How much Armor is enough?

[jintegrity]

If you wanted to build a character (or party) around having enough Armor to take reduced damage in PotD, what would be the amount you'd need to shoot for?

For example, a Warlock (Berserker/Wizard) can get 15 Armor at creation via 10 from Fine Brigandine (with Berath's Blessing), 3 from Spirit Shield, and 2 via Hardy. Later on Pallegina will give 1 more, and later armors will also surely help.

- but (with drugs and potions both included and not) is it possible to have enough armor for a consistent -75% incoming damage? - or is it a waste of time, and Deflection stacking + CC the only viable option?

[1TTFFSSE]

you have to have both high deflection and high ar on a tank because you want to avoid getting crits from an enemy otherwise high ar means nothing.

 

I think once you are above 130 or so deflection you are good (in a party main tank). 160+ if you are soloing some fights though.

as for ar getting around 17 ar is good. 17/18 ar and 150+ deflection and you are pretty safe.

 

like if you are running with a healer a more offensively tuned tank with two weapons (no shield) 135-145 deflection and 16 or so ar should be good. that is at levels 19-20. 

[Dr <3]

Afaik spirit shield and hardy doesn't stack.

 

For max Ar good things are patinated plate, passive from stalker or unbroken subclasses, gilded enmity ( pala subclass), iron skin among others... Just check what actually stacks and what not, usually ar bonus from items and passives stacks, everything active not.

[Boeroer]

Spirit Shield and Hardy and Zealous Endurance don't stack.

[Logos]

I don't normally play potd because I've found that battles last much too long for my tastes, but I'm playing on potd now because I want to unlock the god challenges, and I've found that far more than any stat you can increase the number one thing to focus on to make combat go your way is to split-pull. This doesn't really answer your question directly in the sense that it has no usable information about deflection or ar thresholds, but it lets you go through the game much faster than answers to your original question would. You can't get the levels you'd want for both deflection and ar on your entire party, but when you're only fighting three or four dudes at a time that doesn't matter. 

 

So far there is only one place I've discovered where split-pulling doesn't let you get out of combat (the fampyr crypt, way up NW), but even so by running your tank back and forth you can set it up so you only fight a couple of dudes at a time. 

Edited August 28, 2018 by Logos

[Metaturtle]

As others have stated, most active armor buffs do not stack. You'll need like 26-30 armor if you wanted to reduce most big boss' crit on you which is feasibly impossible with current gear and buffs.

[Dorftek]

Platinated plate + thick skin + blunting belt or Ngatis depending on encounter + squids grasp + paladin is the bulkiest I can think of. Is there a shield that increases armor for the wearer?

 

Also spreading Dazed will go a long way (-4 pen for enemies)

 

I also have no experience or knowledge about DLC gear yet.

Edited August 28, 2018 by Dorftek

[Haplok]

Good point! Dazed would really help make this AR count. Level 19 pure Barbarian with shout upgrades wanted!

[jintegrity]

Thank you for all the informative replies!

Guess that plan is out the window. It's cool though, I was talking about how much I love Deadfire's game mechanics to a friend earlier when I realized that this game is just cool, and you don't have to look for crazy class combos to find cool synergies. This system was made for synergy. - so pretty soon, I'll probably stop trying to make every class interesting to me, and just accept I like some classes, and others just aren't my thing.

I still enjoy the discussion, and am glad to learn from you all. I really hope the Pillars P&P RPG is based off this system (wasn't too thrilled with what I saw thus far, sadly), because the number of cool ways to put classes together is a real treat, and the more I learn, the more I love. ^^

[Dr <3]

Platinated plate + thick skin + blunting belt or Ngatis depending on encounter + squids grasp + paladin is the bulkiest I can think of. Is there a shield that increases armor for the wearer?

 

Also spreading Dazed will go a long way (-4 pen for enemies)

 

I also have no experience or knowledge about DLC gear yet.

You can even multiclass pala with a stalker (+1ar, +5 def) or a unbroken (+1 ar when using a shield). As a pala go for hands of light ( +5 resolve, the +2 ar from hardy are suppressed by the next thing) and for a goldpact subclass for the +5(?) Ar from modified sworn enemy.

