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About the July 12 Q&A livestream

q&a news mechanics updates

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40 replies to this topic

#21
injurai

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Priest is confusing. There are certainly spells I never used. But with the AI system I feel that gives you more time to look through and parse all your options. So I'm not sure why they would make the set smaller. But maybe some of those spells won't have much of a purpose given some of the other changes.



#22
blotter

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So I'm not sure why they would make the set smaller.

 

Part of it may relate back to having the priests of different deities have their own associated lists of prohibited spells, which we've heard about before, but I'd expect that to be balanced out by the deity-specific spells that such priests gain access to.

 

I also feel that not giving the monk class (and/or the monk-subclasses) the ability to chug alcoholic beverages midfight for a bit of "drunken" style fighting would be a huge missed opportunity.

 

The benefits from the Nalpazca subclass could easily extend to alcohol consumption. [Edit: On second thought, I don't think the sentence that used to be here was particularly helpful.]


Edited by blotter, 13 July 2017 - 02:25 PM.

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#23
rjshae

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Perhaps the priest spells lists will expand as you increase in level? I.e. later on you gain access to previously prohibited spells for lower levels?



#24
injurai

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Perhaps the priest spells lists will expand as you increase in level? I.e. later on you gain access to previously prohibited spells for lower levels?

 

Hmm that's interesting. Spell level then becomes more of a tool to denote spell strength and resource management. As opposed to group by level, which is kind of an arbitrary grouping anyways. Makes spell navigation less than ideal.



#25
Lamppost in Winter

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I remember possibly from one of the other Q&As is that the Priest spells will be doled out in smaller packages, and that different deities will have access to different spell lists?



#26
Quillon

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I remember possibly from one of the other Q&As is that the Priest spells will be doled out in smaller packages, and that different deities will have access to different spell lists?

 

Yeah something along those lines for Priests and Druids instead of dumping all the spells as we gain levels.



#27
Osvir

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Which is great! Both Priest and Druid felt a bit caught in the past on spell acquisition/leveling up in Eternity 1. I asked for spell choosing already during the BB (Backer Beta), maybe even before. I'm happy :)

Going to be fun to build various elemental Druids, or maybe even a pure Healer/Support Druid. An all out Druid party with different aspects?

Also got an idea for a buff Priest+debuff Priest combo (will use adventurers and Xoti for that). Great strategy in Tyranny (albeit a bit repetetive), debuff-, buff-, DD-mage, protected by one tank.

Edited by Osvir, 13 July 2017 - 09:01 PM.


#28
MaxQuest

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Priest is confusing. There are certainly spells I never used. But with the AI system I feel that gives you more time to look through and parse all your options. So I'm not sure why they would make the set smaller. But maybe some of those spells won't have much of a purpose given some of the other changes.

Priest indeed has many spells. And I have also used only a portion of them. Specifically:
Spoiler


But tbh, I think it would be great if we still had ~8 spells per rank in Deadfire as we had in PoE1.
Some spells might be underused, but chances are they will be of great use in some very specific situation, and especially if one goes solo.

P.S. Potential removal of spells reminds me of WoW (which I've played 11-6 years ago). Just have to say that I still remember the removal of: Spellstone, Curse of Idiocy, Curse of Recklessness, Curse and Ritual of Doom, Detect Invisibility, and ability to cast low rank spells (especially Corruption, Fear and Healthstone). I've heard even Mana Drain and Unending Breath were removed. And all these had their uses! Such removal was just sad...

Edited by MaxQuest, 14 July 2017 - 02:51 AM.


#29
injurai

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I remember when that big class redactor happened. The one thing I liked is that every class got some sort of proc, and resource management got a bit more diversified. But the major loss to me was the simplification of the talent tree.

 

If they simplified it to build it back up again over time then I can kind of understand, but I didn't stick around long enough to find out. I think I was playing Mage and Paladin at the time.



#30
anameforobsidian

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One thing i dislike is they are making the priest spell list smaller? And people find it difficult and confusing? I mean seriously?

 

I beat the game on the Ultimate and I still think the priest list is somewhat confusing.  

