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Beast of Winter impressions


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#61
Porcelyn

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I have a soft spot for Vatnir. I'm a compassionate person so he really hits me in the feels. I just want to hug him and tell he's not a monster and it's not his fault.


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#62
Zap Gun For Hire

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I have a soft spot for Vatnir. I'm a compassionate person so he really hits me in the feels. I just want to hug him and tell he's not a monster and it's not his fault.

I was completely expecting some crazed death cultist that I needed to keep on a tight leash.  Instead I got someone who was way in over his head, fairly annoyed with the state of his culture over all (though obviously from it, given his attitudes aren't that dissimilar), and someone who was trying to make the best of a crappy hand given to him by the gods.

 

 

Kinda also think Ydwin was projecting just a little bit there.  But even so I can see how someone as stoic as her (or someone who wants to be stoic) could be put off by a sob story.  Especially if it reminded them a bit too much of theirs. ;)

 

Was actually pleased just how much Ydwin was fleshed out in this DLC.  She's fatalistic in general (again, a sign of the culture) but she's rebelling against many ways fatalism is being practiced in her culture.  Not to mention that while she agrees that 'everything dies', she's in absolutely no hurry to actually throw herself on the bonfire anytime soon.

 

Fatalism vs the popular perception of nihilism, might be the way to look at it.

 

In fact, as I think about it, Harbinger's Watch might just be a parody/satire of those 'straw nihilists' mentioned in that TvTropes link.  What with them rushing to die at one moment (and cursing their fate that they weren't lucky enough to die) yet still going about their day-to-day business otherwise.

 

Either way, HW ain't exactly a stable place, as seen by the brewmaster (and his unwillingness to drink his OWN swill ;)). 


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#63
Tarlonniel

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I gotta admit, Rymrgand is remarkably forgiving.

 

Rymie: Hey, why didn't I feel the dragon's soul enter my domain?

Watcher: Dunno.

Rymie: Fine. Hand over the relic so I can cleanse it.

Watcher: No.

Rymie: Pledge yourself in service to me!

Watcher: Never.

Rymie: I kill you!

Watcher: Bring it on!

Rymie: Cool. Bye now.

Watcher: ... what the Hel...

 

I think I like him. And now my wizard has a sweet phylactery collection going.


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#64
Porcelyn

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Rymie: I kill you!

 

I'm going to put that on a shirt. I has Cricut Skills.

 

 

 


Edited by Porcelyn, 09 August 2018 - 10:48 PM.

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#65
handsomenat

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I have a soft spot for Vatnir. I'm a compassionate person so he really hits me in the feels. I just want to hug him and tell he's not a monster and it's not his fault.

I was completely expecting some crazed death cultist that I needed to keep on a tight leash.  Instead I got someone who was way in over his head, fairly annoyed with the state of his culture over all (though obviously from it, given his attitudes aren't that dissimilar), and someone who was trying to make the best of a crappy hand given to him by the gods.

 

 

Kinda also think Ydwin was projecting just a little bit there.  But even so I can see how someone as stoic as her (or someone who wants to be stoic) could be put off by a sob story.  Especially if it reminded them a bit too much of theirs. ;)

 

Was actually pleased just how much Ydwin was fleshed out in this DLC.  She's fatalistic in general (again, a sign of the culture) but she's rebelling against many ways fatalism is being practiced in her culture.  Not to mention that while she agrees that 'everything dies', she's in absolutely no hurry to actually throw herself on the bonfire anytime soon.

 

Fatalism vs the popular perception of nihilism, might be the way to look at it.

 

In fact, as I think about it, Harbinger's Watch might just be a parody/satire of those 'straw nihilists' mentioned in that TvTropes link.  What with them rushing to die at one moment (and cursing their fate that they weren't lucky enough to die) yet still going about their day-to-day business otherwise.

 

Either way, HW ain't exactly a stable place, as seen by the brewmaster (and his unwillingness to drink his OWN swill ;)). 

 

 

Yeah, I remember when I first heard that BoW is going to be a bout a death cult I thought it's going to be serious and kinda what you would expect? But then in the first dev stream showing Harbinger's Watch they said there's going be to some dark comedy there so I guess it could be approached from the parody angle?

 

I'm not sure what I expected from Vatnir when I first saw just the picture of him. I remember though how some posters assumed he's going to be evil.

