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I agree that he is the Durance of Deadfire. The writing is not quite at Durance level, but he starts off intentionally obnoxious and has the most character growth in the entire game, especially if you push him towards being dutiful. The author definitely made me “feel” strongly about his character, and many of those feelings were not positive. But much like Durance, that’s the point.

 

My only actual complaint is that “coming of age” stories tend to be predictable.

But Ondra can get really funny if you romance him.

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Sure, I'm not saying you should like his choices, I was only arguing with the "but he has no goals" part. He does have his own goals,  just because you or I might not like them doesn't make them nonexistent.

 

And apparently the only two ways he can go if you let him recover the secrets of watershaping on Ukaizo is either making sculptures or uniting the Huana in the name of the gods, and I'd rather not do anything that promotes the gods, so that's another reason for me to support his desire for independence (thoughI admit this is a bit metagamey). Imo better if he "wastes" his talent on creating stuff rather than on inspiring faith in the entities that proved their utter incompetence in Deadfire.

 

Seriously? He can't assume leadership of the Watershapers' Guild without proselytizing for his mama? If so, that gives me a good reason to not bother recruiting him at all.

 

And well, a couch potato's got goals, I'm sure- but it's a stretch to call them that.

Edited by Celan
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If you don't share the secrets of watershaping with him, his ending slide is still about getting the Huana together but without all the "emissary of the gods" stuff.

 

In the end, there were some things I really liked about Sharkboy and some things I really didn't like, so... I dunno. I'd take him over Durance any day ;)

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That just makes no sense. Especially in light of learning, hearing it from Eothas' own giant mouth, that the gods are frauds. I mean, take what you can from them, but don't give them more credit than due.

 

The whole way you recruit him irritates me, too, in retrospect. "If it gets me away from the guild" or "i needed to go to the palace anyway"... these are his motivations for wanting to join you, not the fact that a giant adra statue is stomping through his country?

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Seriously? He can't assume leadership of the Watershapers' Guild without proselytizing for his mama? If so, that gives me a good reason to not bother recruiting him at all.

 

He sure can, but you have to keep Ngati's covenant from him to get this particular ending, and that doesn't sit right with me from rp perspective. "Here's the very thing the Huana have been looking for since forever, now let's not give it to them"? Umm feels weird. I could come up with motivations for some Watchers to do it, sure, but it wouldn't fit the Watchers I've played so far.  

 

The whole way you recruit him irritates me, too, in retrospect. "If it gets me away from the guild" or "i needed to go to the palace anyway"... these are his motivations for wanting to join you, not the fact that a giant adra statue is stomping through his country?

 

There is no proof Eothas is going to stomp anything aside from Port-Maje at that point. Some believe the statue is gone for good, and people at the palace even laugh at you when you suggest that it was the giant who destroyed Hasongo. 

 

That just makes no sense. Especially in light of learning, hearing it from Eothas' own giant mouth, that the gods are frauds. I mean, take what you can from them, but don't give them more credit than due.

That's a problem with the Deadfire writing in general, not the companions. Everyone just ignores the big secret. You can discuss it with Aloth openly or even take Xoti and Tekehu to Ashen Maw and have Eothas say it to their faces that he is a former Engwithan, but they won't react to it in any way. This was probably the biggest "wtf?!" moment for me in the entire game.

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There is no proof Eothas is going to stomp anything aside from Port-Maje at that point. Some believe the statue is gone for good, and people at the palace even laugh at you when you suggest that it was the giant who destroyed Hasongo.

Then there's no reason for him to join your crew. He could have hired on any ship blowing through the harbor if he just wanted to get away from the guild.

 

I really think at this point I won't bother recruiting him at all.

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Then there's no reason for him to join your crew. He could have hired on any ship blowing through the harbor if he just wanted to get away from the guild.

 

Did you actually read his dialogue? He joins you to investigate the watershapers going to the Gullet, either because you can take him to the prince without the guildmaster vouching for him or because the prince already told you to pick him up and take him to the Gullet. Getting away from the guild is just a bonus for him. 

