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would it have been better that they fix frostseeker proc rate than outright removing swift flurry for range? frostseeker fire 3 arrows per attack. so why not make it that only 1 of the 3 arrows would have 33% chance to proc? if i understand why it infinitely proc probably because each arrow previously has 33% chance of proccing another attack. also they can go the route to reduce the damage for the procced 2nd attack or restrict 2-3 procs within 2-3secs? what i'm saying they can play around with the balancing of effectiveness of the proccing. what do you think it would have been a better solution for this? just interested to know what people think and how you see it should be balanced.

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I think they mainly changed it to melee only because of Kalakoth's Minor Blights and Rod's Blast modal, not only Frostseeker.

 

Blights and rod were the most prominent and reported tools for Swift Flurry abuse in the beta.

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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But the abuse was made possible by recursive proccing, was it not? Once recursive proccing was fixed, there was no reason left to limit the ability to melee—and yet here we are...


"Time is not your enemy. Forever is."

— Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment

"It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers."

— Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears

My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke

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Yes, I didn't say it was a good fix. ;)

 

By the way I'm still not sure that the chain procs got fixed. Were they?

 

I also have the impression in my playtrough that Cleaving Stance still procs off itself - but only attacks one additional enemy now. But I would need to do more testing to verify.

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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The patch notes do say it was fixed:

 

 

Swift Flurry will no longer recursively proc infinitely.

 

 

Though if "melee only" is the fix, all I can do is facepalm.

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"Time is not your enemy. Forever is."

— Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment

"It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers."

— Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears

My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke

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Recursively? :lol:

 

Why? I think it works in the context:

 

 

pertaining to or using a rule or procedure that can be applied repeatedly.


"Time is not your enemy. Forever is."

— Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment

"It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers."

— Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears

My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke

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I can buy that swift flurry procing off range was just silly conceptually for the monk, and they got rid of it for that reason alone.  Hopefully the Barbarian version was removed for the same reason.

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Recursively? :lol:

Why? I think it works in the context:

pertaining to or using a rule or procedure that can be applied repeatedly.

ROFL! :lol: I meant whether you facepalm recursively! *tearwipe* Edited by Boeroer
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Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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I can buy that swift flurry procing off range was just silly conceptually for the monk, and they got rid of it for that reason alone. Hopefully the Barbarian version was removed for the same reason.

Which Barbarian version? The class has no ability that procs an additional attack on crit or kill - or has it?

 

If you mean Carnage: it doesn't work with ranged weapons. I wonder if Swift Flurry/Heartbeat Drumming and Carnage work with The Long Pain or Instruments of Pain though.

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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LOL epic brain fart fail on my part XD

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"Time is not your enemy. Forever is."

— Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment

"It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers."

— Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears

My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke

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Oop, me too.... was thinking Heartbeat Drumming...  First character I ran through was a Hel / Berz, thought that the Heartbeat was from Barbarian side, since monk is about Swift Flurry for extra attacks...  Upon looking it up again, its Monk, and from Melee only.

 

As for them working with Long Pain / Instruments I would think (haven't tested) that these function like Ranged, not Melee weapons... Should be an easy test though, use Barbaric Smash, at range with one of these, if Carnage triggers then they are eligible.  I might check that.

 

Well, that was Educational. 

 

-Smash is 'Weapon' Range, I use it an a Rog/Bers build that uses Spearcaster, and that works fine.

 

-Long Pain + Smash forces you to run into 'normal' melee range.  It also doesn't trigger Carnage (So I'd assume no Heartbeat either). 

 

-Basic Auto Attacks with Long Pain, had the 'extended' range working fine, but they weren't able to trigger Carnage either.  Possibly some kind of bug with 'Weapon' range effects not correctly reading the actual range of Long Pain, and instead reverting back to 'normal' melee range.

 

So, Long Pain = Ranged weapon, that has bugged range, at least with Smash, possibly other 'Weapon' range abilities also.  Carnage is easier to test (esp. with a Berserker confusion) I'd guess Swift Flurry works the same way, but that's a % to trigger, so would require more time to check than Carnage.

Edited by Lokithecat
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And Instruments of Pain?

 

I would test myself but I'm on vacation - without computer. :)


Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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The patch notes do say it was fixed:

 

 

Swift Flurry will no longer recursively proc infinitely.

 

 

Though if "melee only" is the fix, all I can do is facepalm.

 

if it's already been fixed then it should not restrict to melee only. it has been allowed pre 1.1 for range and it encourages build diversity. limit it to melee is actually discourage build variety.

 

I can buy that swift flurry procing off range was just silly conceptually for the monk, and they got rid of it for that reason alone.  Hopefully the Barbarian version was removed for the same reason.

 

i don't buy it at all. i find it even more silly where barbarian while fighting busily on 1 hand  corpse eating perhaps a human drumstick? lol

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