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Party for upscaled PotD


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#41
r2d23

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Understood about the rogue, I guess I'll spend that talent point elsewhere.

 

So, Cleansing Flames sounds to be kind of broken. I'm reading it's description right now. Could you clarify what does "-5 Duration of active beneficial effects for 5.0 sec" and "+100 Damage Over Time tick rate for 5.0 sec" mean, exactly? It's kind of convoluted.

 

How does it translate into doubling the tick rate? What does tick rate mean here, anyway? 150 raw damage over 18s becomes 150 raw damage over 9s? Or it becomes 300 raw damage over 18s?


Edited by r2d23, 10 May 2017 - 09:30 AM.


#42
MaxQuest

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So, Cleansing Flames sounds to be kind of broken. I'm reading it's description right now. Could you clarify what does "-5 Duration of active beneficial effects for 5.0 sec" and "+100 Damage Over Time tick rate for 5.0 sec" mean, exactly? It's kind of convoluted.

There is more 'broken' stuff in the game :)
 
What the spell does is:
- affects the enemy with a single-target DoT, that deals 80 burning damage over 5s (base values)
- reduces the duration of beneficial buffs on the target by 5s. For example enemy uses Disciplined Barrage. It's duration will be 10s instead of 15s. Or if the enemy is affected by Herald aura (which iirc has 5s duration and ticks every 3s, right?) - he won't get any benefit from it at all.
- doubles the tick rate of all DoTs on the target, for it's duration.
 

How does it translate into doubling the tick rate? What does tick rate mean here, anyway? 150 raw damage over 18s becomes 150 raw damage over 9s? Or it becomes 300 raw damage over 18s?

Closer to the latter. When a DoT ticks on a target affected by Cleansing Flames, there will be two ticks instead of one.
Take note through that CF has base duration of 5s. So at 10 MIG / 10 INT:
- No CF + 150 raw damage over 15s DoT; results in 7 ticks of 21.42 dmg
- CF + 150 raw damage over 15s DoT; results in 9 ticks of 21.42 dmg, i.e. 192.8 dmg over 15s; unless you recast CF on that target, or it jumps back.

The true beauty of CF is through: casting 4 Shining Beacons (which all stack), and then follow with CF, which basically means that target suffers from 8 instances of Shinning Beacon at the same time. And a buffed priest deals ~250 fire damage via single Beacon alone. You can see how Alpine Dragon goes from barely injured to dead in 10s: link.

Edited by MaxQuest, 11 May 2017 - 01:41 AM.


#43
r2d23

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Thanks. I think I've got it all except for this one:

 

- CF + 150 raw damage over 15s DoT; results in 9 ticks of 21.42 dmg, i.e. 192.8 dmg over 15s; unless you recast CF on that target, or it jumps back.

Why does 7 ticks translate into 9 ticks? What's the math here?



#44
Boeroer

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Cleansing Flame's duration is too short to double all the ticks.



#45
MaxQuest

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Why does 7 ticks translate into 9 ticks? What's the math here?

As Boeroer said, it's because CF duration is lower than that of the DoT you have mentioned. 

Interval between two consecutive ticks is 3s.
Interval between a tick and the one after next one is 6s.
This means that 5s-long CF will always double at least one tick, and in 66% of cases it will double one more. Hence 7 => 9. 
Not a lot, but the good thing is that a priest usually has high INT, plus Minor Avatar, which can easily result in 10s long CF on hit, or 15s on crit.

Edited by MaxQuest, 11 May 2017 - 04:42 AM.


#46
r2d23

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Indeed, I forgot that CF itself has a duration, now it all makes sense, thank you.



#47
r2d23

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I'm going to resurrect this old thread of mine.

 

I'm looking to do a TC play-through on upscaled PotD. Party members will be all standard NPCs. Most probably I'll have Eder (DW DPS), Pallegina (alpha strike + Sacred Immolation later on), Aloth, Durance, Hiravias or Kana (tanking + AoE DPS).

 

I'm looking at paladin for the role of the main character. Ideally I want him to have a good mixture of party buffs and offense. Is this too much to expect from? The extreme routes are obvious:

 

1) Darcozzi high con/might/int tank with focus on supportive paladin abilities and, perhaps, later on sacred immolation. Maybe even without it because Pallegina will be specced for fire-based stuff.

