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What made BG good was it told an epic story spanning many games, and let you keep the same character.

 

Following that logic, if PoE is the spiritual successor to BG and hopes to surpass it then we have not seen the last of the watcher.

 

I suspect the next game will involve what happens after the wheel goes down. To answer the 'plot hole' so many people seem to think exists regarding what the world was like before the wheel was made: it was normal. Souls still existed, but they transmigrated somewhere else at death. Like a d&d setting, they went to the Great Beyond and NOBODY KNOWS what happened to them. That's why death is called the great unknown mystery.

 

The 'gods' are a bunch of jerks who decided to co-opt that process and draw power from it. They built a hydroelectric dam and recycled the water endlessly instead of letting it return to the sea, like it should, until kith accepted that as the natural order of things, even though it absolutely wasn't. And if you figured it out the Leaden Key would come along and stab you or set you on fire or whatevers in fashion at the time.

 

I see no plot holes there at all. It's a well thought out plot written by someone with a solid grasp of existential philosophy.

 

As for what happens next, the gods just got exposed as a bunch of seriously amoral (read: psychopathic) people who massacred a whole civilization and nomed their souls so they could move into the Great Beyond and play "lol I'm a super sayan". Now they can't feed on the ambient energy of reincarnation. So they're starving and desperate to keep their power.

 

So the plot is probably "God War"

 

Understand, the gods in this setting have been clearly established as narcissistic and evil. Woedica? Evil. Magran? Evil. Slain? Evil. Ondra? Stupendously evil. The best of them are neutral. Maybe. Hyalea seems like a ditz who doesn't do much. They routinely murder and ruin entire cultures for very little reason at all. They don't act like representations of advanced concepts related to the mortal condition who care about their followers spiritual growth. They act like the Olympians.

 

When you cross the Olympians, they throw tantrums and break stuff and curse people. They release the kraken. They sire demigod offspring. They try to intimidate mortals into obedience.

 

Or at least, I hope they try.

 

 

I like your reasoning, I dislike your "gods are amoral" bias though ;)

Whosoever decides what is moral and what is not ?

Whosoever is so self-important they think themselves judge ?

 

The "gods" saw an opportunity for evolution, to become something more, and they took it.

Did this opportunity come at a cost ? Possibly.

Was that cost worth it ? Possibly.

Was it done in service to the greater good ? Possibly (the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few ; in some cultural or political constructs).

Is murdering an innocent in cold blood to save millions worth it ? Possibly (see the whole Terminator/Skynet uprising timeline for more on that)

Is it moral however ? Again, possibly; that depends what values your morality system is based on.

 

I see nothing amoral or amiss here, all the more so when morality is an abstract and subjective concept ;)

It is amoral, and blessedly punishable by death, to cross or otherwise displease our Overlord Kyros.

I refer you to : https://goo.gl/images/82Q8ut

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What made BG good was it told an epic story spanning many games, and let you keep the same character.

 

Following that logic, if PoE is the spiritual successor to BG and hopes to surpass it then we have not seen the last of the watcher.

 

I suspect the next game will involve what happens after the wheel goes down. To answer the 'plot hole' so many people seem to think exists regarding what the world was like before the wheel was made: it was normal. Souls still existed, but they transmigrated somewhere else at death. Like a d&d setting, they went to the Great Beyond and NOBODY KNOWS what happened to them. That's why death is called the great unknown mystery.

 

The 'gods' are a bunch of jerks who decided to co-opt that process and draw power from it. They built a hydroelectric dam and recycled the water endlessly instead of letting it return to the sea, like it should, until kith accepted that as the natural order of things, even though it absolutely wasn't. And if you figured it out the Leaden Key would come along and stab you or set you on fire or whatevers in fashion at the time.

 

I see no plot holes there at all. It's a well thought out plot written by someone with a solid grasp of existential philosophy.

 

As for what happens next, the gods just got exposed as a bunch of seriously amoral (read: psychopathic) people who massacred a whole civilization and nomed their souls so they could move into the Great Beyond and play "lol I'm a super sayan". Now they can't feed on the ambient energy of reincarnation. So they're starving and desperate to keep their power.

 

So the plot is probably "God War"

 

Understand, the gods in this setting have been clearly established as narcissistic and evil. Woedica? Evil. Magran? Evil. Slain? Evil. Ondra? Stupendously evil. The best of them are neutral. Maybe. Hyalea seems like a ditz who doesn't do much. They routinely murder and ruin entire cultures for very little reason at all. They don't act like representations of advanced concepts related to the mortal condition who care about their followers spiritual growth. They act like the Olympians.

 

When you cross the Olympians, they throw tantrums and break stuff and curse people. They release the kraken. They sire demigod offspring. They try to intimidate mortals into obedience.

 

Or at least, I hope they try.

 

 

I like your reasoning, I dislike your "gods are amoral" bias though ;)

Whosoever decides what is moral and what is not ?

Whosoever is so self-important they think themselves judge ?

 

The "gods" saw an opportunity for evolution, to become something more, and they took it.

Did this opportunity come at a cost ? Possibly.

Was that cost worth it ? Possibly.

Was it done in service to the greater good ? Possibly (the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few ; in some cultural or political constructs).

Is murdering an innocent in cold blood to save millions worth it ? Possibly (see the whole Terminator/Skynet uprising timeline for more on that)

Is it moral however ? Again, possibly; that depends what values your morality system is based on.