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Did you actually read his dialogue? He joins you to investigate the watershapers going to the Gullet, either because you can take him to the prince without the guildmaster vouching for him or because the prince already told you to pick him up and take him to the Gullet. Getting away from the guild is just a bonus for him. 

 

I don't recall that. He and the guildmaster argue about him wanting to present himself at the palace, but they don't say why. He says he sent the prince a letter but doesn't mention the contents. If you invite him to join your crew, he says something about the adventure and to get away from the guild. Later the prince said to take him with us to the Gullet, but didn't say why.

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I liked fish boy.  I especially liked having fish boy and pirate orlan in the group.  They come from two entirely different worlds, yet their banters have them finding common ground in banging everything that moves.  If this were two dude-bros it would be nauseating, but a giant fish and a furry foul-mouthed midget?  Weirdly endearing.

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Did you actually read his dialogue? He joins you to investigate the watershapers going to the Gullet, either because you can take him to the prince without the guildmaster vouching for him or because the prince already told you to pick him up and take him to the Gullet. Getting away from the guild is just a bonus for him. 

 

I don't recall that. He and the guildmaster argue about him wanting to present himself at the palace, but they don't say why. He says he sent the prince a letter but doesn't mention the contents. If you invite him to join your crew, he says something about the adventure and to get away from the guild. Later the prince said to take him with us to the Gullet, but didn't say why.

 

 

This is the general problem with PoE (PoE1 too) - strict order of the events. You deviate the slightest - dialogs (or plot) loose any sense.

Well, they tried, sometimes you can even squint enough to see the plot in unorganized pieces, but in general you are supposed to follow the path that was meant in the plot.

 

In case of Tekēhu you are supposed to talk first with the Prince. And Prince does say why you need Tekēhu - there is already a suspicion of watershapres guild involvement, that was the very reason Tekēhu petitioned to Prince.

If you go to Tekēhu first, though, he actually say that you might help to get the audience with Royalty faster. I'd say it's good enough reason to join.

Not to mention, as long as he is alone, he is bound to the guild and can not leave. Being on the mission is a perfect excuse to get out.

 

I truly do not understand your problem with him (aside from personality).

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I don't recall that. He and the guildmaster argue about him wanting to present himself at the palace, but they don't say why. He says he sent the prince a letter but doesn't mention the contents. If you invite him to join your crew, he says something about the adventure and to get away from the guild. Later the prince said to take him with us to the Gullet, but didn't say why.

It's there. If you ask him about the reasons he wrote to the prince prior to his recruitment, he only says you'd better discuss it away from the guild as anyone could be eavesdropping. But you can ask him again when he is on your crew, and he reveals the whole watershapers visiting the Gullet thing. At least that is how things go if you talk to the prince before you meet Tekehu. But even if you do it out of order, the conversation about the watershapers going into the Gullet is still available after you recruit him, even though some lines are a bit different iirc. 

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It's there. If you ask him about the reasons he wrote to the prince prior to his recruitment, he only says you'd better discuss it away from the guild as anyone could be eavesdropping. But you can ask him again when he is on your crew, and he reveals the whole watershapers visiting the Gullet thing. At least that is how things go if you talk to the prince before you meet Tekehu. But even if you do it out of order, the conversation about the watershapers going into the Gullet is still available after you recruit him, even though some lines are a bit different iirc. 

 

That still doesn't explain what his motivation is for joining your crew, other than a lark.

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This is the general problem with PoE (PoE1 too) - strict order of the events. You deviate the slightest - dialogs (or plot) loose any sense.

Well, they tried, sometimes you can even squint enough to see the plot in unorganized pieces, but in general you are supposed to follow the path that was meant in the plot.

 

In case of Tekēhu you are supposed to talk first with the Prince. And Prince does say why you need Tekēhu - there is already a suspicion of watershapres guild involvement, that was the very reason Tekēhu petitioned to Prince.

If you go to Tekēhu first, though, he actually say that you might help to get the audience with Royalty faster. I'd say it's good enough reason to join.

Not to mention, as long as he is alone, he is bound to the guild and can not leave. Being on the mission is a perfect excuse to get out.

 

I truly do not understand your problem with him (aside from personality).

 

Why are we "supposed" to talk to the Prince first, when we're forced to go through Periki's Overlook to get to the palace?

