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Pathfinder Adventures Dev Q&A Stream this Wednesday 6/7/17


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#21
Asiangoodness

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Will skull and shackles ever be digitilized?

#22
TorNis

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Greetings, I am new player of Pathfinder Adventures (and partnered twitch streamer that wishes to stream it on PC) and I have serious questions about PC release business pricing/model you are pushing for upcoming release.

 

Game as of now, is really good f2p app with the gameplay, that pushes you to play/farm more and more to unlock more adventures, heroes, decks, and treasure chests. You have microtransations, which works really well for those who want them. You play to get more gold, more progress, your character development, for the sake of trying unlock more gameplay elements.

 

With recent blog post, we learned, that all mobile users who have payed for bundle or basically unlocked content with time and effort in mobile app are going to be forced to not play PC version at all because you have to buy it again for full price that doesn't do anything. What if that person wants to play PC client instead of mobile now that it's going to be released? That person is going to locked to pay for the same game twice or pay for something he already have earned in his account.

 

The bigger problem lies within idea of "Buy it on PC = unlock everything instantly". It ruins completely your business model of microtransations in mobile app since accounts are going to be mergable and a new player can just buy PC release, unlock everything and then play on mobile with never caring about in-app purchases or farming anything. What's the point of mobile purchases then?

 

And even bigger issue, and turn off for me as a gamer, is the fact that you get every adventure, hero, decks, even ALL premium treasure chest items on the purchase of the base game.

What's the point of playing then? Quickly complete all campaigns and that's it? So to get access to the product first, you are forcing for PC customers to buy and unlock "win" button right away. This is so confusing as a business decision. Imagine other games that have a lot of unlockables, had them all available and unlocked and purchase, this is unacceptable.

 

I was planning to stream PC release, but knowing that I will have to pay to unlock everything on the spot (and "win") and lose all gameplay interest and value of replaying/grinding is totally a huge let down.

 

I will tune in during Q&A stream, hopefully my post will be reviewed and replied to.

 

Thanks in advance.


Edited by TorNis, 07 June 2017 - 11:04 AM.

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#23
Yewstance

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The feeling of progression is a powerful draw to many - myself included - to such a degree that I tend to prefer a CCG over, say, a Living Card Game or something else that gives everything 'in the box'. PACG is somewhere in between the "acquire more cards in time" and "own all cards at the beginning" by nature of the rules regarding character growth and card acquisition, with the digital version enforcing that in a way that's simply up to the honor code on the physical version. (I wouldn't see why you'd purchase a game like that just to cheat, but the temptation "ah I was just off by one by the dice, I can re-roll that, losing this would mean I'd have to re-do the whole scenario and that's a waste of my time" is always there, and repeatedly giving into it will damage the enjoyability of the game in some peoples' eyes.)

 

With the PC version, it does SOUND like a lot of the progression will be gone, but not all - at least not without the Obsidian bundle. There's still some treasure to acquire, possibly character-alts, possibly new content outside of the Rise of the Runelords adventure path, I think, including the Goblin adventure? Honestly I'm not 100% sure based on the news we've been given, but I would assume that the expectation, or benefits, of grinding will still exist. I hope so, as it both supports the optional microtransaction model as well as actually add value to a certain subset of players. Other player groups, meanwhile, find content gated behind grinding or further transactions infuriating and unnecessary, so it's a mixed bag all around.

 

The mobile/PC thing is the big thing that gets me. From what I've heard, I serve to gain no content whatsoever to move to PC, but have to pay - in AUD and on the Steam store - likely upwards of $30. Some of my best game purchases in the past years have been some top-notch roguelite or other Steam indie title, or game on sale, for about half that price, so it's extremely hard for me to justify the expenditure for almost literally nothing. But I recognize, financially, why they want to shift models (and I suspect the microtransactions in the mobile version weren't quite as profitable as foreseen), it's just so difficult for them to do with an established player base already existing, and I have a host of concerns as to what this means to players both new and old.

 

We'll see what information comes out, but I find it hard to justify a $25+ purchase or recommendation on a game that can be installed for free - even if it's content that you have to grind up towards.



#24
King_Momo

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I, for one, would like to see Flounder on the stream and get to know his thoughts on the future of the game. Also, he said in his dev blog post that he'd say how he got his name but didn't! Hopefully, this gets rectified on the stream.



