Lampros Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 (edited) I was inspired by this post https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/105637-building-a-party-of-5-to-have-fun-in-potd/page-2 by 1TFFSSE, and I was wondering if we can come up with a similar consensus ranking of roles with the current patch, as his post is from June. Also, I'd ask for a slightly different criteria: 1. Best tanks: 2. Best melee DPS: 3. Best ranged DPS: 4. Best support: Edited October 13, 2018 by Lampros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flucas Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Great thread! Imo: 1. Best tanks: Arcane knight: best obtainable defenses, available debuffs, selfhealing Swashbuckler: good tank 'n' debuff combined with excellent selfhealing Holy Slayer: Another variant of swash, with more AR and more support blended in. 4. Best support: Theurge: chanter offers flexibility to boost offense or defense/healing, while lifegiver is best healer with some debuff and cc Liberator: best passive healing, stack +healing done gear on him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaylon Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Best tank should have sustainable defenses. If his defenses are dispelled/wear off he's not the best anymore. Or else we can consider the priest the best tank because of Barring Deaths Door+Salvation of Time. Here's my end game list considering sustainability: Best tank: Goldpact/Troubadour>Goldpact/Monk>Goldpact/Cipher Best melee dps: Soulblade/Rogue>Monk/rogue>Devoted/Rogue Best ranged dps: Monk/Rogue>Chanter/Rogue>Cipher/Rogue Best support: Cipher/Troubadour(mostly because brillance)>Paladin/Troubadour>Druid/Priest PS. Special award for the best tank/dps against enemies without Arcane Dampener Evoker/Priest with the Shroud of the Phantasm. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 13, 2018 Author Share Posted October 13, 2018 (edited) Great thread! Imo: 1. Best tanks: Arcane knight: best obtainable defenses, available debuffs, selfhealing Swashbuckler: good tank 'n' debuff combined with excellent selfhealing Holy Slayer: Another variant of swash, with more AR and more support blended in. 4. Best support: Theurge: chanter offers flexibility to boost offense or defense/healing, while lifegiver is best healer with some debuff and cc Liberator: best passive healing, stack +healing done gear on him. Sounds good - except can the Arcane Knight grab and keep aggro? Best tank should have sustainable defenses. If his defenses are dispelled/wear off he's not the best anymore. Or else we can consider the priest the best tank because of Barring Deaths Door+Salvation of Time. Here's my end game list considering sustainability: Best tank: Goldpact/Troubadour>Goldpact/Monk>Goldpact/Cipher Best melee dps: Soulblade/Rogue>Monk/rogue>Devoted/Rogue Best ranged dps: Monk/Rogue>Chanter/Rogue>Cipher/Rogue Best support: Cipher/Troubadour(mostly because brillance)>Paladin/Troubadour>Druid/Priest PS. Special award for the best tank/dps against enemies without Arcane Dampener Evoker/Priest with the Shroud of the Phantasm. I agree with the need for permanent defenses, but shouldn't tanks have good aggro maintenance (in MMROPG-speak) and keep your friends from harm, too? So I tend to think the Swashbuckler Trickster/Unbending is best. Can you explain the Chanter/Rogue for ranged DPS? What set-up? Other selections in other categories chime in with my experience, too, when applicable. aggro in any way? Edited October 13, 2018 by Lampros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaylon Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Can you explain the Chanter/Rogue for ranged DPS? What set-up? Other selections in other categories chime in with my experience, too, when applicable. aggro in any way? It's simple - the chanter can add 15% lash damage and a 40% reload reduction on top of other buffs (through invocations). Thus a chanter/rogue with the Red Hand will easily outdamage anything but a Helwalker/Rogue using the Red Hand. (And of course I'm talking about sustainable single target damage, because I'm sure some people using blunderbusses and spells/scrolls will disagree) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 13, 2018 Author Share Posted October 13, 2018 Can you explain the Chanter/Rogue for ranged DPS? What set-up? Other selections in other categories chime in with my experience, too, when applicable. aggro in any way? It's simple - the chanter can add 15% lash damage and a 40% reload reduction on top of other buffs (through invocations). Thus a chanter/rogue with the Red Hand will easily outdamage anything but a Helwalker/Rogue using the Red Hand. (And of course I'm talking about sustainable single target damage, because I'm sure some people using blunderbusses and spells/scrolls will disagree) Ah, ok. But both Phrases and Invocations help the whole party, and I tend to run a Chanter support anyways. So in this scenario where everyone gets Chanter support, the Chanter ranged DPS won't be doing more damage than pure ranged DPS. Still, it may be a good idea to combine Chanter support and ranged DPS to economize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boeroer Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Why no single classes? 