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Cinéma vérité - and all other types


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#41
Raithe

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Yeah, it's a comic book movie guys. Relax.

Responses are pretty much exactly as expected

 

We watched Ocean's 8 last night and it was better than I expected but my expectations were so low that it would have been hard not to meet them. That's not to say it was a good movie or anything either as it's probably the worst of the Ocean's movies. 

 

 

 I can't believe it could be worse than Ocean's 12.



#42
ShadySands

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The movie was just lacking in most places. It had great actors but didn't give them much to do and not much character development and the heist was decent but lacked any suspense whatsoever. My wife is usually better than me at ignoring plot problems in movies and just enjoying herself but even she was like who wrote this crap. It's was just meh all around



#43
Hiro Protagonist

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Jurrassic World Fallen KIngdom. The ending reminds me a lot like

 

Spoiler


#44
Lexx

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Sounds pretty stupid to me. Humans would easily turn this into a hunting / sports game and soon the dinosaurs would be gone again.
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#45
Hiro Protagonist

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Never underestimate the stupidity of Hollywood writers and the public who would eat this up.


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#46
TrueNeutral

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Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom was a high budget B-movie. Go into it with low expectations and you'll enjoy yourself.

 

My favourite part was that they were selling dinosaurs for numbers lower than the movie's budget. "Zwenty five mill-ee-yons!"



#47
Hiro Protagonist

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I did enjoy it but yes, I found them selling the dinosaurs for such a low price funny. Also expecting the next movie to be set 5 years from now and Blue is the leader of the dinosaurs living amongst the trees and has gained the ability to talk... the T-rex just sits around like a big orange orangutan.... :lol:



#48
Hurlshot

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Watched Tag with my wife. Pretty funny, but also a bit more heartwarming than expected. It was good. Reading about the true story behind it was even better.



#49
Amentep

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Regarding JW:FK, I don't think they could realistically keep putting the genie in the bottle over dinosaurs getting off the island (how many times have pterosaurs escaped the island again? Three isn't it? And did they ever get rid of the Compys in South America?) so I'm not surprised we had a "release them all" story.

I think you'd have a hard time explaining a post-apocalyptic dino story based on the end of JWFK to fit the modern POTA films as a logical template; that story had two prongs; humanity was decimated by the virus that was making the apes smarter; consequently this gave the apes time to not be molested and grow/create their society. More than likely the next JW story will be about military forces trying to capture the escaped dinosaurs (since that seems to be the direction of the first two JWs), with a group of heroes trying to prevent that from happening while also containing the damage they're doing.



#50
Malcador

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That's pretty much what happened at Cannae, and that was numerically the worst defeat the Romans ever suffered (not as bad as others like Adrianople or the Allia in terms of actual consequences though). Might even still be the largest death toll in any single day European battle up to and including WW1&2.


Had thought Cannae was just tactical idiocy on the Romans' part rather than them losing cohesion (a la Gladiator's opening scene) where they didn't utilize their superior numbers, deployed cavalry incorrectly and got suckered by a feint. Cannae definitely does seem to be up there in total casualties on single day looking at battles, assuming the high number of 92,000 is accurate. Watling Street has 80,000 but nothing close to that until modern times in Europe on a single day.

Also didn't realize Battle of Leipzig was so bloody and large - 600k troops involved and 124k casualties - over 3 days

Edited by Malcador, 25 September 2018 - 01:31 PM.

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#51
Zoraptor

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The 'roman' (mostly allied) cavalry was just rubbish, and always was. All the large battles the Romans lost against Hannibal (Trebia, Trasimene) except Cannae involved their centre holding cohesion while the flanks got slaughtered and said centre just chopping their way through the Carthaginian line to escape, at Cannae they lost cohesion everywhere after their initial success and couldn't do that. No quarter given and the winning side having more than 20% casualties themselves led to the massive death toll, usually the losing side either surrendered or ran away.

 

Borodino is usually cited as the bloodiest day in Europe since Cannae. Even with a moderate estimate for Cannae's death toll it's still 1/20 that of a Verdun or Somme, with swords and spears, and over far less than 1/20 the time scale of those battles.

 

And to be somewhat on topic, Vin Diesel as Hannibal in the movies he was pitching would have been a sight to see.