[Boeroer]

Inspired Defenses (+1) and Stoic Steel (up tp +3) stacks with everything, so does Stalker's armor bonus. Not moving (Stoic Steel) and the nature of Stalker (+1 AR and +5 defenses) fit very well. Pick Strengthened Bond for +15 defenses against all AoE spells) and Superior Camouflage (+8 vs. ranged). Pick Goldpact for unlimited (non-stacking) +4 AR with Gilded Enmity (kind of unlimited with Sworn Rival). Get Patinated Plate and enchant with Bronze Juggernaut (+2 AR). Get Kapana Taga and echant with Lone Champion (+1 AR). Get Akola's Apex Ward and enchant with Hunter's Vigor (+1 AR) and Hide and Tooth (+5% melee dmg, +3 deflection against melee) and activate the modal (-50% dmg from ranged and reflex attacks). Then there are several items with damage reduction (-x% damage taken). Shifting Chroma from that whirling Hel-Stone can add +1 AR as well (random though). And of course pick stuff that raises your defenses in general to produce lots of misses and grazes. This is one of the combos with the highest passive (or let's say endlessly sustainable) damage reduction I can think of atm:

 

Only AR:

 

Plate: 9

Legendary: +4

Stalker: +1 (don't move too far away from pet)

Insp. Def: +1 (drops shortly when different dmg type incoming)

Stoic Steel: +3 (standing still, needs buildup)

Hunter's Vigor: +1

Lone Champion: +1

Gilded Enmity: +4

Bronze Juggernaut: +2 (melee only)

Shifting Chrome: +1 (occasionally)

--------------------------------------------------

together: 27 max, 19 min

 

You can still switch to a dual weapon setup and smack stuff pretty good with all the high ACC Full Attacks you have (FoD, Wounding Shot - also with Full Attacks the Juggernaut is not that bad) and switch back to Apex Ward as soon as you get in trouble, instantly stopping you (modals now stay active when switching back and forth) and granting you Stoic Steel etc. again.

 

There are two pets that grant +1 to freeze or +1 to burn AR and several items that will give you increased AR to a single damage type as well which will stack with the general AR I summed up above.

Edited August 29, 2018 by Boeroer

[Dorftek]

Inspired Defenses (+1) and Stoic Steel (up tp +3) stacks with everything, so does Stalker's armor bonus. Not moving (Stoic Steel) and the nature of Stalker (+1 AR and +5 defenses) fit very well. Pick Strengthened Bond for +15 defenses against all AoE spells) and Superior Camouflage (+8 vs. ranged). Pick Goldpact for unlimited (non-stacking) +4 AR with Gilded Enmity (kind of unlimited with Sworn Rival). Get Patinated Plate and enchant with Bronze Juggernaut (+2 AR). Get Kapana Taga and echant with Lone Champion (+1 AR). Get Akola's Apex Ward and enchant with Hunter's Vigor (+1 AR) and Hide and Tooth (+5% melee dmg, +3 deflection against melee) and activate the modal (-50% dmg from ranged and reflex attacks). Then there are several items with damage reduction (-x% damage taken). Shifting Chroma from that whirling Hel-Stone can add +1 AR as well (random though). And of course pick stuff that raises your defenses in general to produce lots of misses and grazes. This is one of the combos with the highest passive (or let's say endlessly sustainable) damage reduction I can think of atm:

 

Only AR:

 

Plate: 9

Legendary: +4

Stalker: +1 (don't move too far away from pet)

Insp. Def: +1 (drops shortly when different dmg type incoming)

Stoic Steel: +3 (standing still, needs buildup)

Hunter's Vigor: +1

Lone Champion: +1

Gilded Enmity: +4

Bronze Juggernaut: +2 (melee only)

Shifting Chrome: +1 (occasionally)

--------------------------------------------------

together: 27 max, 19 min

 

You can still switch to a dual weapon setup and smack stuff pretty good with all the high ACC Full Attacks you have (FoD, Wounding Shot - also with Full Attacks the Juggernaut is not that bad) and switch back to Apex Ward as soon as you get in trouble, instantly stopping you (modals now stay active when switching back and forth) and granting you Stoic Steel etc. again.