1 Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 13, 2018 Author Share Posted October 13, 2018 You can; I just auto-assumed multi-classes are almost always better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boeroer Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 (edited) Maybe they are. It's rel. difficult to determine. Single classes get some of the good stuff a lot earlier and some high level stuff that is really powerful. But multiclasses' synergies are often pretty front-loaded which also helps a lot. I also ask because I don't know how "best" is defined: best at a certain "peak" or best over the course of a whole playthrough (then I don't think that one can beat Soulblade/Rogue as melee dps for example). For example the single class monk with Whispers of the Wind + Resonant Touch is doing so much dps (even if you substract the casting time) at highest levels that I believe not much can compete with that - ranged weapon or melee. But it comes superlate of course. Edited October 13, 2018 by Boeroer 1 Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 13, 2018 Author Share Posted October 13, 2018 Maybe they are. It's rel. difficult to determine. Single classes get some of the good stuff a lot earlier and some high level stuff that is really powerful. But multiclasses' synergies are often pretty front-loaded which also helps a lot. I also ask because I don't know how "best" is defined: best at a certain "peak" or best over the course of a whole playthrough (then I don't think that one can beat Soulblade/Rogue as melee dps for example). For example the single class monk with Whispers of the Wind + Resonant Touch is doing so much dps (even if you substract the casting time) at highest levels that I believe not much can compete with that - ranged weapon or melee. But it comes superlate of course. I would think from level 1-20 in a group setting would be the criteria? But this is subject to debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flucas Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 3. Best ranged DPS: SC Wizard Hellwalker/streetfighter; blunderbuss modal, can also abuse mortification of the soul to get the blooded bonus (extra nice on human; high risk high reward). Berserker/ascendent; build for mindblades is especially powerful on encounters with a large number of enemies. Once he get's 1 killing blow it becomes a machinegun. Note that mindblades works with Brute Force and also triggers blood frenzy DoT. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadas Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 Some classes aren't the best on their own or in majority of the game, but they are best in party or on hardest bosses. Those include: 1) single class chanter - simply because most hardest bosses in the game are beasts and their anti-beast chant is worth a char slot and summons are broken good in long fights 2) seer (ranger-cipher) - highest accuracy in game that pays off in hardest fights in the game on potd and all the benefits of cipher 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elric Galad Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 It depends on many factors indeed. Many classes have small utilities that can't be replicated easily by other classes. Such as : - Dispell (Wiz and Rangers) - Summons & Pet - Healing (especially passive - ancient memory, semi-passive - shepard FoD, and continuous - Pollen Patch) - Invisibility - Increasing Debuff / CC effects durations (Single Class Ranger) - Brillant Inspiration - etc... Even if Soulblade/Rogue has a higher DPS, he might not be able to deal his DPS while in pesistent invisibility from Vanishing Strike. And I think one of the reason Ranger is seen weak (especially for multiclass) is that he brings very varied abilities, ranging from dispell, "passive summon", DPS (in the semi-hidden form of ACC boni + Driving Flight), semi-hard CC (binding roots) and even a bit of mobility.On the opposite end of the spectrum, Rogue brings a very clear bonus in the DPS department, plus a couple of debuff and positionning stuff. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 14, 2018 Author Share Posted October 14, 2018 It depends on many factors indeed. Many classes have small utilities that can't be replicated easily by other classes. Such as : - Dispell (Wiz and Rangers) - Summons & Pet - Healing (especially passive - ancient memory, semi-passive - shepard FoD, and continuous - Pollen Patch) - Invisibility - Increasing Debuff / CC effects durations (Single Class Ranger) - Brillant Inspiration - etc... Even if Soulblade/Rogue has a higher DPS, he might not be able to deal his DPS while in pesistent invisibility from Vanishing Strike. And I think one of the reason Ranger is seen weak (especially for multiclass) is that he brings very varied abilities, ranging from dispell, "passive summon", DPS (in the semi-hidden form of ACC boni + Driving Flight), semi-hard CC (binding roots) and even a bit of mobility. On the opposite end of the spectrum, Rogue brings a very clear bonus in the DPS department, plus a couple of debuff and positionning stuff. Rangers have dispell?