 

Getting Tekehu into see the prince, even babysitting him on a trip to the Gullet, is no rationale for him joining your crew permanently. His reason for that is a lark that gets him away from the guild.

 

My problem is that the writing doesn't make any sense, and as far as Tekehu goes, the fact that he expresses no concern over the giant statue stomping through his country and just wants to go on a lark to get away from a guild he signed up to join.

 

Though you also remind me that the writing on the prince's task is pretty strained also. He finds a Principi coin and this means there's a smuggling ring? And he needs a stranger to go check it out for him, a stranger who is trying to save his countrymen from Big Stompy?

Edited by Celan
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Yeah. If you get Tekehu before talking to the Prince he doesn’t explain his watershaper Gullet mission until a little later (and you have to ask him). If you talk to the Prince first, the Prince makes it abundantly clear. So Tekehu definitely joins you for a reason. Getting away from the guild is just a bonus.

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This is the general problem with PoE (PoE1 too) - strict order of the events. You deviate the slightest - dialogs (or plot) loose any sense.

Well, they tried, sometimes you can even squint enough to see the plot in unorganized pieces, but in general you are supposed to follow the path that was meant in the plot.

 

In case of Tekēhu you are supposed to talk first with the Prince. And Prince does say why you need Tekēhu - there is already a suspicion of watershapres guild involvement, that was the very reason Tekēhu petitioned to Prince.

If you go to Tekēhu first, though, he actually say that you might help to get the audience with Royalty faster. I'd say it's good enough reason to join.

Not to mention, as long as he is alone, he is bound to the guild and can not leave. Being on the mission is a perfect excuse to get out.

 

I truly do not understand your problem with him (aside from personality).

 

Why are we "supposed" to talk to the Prince first, when we're forced to go through Periki's Overlook to get to the palace?

 

Getting Tekehu into see the prince, even babysitting him on a trip to the Gullet, is no rationale for him joining your crew permanently. His reason for that is a lark that gets him away from the guild.

 

My problem is that the writing doesn't make any sense, and as far as Tekehu goes, the fact that he expresses no concern over the giant statue stomping through his country and just wants to go on a lark to get away from a guild he signed up to join.

 

Though you also remind me that the writing on the prince's task is pretty strained also. He finds a Principi coin and this means there's a smuggling ring? And he needs a stranger to go check it out for him, a stranger who is trying to save his countrymen from Big Stompy?

 

 

Well, you leave Port Maje with the advice to head straight to the palace in Neketaka. So why would you then decide to do anything other than go straight to the palace? So you get to the palace, have the conversation with da Queen, and the Prince shouts for you to talk to him. 

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Yeah. If you get Tekehu before talking to the Prince he doesn’t explain his watershaper Gullet mission until a little later (and you have to ask him). If you talk to the Prince first, the Prince makes it abundantly clear. So Tekehu definitely joins you for a reason. Getting away from the guild is just a bonus.

That's not a reason for joining your crew. If he just needed babysitting to go to a section of his own city, he could have taken an apprentice or two.

 

It's a pretty lame rationale.

 

Well, you leave Port Maje with the advice to head straight to the palace in Neketaka. So why would you then decide to do anything other than go straight to the palace? So you get to the palace, have the conversation with da Queen, and the Prince shouts for you to talk to him.

Because... you have to go through Periki's Overlook and that big building is right on the way? And because why not?

Edited by Celan
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Why are we "supposed" to talk to the Prince first, when we're forced to go through Periki's Overlook to get to the palace?

Because this is why you are on the island to begin with - to see the Queen. Not to solve local problems, not to sightseeing or visiting random temples - you swam across the sea to visit the Palace. You also were told it's very difficult to get the audience. And just the moment ago you impressed the crowd with the ghost show, so, while impression is fresh, it makes perfect sense to proceed to the Palace immediately in hope it will let you see the royal family.

 

Getting Tekehu into see the prince, even babysitting him on a trip to the Gullet, is no rationale for him joining your crew permanently.

His reason for that is a lark that gets him away from the guild.