2) Bleak Walker alpha strike version built full-out for FoD damage (lashes, offensive abilities, talents that increase elemental damage, etc.)

 

Is it possible to have a paladin who can buff the party, be reasonably sturdy (i.e. high CON), pack some punch with FoD and do steady auto-attack damage? Or at least three of these four?

 

I've tried to read up on the subject yesterday, and oh dear there's so much stuff written on the forums, it's like studying for a dissertation. Two hours suddenly passed by and I am more confused than clear.



#48
Boeroer

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This one has good support, great single target CC via mind control items (can crit-charm dragons) and deals decent damage with FoD arquebus alpha strikes and then does ACC marking (+20 stackable ACC for a single ally) + Outworn Bucker passive support while tanking a bit. 

 

He's a Shieldbearer, but you can also play him equally well as Darcozzi (and push the single ACC buff even further to stackable +30 for a single ally via Inspirating Liberation) or Kind Wayfarer (heals via FoD and kills).

 

Bleak Walker and Goldpact don't fit that well with this.

 

He good quite good feedback so far. I guess because he's kind of a Jack of all Trades without sucking at everything but does everything he's supposed to do quite effectively.
I think he's a good addition to a TC run because the mind control with very high ACC helps a lot in difficult fights. If you want him to be more sturdy then just shift some points from INT/MIG/RES towards CON. 

 

He doesn't pack a punch with auto-attacks though. :) But I consider the Outworn Buckler to be a lot more useful than that. Its defensive buff stacks with everything, even with the same aura that Little Savior also has. If you duplicate that one you can have three of those herald-shields and get permanent +15 to all defenses for the whole party - fully stackable.

 


Edited by Boeroer, 14 September 2017 - 11:08 PM.


#49
r2d23

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Yes, I've read this build, it looks quite nice. I am a bit worried about his low CON though. Could be tough dealing with upscaled content without having high fortitude.

 

Does it make sense to have two paladins with accuracy buffs (coordinated attacks, marking weapons, flanking)? If I have two paladins working along with a teammate on a single enemy each would both teammates get accuracy bonuses? E.g., the protagonist supporting Eder and Pallegina improving accuracy of Durance or Aloth for spellcasting or melee attacks (in latter case).



#50
JerekKruger

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Well as a main character Paladin with Deep Faith he's not going to have bad Fortitude. I think he'll have 98 unbuffed and without gear at level 16.



#51
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As I said: no problem with shifting some points here and there. Tht build is not minmaxed in terms of attributes (because you can't dump anything). But since you have Durance you shouldn't have problems with afflictions at all. Just use his prayers and litanies and you don't need high fortitude. 

 

Having two marking paladins is a bit too much for my taste. But yes, the marking of both could be used to support different team members. But marking/coordinated attacks of two paladins won't stack on one single ally (just saying). However - if you have some kind of Ploi-build with the Whisper of Treason + Zealous FOcus + Sworn Enemy and another marking paladin who marks for Ploi then of course you could increase his crit rate with FoD and mind controls even further.

 

Marking works well with casting as well. The nearest party member who is currently attacking/casting at the same target gets the bonus. Casters immediately stop attacking/casting after a spell was delivered in no-AI mode - and thus free up the ACC bonus for the next nearest party member who also attacks that enemy.

If you time it right (not very hard), then all casters who target the same "marked" enemy can use the ACC bonus for their casts. Usually this works automatically if their casts don't hit the target at the exact same time.

 

Also note that Durance's Inspiring Radiation and his Devotions will stack with all universal ACC buffs like Zealous Focus and also with Marking+Coordinated Attacks. That way you can get +30 ACC for the whole party and +60 for single allies (if you use Darcozzi, otherwise +50).

