Jimmysdabestcop
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Posts posted by Jimmysdabestcop
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I still don't think there are any "tanks" in PoE. There is no aggro system, no guarding system, and no taking damage meant for other party members. Those are the 3 things that help make tanks well tanks.
All PoE has is meat shields. Make a character with enough defesne that just cant be hit. Its the AI problem it won't just go around him. But a lot of encoutner areas its actually hard to navigate. And the AI insists on trying to engage melee with a character it cant reach instead of switching to range and killing your low deflection low armor members.
And basing the game on Normal Mode since its "normal" you can easily take Defender and Wary Defender and dual wield with talent which cancels out the -20% speed. Then armor grace gives you -16% recovery. A Fighter can easily dump int to 3. Max Might and Dex and raise Per and Res. Or dump Int and con and max everything else.
Not having Con might mean more rests for overal HP. But the Fighter has a cape that increases regen, 2 regen talents plus other regen items and Endurance boosting items. and max might increases regen further. So they don't need Max Deflection just take the hits and regen while wasting 2 talents on defense and the rest on offense.
And Fighters don't need any management. Just set it and forget it. Any other class that out damages a fighter needs way more management. So you just have to play the game you like with the characters you like.
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Based on normal mode. I don't see how the Paladin out performs the fighter at anything related to the front line. And it can't compete with the support classes either. Its weird hybrid and i dont see how it works well. DnD Paladin had clerical spells, turn undead, plus usually anti magic or anti undead features, or if dark paladin fear like effects.
A fighter doesn't even need a shield. It can dual wield or go 2 handed and out damage a paladin negating the need for MAX Def because its killing enemies way quicker. Plus 2 weapon talent cancels out the only negative from fighter's defender talent.
If you are setting up your Paladin to be a meat shield and max deflect they cannot compete with the Fighter in damage output. And to be effective the Paladin really needs many attributes high. That has always been the problem with a Paladin even in DnD.
Honeslty think Paladins should have had bonuses againt either Vessels or Spirits. The Fighter can get high deflect without even trying while the Paladin has to waste way to many talents on defense or use a shield. And if a fighter needs more Deflect for a specific battle then you just change weapon slots to one with a shield. But the Fighter just doesn't need MAX Deflection because they can absorb damage. Its just to easy to get boosts to regen for your fighter and max Might helps it.
Fighter needs to blow 2 talents on defense. Defender and Wary Defender that's it. Paladin, Probably needs cautious attack, hold the line, sword and shield, greater deflection, faith and conviction 2 talents, and the talent that negates opposite conviction if you aren't paying attention to your choices.
While that fighter can then focus on speed and offense damage talents.
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PC Fighter > NPC/Adventurer Paladin. Since faith and conviction doesn't work.
But I would still favor the Fighter as a PC over the Paladin. The Fighter can completely dump Con and Int and have 18 Might, Dex, Res, Per while a Paladin cannot do that. The paladin needs Int for abilities and auroras or they are pointless. And yeah there are several regen items but a fighter has 2 regen talents and a fighter specific regen cape and more might more regen. Fighters don't need Int they have 2 abilities that use it and aren't really needed. And with max might and the those regen talents & items dont need Con.
The Fighter just needs defender and wary defender to be more then front line ready. And you don't have to manage that character at all. I had Eder setup like that dual wielding sabres. Act 3 his deflection was over 90 probably closer to 100. And there were enough items and rest boosts that all of his attributes were boosted by at least 2 points. imagine that on your PC fighter with four 18 attributes.
A Priest can have just as high deflection as a Paladin however they wont be able to last as long if they are taking damage between rests. Their Endurance might not be far off but overall HP the Paladin will nearly double the Priest.
However A Priest can still deal damage out in melee even with the biggest shield. Take the Skaen priest. +10 to stilettos and clubs. If you take the ruffian talent that is +6 and clubs have a natural +5 before enchantments. Thats +21 to accuracy with no spell buffs and no enhantments and there is a superb club in game +12. Total +33 to accuracy in act 3. And then you have all your priestly spells. And there is an open class herald shield just like the Paladin but you dont get it until you take care of the dragon.
I rather have the front line fighter that I can set and forget. And if I need a front line support member who I actively have to manage I rather bring the Priest for all the Spells.
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6 Adventurers and a Baby!
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Good points. I've probably been to harsh on the Ranger. And I think it has to do with the NPC. The NPC's wolf is terrible and a lot of people its their first ranger and only ranger in the game. A PC Ranger is much better. I'll still take a Rogue in range combat over the Ranger cause I rather not manage the animal and I can set the Rogue up to basically always Crit. But then it comes down to personal preference.