Actually, when you are done with the Gullet, Prince gives you next task and sends Tekehu with you - again. If it's OK to take Tekehu with you to the Gullet on the Prince's request, it should not be less OK to do it again.

 

My problem is that the writing doesn't make any sense, and as far as Tekehu goes, the fact that he expresses no concern over the giant statue stomping through his country and just wants to go on a lark to get away from a guild he signed up to join.

And it does not make any sense because...? No, seriously - why? Tekehu has a personal problem - conflict of artistic nature and demanding political figure role. Why exactly he has to pay attention to some rumors about some giant statues?

 

Though you also remind me that the writing on the prince's task is pretty strained also. He finds a Principi coin and this means there's a smuggling ring? And he needs a stranger to go check it out for him, a stranger who is trying to save his countrymen from Big Stompy?

Not "a stranger" - a Watcher. And how is this particular complain related to believability of Tekehu? Address your complains to the genre then. 99.9% quests in every RPG there is has the same problem - main character being a total stranger is supposed to solve everyone's problems from kittens on the trees to world saving.

 

But we are talking about Tekehu. And I can only repeat - it's totally understandable not to like his personality. But telling he is "badly written" or "makes less sense than any other companion" - is ridiculous.

Edited by Mirandel
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There's a lot in this game you can criticize, but Tekehu's reason for joining the party? Seems like an extremely nittpicky thing to scrutinize? I get that his character is not for everyone though.

It's only one of numerous things that are irritating about his character. But taken together with knowing how his story turns out, it makes me question why I should recruit him at all.

 

 

Why are we "supposed" to talk to the Prince first, when we're forced to go through Periki's Overlook to get to the palace?

Because this is why you are on the island to begin with - to see the Queen. Not to solve local problems, not to sightseeing or visiting random temples - you swam across the sea to visit the Palace. You also were told it's very difficult to get the audience. And just the moment ago you impressed the crowd with the ghost show, so, while impression is fresh, it makes perfect sense to proceed to the Palace immediately in hope it will let you see the royal family.

 

Getting Tekehu into see the prince, even babysitting him on a trip to the Gullet, is no rationale for him joining your crew permanently.

His reason for that is a lark that gets him away from the guild.

Actually, when you are done with the Gullet, Prince gives you next task and sends Tekehu with you - again. If it's OK to take Tekehu with you to the Gullet on the Prince's request, it should not be less OK to do it again.

 

My problem is that the writing doesn't make any sense, and as far as Tekehu goes, the fact that he expresses no concern over the giant statue stomping through his country and just wants to go on a lark to get away from a guild he signed up to join.

And it does not make any sense because...? No, seriously - why? Tekehu has a personal problem - conflict of artistic nature and demanding political figure role. Why exactly he has to pay attention to some rumors about some giant statues?

 

Though you also remind me that the writing on the prince's task is pretty strained also. He finds a Principi coin and this means there's a smuggling ring? And he needs a stranger to go check it out for him, a stranger who is trying to save his countrymen from Big Stompy?

Not "a stranger" - a Watcher. And how is this particular complain related to believability of Tekehu? Address your complains to the genre then. 99.9% quests in every RPG there is has the same problem - main character being a total stranger is supposed to solve everyone's problems from kittens on the trees to world saving.

 

But we are talking about Tekehu. And I can only repeat - it's totally understandable not to like his personality. But telling he is "badly written" or "makes less sense than any other companion" - is ridiculous.

 

I didn't turn in the Prince's quest until the end of the game. First, I didn't like being his lackey. Second, seeing what a mess his city is underscored why I shouldn't bother to run his city for him. So I don't care much about his suggestion to take Tekehu with me, either, especially since he doesn't explain it. Why should I ditch one of my crew so one of the locals can go sightseeing in his own city?

 

You're arguing that I should make a beeline to the palace and stop nowhere along the way, then arguing I should just take Tekehu along for no purpose whatsoever.

 

I get that if you like him, you're interested in his artistic dilemma. I'm not, and it breaks logic that I should recruit someone who is clearly unsuited and not especially willing. If you tell Tekehu (as I did) that you want him along so that he can use his powers to kill your enemies, he ought to refuse to join your crew. After all, he'd just be trading one unpalatable duty for another. His sole rationale (other than adventure and getting away from his guild) being a single quest in the Gullet makes no sense whatsoever for a permanent companion. Particularly since there's no good reason to take him there.