 

There are two pets that grant +1 to freeze or +1 to burn AR and several items that will give you increased AR to a single damage type as well which will stack with the general AR I summed up above.

Yeah very solid stuff. One could use squids grasp also for immunity to flanked, since flanked gives u -1 armor it will sort have the same effect as Kapana

[Dorftek]

 

Platinated plate + thick skin + blunting belt or Ngatis depending on encounter + squids grasp + paladin is the bulkiest I can think of. Is there a shield that increases armor for the wearer?

 

Also spreading Dazed will go a long way (-4 pen for enemies)

 

I also have no experience or knowledge about DLC gear yet.

You can even multiclass pala with a stalker (+1ar, +5 def) or a unbroken (+1 ar when using a shield). As a pala go for hands of light ( +5 resolve, the +2 ar from hardy are suppressed by the next thing) and for a goldpact subclass for the +5(?) Ar from modified sworn enemy.

For sure, pala/stalker is probably a great mix!

[Dr <3]

Inspired Defenses (+1) and Stoic Steel (up tp +3) stacks with everything, so does Stalker's armor bonus. Not moving (Stoic Steel) and the nature of Stalker (+1 AR and +5 defenses) fit very well. Pick Strengthened Bond for +15 defenses against all AoE spells) and Superior Camouflage (+8 vs. ranged). Pick Goldpact for unlimited (non-stacking) +4 AR with Gilded Enmity (kind of unlimited with Sworn Rival). Get Patinated Plate and enchant with Bronze Juggernaut (+2 AR). Get Kapana Taga and echant with Lone Champion (+1 AR). Get Akola's Apex Ward and enchant with Hunter's Vigor (+1 AR) and Hide and Tooth (+5% melee dmg, +3 deflection against melee) and activate the modal (-50% dmg from ranged and reflex attacks). Then there are several items with damage reduction (-x% damage taken). Shifting Chroma from that whirling Hel-Stone can add +1 AR as well (random though). And of course pick stuff that raises your defenses in general to produce lots of misses and grazes. This is one of the combos with the highest passive (or let's say endlessly sustainable) damage reduction I can think of atm:

 

Only AR:

 

Plate: 9

Legendary: +4

Stalker: +1 (don't move too far away from pet)

Insp. Def: +1 (drops shortly when different dmg type incoming)

Stoic Steel: +3 (standing still, needs buildup)

Hunter's Vigor: +1

Lone Champion: +1

Gilded Enmity: +4

Bronze Juggernaut: +2 (melee only)

Shifting Chrome: +1 (occasionally)

--------------------------------------------------

together: 27 max, 19 min

 

You can still switch to a dual weapon setup and smack stuff pretty good with all the high ACC Full Attacks you have (FoD, Wounding Shot - also with Full Attacks the Juggernaut is not that bad) and switch back to Apex Ward as soon as you get in trouble, instantly stopping you (modals now stay active when switching back and forth) and granting you Stoic Steel etc. again.

 

There are two pets that grant +1 to freeze or +1 to burn AR and several items that will give you increased AR to a single damage type as well which will stack with the general AR I summed up above.

Imho still a unbroken does a better job as pal multiclass... +1 ar if using a shield, + 4 def for superior deflection, +5/10 to accuracy, +5/10 to defl for conqueror stance ( or ~20 dmg res for defensive stance), refreshing drfence easily mantaniable for the whole fight.

[Boeroer]

Yeah, but also a lot lower starting reflex and not those nice +15 against AoE and +8 against ranged that are very handy when meeting the really mean foes.

 

Also never forget the second body (aka Animal Companion). The thing about Ranger is: even if you have Stoic Steel working and the wall modal on (and thus can't move) you can use Evasive Roll to move around for cheap. Charge also works but is too expensive just for moving around.

 

But yeah - Unbroken would have been my other alternative for sustained/passive damage reduction. Also the self heals are really good.