 

Part of the reason for that is that the priest list is the best counter for most status effects.  All of the counter effects are spread out on different levels, sometimes in a way that doesn't make sense.  Prayer against infirmity counters two very different status effects.  Prayer against restraint doesn't affect paralyzed, which is healed in the more powerful prayer against imprisonment.  Isn't imprisonment by definition restraint?  Prayer against bewilderment is far too high-level, especially since it's next to litany against minor afflictions.  Same is true for litany of major afflictions.  And bizarrely, stunned is the most powerful debuff in the game since it can't be healed.

 

The whole thing is a bit haphazard.


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#31
DigitalCrack

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One thing i dislike is they are making the priest spell list smaller? And people find it difficult and confusing? I mean seriously?


I beat the game on the Ultimate and I still think the priest list is somewhat confusing.

Part of the reason for that is that the priest list is the best counter for most status effects. All of the counter effects are spread out on different levels, sometimes in a way that doesn't make sense. Prayer against infirmity counters two very different status effects. Prayer against restraint doesn't affect paralyzed, which is healed in the more powerful prayer against imprisonment. Isn't imprisonment by definition restraint? Prayer against bewilderment is far too high-level, especially since it's next to litany against minor afflictions. Same is true for litany of major afflictions. And bizarrely, stunned is the most powerful debuff in the game since it can't be healed.

The whole thing is a bit haphazard.

I actually like that spells are going to be broken down and actually have a different pool based on diety. Makes the priest class diety selection, as a whole, exceedlingly more interesting.
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#32
Archaven

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Priest is confusing. There are certainly spells I never used. But with the AI system I feel that gives you more time to look through and parse all your options. So I'm not sure why they would make the set smaller. But maybe some of those spells won't have much of a purpose given some of the other changes.

Priest indeed has many spells. And I have also used only a portion of them. Specifically:
Spoiler


But tbh, I think it would be great if we still had ~8 spells per rank in Deadfire as we had in PoE1.
Some spells might be underused, but chances are they will be of great use in some very specific situation, and especially if one goes solo.

P.S. Potential removal of spells reminds me of WoW (which I've played 11-6 years ago). Just have to say that I still remember the removal of: Spellstone, Curse of Idiocy, Curse of Recklessness, Curse and Ritual of Doom, Detect Invisibility, and ability to cast low rank spells (especially Corruption, Fear and Healthstone). I've heard even Mana Drain and Unending Breath were removed. And all these had their uses! Such removal was just sad...

 

 

I find myself using many of those Priest spells. Some are situational but they are the answers or counters for some encounters. There maybe few that are less useful. Personally i like the idea of having lots of spells to choose from and these spells may be the answers to turn the tide of a battle. In other words, it's a hidden layer of difficulty that rewards the player for understanding the mechanics? Otherwise if rock, paper, scissor mechanic being removed in an RPG, that will be plain boring of just dealing damage. Of course it's my opinion.


Edited by Archaven, 14 July 2017 - 09:21 AM.

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#33
injurai

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Yeah, if I had to choose. I'd rather have just a few too many spells so that it always felt like I could dig a bit deeper to find a new way to overcome a fight. As opposed to know exactly what I have at my disposal and knowing that I don't really have any tenable options. So as with all things, it's a balancing act.


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#34
Madscientist

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- He said that all classes will have the same base accurancy but different health.

In PoE1, many casters had a lower base acc, but their spells had an acc bonus.

Does this mean the acc bonus of spells will be gone and we get talents for such things (some of them class specific)?

Like a talent that gives an acc bonus to fire spells or fighters can have a bonus for slashing weapons?

 

- He said there will be a fighter subclass that is specialized on one type of weapon.

This sounds very powerful since many players create their builds with one specific weapon in mind.

If I want to make a char who is dual wielding sabres, why should I use a medium bonus to ruffian class if I can have a large bonus to sabres only.



#35
blotter

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This sounds very powerful since many players create their builds with one specific weapon in mind.

If I want to make a char who is dual wielding sabres, why should I use a medium bonus to ruffian class if I can have a large bonus to sabres only.