#25
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Thanks for the Stream and answering our questions

I only caught bits of it as I'm at work, but the 'Pathfinder Ambassador' idea sounds cool. Looking forward to hearing more details next week.
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#26
Yewstance

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The stream's finished? As a result of timezones and work hours, I've been unable to catch any of it; could anyone write up the cliff notes on it? Unless there'll be a blog covering it anyway.

 

Solely from the term alone, Pathfinder Ambassador implies to me some kind of bonus for pre-existing mobile players, presumably for those whom have already unlocked the content that will be 'bundled in' by default in the PC version either by purchasing the RotR bundle through microtransactions or in-game gold. Similar to the Nintendo/3DS Ambassador program given out for 3DS early adopters, before the global price drop.

 

If that is the case, that sounds like an EXCELLENT compromise (one that I'd considered the potential of myself, given my experience with the 3DS ambassador program), assuming the rewards/bonuses are sufficiently pleasing. A rune to increase gold gain permanently? An exclusive character-alt? New players could presumably just install the mobile version and buy the bundle there after getting the PC version if they felt left out.
 

Of course, I'm snowballing ideas here based on literally a 2-word phrase brought up in a stream I didn't watch, so I'm likely making a fool of myself.



#27
WotanAnubis

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The stream's finished? As a result of timezones and work hours, I've been unable to catch any of it; could anyone write up the cliff notes on it? Unless there'll be a blog covering it anyway.

 

I don't really intend to summarize a 40-minute video, because I wouldn't know where to start and as someone who hasn't played Pathfinder don't know what's particularly relevant.

 

But you can watch the video here: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/150267657



#28
Hannibal_PJV

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The Goblin stuff is/will be avesome! Thanks for that in advance. I so much would like to burn down the town and cook some longshanks in a big caultron. And ofcourse I wanna burn some books too!
;)

#29
Hannibal_PJV

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Short summary from the video
- Next there will be PC versio
- Stash is there and your new treasure cards goes to Virtual wanna be stash.
- You have to buy the PC version
- But there is somekind of Pathfinder ambassador system based on gold and money you have used in Mobile version to compensate. More of that next week.
- The quest mode goes out next week
- The Goblin stuff is not in the PC release, but comes as a separate release. Soon tm.
- Obsidian edition includes the alts and treasures and some special extra content
- if PC version sells millions of copies there is a chance of new content
- New goblins Are A consept for new characters. The dev use them as a proof of consept how much time it takes to make new characters to the game. So if PC version sells a lot there may be more, but that information is classified and They have to kill you now if you know this staff ;) They did not catually say so, but They did say that They can not reveal new plans yet. Only that They now know how much work it takes to make new characters. And that there will be new information about new content. Soone TM.
- you can combine your pc and mobile accounts by using a code. Don't play with different platforms at the same time or you Are in big trouble... huge discontinue errors
- there will be huge list of corrected bugs for the next release.
- New Goblin stuff is Runelords adventure, but from the Goblins point of view. There will be new super Villains like horses and longshanks to be worried about. (Cool stuff :) )
- and the dev team will be back...
- the multiplayer is not coming in short time period. It is something that They want to do, but it is not ready and there has not been green light to start the proses of making it yet.

Edited by Hannibal_PJV, 08 June 2017 - 03:34 AM.

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#30
DrDior

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Short summary from the video
- Next there will be PC versio
- Stash is there and your new treasure cards goes to Virtual wanna be stash.
- You have to buy the PC version
- But there is somekind of Pathfinder ambassador system based on gold and money you have used in Mobile version to compensate. More of that next week.
- The quest mode goes out next week
- The Goblin stuff is not in the PC release, but comes as a separate release. Soon tm.
- Obsidian edition includes the alts and treasures and some special extra content
- if PC version sells millions of copies there is a chance of new content
- New goblins Are A consept for new characters. The dev use them as a proof of consept how much time it takes to make new characters to the game. So if PC version sells a lot there may be more, but that information is classified and They have to kill you now if you know this staff ;) They did not catually say so, but They did say that They can not reveal new plans yet. Only that They now know how much work it takes to make new characters. And that there will be new information about new content. Soone TM.
- you can combine your pc and mobile accounts by using a code. Don't play with different platforms at the same time or you Are in big trouble... huge discontinue errors
- there will be huge list of corrected bugs for the next release.
- New Goblin stuff is Runelords adventure, but from the Goblins point of view. There will be new super Villains like horses and longshanks to be worried about. (Cool stuff :) )
- and the dev team will be back...