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#52
Orogun01

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The 'roman' (mostly allied) cavalry was just rubbish, and always was. All the large battles the Romans lost against Hannibal (Trebia, Trasimene) except Cannae involved their centre holding cohesion while the flanks got slaughtered and said centre just chopping their way through the Carthaginian line to escape, at Cannae they lost cohesion everywhere after their initial success and couldn't do that. No quarter given and the winning side having more than 20% casualties themselves led to the massive death toll, usually the losing side either surrendered or ran away.

 

Borodino is usually cited as the bloodiest day in Europe since Cannae. Even with a moderate estimate for Cannae's death toll it's still 1/20 that of a Verdun or Somme, with swords and spears, and over far less than 1/20 the time scale of those battles.

 

And to be somewhat on topic, Vin Diesel as Hannibal in the movies he was pitching would have been a sight to see.

I think you might be overlooking all the prelude that Hannibal did to ensure Cannae happened that it happened the way he wanted it.
He let the Romans win a skirmish to bolster their confidence and underestimate his cavalry, and he successfully harassed the Romans into a battlefield of his choosing.
 


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#53
Zoraptor

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I'm not ignoring it as Hannibal was undoubted a superb tactician, I just didn't mention them as they weren't relevant.

 

(I am highly skeptical of some parts of the battle narrative though due to Livy and Polybius both being more than a touch prone to spreading what might now be referred to as 'fake news'. Paullus was almost certainly not blameless- his family was immensely powerful however- and the supposed cavalry ruse in Livy involving a fake surrender doesn't work well timing wise and I suspect exists to give a reason for the terrible cavalry performance blaming perfidy instead of them just being atrocious/ cowardly since a lot of prominent Romans escaped in said cavalry. That it was one of if not the single most complete victories of all time cannot really be doubted whatever the exact details)


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#54
Orogun01

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I'm not ignoring it as Hannibal was undoubted a superb tactician, I just didn't mention them as they weren't relevant.

 

(I am highly skeptical of some parts of the battle narrative though due to Livy and Polybius both being more than a touch prone to spreading what might now be referred to as 'fake news'. Paullus was almost certainly not blameless- his family was immensely powerful however- and the supposed cavalry ruse in Livy involving a fake surrender doesn't work well timing wise and I suspect exists to give a reason for the terrible cavalry performance blaming perfidy instead of them just being atrocious/ cowardly since a lot of prominent Romans escaped in said cavalry. That it was one of if not the single most complete victories of all time cannot really be doubted whatever the exact details)

The whole battle could also be framed within the context of Roman class system. Verrus was a commoner and the Roman cavalry at the time had quite the few patricians on it, as they could afford to maintain horses. I think Roman politics might have also played a role in the outcome of Cannae, the rejection of the Fabian strategy and the class divide within the Senate seem to be weak points that Hannibal exploited. Carthaginian intelligence was way ahead of its time.

PS: Movie thread, something something about movies. They all suck anyways.

Cathedral of the Sea, good TV show if you are not averse to graphic depictions of realistic themes (Translation: Its set on the middle ages and doesn't shy away from the dark events of the period, although it is never gratuitous)



#55
TrueNeutral

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And did they ever get rid of the Compys in South America?


The Compys that were only there in the novel? I don't recall that subplot making it off the page.

#56
Amentep

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And did they ever get rid of the Compys in South America?


The Compys that were only there in the novel? I don't recall that subplot making it off the page.

 

 

My memory mixed the book and Lost World Jurassic Park.  Opening of LW has the girl attacked by Compys, but that's apparently on Isla Sorna and not on the Costa Rica coast like it is in the book.



#57
TrueNeutral

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To be fair, in the books that subplot also went nowhere. :lol:



#58
Tale

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How the heck are you guys remembering that book subplot? I was obsessed with Jurassic Park in the 90s and about the only thing I remember from the books is the Pteranadon river in JP and the invisible dino in LW.

Upgrade. Unexpectedly good.


Also this was a very fun movie. I have to recommend it.

#59
TrueNeutral

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Well, for me that obsession never stopped. I re-read both books before Fallen Kingdom came out. Jurassic Park is my Star Wars and I'll stick with that franchise no matter how more awful it's bound to get. I even have some 200 hours in that new game, which by all real metrics has maybe 10 hours worth of content in it. In essence, I'm a sad nerd boy holding on to childhood nostalgia with desperation. :lol:


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#60
SonicMage117

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It's more legit. It's the Transformers movie we've always wanted in the 80's but never got.

Edited by SonicMage117, 26 September 2018 - 06:53 AM.





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