 

Two things: 1) Proficiency groups like Ruffian no longer exist, all proficiencies apply to a single weapon type, 2) the way enchantment is planned to work in Pillars 2 thematically restricts the sorts of abilities you can add to weapons and also limits the quality level they can be raised to (e.g., fine to exceptional and no further).

 

Consequently, players may find it highly tempting or even necessary in cases (such as when faced with enemies that are highly resistant or even immune to a particular damage type) to switch to weapons that aren't of their chosen type depending on what's available through item drops and stores. Even if finding/being able to buy weapons of more or less any type up to the exceptional level is more or less guaranteed, you may well find yourself deprived of access to unique weapon traits that might otherwise greatly compliment your build so long as you continue to restrict yourself to the use of a single weapon type.



#36
Archaven

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Yeah, if I had to choose. I'd rather have just a few too many spells so that it always felt like I could dig a bit deeper to find a new way to overcome a fight. As opposed to know exactly what I have at my disposal and knowing that I don't really have any tenable options. So as with all things, it's a balancing act.

 

It's a tough call tbh. Devs are trying to make the game more accessible (possibly to newcomers who have not play PoE too). This is evident in one of the recent interview that i read. IMO, i rather they make the game for that "niche" market rather than trying to make the game more accessible.



#37
Archaven

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- He said that all classes will have the same base accurancy but different health.

In PoE1, many casters had a lower base acc, but their spells had an acc bonus.

Does this mean the acc bonus of spells will be gone and we get talents for such things (some of them class specific)?

Like a talent that gives an acc bonus to fire spells or fighters can have a bonus for slashing weapons?

 

- He said there will be a fighter subclass that is specialized on one type of weapon.

This sounds very powerful since many players create their builds with one specific weapon in mind.

If I want to make a char who is dual wielding sabres, why should I use a medium bonus to ruffian class if I can have a large bonus to sabres only.

 

I'm wondering how people overcome damage type immunity or high resist in those damage types. Otherwise, i see the only possible way is to have a weapon to deal dual damage types. For example a Rock Elemental, it should be having high resist on slash/pierce and it's a llittle immersion breaking if the sabres suddenly deal crush/blunt damage.



#38
fortuntek

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Didn't Josh say there was a Fighter subclass called Devoted, which is "devoted" to one weapon type? It's been a few days since I watched the stream and I noticed it hasn't been added to the subclass thread (which has become bloated AF and probably OP can't easily dig through all the posts from people debating what they want instead). Did I imagine this? Or was he just talking hypothetically, anyone know?



#39
Sedrefilos

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Didn't Josh say there was a Fighter subclass called Devoted, which is "devoted" to one weapon type? It's been a few days since I watched the stream and I noticed it hasn't been added to the subclass thread (which has become bloated AF and probably OP can't easily dig through all the posts from people debating what they want instead). Did I imagine this? Or was he just talking hypothetically, anyone know?

Well, that's the nature of internet threads. They get sidetracked upon sidetracked to the point they lose their initial purpose. Εκφυλίζονται.

About the Q&A, yeah, Josh mentioned something like that, though he didn't said much about it.

At this point, seeing how often we get updates and what they usually are, I believe we'll get the most meaningful of those when the game gets close to beta, which is gonna be sometime in (north hemisphere) winter, I hope, if they stick to their scedule.



#40
battlealpaca

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Didn't Josh say there was a Fighter subclass called Devoted, which is "devoted" to one weapon type? It's been a few days since I watched the stream and I noticed it hasn't been added to the subclass thread (which has become bloated AF and probably OP can't easily dig through all the posts from people debating what they want instead). Did I imagine this? Or was he just talking hypothetically, anyone know?

Well, that's the nature of internet threads. They get sidetracked upon sidetracked to the point they lose their initial purpose. Εκφυλίζονται.
About the Q&A, yeah, Josh mentioned something like that, though he didn't said much about it.
At this point, seeing how often we get updates and what they usually are, I believe we'll get the most meaningful of those when the game gets close to beta, which is gonna be sometime in (north hemisphere) winter, I hope, if they stick to their scedule.
I asked on tumblr about devoted as well so theres a bit more info there





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