 

Contrast Serafen- after the Principi attacks your ship, his rationale for joining  you to hunt down the ones who attacked you makes sense, and his personality is suited to your mission. Or Maia- I wasn't thrilled with where her quest was going, either, but she had a legitimate reason to want to serve on your crew, and her story ended up resolving itself surprisingly well. Tekehu's is just disappointing all throughout.

Edited by Celan
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I actually have some questions about Serafen sticking around when I don't head to Fort Deadlight until very late in the game. He isn't really here to help me kill Benweth, he is here for Remaro, so why does he stay with me if I avoid visiting Deadlight for many months? There is a risk Remaro's trail will run cold. 

 

But I just roll with it because it's a videogame, and not everything makes perfect sense if you do things out of order. 

 

Or Maia- I wasn't thrilled with where her quest was going, either, but she had a legitimate reason to want to serve on your crew, and her story ended up resolving itself surprisingly well. 

No it didn't. There should be an option to kick her out after her quest, and I know quite a few people who were surprised that it wasn't there. 

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I would have no problem with having an option to kick Maia out. I think that should be available for every companion tbh.

 

Again, with Serafen, I only went to Fort Deadlight in mid to late game. I got the impression that he only decided to tell you about Remaro after seeing that you can get things done.

 

And if I have to twist this much to make Tekehu's story seem plausible, that is bad writing- or bad quest design. If, as people keep saying, you're supposed to go to the palace on a beeline, then the rest of the city should have been gated off until you did.

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I cannot stand Tuna Man.

 

OK. I will admit he is good in combat.

 

Aside from that I cannot stand his whole, prideful naive personality.  Its like nails on a chalkboard.

 

And to make matters worse I recruit him and then seconds later he wants to bed me. Uh. No.

 

Just the thought of my character sleeping with him :x! (It really does make me want to toss-up my cookies).

 

Last thing I need is to indulge in ichthyophile.

 

I really do not get why people are like, "OMG! He is the best character!" To each their own I guess.

 

But does anyone out there not like Mackerel Boy and/or get literately sick about the concept of having "relations" with him?!?

 

 

(BTW: Props to the developers/writers for creating the first NPC in my 30+ years of gaming that literately makes me so damn queasy when he speaks to me/anyone about sex either directly or in-directly).

I'm the same. I want him in the party for the perspective he brings, but I can't stand him. He is revolting. I hated Durance, but at least I thought Durance was a good character. I can't say the same for Fishboy. His perspective is interesting and well written, but everything else about him seems like it came from a can and was packed in oil.

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Again, with Serafen, I only went to Fort Deadlight in mid to late game. I got the impression that he only decided to tell you about Remaro after seeing that you can get things done

You can head to Deadlight right after Port-Maje, and he will still tell you about Remaro even though he barely knows you. The only difference between the quality of his motivation and Tekehu's is that you are okay with one character but dislike another.

 

If you want to talk about companions who don't have proper motivations to join you, look at Eder who goes back to Adyr to reunite with his parents if you don't finish his quest in the first game. Yet in Deadfire he is suddenly by your side because reasons, even though he doesn't really owe you anything.

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Again, with Serafen, I only went to Fort Deadlight in mid to late game. I got the impression that he only decided to tell you about Remaro after seeing that you can get things done

You can head to Deadlight right after Port-Maje, and he will still tell you about Remaro even though he barely knows you. The only difference between the quality of his motivation and Tekehu's is that you are okay with one character but dislike another.

 

If you want to talk about companions who don't have proper motivations to join you, look at Eder who goes back to Adyr to reunite with his parents if you don't finish his quest in the first game. Yet in Deadfire he is suddenly by your side because reasons, even though he doesn't really owe you anything.

 

He can decide that you get things done based on your initial encounter with Benweth and his head scan. And he's still 100% more suited to your real mission than Tekehu is.

 

As for Eder, regardless of where he was at the end of PoE1, he's not there for you- he's there for Eothas who's up and walking around.

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