post giant grub fight (part 9)and then somewhere in SSS but just with +3PL from Weyc wand,  run was a little bit lucky that any of beast bosses didn't spawn with prowling (like water dragon or beast of winter) because idk how i would start fight 

Edited December 10, 2020 by Waski

[thelee]

sorry for the nub question - but i'm not totally familiar with this cheese, so the mechanics aren't totally clear to me. does time passage not reduce vanishing strikes duration? because i skipped over to hauane o whe and it appears you already have all the buffs active, despite being preceded only by travel time. have i missed something obvious about buff durations?

Edited December 10, 2020 by thelee

[Waski]

screen from test run, I think everything exept resoundig call stop counting down, never bother to double check it couse i calculated i need around 200000 sec on lowest duration  buff before eothas challange fails

[thelee]

looooooooooooooooooooool amazing

[Boeroer]

was that only achieved by re-equipping Strand of Favor???

Edit: I just tried it - it's multiplicative! I didn't know that.  So after some time it climbs really quickly obviously.

Too bad it doesn't work with stuff like Avenging Storm from Heaven's Cacophony. It gets removed as soon as combat stops.

Edited December 10, 2020 by Boeroer

[Waski]

yep it's ridiculous, never tested it but now i wonder if it's possible to grab all tier 3 inspirations out of combat by hitting shipcrew (or companions) with empowered attacks while wearing unstable coil

[Boeroer]

I guess so but I would need to test that as well. I just prolonged a Bellower's +7 PL buff to 343453456346 secs or so.  It doesn't stack with the next one - but still it's cool to always have +7 PL for your invocations.

I wonder if I can manage to prolong Whispers of the Wind's invisibility as well...

 

[thelee]

42 minutes ago, Waski said:

yep it's ridiculous, never tested it but now i wonder if it's possible to grab all tier 3 inspirations out of combat by hitting shipcrew (or companions) with empowered attacks while wearing unstable coil

i'm actually surprised vanishing strikes persists past combat - i assumed all non-item-based buffs cleared at end of combat. is it just something special about vanishing strikes, or is it something about how you buff by attacking vela out of combat?

[Waski]

1 minute ago, thelee said:

i'm actually surprised vanishing strikes persists past combat - i assumed all non-item-based buffs cleared at end of combat. is it just something special about vanishing strikes, or is it something about how you buff by attacking vela out of combat?

If you can use it outside combat you can prolong it, vanishing strike isn't restricted to combat only. You can grab invis from slippers of assassin(but it's on kill so setup to trigger is a bit harder) too and if i remember correctly it behaves similar to Arkemyr Departure (you can summon or debuff etc). Like Boeroer said WotW is another strong candidate.

Others quirks that came out: frenzy from dagger and debuff from ring of clenched muscle were procing from biding web on Vela, no clue if it triggers on other scrolls or spells

[depth]

Is it not mandatory to kill Giant Cave Grub during Cornett's Call Quest? I happened to notice while watching Višnja's SC Bloodmage run that the fight is skipped and quest is turned in. That fight can be a pain.

from Wiki:

"Kill the Tunneler below Neketaka.        Giant cave grub        During The Cornett's Call."

EDIT: Butchered the spelling of name.

Edited December 11, 2020 by depth

[Waski]

@depth no, you can kill him later

[depth]

Oh, that's nice. This is good to know. Are there other fights that don't need to be completed 'during quest' as well? The list is quite long of quests that were similarly phrased as per the qiki page I was getting my information from:

 

Defeat the Everlasting Archmage.        Concelhaut        During Bekarna's Folly
Defeat the Destroyer within Drowned Barrows.    Nemnok the Devourer    During Nemnok the Devourer (quest)
Kill the Secret of the Watershapers.        Scyorielaphas        During The Shadow under Neketaka
Kill the Terror of the Maw.            Jadaferlas the Ancient    During He Waits in Fire
Destroy the Guardian beyond the Mortar.        Guardian of Ukaizo    During The City Lost to Time
Kill the Tunneler below Neketaka.        Giant cave grub        During The Cornett's Call
Kill the Crystal Empress.            Belranga        In Mega Boss - The Crystal Empress
Destroy the Voracious Mountain.            Hauani O Whe        In Mega Boss - The Voracious Mountain
Kill the Arcane Sigilmaster.            Sigilmaster Auranic    In Mega Boss - Sigilmaster Auranic
Destroy the Ironclad Colossus.            Dorudugan        In Mega Boss - The Helfire Colossus
Kill the Abomination of Galawain.        Porokoa            During The Hunter Hunted [SSS]
Kill the Risen Dragon.                Neriscyrlas        During Death's Depthless Dominion [BW]
Defeat the Beast of Winter.            The Beast of Winter    During Death's Depthless Dominion [BW]
Kill the Memory Hoarder.            Memory Hoarder         [FS]
Defeat the Oracle.                Oracle of Wael        [FS]

[Waski]

If you can return later, you can do it whenever you want. Some encounters are 1 time only (like beast of winter or fire dragon for example)