 

Also to respond to some of your points from your previous post about endings I agree that it is kinda disappointing how we don't learn about Vatnir's fate unless he's killed by the cult. As for him going back to the cult once everything's over... Would he still want that? (I don't know, that's why I'm asking. But my feeling is that he wants to leave this place. I might be wrong).

 

D2DZXsK.png


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#66
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Minor thing I didn't like: I didn't like that Eder's only reactions to animals and wilder was "can i pet them" like yeah I know Eder's been like this but at this point it's like a tired joke. For example in White March he has a scene where he helps an injured wolf... it showed his affection for animals in a different way than just the brainless "must pet”.

Eder in Pillars 1 was a well-rounded character who flirted with stereotypes without giving in to them. Eder is Pillars 2 is Jethro from the Beverly Hillbillies.
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#67
Tick

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Minor thing I didn't like: I didn't like that Eder's only reactions to animals and wilder was "can i pet them" like yeah I know Eder's been like this but at this point it's like a tired joke. For example in White March he has a scene where he helps an injured wolf... it showed his affection for animals in a different way than just the brainless "must pet”.

Eder in Pillars 1 was a well-rounded character who flirted with stereotypes without giving in to them. Eder is Pillars 2 is Jethro from the Beverly Hillbillies.

I don't *100%* agree but I really relate to /get what you're saying. Playing PoE 1 really emphasizes how off Eder feels in parts of Deadfire. It's really surreal. Especially because when they're not playing him up for laughs, I think the way he's written goes in the right direction. Like Eder wasn't ever crazy smart, but he was very aware of the problems with his culture and country and he had a good sense of things in that regard. Insightful maybe is the word I'm going for.

He can still be insightful and protective and good ol boy in the game, but it's in pieces. It's just weird.
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#68
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Also to respond to some of your points from your previous post about endings I agree that it is kinda disappointing how we don't learn about Vatnir's fate unless he's killed by the cult. As for him going back to the cult once everything's over... Would he still want that? (I don't know, that's why I'm asking. But my feeling is that he wants to leave this place. I might be wrong).

 

D2DZXsK.png

 

 

I forced him to come on the expedition (didn't persuade, out and out dragged him) and let him handle the explanations at the end.

He said it was imperative that the other guy stay in charge, and that he was needed at the Duskspeaker's side.

 

So given the option, he seems to want to leave. 


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#69
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Minor thing I didn't like: I didn't like that Eder's only reactions to animals and wilder was "can i pet them" like yeah I know Eder's been like this but at this point it's like a tired joke. For example in White March he has a scene where he helps an injured wolf... it showed his affection for animals in a different way than just the brainless "must pet”.

Eder in Pillars 1 was a well-rounded character who flirted with stereotypes without giving in to them. Eder is Pillars 2 is Jethro from the Beverly Hillbillies.
I don't *100%* agree but I really relate to /get what you're saying. Playing PoE 1 really emphasizes how off Eder feels in parts of Deadfire. It's really surreal. Especially because when they're not playing him up for laughs, I think the way he's written goes in the right direction. Like Eder wasn't ever crazy smart, but he was very aware of the problems with his culture and country and he had a good sense of things in that regard. Insightful maybe is the word I'm going for.

He can still be insightful and protective and good ol boy in the game, but it's in pieces. It's just weird.
Yeah, to be fair, I’m being slightly hyperbolic. I guess I’m just disappointed by how much they jettisoned the darker tone of the first game. And unfortunately this contrast is most apparent with the returning characters.
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#70
handsomenat

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Uhh... didn't one of the developers say that Eder was written in parts by three different writers in Deadfire? I don't really like how Eder is characterized in the sequel so maybe it's due to that. Or maybe it's a standard practice and usually works out? Anyway yeah it's disappointing how Eder was handled in this game, playing straight his low int and throwing in love for animals as a flavor so we still recognize the guy. There has been a topic here on the forum about him already so I'm not sure if we should discuss this further here...? But I just wanted to say that I agree with your points. Some people were perfectly fine with how Eder felt in this game too so I think it always feels so... validating when you find you're not the only one.