However I've been playing with a new build. Melee Ranger Dual Spears or hatchets or mixture. Its actually pretty good because you don't have to baby sit the Ranger like you do the Rogue cause by Act 3 you can get 90+ deflection. Granted the Rogue with Tall Grass can cause never ending prone/crit attacks but it has to do it behind a front liner or flanking an enemy and can never be put on the front line. If the Ranger cant reach melee he can still switch to quaterstaff or hunting bow.
But then the Ranger has no ranger talents that really help in melee. That's a shame. The Ranger class historical is what started the dual weapon craze. I would like 1 specific ranger talent to have something to do with dual wield. Perhaps add damage multiplier ranger only.
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Absolutely no way a Ranger does more damage then a Rogue in ranged combat. its impossible and doesn't come close to out meleeing a rogue. As long as its a proper rogue build they will basically crit on at least 75% of all there hits. And they should have the most hits in the party if ranged with max dex and clothes or robes.
And if an of the enemies are flanked or have a disable on them not only does the rogue crit but they will score a critical sneak attack. And say if you have a weapon that causes stun or prone on crits. Plus additional crit damage multipliers. No way a ranger can keep up pet or no pet.
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Ranger is one of the best classes for Path of the Damned, Trial of Iron playing blind. I kid you not. I'm currently doing POTD on TOI and dominating everything in my path. Check out my ranger build - http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/78315-ranger-build-path-of-the-damned-trial-of-iron-81-dmg-crit-at-level-4/ - Ranger is VERY powerful!
I do think you have to base everything on normal mode. That should always be the most balanced mode for the most players. Or else it wouldn't be normal
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how do you achieve 135 deflection without buffs with a priest??
16 shield + 12 upgraded +6 (shield + talent) + 5 raw talent + 10 ring + up to 30 stats(durance wont reach this) + 15 base deflection + 36 (level up) = 130, i am missing something?
+5 deflection from Hatchet, but still doesn't explain the stats, unless what he's saying is unbuffed is including something like the Paladin shield, maybe fighter aura too.
He also has the Cautious Defender Talent and his Res and Per are both enhanced with items.(+3/+2). Buffs I should have specified meaning no spellcasting buffs. No Paladin in party.
.....Just double checked my last save it was 125 deflection not 135 on Durance my bad. Still damn high. He had 2 regen items and a 2nd chance item. His spell casting was slooooooooow but honeslty only needed them for boss fights or mini bosses. Probably would have made more sense to bring chanter/paladin or even the ranger NPC along. But I just didn't feel like swapping out party members for when I knew I need priest spells.
Act 3 was kind of boring difficulty wise. My entire party was level 12 already at the start. I can also say that by Act 3 I grew super lazy. Tired of microing everyone's spells or encounter abilities. So it was easy to send Durance in and have my 2 fighter engage in melee. With GM, Druid NPC and custom range rogue auto attacking. Maybe throw 1-2 GM cipher attacks out there.
Think the only party members who didn't have Second Chance items was Rogue adventurer and GM. Gave Hirvaris that 2nd chance robe. GM did some nice range damage with +3 Might item.
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Bioware has been going downhill after DAO which is what I consider the last real rpg they produced(didn't play DA2 so can't comment on that one). It is not that they are bad games, but they are bad RPGs. They are more akin to action games than RPGs these days.
Agreed. They might still be games but they aren't cRPG's. They are all action/adventure hybrids while not being aRPG's either.
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Maxis and Bioware yup 1 thing in common as already stated EA. It did take EA a lot longer to kill Maxis then Bioware since Maxis was such a giant company at the time and Wil Wright was a game rockstar. I mean Windows 95 came default with a Maxis game. And later ms offfice had a built in easter egg for the Maxis game. And they were already a public traded company. So it took like 2 decades for Maxis to be wiped out by EA.
You will notice Simcity 4 is where the SimCity games really started down a different path. Because Wil Wright had nothing to do it. Those games lost their heart. They were just SimCity in name. Wil was off doing the Sims until he stopped doing that and then left Maxis. My favorite is still SimCity 3000 Unlimited Edition. Wil Wright's last city masterpiece.
Bioware you can tell their cRPG's were completely different after Mass Effect 1. Microsoft basically let them alone. Then under EA all of their games had less RPG elements and more action/adventure. ME1 I platyed about a 12 times. ME2 once and didn't even bother with ME3 by that time it was basically void of all classic RPG elements.
The only reason Dragon Age Origins survived was because it was in development since 2004 and released in 2009 So EA couldn't change the game. The newest game Dragon Age inquistion I'm not even sure how you can call it a cRPG. I mean you cant even switch weapons from melee to range. There are spells but not real spells with real effects. Its action/adventure spells not cRPG spells. There is no real choice in class or talents everything is bland. Its more Zelda then RPG except Zelda series did it better. At least you could switch items and have meaning for it. And it can't compete with say Torchwood 2 in the aRPG world. Its like some kind of weird hybrid RPG that excels at nothing but covers every area of RPG gaming. Hell I take Jade Empire over DAI.