 

All sounds good to me.  Strange that nothing was said about multi-player.   That would give the game a whole new dimension.



#31
Ethics Gradient

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All sounds good to me.  Strange that nothing was said about multi-player.   That would give the game a whole new dimension.

 

It was mentioned very briefly.  The key points were:

- It was/is hard to find a way to do multiplayer that would fit the game well.  They may need to simplify some of the rules and features to find a way to make asynchronous gameplay manageable.

- If Pathfinder Adventures sells a million copies on steam, they totally promise they'll add multiplayer!   ;)


Edited by Ethics Gradient, 08 June 2017 - 10:07 AM.


#32
Slide87

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but the mobile version will be updated as usual(even if it will work in a different way PC version works)?

#33
Hannibal_PJV

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The dev did say that They try to keep all versions as similar as possible (otherwice the crossplatform binding would not work!)
I would personally be vaurioista when new update arrives. We know that for example Apple store and google store updates does not arrive exactly at the same time. So it may be easiest to wait Until the same patch has arrived to all platforms that you Are using. In most cases it ay be no problem at all, depending on how massive the changes Are. Normal bug fixes should be quite easy.

Edited by Hannibal_PJV, 08 June 2017 - 04:42 AM.


#34
helldraco

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So, basically, the long awaited PC version is coming and they screwing the game by removing the Quest Mode.

 

The fun part of the game, the one you can play for hours thanks to the renewal of the objectives/ennemies/restrictions is being shut down.

 

How can someone possibly think this is a good idea ? Seriously, now there's only the story mode. Who's gonna play the same thing over and over ? Why would play something over and over ?

 

Heck, with the must buy option on PC (and everything unlocked), what's the point of the game without multiplayer ?

 

 

Do you guys have a vision of your project ? You were on a track for years and now you're going on a totally different track ... what are you thinking ?!?

 

To say i'm utterly disappointed is an understatement. To me, you just killed the game. :'(



#35
Musaab

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They said that quest mode was causing bugs with the normal mode and that they didn't have the resources to maintain quest mode.  I agree with you that quest mode is really great thanks to the randomness of it, basically making the game endless.  Let's hope the game sells well, so they can expand the team and keep adding content.  I don't think they are making enough at the moment.  We could also help by recommending the game in more places...so many people haven't heard of it.



#36
PinkRose

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Just as an alternative view, I have played Quest mode only up to a level 6 character. Really just to check it out.

I've played Story, over and over and over. As a Tester, I've played Brigandoom A LOT!!! Still a great game, completed multiple times. 

I am hopeful that the removal of Quest mode means they can focus on more official content and don't have to chase bugs.

Sorry you are losing Quest mode, but it is possible to enjoy the game without it.


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#37
Hannibal_PJV

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I personally think that quest mode would work better as a separate app. It is very true that it caused a lot of problems is the story mode, so separate app with quest mode and nothing else could be solution, but even that would require more work force than They have now... so not likely to happen but I really hope that it will come back after the Rice of the Runelords have sold millions of copies that may allow the multiplayer and even some new content to Runelords.

#38
DrDior

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I always thought that quest mode would be an attractive match to multiplayer.  Just my opinion.  Possible to even create head to head matches.



#39
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Well, for multiplayer to work they need to handle it the way Paizo handle Organized play (which IS multiplayer for physical game!)... and for that they need to introduce Class decks.

 

As for Story vs. Quest mode... I actually prefer Story because it's a lot less grinding there. Quest mode is just constant repeating of same 5-6 scenario setups untill you get to add a new tier od cards where you get to repeat another set of same 5-6 scenario setups. Difference is, in Story mode you get to add new tier much faster (5 scenarios won as opposed to 15-20). 


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#40
cartmanbeck

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Well, for multiplayer to work they need to handle it the way Paizo handle Organized play (which IS multiplayer for physical game!)... and for that they need to introduce Class decks.

 

As for Story vs. Quest mode... I actually prefer Story because it's a lot less grinding there. Quest mode is just constant repeating of same 5-6 scenario setups untill you get to add a new tier od cards where you get to repeat another set of same 5-6 scenario setups. Difference is, in Story mode you get to add new tier much faster (5 scenarios won as opposed to 15-20). 

I don't see why you'd think this is the case... there's really no reason they'd need to introduce class decks in order for you to have characters play in an asynchronous way... they could do it with their current cards and mechanics.






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