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#71
AndreaColombo

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For the base game, Eric Fenstermaker wrote most of Edér. Josh filled in the missing bits. For BoW, it was Josh and Paul.
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#72
Verde

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Overall I thought the DLC was everything the base game should have been - focused and narrative driven. I'm glad to see Obsidian still has it because after all the bugs and cringey dialogue I was wondering if Deadfire was made by the B team :p

#73
uuuhhii

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Uhh... didn't one of the developers say that Eder was written in parts by three different writers in Deadfire? I don't really like how Eder is characterized in the sequel so maybe it's due to that. Or maybe it's a standard practice and usually works out? Anyway yeah it's disappointing how Eder was handled in this game, playing straight his low int and throwing in love for animals as a flavor so we still recognize the guy. There has been a topic here on the forum about him already so I'm not sure if we should discuss this further here...? But I just wanted to say that I agree with your points. Some people were perfectly fine with how Eder felt in this game too so I think it always feels so... validating when you find you're not the only one.

the old lover thing doesn't have much setup and lack content

but other part of eder are good enough



#74
AndreaColombo

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The old lover thing was actually the focal point of the short story Eric had written about Edér. I thought it was a nice tie-in.
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#75
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I like Edér a lot in Deadfire as well as in PoE1. Though I think he definitely felt like he was more of a centerpiece to PoE1. And I would agree that they need to lay the "pet animals!" thing to rest a bit.

 

As far as BoW goes, I have mixed feelings on it I have to say.

 

+ The setting is cool (no pun intended)

+ It's a nice change to get some quality time with a single god again. It's mainly bickering in the main game, so it's great to focus on just one. And Rymrgand is a glorious butthole, makes for a good character I think.

+ I like that they went a bit crazy with the areas, nice to get into more obviously supernatural stuff in the Beyond.

+ Probably my most favorite thing was the lore tidbits. It was all interesting to me, with Waidwen's story being the highlight. I wish we had gotten even more backstory because that was genuinely fascinating.

 

-The combat was a huge step back from Deadfire I think. For the main game, it felt like they made an effort to pull back on the encounters and I think it really improved the pace and made the game "breathe" a bit. For BoW, I think it once again feels 1) too copy/paste and 2) overly reliant on "mobs popping up behind your party". It never turns into a slog like Gambino's Workshop but it definitely felt like a move in the wrong direction for me. It felt like padding.

-Gimmicks like teleportation puzzles and raising/lowering water levels feel like a creative lowpoint. And again, it just feels like padding that slows the game down. Puzzles can be fun in RPGs, but the ones in BoW just felt really uninspired and like you've seen it a million times before.

 

So yeah, setting, story, choices and lore were really cool. The more immediate gameplay like exploration, combat and puzzles was pretty mediocre I think.

 

A good addition to the game I would say!


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#76
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I've been thinking a little about pale elves and checked the wikia. I remembered Glasvahl from the first game. He and his clan learned that they are trapped in a reincarnation cycle that forces them to be reborn in the same place over and over for millennia. Is this true to ALL of pale elves? (Yet again Rymrgand looks like a master torturer; promises an out from an endless cycle of misery that he created)

 

Also I have to retract what I said about the cult not being representative of general pale elf culture/religion/philosophy. I think that their overall worldview reflects the overall worldview of pale elves from WtW as a whole. Ydwin recognizes it. Harbingers also came from all over the WtW to join Vatnir. There was something universal in his vision he preached so yeah, my initial caution seems to be wrong in that matter. Main difference is in how they approach the inevitable ending; glamfellen outside of the cult don't run towards dragons to get killed.


Edited by handsomenat, 11 August 2018 - 10:09 AM.

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#77
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I had real concerns about quality after Obsidian revealed that they weren't going to put out full-blown expansion packs despite Backer community polling, but I enjoyed BoW and at this point I'm confident that between the three DLC I'll feel like my $20 season pass was worth it. That said, I would not part w/ the standard retail price of $10/DLC.

Some thoughts:
-Thank the gods for dismissal! Some other folks mentioned this too but the trash mobs are fairly tedious throughout the expansion.
-I enjoyed all three boss fights. After coasting through the game on PotD before the patch I feel like the difficulty is a lot more acceptable at this point, but it is still not quite hard enough, IMO -- "acceptable" difficulty in my purely subjective view would be like, me not being able to winging it through boss fights unprepared and having to reload once or twice. I liked that about the original POE. (I played on PotD with level-scaling).
-I like most of the items but imo there are a few //too// many ice-themed ones. I understand that the theme is Rymrgand,  I do, but would have appreciated items weighted a bit more towards say, the Blazing Bridge and the rest. The Soulbounds weren't generally as cool as in the White March...
-The lore reveals were a good touch and I appreciated that the story tied back into the series. 


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