Then finally Bioware suffers same fate as Maxis and studio heads left. Bioware probably has 5-10 years before EA just dissolves the name like it always does.
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How about a durance falls off a cliff mod never to bother me again
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Kill both sides and leave the child in your stash the entire game......
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The House Doemenel thread is so funky depending it what happens you won't even get a chance to their 1st quest let alone know that they are even a faction. And the Dozens is most likely one of the 1st building you will enter in defiance bay.
Perhaps an even better idea is to have a diplomat of each faction at the palace and that is who gives you the quests. The npcs in the building headquarters could just give random non faction locking quests to unclock traders/shops. At least new players will have an idea then.
I didn't read 1 sentence before the game launch. The Dozens never showed up on my character sheet as a faction even though I eventually joined them. House Doemenel quest never spawned I only ever got the vendor quest and then finally their faction showed up on my sheet.
Its possible not even to see the other factions do the quick dozens one and accept the 2nd one and boom locked out.
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I mean you figure getting locked into a faction should have to do with your reputation for that faction. But it comes down to accepting 1 extra quest that's it. Where as when you do the quests for the God's they kind of specificaly state don't double cross us etc.
It should be setup that you cant take any 2nd quest from any faction until you did 1 quest for each faction first. Then maybe have a random encounter for each faction where a character is saying something like we can give you more quests/jobs but you have to pledge with us and not those other 2 factions.
If you go into the playthrough blind you will never even know there are factions and you get locked out of stuff. Like Wasteland 2 you can often go in complete different paths but it is made known you are locking the other part out.
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I actually think PoE has no tanks at all. There is no guard feature. So can't auto protect anyone. And there is no ability on an warrior type class that can absorb damage meant for other characters. And there is no taunting or aggro of any kind. And engagement rules don't really lock enemies onto to anyone. If tere is a big enough area who ever cant engange will just run around your front line crew and melee anyone they want.
But most engagement areas aren't wide open. And the AI isn't as strong as it needs to be a 100% of the time. As sometimes the enemy AI will try forever to engage melee even if it cant reach that party member. I mean if the AI was smart enough they just run around your front liners to your spells casters. Or everyone go range and take out your Wizard/Cipher in the first 10 seconds like the Player can do.
Really the only thing making these PoE "psuedo tanks" is some classes have high base deflection, plus right attributes, and items so you can engage many enemies and not die while not dealing damage. PoE tank would then just be described as a character focused on high defenses that does no damage. Not really the classical tank definition.
Now compare that to the IE cRPG's where you didn't have to pick between taking a hit or dealing damage. You just had to have the right armor and AC boosts. You could "tank" with any class and didn't have to sacrifice dealing damage at all. Seems kind of limiting in PoE.
Like in my Party I set Durance up to be my meat shield. In Act 3 his deflection was like 135 or something unbuffed. So he never got hit. I really him doing damage cause the fights were over so quick there was no time for his spells. Only reason I brought him was stroyline and for boss and mini boss battles where his spells were useful.
And I could have swapped Durance out for a better damage dealer NPC and gotten the fights over even quicker.
But I do think levels 1-5 are a lot harder then levels 6-12 in the game.
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Honestly I feel Priests and Paladin kind of lackluster to DnD at least 2nd through 3.5 editions. Plus compared to the IE cRPG games it feels like the battles are just over really quickly. At least in say BG2 you had several enemy casters with defenses up and you had to take them down before you could generally hurt them in melee or with magic. Granted other difficulties have increased battle length but you have to base everything off of normal mode.
Wonder how many spells my Durance even used? I would say less then a dozen heal spells for sure. And probably less then 50 spells the entire game. Most fights didn't require it.
and speaking of the Wizard. After level 9 I actually liked the Druid spells better than the Wizard so switched him out. Another strange decision. Every other spell casters gets entire level of spells but Wizards has to pick 2 per level or find them in books but cant find in loot or buy in stores. That is just strange.
The Paladin NPC I didn't even need her. I already had 3 front line characters. And Eder set up as dual weapon saber user. He was able to tank just fine while not even trying. So why would I want the Paladin to come along? Feels like its basically a character with high deflection, no regen, who cant put any damage out at least not as much as Eder can. Granted a PC Paladin would play different.
DnD Paladin had the entire undead and cleric spells going for the class. Plus the kits. PoE wants the Paladin as a Knight really. Should have just made the class into a knight or cavalier class. You would figure a PoE Paladin should be all anti soul, anti animancracy, anti vessel at least. But its not. It just gets Auroras.
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Plus, PoE shades aren't like BG1 Ankhegs because you can't take "shade shells" to a smithy and have him make "shade plate" out of it.
Wait how about Soul Spirit Plate!!!! I want it. I need it. it must be mine. That would be best item ever.