 

I see nothing amoral or amiss here, all the more so when morality is an abstract and subjective concept ;)

It is amoral, and blessedly punishable by death, to cross or otherwise displease our Overlord Kyros.

I refer you to : https://goo.gl/images/82Q8ut

 

 

See we need all these questions answered in POE3!!!!

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“How do you 'accidentally' kill a nobleman in his own mansion?"

"With a knife in the chest. Or, rather, a pair of knives in the chest...”

The Final Empire, Mistborn Trilogy

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Posted (edited)

I believe if they want to reach a bigger audience/player base the next PoE (if it comes in the first place) should be done in a rel. conservative base setting/biome. So Raedceras, Aedyr come to mind. Most others sound too outlandish or we already had it (snow etc). I personally would like some exotic place better, but I also believe you lose the interest of many players if you pick a setting that is too "exotic".

So I would vote for Living Lands: it sounds if this can contain anything from flying ships to giant beasts and medieval cities etc.

Edited by Boeroer
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Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Guest Blutwurstritter

Why limit yourself to one region ? I would like more traveling between distinctly different places. The game could feature a small number of hubs all around the world in Eora, we saw already tinkering with portals so the means for travel are already conceived. The starting area can be a more "conservative" settings, by this they can avoid alienating new players.

To make it clear, I don't want a large open world, just a map with quick travel to the different hubs which are located all over Eora, no ships or planes or whatever.

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I don't really think a prequel would be as engaging unless they were really smart about it. Maybe something that took place just after the creation of the gods, but in general, it's like a lot of people have said-it's limiting to go back and tell stories about events we already know the outcome of. A book or comic about the Saints War? That would be awesome though. Maybe told from the perspective of Eders brother.

 

As for what I actually think the next game should involve? I absolutely want it to take place in Ixamitl. A south American style setting isn't one that's been done before as far as fantasy games go, and it being a land full of philosophers could make for some interesting interactions.

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What about Pillars of Eternity with trains?  Kind of further jump into the future ... I guess it would be considered steampunk then ...


“How do you 'accidentally' kill a nobleman in his own mansion?"

"With a knife in the chest. Or, rather, a pair of knives in the chest...”

The Final Empire, Mistborn Trilogy

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Not too fond of the idea of a PoE prequel set during the Saint's War. If there's to be a prequel, I'd much rather have it set in the time leading up to, and about, the creation of the Engwithan gods. 

 

A PoE3 could be set immidiately following PoE2, but the mechanics of the game would change, and you no longer control the Watcher of Caed Nua. It could be a RPG/strategy combo. And the only class is cipher. You play an animancer on a desperate/near hopeless/challenging (depending on PoE2 ending) mission to solve the mess Eothas made. Main enemy are crazed followers of Rymrgand, who either are powerful and comfortably enjoy the - supposedly - inevitable final doom of life if the Watcher encouraged Eothas to end the world, OR they are desperate and aggresive and weakened yet dangerous if the PoE2 ending encouraged greater animancy studies. 

 

The PC cipher/researcher goes around collecting Engwithan knowledge, other researchers, protecting animancers and their research, and gains funding and directs research at his small workshop... that eventually is extended, enlarged into a proper academy, and gets more prestigious as the game progresses untill it's a major center for animancy research. 

 

Instead of game chapters, you fight against a Doomsday Clock. The Rymrgand cults (and others) constantly seek to speed up the time of doom, but your mission is to build a "critical mass" of progress in animancy research and application that can reverse and then stop the clock. 

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The speculate Pillars 3 will be taking place on one of the moons of Eora which is made out of gingerbread. 

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Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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The speculate Pillars 3 will be taking place on one of the moons of Eora which is made out of gingerbread. 

 

I'm holding out for blue cheese!  Who knows?  Maybe a little space alien named Boo will be hiding there.

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If it's made of blue cheese then I will be hiding there! ;)


Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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If it's made of blue cheese then I will be hiding there! ;)

 

Don't be ridiculous, Boeroer, you cannot hide in blue cheese, it does not have holes. Perhaps in Emmental or Maasdam. 

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Dude trust me: once I'm there it will have holes.  :biggrin:

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It would be great that, if there is a minimal chance of a new PoE, someone of devs could drop a word here :biggrin:

 

As you can see in the poll we voted sometime ago, the Living Lands was the winner

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/103574-poll-where-would-you-like-to-travel-if-poe-saga-continues/

 

I saw a lot of complains about the Vailians faction and the Deadfire setting. I love both but I recognize that in general, gamers prefer traditional medieval places rather than exotic places/cultures. I don't know if the lIving lands would have success in a sequel. Maybe Aedyr empire or Readceras are more welcomed by the players community.

 

A new PoE with the same engine set in Readceras, a region ruled by strict religious laws, with inquisitors, heretics, etc, would be very interesting.

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Why is morality so sensitive a topic? Are people trying to hide their dirty actions behind subjectivity and it being beyond our grasp?

 

Drs tell us what we ought to do with our body all the time. Do we say who are you to judge?

 

I can think of terrible and horrible things to do to little girls, but i guess no one can judge me. I guess all actions are cool. Let me do my horrible actions. Whats worse is being self important appearantly.

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Cheesus spiced! You should really stop smoking that gorgonzola.


Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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