Edited August 29, 2018 by Boeroer

[Dr <3]

Yeah, but also a lot lower starting reflex and not those nice +15 against AoE and +8 against ranged that are very handy when meeting the really mean foes.

 

Also never forget the second body (aka Animal Companion). The thing about Ranger is: even if you have Stoic Steel working and the wall modal on (and thus can't move) you can use Evasive Roll to move around for cheap. Charge also works but is too expensive just for moving around.

 

But yeah - Unbroken would have been my other alternative for sustained/passive damage reduction. Also the self heals are really good.

Build name: the jumping fortress

 

About animal companion: surely an extra body is nice, but if you solo it will end up dying pretty soon ( even if bear is actually pretty thoug). Nice new is that as a ranger you should have enogh bond to revive him more than once in every fight, but still... In a party i agree ranger could be superior, soloing i'd like fighter version more

Edited August 29, 2018 by Dr <3

[whimper]

 

Yeah, but also a lot lower starting reflex and not those nice +15 against AoE and +8 against ranged that are very handy when meeting the really mean foes.

 

Also never forget the second body (aka Animal Companion). The thing about Ranger is: even if you have Stoic Steel working and the wall modal on (and thus can't move) you can use Evasive Roll to move around for cheap. Charge also works but is too expensive just for moving around.

 

But yeah - Unbroken would have been my other alternative for sustained/passive damage reduction. Also the self heals are really good.

Build name: the jumping fortress

This was pretty much exactly what my Stop-N-Go build does -- it stacks standing-still effects to make it incredibly tanky, and then uses Evasion to teleport around without losing them... 

[hansvedic]

Inspired Defenses (+1) and Stoic Steel (up tp +3) stacks with everything, so does Stalker's armor bonus. Not moving (Stoic Steel) and the nature of Stalker (+1 AR and +5 defenses) fit very well. Pick Strengthened Bond for +15 defenses against all AoE spells) and Superior Camouflage (+8 vs. ranged). Pick Goldpact for unlimited (non-stacking) +4 AR with Gilded Enmity (kind of unlimited with Sworn Rival). Get Patinated Plate and enchant with Bronze Juggernaut (+2 AR). Get Kapana Taga and echant with Lone Champion (+1 AR). Get Akola's Apex Ward and enchant with Hunter's Vigor (+1 AR) and Hide and Tooth (+5% melee dmg, +3 deflection against melee) and activate the modal (-50% dmg from ranged and reflex attacks). Then there are several items with damage reduction (-x% damage taken). Shifting Chroma from that whirling Hel-Stone can add +1 AR as well (random though). And of course pick stuff that raises your defenses in general to produce lots of misses and grazes. This is one of the combos with the highest passive (or let's say endlessly sustainable) damage reduction I can think of atm:

 

Only AR:

 

Plate: 9

Legendary: +4

Stalker: +1 (don't move too far away from pet)

Insp. Def: +1 (drops shortly when different dmg type incoming)

Stoic Steel: +3 (standing still, needs buildup)

Hunter's Vigor: +1

Lone Champion: +1

Gilded Enmity: +4

Bronze Juggernaut: +2 (melee only)

Shifting Chrome: +1 (occasionally)

--------------------------------------------------

together: 27 max, 19 min

 

You can still switch to a dual weapon setup and smack stuff pretty good with all the high ACC Full Attacks you have (FoD, Wounding Shot - also with Full Attacks the Juggernaut is not that bad) and switch back to Apex Ward as soon as you get in trouble, instantly stopping you (modals now stay active when switching back and forth) and granting you Stoic Steel etc. again.

 

There are two pets that grant +1 to freeze or +1 to burn AR and several items that will give you increased AR to a single damage type as well which will stack with the general AR I summed up above.

Sorry to necro this thread, but does Lone Champion still work when you're near your pet? If not, doesn't that mean that the maximum achievable armor is actually 26?

 

What about summons? Are they counted as allies?

[Kaylon]

 

Sorry to necro this thread, but does Lone Champion still work when you're near your pet? If not, doesn't that mean that the maximum achievable armor is actually 26?