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Plus Ankhegs always reminded me of Kevin Bacon and Tremors. Didn't they remake the Ankhegs in Mass Effect 1 aka Thresher Maws.
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A rogue is pretty good in melee or ranged. But it is easier if you decide at creation which way to go. Focus on anything that improves Crit. Even Race, hint hint. There are weapons as well as factions that will increase crit % as well. Its possible to basically get a rogue to crit on every melee hit. Even ranged not trying 1st playthrough ym rogue crit on like 80% of all hits.
Priests I kind of find lackluster in PoE. Adored Clerics in DnD. But I guess in DnD you almost always had several fighter levels 1st. But the Cleric buffs in DnD were ridiculous. Made them almost not hittable and also gave them same To Hit and like Orgre Strength.
Priest Accuracy kind of sucks in PoE. And you have to put so much effort into it I feel to make it worth it if you want to engange and do good melee damage. They can be cannons pretty good. Right Race and talents can really boost ranged Accuracy a lot. Melee you have to make sure you give them a reach item that has extra accuracy or go 1 handed.
I turned my Durance into a front line Tank. So he could cast his buffs/debuffs/heals at the front line. Focus on them defense talents. Biggest enchanted shield until you find that "special small shield" and hatchet for more deflection. a +10 deflection item as well. Som Con/Endurance boosting items. Second chance item. Even got him a endurance regenration item. He rarely got hit and he could regen like a fighter.
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A DPS fighter is a poor toon in POE.
The right way to play is very heavy armor tank/s and DPS ranged/spellcasters behind.
A DPS fighter will be at the front line needs heavy armor. heavy armor in this game means no damage because it reduces your speed. This was out of some bizzare and silly notion that all armors should be equal in usability and no armor better than another. Idiotic to the extreme, but whatever.
If you use a front line fighter without armor you'll die in a second (but have good DPS
)On normal mode I disagree. I turned Eder into dual wielding sabre monster. Boosted his Dex +3 and his might +3 and he even has boosted per and res. Enchanted his starting armor up to superb. As well as dual wield a pair unique sabres with full enchantments. He puts out some serious damage. And barely takes damage since he dflection is so high by default. And his starting armor has 2nd chance. More danger of a KO early game then mid to late game.
Will they out DPS every class? No you have the bugged Barbarian and probably the Rogue if focused on critical chance that will out DPS. But the fighter will be top 3 DPS while not getting hit. You only have to take 2 defensive talents to make this happen. And if something goes wrong just switch to weapon slot that has a shield.
Normal mode is setup that you dont really need the MMO tank character. You could just opt for 3 melee characters with 2 of them being some kind of martial class. Then still have your 3 DPS ranged characters. Or 2 ranged and throw in a melee barb or melee rogue with reach weapon.
Other difficulty modes might provide better challenge. But Normal modes can be the most the fun becasue you honestly don't have to worry about party or class. You could roll with 6 priests if you wanted and be fine.
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How about when you get that +20 Crit Chance from the thief faction in defiance bay. It be more like 60% crit chance if you had summon that should trigger racial. And if not its 50% chance to crit. Attack it from stealth x2 damage as well if you have backstab.
No but prone on crit the next attack will be sneak attack. And with 50-60% chance of crit it will probably be crit as well. I had a range rogue on normal and not even really focusing on crit hits ended up with 80% crits by act 3.
Its not really for me but I'm sure someone on here could solo the dragon as a melee rogue.
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You only really run out of superb ingredients. If not your garden and other stronghold options generate enough at least for all weapomns and armors.
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Woah why all the bashing? PoE hits all the right notes with nostalgia...although Shades posed a problems for weaker members (I'm looking at you Aloth), at least it was not as bad as the Ankhegs who could one shot your party.
Nothing like slow moving green spit to act as a homing missle right at your wizard or thief.
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Dozens never even showed up under my Party as a faction or dispalyed my standing with them. Even though they sponsored me at the meeting.
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Are Paladins really not that bad?
in Pillars of Eternity: Characters Builds, Strategies & the Unity Engine (Spoiler Warning!)
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Yeah it is weird that is in an item in the first village the game puts you in. i'm sure it drops paladin shield idea into peoples heads. But I guess yeah nothing is forcing you to use a shield.
I will give PoE the fact that you basically have a party consiting of any combination of classes and have awful attributes and you will still be fine and enjoy the game if its what you picked while playing on normal.
But the Paladin right now you are forced to use as the PC or the major Paladin mojo (faith and conviction) doesn't work. Even as your PC the Paladin just feels "off". Like it is missing something that Paladin's always have in DnD, P&P, other cRPG's. Might not be able to put my finger on it but the Paladin is just lacking something. Maybe its because Religion/Gods is completely removed? And the Class plays as some kind of Knight/Commander/Leader type of character.
Like if the class was called something else beside Paladin would so many people be disappointed with the class?