Also note that dual wielding marking weapons works, too. You will give +30 ACC to a single ally with dual marking weapons + Coordinated Attacks. +40 as Darcozzi with Insp. Lib. But since you would have to use Shame or Glory and Cladhaliath on the same paladin (those are the only two one-handed marking weapons) it would look really weird. :)

 

Usually I use my marking paladin to flank a dragon and then comes my Knockdown-Fighter or monk with Force of Anguish and prones the dragon. Even though dragons have tremendous fort. and also restistance to prone (+20) I never missed a Knockdown/Force of Anguish because the ACC boost from Inspiring Radiance, Marking, Coordinated Attacks and Devotions is so high that the dragon falls.

You can take it to the extreme if you mark-buff a cipher who casts Tactical Meld on you. He will get +20 ACC on top (stacks) and can then hit or crit everthing in this game that's not immune.


Edited by Boeroer, 15 September 2017 - 12:28 AM.

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#52
r2d23

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Thanks for the info. I've already gathered that one can stack indecent amounts of accuracy on a frontman with the help of a paladin and a priest.

 

Well as a main character Paladin with Deep Faith he's not going to have bad Fortitude. I think he'll have 98 unbuffed and without gear at level 16.

 

 
And what about before he hits level 16 along with Deep Faith and max bonus from Faith and Conviction? I am always more worried about mid-game scenarios rather than late game ones. In any case, I can always shift some points from RES to CON as Boeroer suggested.


#53
JerekKruger

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I am always more worried about mid-game scenarios rather than late game ones.

 

Of course. Well for non-Deflection saves he'll have +10 from the very start of the game, the equivalent of 5 points of Might or Constitution, and he'll gain +4 quite quickly from getting the first rank in each of his favoured dispositions (you can get Diplomatic and Honest 1 by doing a few easy side quests in Gilded Vale). This gives him comparable or better saves most non-Paladin classes would have and they're just going to get better as you level up.

 

In any case, I can always shift some points from RES to CON as Boeroer suggested.

 

This is true. I'm not entirely sure why the build has such (relatively) high Resolve. I'd probably go with a Resolve of 10 and pump his Might to 18 and use the other two points on Intellect and Perception, or perhaps Constitution.


Edited by JerekKruger, 15 September 2017 - 01:44 AM.


#54
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High RES for da dialogues, man! :)



#55
JerekKruger

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High RES for da dialogues, man! :)

 

I never thought I'd see you advocate attribute choices based on dialogue options Boeroer  :w00t:


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#56
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Sure, why not? In most of my builds I try at least to somehow explain the attribute spread from a rp-perpective (even when it means I have to make up really weird background-stories). :)

I also seldomly recommend the latest high end gear but rather gear that fits the style and "vibe" or the char. Else they all would wear Maegfolc Skull. ;)

 

I don't enjoy playing superpowerful characters if the rp-part is totally bonkers - or non-existent.


Edited by Boeroer, 15 September 2017 - 02:13 AM.

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#57
JerekKruger

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No reason why not, for whatever reason I just didn't think that was you.

 

I have to admit I always feel a little bad that my characters almost exclusively have low (usually 8) Resolve. There's always this feeling that they'd all be really easy to tempt, or they'd all have addictive personalities. Resolve just seems so unimportant though.

 

EDIT: I hope they improve Resolve in Deadfire.


Edited by JerekKruger, 15 September 2017 - 02:18 AM.


#58
Lampros

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Sure, why not? In most of my builds I try at least to somehow explain the attribute spread from a rp-perpective (even when it means I have to make up really weird background-stories). :)

I also seldomly recommend the latest high end gear but rather gear that fits the style and "vibe" or the char. Else they all would wear Maegfolc Skull. ;)

 

I don't enjoy playing superpowerful characters if the rp-part is totally bonkers - or non-existent.

 

Yup. Maegfolc Skull looks so terrible that I declined to use it when I looted it.



#59
JerekKruger

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Yup. Maegfolc Skull looks so terrible that I declined to use it when I looted it.

 

You can use the console to turn off helms without removing the ability to get achievements.


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#60
Lampros

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Yup. Maegfolc Skull looks so terrible that I declined to use it when I looted it.

 

You can use the console to turn off helms without removing the ability to get achievements.

 

 

I like Achievements ;)

 

Edit: Oh, wait. You say I can still get Achievements?!!!


Edited by Lampros, 15 September 2017 - 05:36 AM.





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