 

What about summons? Are they counted as allies?

 

Yes, pet and summons are considered allies but you can replace the stalker with the unbroken and achieve the same armor rating. Also you can achieve higher resists vs each damage type using various items.

[whimper]

 

Sorry to necro this thread, but does Lone Champion still work when you're near your pet? If not, doesn't that mean that the maximum achievable armor is actually 26?

 

What about summons? Are they counted as allies?

 

Yes, pet and summons are considered allies but you can replace the stalker with the unbroken and achieve the same armor rating. Also you can achieve higher resists vs each damage type using various items.

Man, pets still deactivate this? I thought that they reported that they’d fixed that bug.

 

EDIT: Lone Champion appears to work for me with a pet. But it does turn off near summons.

Edited November 22, 2018 by whimper

[Boeroer]

I actually totally forgot about animal companionsand pets removing Lone Champion (although I reported that bug myself *facepalm*). Glad to hear that at least the pet issue got removed. 

[hansvedic]

I actually totally forgot about animal companionsand pets removing Lone Champion (although I reported that bug myself *facepalm*). Glad to hear that at least the pet issue got removed. 

 

Wait... so does Lone Champion work around animal companions now, or is it just pets, like Cutthroat Cosmo, that it works around?

[Boeroer]

I don't know. Didn't test AC yet.

[baldurs_gate_2]

 

I actually totally forgot about animal companionsand pets removing Lone Champion (although I reported that bug myself *facepalm*). Glad to hear that at least the pet issue got removed. 

 

Wait... so does Lone Champion work around animal companions now, or is it just pets, like Cutthroat Cosmo, that it works around?

 

Ring of solitary wanderer an the fallen star cape definitly does not work with summons

[Lampros]

On 8/29/2018 at 3:10 AM, Boeroer said:

Inspired Defenses (+1) and Stoic Steel (up tp +3) stacks with everything, so does Stalker's armor bonus. Not moving (Stoic Steel) and the nature of Stalker (+1 AR and +5 defenses) fit very well. Pick Strengthened Bond for +15 defenses against all AoE spells) and Superior Camouflage (+8 vs. ranged). Pick Goldpact for unlimited (non-stacking) +4 AR with Gilded Enmity (kind of unlimited with Sworn Rival). Get Patinated Plate and enchant with Bronze Juggernaut (+2 AR). Get Kapana Taga and echant with Lone Champion (+1 AR). Get Akola's Apex Ward and enchant with Hunter's Vigor (+1 AR) and Hide and Tooth (+5% melee dmg, +3 deflection against melee) and activate the modal (-50% dmg from ranged and reflex attacks). Then there are several items with damage reduction (-x% damage taken). Shifting Chroma from that whirling Hel-Stone can add +1 AR as well (random though). And of course pick stuff that raises your defenses in general to produce lots of misses and grazes. This is one of the combos with the highest passive (or let's say endlessly sustainable) damage reduction I can think of atm:

 

Only AR:

 

Plate: 9

Legendary: +4

Stalker: +1 (don't move too far away from pet)

Insp. Def: +1 (drops shortly when different dmg type incoming)

Stoic Steel: +3 (standing still, needs buildup)

Hunter's Vigor: +1

Lone Champion: +1

Gilded Enmity: +4

Bronze Juggernaut: +2 (melee only)

Shifting Chrome: +1 (occasionally)

--------------------------------------------------

together: 27 max, 19 min

 

You can still switch to a dual weapon setup and smack stuff pretty good with all the high ACC Full Attacks you have (FoD, Wounding Shot - also with Full Attacks the Juggernaut is not that bad) and switch back to Apex Ward as soon as you get in trouble, instantly stopping you (modals now stay active when switching back and forth) and granting you Stoic Steel etc. again.

 

There are two pets that grant +1 to freeze or +1 to burn AR and several items that will give you increased AR to a single damage type as well which will stack with the general AR I summed up above.

Jesus, you are a walking encyclopedia! What would the player-base around the world do without you?