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 14, 2018 Author Share Posted October 14, 2018 It depends on many factors indeed. Many classes have small utilities that can't be replicated easily by other classes. Such as : - Dispell (Wiz and Rangers) - Summons & Pet - Healing (especially passive - ancient memory, semi-passive - shepard FoD, and continuous - Pollen Patch) - Invisibility - Increasing Debuff / CC effects durations (Single Class Ranger) - Brillant Inspiration - etc... Even if Soulblade/Rogue has a higher DPS, he might not be able to deal his DPS while in pesistent invisibility from Vanishing Strike. And I think one of the reason Ranger is seen weak (especially for multiclass) is that he brings very varied abilities, ranging from dispell, "passive summon", DPS (in the semi-hidden form of ACC boni + Driving Flight), semi-hard CC (binding roots) and even a bit of mobility. On the opposite end of the spectrum, Rogue brings a very clear bonus in the DPS department, plus a couple of debuff and positionning stuff. Rangers have dispell?! Hmm, I see it now: Concussive Tranquilizer. It's very late in the game if you multi-class; and it also requires 2 investment in skill points - so expensive. But nonetheless an option. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haplok Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Yes. But it is the best dispel+interrupt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 14, 2018 Author Share Posted October 14, 2018 Yes. But it is the best dispel+interrupt. Yeah, I was reading more about it on the forum the last few hours; I will try it out then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elric Galad Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 AoE weapon + Driving Flight by the way 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampros Posted October 14, 2018 Author Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) AoE weapon + Driving Flight by the way Darn. My Ranger multi-classed with Devoted in Hunting Bow - not blunderbuss. So no AoE weapon. And my blunderbuss AoE guy is Rogue/Monk. Speaking of blunderbuss spam AoE builds: What's the best? "Howitzer" (Rogue/Monk) or "Holy Grenadier" (Rogue/Paladin) or Rogue/Ranger (I've not seen a built posted for this, but I've seen a lot of folks referring to this path). Edited October 14, 2018 by Lampros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haplok Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) I like Rogue/Ranger. Though I guess Rogue/Helwalker is also fun. Edited October 14, 2018 by Haplok 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verde Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) Best melee DPS is Rogue/Soulblade imho. You can easily accumulate triple digit Focus with later levels and SA crit for huge damage. And with Cipher buffs/afflictions + Sneak Attacks your auto attacks do dmg as well. Later levels you get crazy synergies like Borrowed Instinct + Persistant Distraction when you become a true madman. I will say for overall balance - DPS, Tankiness, and Versatility, I'd put a single Trickster up there. But I may be biased with Rogues Edited October 14, 2018 by Verde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haplok Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 I didn't think SA could crit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verde Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 I didn't think SA could crit? I'm pretty sure I asked in a topic and you answered yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boeroer Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 Soul Annihilation as the actual attack can crit - I'm not sure atm of the raw dmg is unfluenced by it though...? I know it profits from stuff like Sneak and Deathblows so I assume crits also help - but I'm not 100% sure/forgot. Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mukurome Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 (edited) 1. Best tanks: mage/cleric of skaen - can get total of 120 deflection (50 escape +50 veil +20 safeguard) and can increase buff duration with salvation of time (if we get brilliant cloack proc, we can do this until infinity) 2. Best melee DPS: mage/cleric of skaen - citzal spirit lance+finishing blow from skaen spells - high dmg aoe in melee 3. Best ranged DPS: mage/cleric of skaen - calbedan bow have high dmg, mage have +speed spells, cleric finishing blow for more dmgalso any class + assasin - Arterial Strike is one of the best skill in case of dmg, if we hit enemy from distance, it cane take him down 1shot when he start to run 4. Best support: mage/cleric or cleric/cipher Edited October 15, 2018 by mukurome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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